View Full Version : Chicago Teaching style: 3x4=11 is ok
muddywings
08-18-2013, 12:48
http://youtu.be/DW0VxxoCrNo
Children who never learn how to fail, will fail when they are adults.
:(
KestrelBike
08-18-2013, 12:55
Reminds me of a story Bert told me [I'll leave it to him to tell, if he wishes]. Very worrying indeed.
As long as there's an explanation for why 3x4=11...
"Someone shot the other "1" in gang/drug violence and we just don't talk about that."
BPTactical
08-18-2013, 15:15
Reminds me of a story Bert told me [I'll leave it to him to tell, if he wishes]. Very worrying indeed.
My oldest was in grade school doing some math homework (kinda pre algebra stuff, X+Y = Z and such)and I saw some previous papers that had been graded, I noticed although he had a rough idea what was going on his answers were wrong, but had not been marked as such. I asked the kiddo about it and he said the teacher said they were correct.
I stashed the paper until the next parent teacher conference.
When that time came I pulled out the papers and asked the teacher why the incorrect answers had received credit for being correct.
"Well I am not worried about the CORRECT answers, rather I want them to work on the concept"
I just about blew a gasket! I laid into here in a polite manner and asked here how on earth the kids could ever be expected to learn the "concept" if they are not getting the answers correct? I then told here we did not go to the moon on a "concept".
I also told her to teach my kid correctly or don't bother teaching at all.
Freakin appalling.
Imagine if we built cars close enough to concept or airplanes etc...yeah that engine is supposed to have 30 fan blades but 29 is close enough.
When it comes to math you are either right or wrong. There are different methods of getting there but you all end up at the same place.
BPTactical
08-18-2013, 15:39
Very well said Sniper7.
"Commie Core" will be the final nail in our public education system.
The video shown should be all the motivation one needs to do whatever they have to do to ensure their kids receive either homeschooling or private education.
I know lots of you guys are not Glenn Beck fans, but he has spoken on the failure of "Common Core" and its dangers to society for a few years now.
Again, he is uncannily accurate.
We are in serious trouble folks........
Look at this way guys, in 10 years if you buy 3 boxes of 22lr for $4 each it will only cost you $11. Imagine the savings passed onto the consumer!
theGinsue
08-18-2013, 15:46
^^^ Win!
Rooskibar03
08-18-2013, 15:47
Very well said Sniper7.
"Commie Core" will be the final nail in our public education system.
The video shown should be all the motivation one needs to do whatever they have to do to ensure their kids receive either homeschooling or private education.
I know lots of you guys are not Glenn Beck fans, but he has spoken on the failure of "Common Core" and its dangers to society for a few years now.
Again, he is uncannily accurate.
We are in serious trouble folks........
Was the final step for us. Home school started Thursday. The curriculum we went with still has some CC elements to it, but now we can control the exposure level.
cmailliard
08-18-2013, 15:49
As a teacher, I get the ability to change my curriculum every year as trends and industry dictate. Since I give high school english credit I still have to go by some of these "rules" but in CTE there is so much latitude to teach what we want and how we want, to make sure the students understand the basics as well as what industry requires of them.
What she is talking about, I have never heard of this. I had to send it off to some smarter people to tell me if this is true or if she was just talking out her ass. If it is ture, thaen god heple us.
theGinsue
08-18-2013, 16:17
It's all part of the "Common Core" curriculum. Expect to see much more of this sort of teaching concept.
Beprepared
08-18-2013, 16:32
This is one of the main reasons we are leaving the state next year. We're moving back to Alaska, where the kids will be put in private school. Alaska was one of maybe three or four states that would not accept Common Core. Unfortunately the Governor signed the identical curriculum with common core crossed out. Bill Ayers and his pinko's have been in the back door of these few states slipping their garbage in. I wish I had the patients to home school.
"Common Core" is one of the main reasons Kat is doing the on-line public school with both kids this year.
