PDA

View Full Version : Zimmerman part 2



skullybones
07-28-2013, 17:35
Here we go again

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/07/zimmerman-redux-the-breaking-louisiana-self-defense-case-of-merritt-landry//#more

White homeowner shoots black 14YR old at 2:00am...

The Story:

Merritt Landry, a 33-year-old “white caucasian” shot the victim, a 14-year-old black boy, in the head. A single spent cartridge case was recovered at the scene, indicating that a semi-automatic weapon was used and suggesting that a single shot was fired. The hour of the shooting was approximately 2:00AM, on Friday, July 26, 2013. As of this writing the victim is reported to remain alive, in critical condition at a local hospital.


Screen Shot 2013-07-27 at 12.00.56 PM


The victim was shot within feet from the rear door of Landry’s dwelling in New Orleans, in an area accessible only by having to scale a locked fence, suggesting forcible entry onto the property by the victim.


A local resident and friend of Landry’s, Charles Hazouri, had security cameras on the exterior of the home which appear to have recorded the victim and a friend riding their bicycles up and down the street at 1:44AM. Earlier in the evening, another neighbor had seen the apparent friend biking around the neighborhood at 8:00PM. This neighbor, like Landry a “white caucasian,” considered calling the police, but decided against this for fear of being perceived as having racially profiled a “kid who’s just biking.”


The Hazouri recording purportedly shows the two teens talking in the middle of the street outside of Landry’s house at about 1:44AM. One wore a dark tank top and the other wore a light tank top. The teen in the light tank top climbed over Landry’s fence and into the yard. Landry’s large dog began to bark, alerting Landry to the intruder.


Screen Shot 2013-07-27 at 1.41.14 PM
The Landry’s pet dog which alerted the homeowner to the presence of an intruder within his gated and secured driveway at 2:00AM.


An anonymous friend has stated that Landry’s father reported his son believed he was shooting an intruder. In terms of the victim being an intruder upon secured property, this seems a reasonable perception. Whether the victim intended to intrude into the dwelling is not known, or that under the circumstances a reasonable person would have believed the victim was intending to do so, is less clear.


Screen Shot 2013-07-27 at 1.40.47 PM
The locked gate over which the intruder scaled at 2:00AM, shortly before approaching the home’s rear door and being shot through head by homeowner Merritt Landry.


Hazouri reports that Landry, who has a baby daughter and whose wife is pregnant, believed that the victim was trying to break into his house. “All I know is that Merritt had told his family that he had said: ‘Freeze!’ and it looked like the guy turned at him and had his hand on his hip,” Hazouri reported.


Screen Shot 2013-07-27 at 1.41.26 PM
The rear door of Merritt Landry’s home, and the driveway where car was parked, when Landry came upon intruder at 2:00AM.


Landry has been charged with attempted second degree murder. His bond was set to $10,000; he posted bond late Friday afternoon. Landry works for the City of New Orleans as a building inspector. The city says he has been placed on emergency suspension without pay pending the outcome of this case.


LOSD Analysis


Disclaimer: This analysis is based upon the “facts” as reported by the news media. These “facts” so must therefore be assumed to be elastic, selected to fit a hidden narrative, and perhaps even outright false. Nevertheless, they are the only “facts” with which we have to work. As new information becomes available we will adjust our coverage and analysis accordingly.


Attempted Second Degree Murder


The attempted second degree murder charge is as blatant a piece of overcharging as was the second degree murder charge brought against George Zimmerman.


Under LRS 14:30.1 Second degree murder, there are four paths to a conviction on second degree murder. Two of these involve the distribution of drugs and can be discarded on their face. A third involves a killing during the course of committing a violent felony, and this also clearly does not apply to these facts.


The last path involves the offender with a specific intent to kill or to inflict great bodily harm. Although such intent can form quickly, and Louisiana’s second degree murder charge does not incorporate the element of a “depraved murder” as is the case in Florida, it seems clear that Landry’s only use of force was in a perceived need to act in self-defense.


That perception may have been unreasonable, and therefore self-defense may fail in this instance, but even then the killing can not have been second degree murder where the killer possessed a genuine (if unreasonable) belief that he must use deadly force in self-defense rather than the intentional mental state of committing a murder.


