Have we lost our Patriotism?

[jhirsh5280]

It seems today that I hear more and more stories about our veterans being used and abused. I hear more and more stories about placing a higher value on illegal aliens as the future of our country while kicking our veterans to the curb. The latest budget deal has me seriously questioning whether or not our country has lost its patriotism.

I just spent 1 week in Pearl Harbor with 8 survivors for the 72nd commemoration of the attacks. They told me stories of what it used to be like in this country. When soldiers were respected, when people helped one another out of the goodness of their hearts for God and country. When people didnt worry about payment for services, they just wanted to make sure it got done and done right...the first time. I sat in awe of these men not just for what they did for our country as young men (teenagers really) but for what they stand for and what they believe in. They continually told me throughout the trip that the current iteration of our country is far from what they fought for 72 years ago. They despise Washington, politicians and especially our president.

This is the second year in a row Ive done this trip (Through the "Greatest Generations Foundation") and each time Ive come back was a tremendous sense of pride and excitement, not just about our military and our vets but about our country. Then reality snaps me back and I see stories like the new budget deal that cuts veteran benefits, things like Phil Robertson giving his personal opinion then being lambasted by the media and strong armed by certain groups. It makes me wonder, what are we doing? How have we come so far from those brave young men 72 years ago to now?

I know there are Patriots all over this country and especially on this forum, but I cant help but think the rest of the country has no idea. They choose to ignore what made this country great in the first place. They choose to ignore the sacrifice of our soldiers who literally put their lives on the line and those that pay the ultimate sacrifice in blood. The same people who are now ruining the country our veterans fought and died for are the same people who spit on our returning soldiers from Vietnam and they are trying to do what the Viet Cong, Germans, Japanese, Koreans and Taliban couldnt do. It upsets and saddens me that we dont give more reverence.

I know my country will not die, I know there are good people left who will continue to fight the good fight but I cant help but think: Have we lost our Patriotism?

[ChuckNorris]

A smart person learns from past history. Unfortunately we have too many lazy idiots in this country with the ability to vote - but not the ability to learn or educate themselves.
The old lessons of pride, dignity, and self worth are no longer accepted by the younger generation. They feel that they are entitled by just being born.
I am sick and tired of all of this 'politically correct' crap.
This country needs to stand up and fight back for what is right, and quit rolling over to all of these bleeding heart, liberal assholes!

[Circuits]

Refusal of immigrants to assimilate waters down the national identity. Big swathes of the country are now west-west europe, or east-east-asia or north-north mexico, and they don't really give a crap about US traditional values.

[RblDiver]

Refusal of immigrants to assimilate waters down the national identity. Big swathes of the country are now west-west europe, or east-east-asia or north-north mexico, and they don't really give a crap about US traditional values.

Pffft, CLEARLY you're just a bigot, wanting them to give up THEIR identity. How dare you demand that people who come to join our country also accept our culture?

(*Sigh* Whatever happened to the melting pot, not the salad bowl)

[Ranger353]

Thank you and God bless you for thinking of the Veterans. It seems that the term "Vet" is a dirty foul word in some liberal circles, and I just don't understand why.

[osok-308]

Pffft, CLEARLY you're just a bigot, wanting them to give up THEIR identity. How dare you demand that people who come to join our country also accept our culture?

(*Sigh* Whatever happened to the melting pot, not the salad bowl)

"We should insist that if the immigrant who comes here does in good faith become an

American and assimilates himself to us he shall be treated on an exact equality with every one else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed or birth-place or origin.

But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American and nothing but an American. If he tries to keep segregated with men of his own origin and separated from the rest of America, then he isn't doing his part as an American. There can be no divided allegiance here. . . We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language, for we intend to see that the crucible turns our people out as Americans, of American nationality, and not as dwellers in a polyglot boarding-house; and we have room for but one soul loyalty, and that is loyalty to the American people."
--Theodore Roosevelt

Allowing for people to not speak the language of our country does nothing to increase fellowship among Americans, but it keeps us divided. You cannot be in league with someone unless you have a mutual way to understand one another. If I were planning on living in Germany, you can bet your backside I'd learn German, or if I wanted to live in Russia (God help me) I'd learn Russian. It's respect for the country you choose to live in and those who are allowing such a thing to happen. I work with many immigrants, and I can tell you that I personally will gladly take them trying to speak broken English over their language, mostly because it shows that they are trying to learn and have (at least some level of) respect for this country.

[kidicarus13]

Unfortunately this country will never be what it was 72 years ago as far as patriotism goes. We'll see patriotic periods of time (the months after 9-11) but those periods fade away quickly when a country as a whole is more concerned about where the cast of Jersey Shore is now and the release of the IPhone 6.