Early last year our daughter was really struggling with a math assignment and I couldn't figure out why since she was already very good at the basics. We sat down to go over some subtraction and this is the type of problem we were presented with (this is from Everyday Math aka Chicago Math). http://www.nychold.com/em-arith.html
32841
I've always been very good at math but I had to look up multiple examples online to figure out what the hell they were doing. :)
As a teacher... I have some horror stories I could pass on. But half of you wouldn't believe they are true. Half of this crap is thought up by administration who never spent time in a classroom, nor understand how a child grows both in concrete and abstract reasoning. The new core curriculum (is just a new name for old crap they've been trying to pass for years) is killing the education system quicker than anything and making the truly good teachers want to leave with the added "pay per performance" and all the other crap. As in everything, there are some good ideas, but very, VERY bad implementation...
Anyways, what do I know, I'm just a silly musician...
What is said in the video doesn't make sense because there is no way to explain how you arrived at 3x4=11, because 3x4 does not equal 11.
muddywings
08-18-2013, 16:57
32841
.
what the hell is that crap ^^^^
burn it, BURN IT!!!!
SideShow Bob
08-18-2013, 17:24
As a teacher,.....................If it is ture, thaen god heple us.
Let us hope you typed this last sentence sarcasticly............[hahhah-no]
KestrelBike
08-18-2013, 17:46
32841
I've always been very good at math but I had to look up multiple examples online to figure out what the hell they were doing. :)
What.The.Fuck.
Make it as confusing and convoluted as possible and they'll never learn self-reliance.
jerrymrc
08-18-2013, 18:25
What.The.Fuck.
This comes from the same people that taught all your (Insert retail store here) how to give you back your change. I was somewhere the other day and the bill came to $3:20. I handed her a 10 and said I think I have the 20 cents. I had a quarter and handed it to her.
It came back as (handing me the nickle) that is 3 and two makes five and five is ten handing the rest of the bills in order to me. I about fell out until I took a good look and realized that the gal behind the counter had a good bit of years over me. I thanked her for counting out the change and said it is a dying art. She just smiled.[Flower]
TEAMRICO
08-18-2013, 18:27
I told my sons new teacher at open house to her face that I did not want to hear about this Common Core BS from my son. None of this wrong answers are right if he can explain why he got it wrong. I told her no Global Warming, Alternative Learning, pushing agendas, anything related to Politics or Gov. programs and sex education.........he is in the 4th grade!!!
I told her I would be a thorn in her side when I hear him saying things that don't sound right.
I also mentioned that I ask him "So, what did you learn today in school" as soon as I pick him up from daycare.
I have battled with this math crap as well, a simple problem to solve has been made to have as many steps and stupid new terms to solve 1+1.
Im known for writing notes on his homework for teachers to read and explain to me what they are teaching. Nothing drives them more crazy then having to write or email me taking more of their time.
jerrymrc
08-18-2013, 18:40
In my best as I remember grade school manner I fixed it. http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac44/jerrymrc/IMG_0040Medium_zpse2621d96.jpg (http://s884.photobucket.com/user/jerrymrc/media/IMG_0040Medium_zpse2621d96.jpg.html)
BPTactical
08-18-2013, 18:59
"Common Core" is one of the main reasons Kat is doing the on-line public school with both kids this year.
Early last year our daughter was really struggling with a math assignment and I couldn't figure out why since she was already very good at the basics. We sat down to go over some subtraction and this is the type of problem we were presented with (this is from Everyday Math aka Chicago Math). http://www.nychold.com/em-arith.html
32841
I've always been very good at math but I had to look up multiple examples online to figure out what the hell they were doing. :)
WTF squared?
is that the inverse of Reverse Polish Notation????
I think I will roll with Jerry's version......
As a teacher... I have some horror stories I could pass on. But half of you wouldn't believe they are true. Half of this crap is thought up by administration who never spent time in a classroom, nor understand how a child grows both in concrete and abstract reasoning. The new core curriculum (is just a new name for old crap they've been trying to pass for years) is killing the education system quicker than anything and making the truly good teachers want to leave with the added "pay per performance" and all the other crap. As in everything, there are some good ideas, but very, VERY bad implementation...