A more reasonable charge would have been manslaughter, under LRS 14:31, if the victim’s intrusion into the property might be seen as adequate provocation, or perhaps negligent homicide under LRS 14:32.


LRS 14:19 Use of force or violence in defense


Landry will surely seek to advance self-defense against the charges. Louisiana has one self-defense statute for when the use of defensive force does not result in a death—LRS 14:19 Use of force or violence in defense—and a second self-defense statute for when the use of force does result in a death- LRS 14:20 Justifiable homicide.


As of this writing the victim remains alive, and the charge remains attempted murder rather than murder, so in this context we would look to LRS 14:19. Several sections of LRS 14:19 would seem to apply here.


First, LRS 14:19(A) provides that the use of defensive force is justifiable to prevent a forcible offense against a person or trespass against property. It states that the force must be reasonable and necessary under the circumstances, but does not explicitly limit the degree of force to non-deadly force. If, however, the person against whom the force was used actually does die, LRS 14:19 is no longer applicable and instead LRS 14:20 comes into play. If the defendant’s apparent testimony that the victim turned towards him at being challenged and appeared to be reaching for a weapon is believed, the element of prevention of a forcible offense against a person will have been met.


Second, LRS 14:19(B) provides a legal presumption of a reasonable belief that the use of force was necessary if the person using the defensive force was inside his dwelling and the force was necessary to prevent unlawful entry into the dwelling or to compel an unlawful intruder to leave the premises. The facts do not suggest that the victim here was actually inside the dwelling, but rather was a few feet from the door to the dwelling. There are two conditions to this presumption. First, that the victim either had or was in the process of unlawfully entering the dwelling, and second that the person using defensive force had reason to believe that an unlawful entry had, or was about to, occur. It seems likely that Landry will claim that he believed his use of force was necessary to prevent the victim’s unlawful entry into the dwelling.


The presence of an unknown person immediately outside one’s backdoor at 2:00AM, under circumstance that would have required them to scale a fence in order to be so situated, would seem to allow a reasonable belief that an unlawful entry into the dwelling was intended.


Alternatively, depending on how Louisiana defines “dwelling” and “curtilage” for defenses purposes, the defendant may also rely on the claim that he reasonably believed the force was necessary to compel the victim to leave. This seems a more tenuous defense, however.


Finally, 14:19(C) is Louisiana’s Stand-Your-Ground law in the context of non-fatal defensive force, relieving the defendant of any generalized duty to retreat, and 14:19(D) prohibits the jury from even considering whether retreat was possible.


LRS 14:20 Justifiable homicide


But what if the victim in this matter dies? Then 14:19 goes out the window, and we turn to LRS 14:20 Justifiable homicide.


14:20(A)(1) provides, succinctly, that a homicide is justifiable “When committed in self-defense by one who reasonably believes that he is in imminent danger of losing his life or receiving great bodily harm and that the killing is necessary to save himself from that danger.” If Landry’s claim that the victim here turned and being challenged and appeared to be reaching for a weapon is believed, and particularly under the circumstances of the hour of night and the need for the victim to have scaled a locked fence, (A)(1) would appear to fit the facts well.


Section (A)(2) justifies a homicide when committed to stop a forcible felony involving danger of death or great bodily harm. Interestingly, it does not require that the person using force be in reasonable fear of death or great bodily harm, only that these are possible dangers of the violent felony. This section does, however, require that the use of defensive force reasonably believe that an attempt to prevent the forcible felony without killing would expose him to a serious danger to his own life or person.


The state may argue that the victim was merely attempting to break into Landry’s car, rather than enter the dwelling. A car break-in does not usually involve an act of violence against a person, and car break-in is not explicitly listed in LRS 14:2 Definitions as among the states’ defined “crimes of violence.” The defense could well respond, however, that this was not a simple car-break in, that the car’s position within feet of Landry’s door and the need for the victim to have scaled a locked fence transforms what might otherwise have been a relatively innocuous car break-in to a crime that, like a burglary, substantially raises the risk that the thief may be confronted by the car owner and violence erupt.