[osok-308]

Unfortunately this country will never be what it was 72 years ago as far as patriotism goes. We'll see patriotic periods of time (the months after 9-11) but those periods fade away quickly when a country as a whole is more concerned about where the cast of Jersey Shore is now and the release of the IPhone 6.

Truer words... it is incredibly sad that we have people who care more about people who don't contribute society (Kardashians, Jersey Shore, etc.) than about freedoms being infringed upon. We have people vote one way because p. diddy is endorsing him or because it's cool to vote for someone.

[MED]

I was a kid growing up when the Vietnam vets were coming home, and compared to that, things are GREAT now! I am still saddened and ashamed at what people did back then. My father is a WWII vet, and this country will never be what it was back then...NEVER!!! We live in a country of entitlements and victims along with a good dose of political correctness that drives decisions in public policy. I don't think it is as much of a lack of patriotism that is driving the budget but a push for the socialist agenda that has corrupted this country. People are fickle and they forget quickly so I have no doubt that our newest veterans will be overlooked. I was once an extremely patriotic individual, but I am not any more because of the people that are taking over this country. Our society needs to be flushed.

[Bailey Guns]

Have we lost our Patriotism?

I think you need to define "we". And then I think you'll find your questions rhetorical.

[Bailey Guns]

I was a kid growing up when the Vietnam vets were coming home, and compared to that, things are GREAT now!

Disagree. It's not fashionable to do/say the things in public that the leftists said about the military in the 60s and 70s, and it certainly doesn't help their agenda. In general, the left doesn't give a rat's ass about veterans. It's all about furthering the cause and badmouthing vets, at least in public, hurts the cause.

Think of what liberals typically say: "Oh, yeah. I support the troops, fer sure. I just don't support the wars." I can think of few things that are more hypocritical and transparent than saying/believing something like that.

It's the modern-day version of "baby killer".

[spqrzilla]

The people have not lost their patriotism at all.

Our political class has.

[crays]

The people have not lost their patriotism at all.

Our political class has.

Political Class??? Now there's an oxymoron...extra heavy on the moron. [Coffee]

[<MADDOG>]

"Oh, yeah. I support the troops, fer sure. I just don't support the wars." I can think of few things that are more hypocritical and transparent than saying/believing something like that...

So what is your response if I state, and believe the same? Does that make me a "leftist"?

What if I were to follow up that statement by stating we should have went to Afghanistan and terminated Osama, and anyone else who got in our way, then got the hell out?

What if the comment was made by a soldier who has been to that dump 3,4 times trying to "nation build" and provide security to a bunch of goat f'n, doped out, pedopile savages who know nothing but fighting "infidels"; and lost some of his brothers trying to do the impossible?

[MED]

Disagree. It's not fashionable to do/say the things in public that the leftists said about the military in the 60s and 70s, and it certainly doesn't help their agenda. In general, the left doesn't give a rat's ass about veterans. It's all about furthering the cause and badmouthing vets, at least in public, hurts the cause.

Think of what liberals typically say: "Oh, yeah. I support the troops, fer sure. I just don't support the wars." I can think of few things that are more hypocritical and transparent than saying/believing something like that.

It's the modern-day version of "baby killer".

The left is scum and they will always be scum; no debate on their motives from me. At least the vets didn't have to put up with all the crap this time. Also, I think all the good people stepped up to help this time and the vets were generally treated with respect. Vietnam vets were treated with disdain by most people; it was truly sad.

[MED]

So what is your response if I state, and believe the same? Does that make me a "leftist"?

What if I were to follow up that statement by stating we should have went to Afghanistan and terminated Osama, and anyone else who got in our way, then got the hell out?

What if the comment was made by a soldier who has been to that dump 3,4 times trying to "nation build" and provide security to a bunch of goat f'n, doped out, pedopile savages who know nothing but fighting "infidels"; and lost some of his brothers trying to do the impossible?

Blowing the fuckers up was a worthy objective; establishing a stable democracy was a fools errand.

[Aloha_Shooter]

Patriotism started dying with the Flower Children and Bill Ayres's ilk. The death rate accelerated during Clinton's term and has hit a crescendo during Obama's reign. I mark Nov 6, 2012 as the death of the Founding Fathers' ideals.

[Aloha_Shooter]

Disagree. It's not fashionable to do/say the things in public that the leftists said about the military in the 60s and 70s, and it certainly doesn't help their agenda. In general, the left doesn't give a rat's ass about veterans. It's all about furthering the cause and badmouthing vets, at least in public, hurts the cause.

Think of what liberals typically say: "Oh, yeah. I support the troops, fer sure. I just don't support the wars." I can think of few things that are more hypocritical and transparent than saying/believing something like that.