Anyways, what do I know, I'm just a silly musician...
Music IS mathematics, and the wrong answer is still wrong, no matter how one arrives at it.
If you can explain why you played A minor instead of A major, then the song sounds fine.
NPR played some thing about an orchestra once and the conducter had them play some song for 60 seconds or so. He then had them play it again where only 90% of the notes were correct and the song was near unrecognizable.
sellersm
08-18-2013, 20:18
Ok, since you asked (no you didn't)... Agenda 21. Learn about it. Now. it is what's behind the CC stuff, and a ton of other stuff, including.... <wait for it> planned urban communities! Yep. Denver area is one of their poster children, don't recall the community's name, but it's one of their 'successes'!
This type of thinking is only acceptable if you're living in 1984... (yes, I mean the book, not the time period)
The goal is to teach 'thinking' (or at least, what they call thinking), and understanding that the only right answer is what they're told (because they've been dumbed down enough so they can't arrive at the correct answer themselves!). It's part of the reason that we've been seeing, for the past 20+ years, a huge emphasis on "the professionals": only the 'professionals' are qualified to do <fill in the blank>... And a bunch of other nonsense that will make your blood boil.
Seriously, I've said it a zillion times here: Agenda 21, look it up, learn about it, get some of the books (yes, it's actually published by the UN) and see what's going on around you and around your kids & neighbors' kids...
sellersm
08-18-2013, 20:21
Here's a great video explanation of Agenda 21. And there are many more, and many books you can find on the topic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCU5sfmU8kU
Something tells me the South Koreans don't use this style of teaching.
http://youtu.be/DW0VxxoCrNo
Children who never learn how to fail, will fail when they are adults.
:(
This is how Chicago makes money from NW/Cornflakes, UofChi.
Since their own kids in Chicago are so stupid that out of state students are getting into these schools listed above.
Something tells me the South Koreans don't use this style of teaching.
I think South Korean education system teaches normal way. (like how we learned how to do basic asthmatics)
I think ROK's k-12 is ranked top 3 in the world.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/27/best-education-in-the-wor_n_2199795.html
However, their teachings are very generic/fixed. K-12 materials are ONLY about semester to 3/4 quarters ahead of average US schools, but the kids (or shall I say their parents) are extremely competitive relative to kids' class/school ranking.
CRAP below is more:
-Complicated than a fukN Complex Variables.
-Abstract than a damn Abstract Algebra.
-Differentiated than a crazy Partial Differential Equations.
:(
32841
This is one of the main reasons we are leaving the state next year. We're moving back to Alaska, where the kids will be put in private school. Alaska was one of maybe three or four states that would not accept Common Core. Unfortunatly UNFORTUNATELY the Governor signed the identical curriculum with common core crossed out. Bill Ayers and his pinko's have been in the back door of these few states slipping their garbage in. I wish I had the pateints PATIENCE to home school.
Because I couldn't just let it go...
If you chose to home school, please do endeavor to teach them how to spell and use the proper word, and spell it properly as well. [Bang]
Because I couldn't just let it go...
If you chose to home school, please do endeavor to teach them how to spell and use the proper word, and spell it properly as well. [Bang]
A while back Mike Rosen had a teacher on that was part of an organization that advocated less or no homework for students. Rosen brought up weekly spelling tests and asked how a student was to learn how to spell correctly. The teacher replied that if there was a question on how a word should be spelled she let the students discuss and decide how they wanted to spell it.
Words have no meanings any more so why should they have a correct spelling?
Just got this email from one of the grandson's teachers - gives me a headache trying to figure out WTF he's talking about. Glad the kid's a junior this year.