Section (A)(3) is Louisiana’s Make-My-Day law, and justifies a killing of a person believed to be likely to use any unlawful force against someone in a dwelling, while that person is committing or attempting to commit a burglary or robbery of the dwelling. Whether the facts, as they develop, can support a reasonable belief that the victim here was attempting to commit a burglary of the dwelling shall be seen.


Section (A)(4) justifies the killing by a person lawfully inside a dwelling of another who either has or is attempting to unlawfully enter that dwelling. Again, we will need to see whether the facts support a reasonable belief on Landry’s part that the victim was attempting to unlawfully enter the dwelling.


Section (B) of 14:20 creates a legal presumption that an occupant of a dwelling had a reasonable belief that the use of deadly force was necessary to prevent unlawful entry by, or compel the departure of, an intruder into that dwelling if two conditions are met: first, the intruder either had or was attempting to enter the dwelling forcibly and second the person using defensive force reasonably believed the intrusion to be unlawful.


Section (C) is Louisiana’s Stand-Your-Ground law in the context of a fatal use of defensive force, and section (D) prohibits the jury from even considering whether retreat was possible.


9:2800.19 Limitation of liability for use of force in defense of certain crimes


Finally, it is noteworthy that Louisiana has a self-defense immunity statute, 9:2800.19 Limitation of liability for use of force in defense of certain crimes. Unlike Florida’s 776.032 Immunity from criminal prosecution and civil action for justifiable use of force, however, Louisiana’s statute applies only to civil liability where the defendant’s conduct was found justified under 14:19 or 14:20. Like Florida’s, it provides that the civil trial court shall (not may) attorneys fees, court costs, and even compensation for loss of income and “all expenses” to the defendant in a civil action where self-defense immunity is found to apply.


Look to Legal Insurrection for Continued Coverage of Landry Case


In summary, we’ll be following the Landry case just as closely as we did Zimmerman. Keep your eyes here for the latest and greatest new information and legal analysis.

wctriumph
07-28-2013, 17:55
Well, crap ..

BREATHER
07-28-2013, 18:01
Was it Blowbama 30 years ago ????? WTF were they doing out at 2:00am did the bars just close... For fuck sakes where are the fucking parents. If I was out at 2am at 14 years old and got caught my old man would have kicked my ass around the neighborhood.. Or the neighbors would have kicked my ass then my pops would have done it again...

skullybones
07-28-2013, 18:22
Was it Blowbama 30 years ago ????? WTF were they doing out at 2:00am did the bars just close... For fuck sakes where are the fucking parents. If I was out at 2am at 14 years old and got caught my old man would have kicked my ass around the neighborhood.. Or the neighbors would have kicked my ass then my pops would have done it again...

I was allowed to be out late (lived in a very rural midwestern area).
But I do not advocate the mischief at that hour. Better be able to explain yourself to anyone of authority.

Rooskibar03
07-28-2013, 18:45
Wait until they are inside the house.

skullybones
07-28-2013, 18:46
Wait until they are inside the house.

My thoughts exactly.

Grime
07-28-2013, 18:53
More fuel for the fire. [facepalm]

MrPrena
07-28-2013, 19:10
I bet those major media will be all over this........

$$$$$$ for them.

To stupidass underage criminals who might get shot near future by committing a crime: DON'T BE A FUC*N DUMBASS AND STOP COMMITTING A CRIME ON OTHER INNOCENT PERSON'S PROPERTY AND/OR LIFE.

KestrelBike
07-28-2013, 19:14
super [sarcasm]

The fact that he was shot in the head will make this case 1,000x worse. Hopefully the trespasser survives (for everyone involved). And then we can find the kid's parent and punch her in the face.

sniper7
07-28-2013, 19:16
Interested in more details. Either way the kid climbed the locked gate, didn't retreat when the dog was barking. I hope the homeowner gets off.

stoner01
07-28-2013, 21:51
I think the media will be more focused on the other white Hispanic guy in Florida. Seriously, the dude looks whiter than me. Must have been the roids.

BPTactical
07-29-2013, 06:01
So just what is a 14 yo doing out at 2am and why did he climb a security fence?