It's the modern-day version of "baby killer".

I'm with Bailey here. It's not that the liberals have changed their minds or attitudes, it's that they learned how despicable people thought they were for spitting on troops and waving "baby killer" signs so they hide or disguise their attitude in public. Bottom line decisions show today's generation is even worse because so many of them have no connection whatsoever to the structures and traditions that built the country. They just don't think about what it means -- and you see it in the disrespect and disregard shown through daily actions like the stupid beeyatch with the dumb YouTube video at Arlington this past year.

[MED]

Patriotism started dying with the Flower Children and Bill Ayres's ilk. The death rate accelerated during Clinton's term and has hit a crescendo during Obama's reign. I mark Nov 6, 2012 as the death of the Founding Fathers' ideals.

Actually, the death of the Founding Father's Ideals started in 1937 when the court packing plan of FDR led to a switch of interpretation of the Commerce Clause that magically made the New Deal legislation constitutional and brought forth the Nanny States of America.

[MED]

I'm with Bailey here. It's not that the liberals have changed their minds or attitudes, it's that they learned how despicable people thought they were for spitting on troops and waving "baby killer" signs so they hide or disguise their attitude in public. Bottom line decisions show today's generation is even worse because so many of them have no connection whatsoever to the structures and traditions that built the country. They just don't think about what it means -- and you see it in the disrespect and disregard shown through daily actions like the stupid beeyatch with the dumb YouTube video at Arlington this past year.

I guess one truly revealing factor is the election of Obama. I truly can't believe that somebody who was as openly anti-American as Obama was elected as president. How could he say what he said, wrote what he wrote, and associate with who he associated with and be elected. ...because, the people in the country have no sense of country, patriotism, or founding principles; In other words patriotism is dead.

[Bailey Guns]

So what is your response if I state, and believe the same? Does that make me a "leftist"?

What if I were to follow up that statement by stating we should have went to Afghanistan and terminated Osama, and anyone else who got in our way, then got the hell out?

What if the comment was made by a soldier who has been to that dump 3,4 times trying to "nation build" and provide security to a bunch of goat f'n, doped out, pedopile savages who know nothing but fighting "infidels"; and lost some of his brothers trying to do the impossible?

OK...maybe I should have expanded on that because I think you can be against the war and fully support our troops. But to keep this response to a manageable level let me just give you the reader's digest version: when it's said by a solid leftist it's probably going to be apparent in the rest of their behavior and lifestyle. When someone like you or I say it (because frankly I'm way past my tolerance level for the BS in Afghanistan) it's for other reasons. I think you'll get my overall drift with having said that. Because a real explanation would take pages.

A leftist will talk to a soldier and say: "Wow. I, like, really support you and all but how can you follow orders from someone like Bush who's killed millions of innocent people by lying about WMDs, blah, blah, blah". It'll all be bullshit, but, yeah, he supports the troops.

A righty (who's against the war) will say: "I'm glad I never had to serve under a fuck-stick CinC like Obama under those bullshit ROEs that are getting our guys killed for no reason. We should be going in to win the war or we shouldn't be going in."

The left generally has no understanding of honor, duty and sacrifice.

Does that help you understand what I meant?

[Ronin13]

I was just thinking about this earlier today... I was reading a bunch of stuff about the whole Robertson fiasco and thought back to 2001. Remember after 9/11 how our nation came together as one? Everyone waved their flags, stickers and those yellow ribbons adorned nearly every car. Fast forward just a few years and we've become the most split I've seen in my nearly 30 years of being alive. In my lifetime I cannot recall a time where being "American" has ever been something to be disgraceful about, yet some out there would try to convince you that we shouldn't be proud of our nation, our history, and our heritage. Sure our country has done some messed up stuff, but that all pales in comparison to all the good we've done throughout the last 2 1/2 centuries (You're welcome Europe, since you know, only one country speaks German). Further, why are we so divided over all this petty shit? He doesn't like gays? SO FREAKING WHAT!? She wants to get an abortion? OH MY GOD, who cares? I hate to quote a d-bag celebrity, but Jay-Z did have one really good line: "What you eat doesn't make me shit." Why can't we just move on from these petty squabbles and move forward toward a better, more united, more patriotic nation? It seems like so many want to bad mouth this country, then turn around and be hypocrites and not leave it if they don't love it.

[jhood001]

but Jay-Z did have one really good line: "What you eat doesn't make me shit."

That's pretty good right there.