Hello everyone -
I wanted to say hello and clear up what an M would mean in the gradebook for Algebra 2. Students have the chance to make their homework better if needed (so an extra night). You should see scores of 10, 9, 8 or 7 for scores. If a 10 is earned, then the student did all homework with no more than 3 errors. If there is an M for now, then the following class time day should have a better score. A grade of 9 would mean a student missed 4 or more problems and are doing corrections on a separate sheet of paper. If a score of 8 is earned, then the student tried 1/2 to 3/4 of homework took it home to complete/correct. If a 7 is earned, then less than 1/2 was tried and it was taken home to complete/correct. If an M stays in the gradebook, then a student did not submit.
If you happen to see the grade of 0, 4, or 5 are earned, then your child is not completing the work. If the above scores are earned, then by completing the 0 would have earned a 7, the 4 would have earned an 8, and the 5 would have earned a 9 if the student had taken home and completed. If you see an M, please realize your child is doing completion and should earn a grade of 7, 8 or 9.
centrarchidae
08-19-2013, 00:53
I think he saying that the first rule of Algebra 2, is that you don't talk about Algebra 2.
Just got this email from one of the grandson's teachers - gives me a headache trying to figure out WTF he's talking about. Glad the kid's a junior this year.
(Sorry, couldn't bring myself to re-quote that - centrarchidae)
In my best as I remember grade school manner I fixed it. http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac44/jerrymrc/IMG_0040Medium_zpse2621d96.jpg (http://s884.photobucket.com/user/jerrymrc/media/IMG_0040Medium_zpse2621d96.jpg.html)
That's exactly how I learned it....and it's quite efficient.
ZERO THEORY
08-19-2013, 07:36
http://www.miscupload.com/upload/396999054462766256439016.gif
Beprepared
08-19-2013, 08:26
Because I couldn't just let it go...
If you chose to home school, please do endeavor to teach them how to spell and use the proper word, and spell it properly as well. [Bang]
Thank you for the correction. This is one reason why I stated I "do not have the patience" to home school my children. I am the first to admit that my spelling and grammer sucks (yes I had weekly spelling tests). I will no longer trust my typing and proofing skills after having a restless night. The post will be edited promptly.
In my best as I remember grade school manner I fixed it.
That is how I learned it too and it still works best today. I don't understand why it has to be so complex. Carry over is much easier...for me anyway.
BPTactical
08-19-2013, 10:42
Just got this email from one of the grandson's teachers - gives me a headache trying to figure out WTF he's talking about. Glad the kid's a junior this year.
Hello everyone -
I wanted to say hello and clear up what an M would mean in the gradebook for Algebra 2. Students have the chance to make their homework better if needed (so an extra night). You should see scores of 10, 9, 8 or 7 for scores. If a 10 is earned, then the student did all homework with no more than 3 errors. If there is an M for now, then the following class time day should have a better score. A grade of 9 would mean a student missed 4 or more problems and are doing corrections on a separate sheet of paper. If a score of 8 is earned, then the student tried 1/2 to 3/4 of homework took it home to complete/correct. If a 7 is earned, then less than 1/2 was tried and it was taken home to complete/correct. If an M stays in the gradebook, then a student did not submit.
If you happen to see the grade of 0, 4, or 5 are earned, then your child is not completing the work. If the above scores are earned, then by completing the 0 would have earned a 7, the 4 would have earned an 8, and the 5 would have earned a 9 if the student had taken home and completed. If you see an M, please realize your child is doing completion and should earn a grade of 7, 8 or 9.
Today's lesson in stupidity is brought to you by the same dickwads that won't spank a child for behaving badly and EVERYBODY gets a trophy!
I find the above e mail virtually incomprehensible.
Rooskibar03
08-19-2013, 11:05
Ok, since you asked (no you didn't)... Agenda 21. Learn about it. Now. it is what's behind the CC stuff, and a ton of other stuff, including.... <wait for it> planned urban communities! Yep. Denver area is one of their poster children, don't recall the community's name, but it's one of their 'successes'!