Oh wait, we can't ask that because it would put accountability on the poor, sweet and innocent boy that was ruthlessly hunted down by that mean homeowner.

Its gonna get good........

Bailey Guns
07-29-2013, 06:20
From the NY Daily News:


The teen had a few burglary charges against him, though his family told the paper that none of those had ever been armed robberies.

And another interesting quote:


The paper spoke to other neighbors, who said they saw Coulter biking around the neighborhood earlier Friday evening. "I thought about calling the cops, but the last thing I want to do is racially profile a little kid who's just biking," the neighbor told the Times-Picayune.

Another thug-in-training has had his worthless criminal career, and maybe his life, terminated saving who knows how many people from being the victim of one his future crimes. Boo fuckin' hoo. I feel sorry for the homeowner and his family. He's done society a great service and he'll be vilified for it.

Kraven251
07-29-2013, 07:14
for fucksake, why are they even charging this guy with anything... while yes he should have waited until the criminal entered or was attempting entry into the home, I don't see him at fault for engaging someone trespassing on his property and reacting to the situation (assuming all things reported are accurate) the way he did

wtf happened to this country

Singlestack
07-29-2013, 07:20
And now because of a "white hispanic getting away with murder", they are going to make sure this fish doesn't get away. The race baiters feel they "need a skin" and will be all over this.

Bailey Guns
07-29-2013, 08:13
Surprisingly, I haven't heard the usual nonsense from the usual suspects regarding this incident.

As a matter of fact, I did find this. Some common sense spoken by the organizer of a black activist group in New Orleans:



"Instead of turning against each other, we need to try and unite," he told WWL First News. "Focus on common issues of public safety."

Captain Black says at a time when people could be driving wedges, they need to be coming together.

"Recent events like the George Zimmerman acquittal... and other political issues promise to raise tensions within our community. This press conference, along with other upcoming efforts, are steps to relive, not inflame, these tensions," he explained.

He also raised concerns about a lack of good parenting.

"The young man was 14 years old, two o' clock in the morning, with a record of burglary. Regrettable that's not uncommon in our community," Captain Black explained.

SOURCE (http://www.wwl.com/pages/16928951.php?contentType=4&contentId=13498869)

muddywings
07-29-2013, 08:47
http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/2013/07/marigny_homeowner_shooting.html#incart_m-rpt-2

A 14-year-old boy remained in critical condition Friday after being shot in the head by a homeowner (http://www.nola.com/crime/index.ssf/2013/07/marigny_homeowner_booked_after.html) who said he thought the teen was trying to break into his house. But police said the teen was unarmed and did not pose an "imminent threat" when he was shot and have charged the owner with attempted second-degree murder.

The family of Marshall Coulter said the teenager could move only the right side of his body a little, but not the left. Doctors told the family that if Coulter survives, he would likely be severely brain damaged.
Coulter's family acknowledged the teen's history of burglary arrests but said he had never used a gun.
Police said that Coulter did not pose a threat to the homeowner, Merritt Landry, who works as a building inspector for the Historic District Landmarks Commission.