This type of thinking is only acceptable if you're living in 1984... (yes, I mean the book, not the time period)
The goal is to teach 'thinking' (or at least, what they call thinking), and understanding that the only right answer is what they're told (because they've been dumbed down enough so they can't arrive at the correct answer themselves!). It's part of the reason that we've been seeing, for the past 20+ years, a huge emphasis on "the professionals": only the 'professionals' are qualified to do <fill in the blank>... And a bunch of other nonsense that will make your blood boil.
Seriously, I've said it a zillion times here: Agenda 21, look it up, learn about it, get some of the books (yes, it's actually published by the UN) and see what's going on around you and around your kids & neighbors' kids...
Ding, ding, ding. We have a winner.
A21 is some scary stuff.
Originally Posted by rondog https://www.ar-15.co/images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (https://www.ar-15.co/showthread.php?p=1292269#post1292269) Just got this email from one of the grandson's teachers - gives me a headache trying to figure out WTF he's talking about. Glad the kid's a junior this year.
Hello everyone -
I wanted to say hello and clear up what an M would mean in the gradebook for Algebra 2. Students have the chance to make their homework better if needed (so an extra night). You should see scores of 10, 9, 8 or 7 for scores. If a 10 is earned, then the student did all homework with no more than 3 errors. If there is an M for now, then the following class time day should have a better score. A grade of 9 would mean a student missed 4 or more problems and are doing corrections on a separate sheet of paper. If a score of 8 is earned, then the student tried 1/2 to 3/4 of homework took it home to complete/correct. If a 7 is earned, then less than 1/2 was tried and it was taken home to complete/correct. If an M stays in the gradebook, then a student did not submit.
If you happen to see the grade of 0, 4, or 5 are earned, then your child is not completing the work. If the above scores are earned, then by completing the 0 would have earned a 7, the 4 would have earned an 8, and the 5 would have earned a 9 if the student had taken home and completed. If you see an M, please realize your child is doing completion and should earn a grade of 7, 8 or 9.
Today's lesson in stupidity is brought to you by the same dickwads that won't spank a child for behaving badly and EVERYBODY gets a trophy!
I find the above e mail virtually incomprehensible.
No kidding! What is wrong with A, B, C, D, F!
Life doesn't give you any do-overs. Get it right the first time, or learn by your failures.
Inconel710
08-19-2013, 11:51
Agenda21 and other examples aside, the video sounded like the way my college engineering statics and mechanics courses were graded. In a ten point "problem", having the correct answer would be one point. Breaking down the forces and following the procedures to determine the answer accounted for the other nine. Those problems were a lot more complicated that 3*4, but the process was the important thing in those courses. This is bringing that type of grading down to a ridiculous level though.
Today's lesson in stupidity is brought to you by the same dickwads that won't spank a child for behaving badly and EVERYBODY gets a trophy!
I find the above e mail virtually incomprehensible.
Glad to hear it. I tried to understand it and thought "wow, I've been drinking too much cocoa...."
Circuits
08-19-2013, 13:10
Liberalism in education - teaching your kids to feel great about their own ignorance!
sellersm
08-19-2013, 13:11
Liberalism in education - teaching your kids to feel great about their own ignorance!
And applauding the ignorance of their teachers!
RblDiver
08-19-2013, 13:20
It's one thing to have a long process and series of equations and give partial credit for an incorrect answer (perhaps you read a 3 as an 8, or something, but everything else was correct) (and definitely not give full credit for a wrong answer). It is totally separate to give full credit for a wrong answer on a one-step process!
(And while on the subject of teaching, anyone remember CSMP? I think they got rid of it after I'd just finished third grade, so I don't remember anything EXCEPT the "magic computers," which were really just teaching binary counting. It's too bad that in this technology-driven age that they don't teach binary more; if you learned it, you could count up to 1023 on your fingers!) (just be careful on numbers 4, 128, and 132 :D lol)
Circuits
08-19-2013, 14:28
It's one thing to have a long process and series of equations and give partial credit for an incorrect answer (perhaps you read a 3 as an 8, or something, but everything else was correct) (and definitely not give full credit for a wrong answer). It is totally separate to give full credit for a wrong answer on a one-step process!
Totally - in advanced calculus, advanced physics and honors chemistry, where some proofs or derivations run tens of pages (more in some really difficult cases), I was graded about 50% for applying the correct lemma or whatever, and the other 50% credit was for correct answers. If you did everything else right, and just screwed up a substitution late in the game, you might be able to get 60% credit for that problem - but no credit for wrong procedure or work not shown regardless of answer provided, and not possible to get full credit for a wrong answer.
BPTactical
08-19-2013, 16:19
Glad to hear it. I tried to understand it and thought "wow, I've been freebasing too much cocaine...."
IFIFY........
ZERO THEORY
08-19-2013, 17:18
Agenda21 and other examples aside, the video sounded like the way my college engineering statics and mechanics courses were graded. In a ten point "problem", having the correct answer would be one point. Breaking down the forces and following the procedures to determine the answer accounted for the other nine. Those problems were a lot more complicated that 3*4, but the process was the important thing in those courses. This is bringing that type of grading down to a ridiculous level though.
In mechanical engineering or organic chemistry, manipulating functions and equations is a valid cornerstone of grading.
You can't sublet a fundamental principle. Imagine if you took your truck into the shop and they poured coolant into your crankcase. Your motor blows up because it's not lubricated with a catalyst of the proper viscosity and temperature resistance, but you should give the mechanic credit for understanding the principle of using fluid to lubricate moving parts?
Do liberals genuinely believe that in the future we're all just going to sing "We Are the World" and never say mean things? Because aggression, selective breeding, and "unfairness" is inherent in life across all species. They're not fixing anything; they're trying to pretend that sentience makes us immune to nature. And weakening our naturally-given means of self defense and survivability in the process.
how times have changed....I was a Jr or Sr in high school and we were having a test, I think it was Calculus. I had the right answers, but the work was incorrect to get the answers. I got an F on the test and a note from the teacher
"Right answers, wrong work!!! did you CHEAT or GUESS?"
Poor education can be correlated to crime... my future job just got a little bit harder.
This is going against the critical thinking and arguing that I was taught: in most cases there are right and wrong answers, however, in some things, where it is more gray (math is NOT one of those things), if you can articulate why your position is correct then you cannot be faulted. We were taught this in classes where things are not as concrete as spelling, math, and proven history. Things like theory and concepts can be argued. Things like "the Earth is round" simply cannot. We, as a society, are going the way of Idiocracy (scary future view of how dumb things may get).
I heard a story about this once, and they tried to explain the reasoning behind this change. Basically, they were saying that by teaching it this way, they are better explaining how to solve the problem in your head. I can understand how someone came about this idea, as I am not very good at math and with certain problems solve them in my head in a way that is similar to what is shown in that image earlier in the thread. HOWEVER, that is the way I can work the math problem in my own head BECAUSE I'm not the best at math. It doesn't make sense to teach a subject to EVERYONE, the way that the people whom are bad at the subject understand it. People who are good at math won't be any better by making the teaching more complicated, it will only make the kids who are good at math worse. The whole weakest link thing, but worse. I know that if I was taught math this way, I wouldn't be able to do it at all.
Music IS mathematics, and the wrong answer is still wrong, no matter how one arrives at it.
Amen.. There are different routes to get there, but the bottom line is the same, the wrong answer is wrong. This just goes back to the "feel good" teaching... it's horrible. I can "understand" what they are trying to do, but I don't agree and think it will kill our future.
If you can explain why you played A minor instead of A major, then the song sounds fine.
NPR played some thing about an orchestra once and the conducter had them play some song for 60 seconds or so. He then had them play it again where only 90% of the notes were correct and the song was near unrecognizable.
Yeah, I remember that one. And it's completely true too. Even if one person misses the key and plays a wrong note, it's ALL wrong. I need to go back and find that recording, thanks Irving.