Police said the teen was near Landry's vehicle when he was shot about 2 a.m. Landry's friends said the vehicle was in the driveway behind a gate just a few feet from the house's backdoor.
According to an NOPD arrest warrant, Landry shot Coulter from 30 feet away, evidenced by the distance between the blood found on the ground and the single bullet casing outside Landry's house in the 700 block of Mandeville Street.
Landry told police that he approached the boy from his front yard, near his vehicle. As he grew closer, he said, the boy made a "move, as if to reach for something" -- possibly a weapon -- so Landry shot him, the warrant states.
NOPD Detective Nicholas Williams spoke with an unidentified witness who gave an account that differed from Landry's, though the detective did not specify how. Williams wrote in the warrant that Coulter was not trying to enter Landry's house and did not pose an "imminent threat" to Landry.
Judge Franz Zibilich set Landry's bond at $100,000. Landry posted a property bond and was released late Friday.
Landry's attorneys, Michael Kennedy and Miles Swanson, issued a statement after the arrest saying, "This incident is terrible, and Mr. Landry feels terrible about how things have occurred. Nevertheless, we remain convinced our client has done nothing wrong, and we are sure -- as facts come to light -- it'll become clear that Mr. Landry will be fully exonerated of any wrongdoing."
A spokesman for the City of New Orleans said Landry has been placed on emergency suspension without pay, pending the outcome of the criminal investigation.
Meanwhile, Coulter's mother would not leave his hospital bedside. His grandmother and older brother sat outside the family's home on Elysian Fields Avenue on Friday afternoon, grieving and upset.
Coulter is the seventh of eight children. Coulter's 23-year-old brother, David Coulter, said he had largely raised the children after their father died three years ago of stomach cancer. David said he and his mother did his best to keep Marshall out of trouble.
Marshall Coulter, who had been on medication for attention deficit hyperactive disorder, was awaiting trial for "stealing stuff," his brother said.
"He would steal -- he was a professional thief, sure," David Coulter said. "But he would never pick up a gun, not in a million years. He was too scared to aim a gun at the grass, let alone aim it at a person. No way. Before he'll ever pick up a gun, he'll be your friend first.
"He's still a little boy," the brother said. "Who pulls a trigger on a 14-year-old? What if it was your little brother or your sister? How would you feel?"
But Landry's neighbors and friends said they could understand where Landry's actions. They said that Landry, who has a pregnant wife and baby daughter, believed the teen was trying to break into his house.
"Merritt is a friend. I can't blame him one bit," Charles Hazouri said. "He's got a family. You've got to protect your own."
Hazouri, who owns property near Landry's house, said his surveillance cameras captured two juveniles riding BMX bikes up and down Mandeville and Dauphine streets around 1:44 a.m. One of the teens was wearing a blue tank top with white stripes; the other was wearing a light-colored T-shirt, Hazouri said.
Earlier in the evening, a different neighbor said the teen in the blue tank top had been biking around the area around 8 p.m. and the neighbor believed he was looking at different houses.
"I thought about calling the cops, but the last thing I want to do is racially profile a little kid who's just biking," said the neighbor, who spoke on condition of anonymity. The neighbor and Landry are white; the two teens are black.
Hazouri said his video, which he gave to NOPD detectives, shows the two teens talking in the middle of Mandeville Street outside of Landry's house. The video then shows the teen in the light-colored T-shirt walk his bike across Mandeville toward Landry's house. Then, the teen walks back out to the middle of the road before climbing over Landry's fence, Hazouri said. The other teen in the tank top stayed on the other side of Mandeville Street, Hazouri said.
Landry's large dog started barking, which alerted Landry to the teen being inside his yard, according to Landry's friends.
Hazouri acknowledged the potential for his friend to be in legal trouble, nodding to the recent controversial acquittal of George Zimmerman in the fatal shooting of 17-year-old Trayvon Martin in Florida. Zimmerman's trial brought issues of self-defense shootings, racial profiling and Castle or "Stand Your Ground" laws to the national spotlight.
"Unfortunately, I feel bad about it because I hope it doesn't turn out to be another Florida deal," Hazouri said. "I'm a permit holder and a gun owner myself. You've got to stand up for your family."
The comparisons that many have drawn with the Trayvon Martin case disturbed Coulter's brother. "That's a different story," he said. "That was Trayvon, this is Marshall. This is a whole different world. This is my little brother's life on the line - I don't care about anything else."
David Coulter said he hoped Landry would be imprisoned for the shooting. "I want to see a prosecution, not somebody who gets out after a couple of years," he said. "I want to see the system do its job for once."
Marshall Coulter was a student at Renew School Network in the 2012-2013 school year, but his mother chose to send him to another school for the 2013-2014 school year because she wanted to separate him from his younger brother, according to the schools' chief executive officer, Gary Robichaux.
Renew School started last Monday, and Marshall Coulter's little brother has been in school all week. "It's just a really sad situation," Robichaux said between tears, "and we just wish he had been in school this week."

muddywings
07-29-2013, 09:05
from what I read, burglar inside fenced yard charges home owner=good shoot (IMHO).