In mechanical engineering or organic chemistry, manipulating functions and equations is a valid cornerstone of grading.
You can't sublet a fundamental principle. Imagine if you took your truck into the shop and they poured coolant into your crankcase. Your motor blows up because it's not lubricated with a catalyst of the proper viscosity and temperature resistance, but you should give the mechanic credit for understanding the principle of using fluid to lubricate moving parts?
Do liberals genuinely believe that in the future we're all just going to sing "We Are the World" and never say mean things? Because aggression, selective breeding, and "unfairness" is inherent in life across all species. They're not fixing anything; they're trying to pretend that sentience makes us immune to nature. And weakening our naturally-given means of self defense and survivability in the process.
Yup.
Those MATH Theories should be taught at HS like stupid Geometry theories/proof.
"This side is equal, so that side is equal"
"This is iso, so both side are con-freaking-gruent"
I think my first semester of Highschool Geometry with all that useless proofs were somewhat waste of time.
Aloha_Shooter
08-19-2013, 18:42
No kidding! What is wrong with A, B, C, D, F!
Life doesn't give you any do-overs. Get it right the first time, or learn by your failures.
The Libs got spanked over "Outcome-Based Education" 20 years ago so this is their stealth way of implementing it anyway. They can't give Fs ... notice the lowest grade for completing the work (correct or not) listed by rondog was a 7 out of 10 ...
Liberals LIKE having the general public think things are "too difficult" for them to understand personally ... it makes it easier for the libs to pass crap where the math doesn't work by saying "trust us, we have PhDs". OTOH, with such impressive intellectual specimens for parents, Common Core might be the only way Sasha and Malia can get an A in Math ...
electronman1729
08-19-2013, 18:45
32893
electronman1729
08-19-2013, 18:46
32895
BPTactical
08-20-2013, 05:59
And people actually have the gall to ask: "Why are we failing as a nation?"
PHD? Push Here Dummy.......
buffalobo
08-20-2013, 06:45
Progressives have controlled education system for generations.
American citizenry has been apathetic towards education for a couple generations.
Combination of the two conditions has created the indoctrination camps we have today.
Another step on the path...
Sent from my electronic ball and chain.
dirtrulz
08-20-2013, 08:06
And people wonder why I hate supporting a screwed up education system with my tax dollars. I would seirously have to consider home school so I could at least control a little of how they learn. Why cant I use this same theory on my taxes. I am sure I could show them why I thought I should get 50,000 on my tax return.
Oh, but we have to bow down to the child's 'self-esteem' which has become the primary concern. These kids will have to find out where they really fit in the world from their boss instead of their parents.
Nobody catered to my 'self-esteem' when I was a kid. I knew right from wrong and where I stood in the world. My existence was pretty insignificant in the grand scheme. It was up to me to make my way in this world.
The answer to education isn't computers in every classroom. Personal computers didn't exist until the end of my public education and were found in a course known as "Computer Math". I was taught in school how to read and learn on my own. There's no limit to what you can learn when you have those skills. Now I work with computers every day for a good living. If you learned on a computer in school, what happens when technology moves on and those skills no longer apply?
Byte Stryke
08-20-2013, 12:16
the ONLY part of the entire thing I agree with is that we should expect the child to be able to explain why they cam up with the number... it should still be right.
But, if they are just memorizing figures, they are not learning how to think.
4 nines is 36
thats great...
WHY is 4 nines 36
as far as the incorrect answer being OK... I don't think so
sellersm
08-20-2013, 12:48
Take this one more step, logically, towards its conclusion: if simple mathematics (simple math we're talking about, not complicated, theoretical stuff) can't be based on 'absolutes', then what else in life can't be based on absolutes? See where this is going? The only absolutes in life, are the ones "they" tell you are absolute! Moral foundation? Fugettaboutit. Scientific foundation? What? Are you kidding? Etc. etc. etc...
As was mentioned, another HUGE step on the path, and the end of the pat is now in sight!
Classroom chaos? Critics blast new Common Core education standards (http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/03/critics-claim-common-core-brings-chaos-not-acountability-to-classroom/)
As critics fear Washington is poised to take control of what and how local districts teach kids, school administrators are adopting new curriculum in an effort to ensure their students outperform their peers and parents worry that their children are being used as academic guinea pigs. As the program gets closer to full implementation, a full-blown backlash is developing despite assurances from supporters that it is merely a test aimed at establishing a national standard.
“It’s just now reaching their school districts and their children’s schools and they want to know, ‘What is this, and why is it being forced on us?’” said the Cato Institute’s Neil McCluskey.
When 90 percent of states signed on to subject K-12 students to the Common Core math and English standards being pushed by the federal government, the program looked like an unqualified success. Kids around the nation would be tested once a year in grades 3-8 in math and English language arts, and once in high school, either in the 10th or 11th grades. Finally, students throughout the country could be measured by the same yardstick, long before taking college entrance exams. Local districts that excelled at educating children could be singled out, and ones who lagged could also be identified in order to address problems.
But if what happened in New York and Kentucky, two of the 45 states that have signed on to the Common Core State Standards Initiative, is any indication, the chaos has only just begun. Those states administered their own standardized tests aligned with Common Core, and the results were disastrous. Just 31 percent of New York students in the third through eighth grades were deemed proficient in math and English on the new tests, down about 50 percent from the traditional test given the year before. Kentucky, which also implemented its own Common Core-aligned tests, experienced similar declines in scores.
Gman, what is the complaint there? That the new tests are too hard? (big decline in numbers deemed acceptable) I see harder tests as a good thing.
Local government should be making the calls for education, not the disconnected Feds.
...and it's not that the tests are "harder". The expectations for learned content in the new tests are "different".
What does the Federal government do efficiently or better than the states?
If the local (state in that article) gov is setting standards such that everyone passes and FedGov comes along with a harder test it is going to be very hard for me to side with the locals.
Did you miss the rest of the thread discussing 'common core'?
DAVID BARTON EXPLAINS HOW COMMON CORE POSES ‘SERIOUS PROBLEMS FOR THE FUTURE OF THE REPUBLIC’ (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/08/23/david-barton-explains-how-common-core-poses-serious-problems-for-the-future-of-the-republic/)
That article in context of the rest of the thread is what has me confused. If common core is really a step UP in difficulty, what the hell is being taught now?
Math & English are pretty straightforward subjects. Math has provably right & wrong answers, OP notwithstanding. I refuse to believe anyone would mark 3x4=12 incorrect even if they might mark 3x4=11 half credit for effort. English again is a straightforward subject at the root, can you understand and write a sentence. Combine the two subjects and you get the dreaded word problems from math class.
In the two test states more kids failed the common core test than whatever was being tested before. Either that is a deeply flawed test which we would be hearing about everywhere or it is a more difficult test than existing standards.
DavieD55
10-25-2013, 10:32
http://youtu.be/rGph7QHzmo8
osok-308
10-25-2013, 10:45
Imagine if we built cars close enough to concept or airplanes etc...yeah that engine is supposed to have 30 fan blades but 29 is close enough.
When it comes to math you are either right or wrong. There are different methods of getting there but you all end up at the same place.
I don't care if you can explain why you think the wrong answer is right. Unless your math says 3x4=12 you are wrong. Why does our society wish too keep accommodating mediocrity. We have the most technology that the world has ever seen, yet our literacy and computing abilities are abysmal. What ever happened to people thirsting for knowledge rather than just wanting the right answer to get someone off their back?
BushMasterBoy
10-25-2013, 11:33
This probably explains why we stopped going to the moon...and will never make it to Mars!
Aloha_Shooter
10-25-2013, 11:39
That's right if you're in Base 11 (or Base A):
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 A as unique digits so 3x4 == 11 ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYUoYJeANq4
Not that I expect Chicago Public School teachers to understand anything about radix conversions ...
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