30 ft distance, no weapon, no contact, TM/GZ trial, current political climate=conviction

sad :(

RMAC757
07-29-2013, 09:21
And now because of a "white hispanic getting away with murder", they are going to make sure this fish doesn't get away. The race baiters feel they "need a skin" and will be all over this.

Seriously, who do you think is "stoking" these flames? This board is the first I've seen of any of this. Personally, I'm not not gonna shoot someone who has trespassed on my property. I may try and scare the crap out of them, but unless my or my families life is in danger or the trespasser has entered my home I'm gonna do everything possible to them off my property without the use of lethal force. This is me personally.

Ronin13
07-29-2013, 09:28
Like everyone else already stated- this is a clean shoot for the homeowner- kid jumping the fence and trespassing at that hour? My father used to always give out the advice: "Nothing good happens after midnight... Unless it involves a girl and the safety of your home or hers."

muddywings
07-29-2013, 09:36
Seriously, who do you think is "stoking" these flames? This board is the first I've seen of any of this.

don't hate the OP or people like me because we're news junkies. Wait for it.....National News in 3....2....1....


Personally, I'm not not gonna shoot someone who has trespassed on my property. I may try and scare the crap out of them, but unless my or my families life is in danger or the trespasser has entered my home I'm gonna do everything possible to them off my property without the use of lethal force. This is me personally.

I'm not going to shoot a 2nd degree trespasser either. Likewise, I'm going revert to LEO training and be yelling "STOP RIGHT THERE, SHOW ME YOUR HANDS." That being said, someone charges me as I'm displaying a firearm then I pull the trigger. Why? Because if they take it, then I'm dead.
I wasn't there but from the little knowledge I have due to the articles I read, it's a good shoot. Don't break into people's property and don't charge people holding you at gun point when you have committed a crime.

I'm thinking that we'll have to agree to disagree with this one though.

RMAC757
07-29-2013, 09:56
Like everyone else already stated- this is a clean shoot for the homeowner- kid jumping the fence and trespassing at that hour? My father used to always give out the advice: "Nothing good happens after midnight... Unless it involves a girl and the safety of your home or hers."

Most of us Ronin snuck out of the house at one time or another when we were young so that is kind of a non-issue. I snuck out all the time when i was kid ( this is probably why I ended up in military school ). Admittedly I wasn't an angel, though i never stole anything or vandalized someone's property with the exception of some toilet paper in a tree or two. Maybe times have changed or I lived in an area where no one one would of considered shooting someone at first glance on their property. Parenting isn't up to the kid. I had good parents and i still raised a little hell. The shoot appears to be in the commission of a crime so it was probably legal. I guess we all have a personal threshold on where lethal force is warranted.

RMAC757
07-29-2013, 10:02
don't hate the OP or people like me because we're news junkies. Wait for it.....National News in 3....2....1....



I'm not going to shoot a 2nd degree trespasser either. Likewise, I'm going revert to LEO training and be yelling "STOP RIGHT THERE, SHOW ME YOUR HANDS." That being said, someone charges me as I'm displaying a firearm then I pull the trigger. Why? Because if they take it, then I'm dead.
I wasn't there but from the little knowledge I have due to the articles I read, it's a good shoot. Don't break into people's property and don't charge people holding you at gun point when you have committed a crime.

I'm thinking that we'll have to agree to disagree with this one though.

C'mon man. I'm not hating anyone. If you disagree with the National news though, why are you reading it? Muddy, if someone charges me holding a firearm, I'm not gonna throw it at them. The result would most likely end up the same both of our scenarios. There's a pretty big gap between someone being on your property and someone charging a person with a loaded firearm.

muddywings
07-29-2013, 10:08
C'mon man. I'm not hating anyone. If you disagree with the National news though, why are you reading it? Muddy, if someone charges me holding a firearm, I'm not gonna throw it at them. The result would most likely end up the same both of our scenarios. There's a pretty big gap between someone being on your property and someone charging a person with a loaded firearm.

the word "hate" was supposed to be given with a slight humorous tone...such as, "don't hate the playa" ;) (internet humor fail on my part-my bad)
As for "national news," I read everything: NBC, CNN, FOX. They are all BS. You gotta read them all plus others, just so you can figure out the truth from their BS.
I thought I had read elsewhere that the kid "charged." Couldn't quickly find it above but for some reason i thought I read that. Will have to look later. If he didn't come at the homeowner, the homeowner is going to have more problems.

RMAC757
07-29-2013, 10:10
the word "hate" was supposed to be given with a slight humorous tone...such as, "don't hate the playa" ;)
As for "national news," I read everything: NBC, CNN, FOX. They are all BS. You gotta read them all plus others, just so you can figure out the truth from their BS.
I thought I had read elsewhere that the kid "charged." Couldn't quickly find it above but for some reason i thought I read that. Will have to look later. If he didn't come at the homeowner, the homeowner is going to have more problems.
[Beer]

Chad4000
07-29-2013, 10:58
yeah I thought on your property meant on your property... inside the house or not...

ya know,, theres a simple fuckin solution here... quit breaking into peoples houses...q

Inconel710
07-29-2013, 11:00
One more reason "bumps in the night" have to be answered by a gun in one hand and a FLASHLIGHT in the other. While this may be a legal shoot, I wouldn't call it "good". Even if the homeowner doesn't go to jail, he'll get slapped with a civil suit. Win or lose, his life is still going to be ruined (like Zimmerman's).

RMAC757
07-29-2013, 11:22
yeah I thought on your property meant on your property... inside the house or not...

ya know,, theres a simple fuckin solution here... quit breaking into peoples houses...q

I'm not disagreeing with you at all Chad. Just stating that life isn't always that linear. If a person can live with their decision and is comfortable with that degree of force escalation than so be it.

Ronin13
07-29-2013, 11:46
One more reason "bumps in the night" have to be answered by a gun in one hand and a FLASHLIGHT in the other. While this may be a legal shoot, I wouldn't call it "good". Even if the homeowner doesn't go to jail, he'll get slapped with a civil suit. Win or lose, his life is still going to be ruined (like Zimmerman's).
Had this happen last night- heard a loud crash on the back deck, grabbed the Sig and my Surefire, met the brother at the back door, went outside to see what was what- planned that if I confronted someone brother would call 911 and I'd hold them there. Turned out to be a chair that fell over on our deck (not sure how, but it was resting on the railing and toppled).

spyder
07-29-2013, 11:53
If the laws were more stringent, less shit would happen. You don't see many people screwing with each other in Arizona (or hear about it anyway)... wonder why? Oh ya, because in AZ, if you screw with someone, you can get your ass shot. I wish the laws were more open everywhere.

BPTactical
07-29-2013, 14:21
If the laws were more ENFORCED, less shit would happen. You don't see many people screwing with each other in Arizona (or hear about it anyway)... wonder why? Oh ya, because in AZ, if you screw with someone, you can get your ass shot. I wish the laws were more open everywhere.

IFIFY

Chad4000
07-29-2013, 15:01
I'm not disagreeing with you at all Chad. Just stating that life isn't always that linear. If a person can live with their decision and is comfortable with that degree of force escalation than so be it.


my bad man.. I didnt mean to sound like I was pissy with you.. just annoyed by the criminal who's like "I know I was breaking in to somebodys house, by I dont think I deserved to be shot" mentality. (not on this board.. I mean like media etc)

spyder
07-29-2013, 17:49
If self defense laws were more open (you could defend yourself, or property in more situations), less shit would happen. You don't see many people screwing with each other in Arizona (or hear about it anyway)... wonder why? Oh ya, because in AZ, if you screw with someone, you can get your ass shot. I wish the laws were more open everywhere.

Had to edit so it made more sense, stuff in red is the edit.

rockhound
07-29-2013, 17:57
that cracka shot an innocent black kid who was just climbing in to your back yard and walking up to your door at 2:00 cause he thought you might have skittles and an iced tea

every time some little punk get shot it is never the parents or the kids fault. take some damn responsibility for your actions. why did I not get shot by some homeowner when i was 14, oh yeah now i remember, i wasn't on his property at 2:00 am

do stupid shit win stupid prizes.

I am sure he had a legitimate reason to climb the fence and walk up to the back door, if you take away private property right then he was justified to be there any time he wants.

buffalobo
07-29-2013, 18:19
I blame Darwin. :beer:

Sent from my DROID BIONIC using Tapatalk 2

ANADRILL
07-29-2013, 21:35
Was it Blowbama 30 years ago ????? WTF were they doing out at 2:00am did the bars just close... For fuck sakes where are the fucking parents. If I was out at 2am at 14 years old and got caught my old man would have kicked my ass around the neighborhood.. Or the neighbors would have kicked my ass then my pops would have done it again...
Bars don't close in the Big Easy, it's 24/7.

RMAC757
07-30-2013, 08:39
my bad man.. I didnt mean to sound like I was pissy with you.. just annoyed by the criminal who's like "I know I was breaking in to somebodys house, by I dont think I deserved to be shot" mentality. (not on this board.. I mean like media etc)

[Beer]

muddywings
07-30-2013, 08:44
well, i guess I'll have to admit I was wrong. The MSM/national news hasn't picked it up yet! [Dunno]

RblDiver
07-30-2013, 09:04
I am sure he had a legitimate reason to climb the fence and walk up to the back door, if you take away private property right then he was justified to be there any time he wants.

Heh, even his brother admitted he has burglary convictions, "But he would never use a gun, he's scared of guns!" :rolleyes:

cwripinz
08-06-2013, 14:15
Heh, even his brother admitted he has burglary convictions, "But he would never use a gun, he's scared of guns!" :rolleyes:

Bet he's even more scared of them now...[LOL]

mtnhack
08-06-2013, 16:47
If the laws were more stringent, less shit would happen. You don't see many people screwing with each other in Arizona (or hear about it anyway)... wonder why? Oh ya, because in AZ, if you screw with someone, you can get your ass shot. I wish the laws were more open everywhere.
Had to edit so it made more sense, stuff in red is the edit.



If self defense laws were more open (you could defend yourself, or property in more situations), less shit would happen. You don't see many people screwing with each other in Arizona (or hear about it anyway)... wonder why? Oh ya, because in AZ, if you screw with someone, you can get your ass shot. I wish the laws were more open everywhere.


You have got to be joking, right? Pheonix is a safe haven from violence and crime? http://www.azcentral.com/CrimeMaps/?sort=d_date&city=Phoenix&zipcode=&location=&days=30&category=


That is last month. I think I topped it off because it says it found more than 200 crimes. The reason you don't hear about AZ shit is because you don't live there. Visit and turn on the local news, it is all crime all the time.

mtnhack
08-06-2013, 16:52
You have got to be joking, right? Pheonix is a safe haven from violence and crime? http://www.azcentral.com/CrimeMaps/?sort=d_date&city=Phoenix&zipcode=&location=&days=30&category= That is last month. I think I topped it off because it says it found more than 200 crimes. The reason you don't hear about AZ shit is because you don't live there. Visit and turn on the local news, it is all crime all the time.Yeah, I did break the counting part anyway. 1248 Burglaries in July in only Phoenix (no suburbs)

Great-Kazoo
08-06-2013, 18:11
Yeah, I did break the counting part anyway. 1248 Burglaries in July in only Phoenix (no suburbs)

Phoenix is a suburb, Of Nogales;) 20 yrs ago there were places you didn't wander, if you were anglo. Today anyones guess.

claimbuster
08-06-2013, 19:49
Another one of Obama's sons?

skullybones
08-07-2013, 19:02
http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/08/merritt-landry-allies-developing-narrative-of-innocence/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+LegalInsurrection+%28Le%C2%B7 gal+In%C2%B7sur%C2%B7rec%C2%B7tion%29

Seems as though they are trying to get this one right.
Whatever that means.

RMAC757
08-07-2013, 21:58
http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/08/merritt-landry-allies-developing-narrative-of-innocence/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+LegalInsurrection+%28Le%C2%B7 gal+In%C2%B7sur%C2%B7rec%C2%B7tion%29

Seems as though they are trying to get this one right.
Whatever that means.

Wait a minute....no racial riots?!....What's this country coming to?