[MED]

I was just thinking about this earlier today... I was reading a bunch of stuff about the whole Robertson fiasco and thought back to 2001. Remember after 9/11 how our nation came together as one? Everyone waved their flags, stickers and those yellow ribbons adorned nearly every car. Fast forward just a few years and we've become the most split I've seen in my nearly 30 years of being alive. In my lifetime I cannot recall a time where being "American" has ever been something to be disgraceful about, yet some out there would try to convince you that we shouldn't be proud of our nation, our history, and our heritage. Sure our country has done some messed up stuff, but that all pales in comparison to all the good we've done throughout the last 2 1/2 centuries (You're welcome Europe, since you know, only one country speaks German). Further, why are we so divided over all this petty shit? He doesn't like gays? SO FREAKING WHAT!? She wants to get an abortion? OH MY GOD, who cares? I hate to quote a d-bag celebrity, but Jay-Z did have one really good line: "What you eat doesn't make me shit." Why can't we just move on from these petty squabbles and move forward toward a better, more united, more patriotic nation? It seems like so many want to bad mouth this country, then turn around and be hypocrites and not leave it if they don't love it.

We can't be a united nation because socialism and liberty are mutually exclusive.

[Bailey Guns]

We can't be a united nation because socialism and liberty are mutually exclusive.

True dat!

[blacklabel]

We can't be a united nation because socialism and liberty are mutually exclusive.

It can't be said better than that.

[Zundfolge]

Actually, the death of the Founding Father's Ideals started in 1937...

No actually the death of the Founding Fathers' Ideals started in 1913 with the rise of the Progressive movement and the presidency of Woodrow Wilson.


We tend to think of the unpatriotic as being leftists, but more and more I'm seeing conservatives losing their patriotism ... hell I'm nowhere near as patriotic as I used to be because more and more I believe that America (the government and its institutions) are becoming the very enemy of the people that our Constitution was written to counter.

I'm deeply committed to the ideals of the founders, but I don't believe that America (the government and its institutions) are even remotely connected to those ideals anymore and America (the people and culture) are headed away from those ideals as well.

How can I remain a patriot when America isn't America anymore?

My Grandfather was the most patriotic man I've ever known ... all I can say is that I'm glad he died while Reagan was still president so he didn't have to see what's become of his beloved nation.

[MED]

My Grandfather was the most patriotic man I've ever known ... all I can say is that I'm glad he died while Reagan was still president so he didn't have to see what's become of his beloved nation.

I think this is why my dad is developing altizimers; it is a defence mechanism from watching the decay. Both my parents make comments that they are ready to go; they don't want to watch.

[blacklabel]

I'm deeply committed to the ideals of the founders, but I don't believe that America (the government and its institutions) are even remotely connected to those ideals anymore and America (the people and culture) are headed away from those ideals as well.

How can I remain a patriot when America isn't America anymore?

I've struggled with this a lot lately. The more I realize how far gone American politics are, the more I realize that I need to focus on my own personal liberty outside of the political cluster.


Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

[Ronin13]

We can't be a united nation because socialism and liberty are mutually exclusive.
Indeed! Touche!

No actually the death of the Founding Fathers' Ideals started in 1913 with the rise of the Progressive movement and the presidency of Woodrow Wilson.

We tend to think of the unpatriotic as being leftists, but more and more I'm seeing conservatives losing their patriotism ... hell I'm nowhere near as patriotic as I used to be because more and more I believe that America (the government and its institutions) are becoming the very enemy of the people that our Constitution was written to counter.

I'm deeply committed to the ideals of the founders, but I don't believe that America (the government and its institutions) are even remotely connected to those ideals anymore and America (the people and culture) are headed away from those ideals as well.

How can I remain a patriot when America isn't America anymore?

My Grandfather was the most patriotic man I've ever known ... all I can say is that I'm glad he died while Reagan was still president so he didn't have to see what's become of his beloved nation.
Well put, however the socialist is soulless, and those who were supposed to be champions of liberty (conservatives) are losing their souls at an alarming rate... By souls I'm referring to the American Patriot Soul. Do not look to Washington for patriots, they're all corrupt and cowardly with a severe lacking in patriotism, if you want a real patriot, look to real life heroes like Marcus Luttrell, Colion Noir, Bill Whittle, Greg Brophy, and Michael Brown.

[MED]

No actually the death of the Founding Fathers' Ideals started in 1913 with the rise of the Progressive movement and the presidency of Woodrow Wilson.

Woodrow Wilson was certainly a douch, but the first wound on the constitution was in 1937. Until then, limits were placed on government. The consequences of the civil war and the move to federalism is an interesting area of study.

[Zundfolge]

Woodrow Wilson was certainly a douch, but the first wound on the constitution was in 1937. Until then, limits were placed on government. The consequences of the civil war and the move to federalism is an interesting area of study.
The first wounds on the constitution were in 1913 with the 16th and 17th amendments ... which came about because of the rise of the Progressive movement and the Wilson presidency.

If you don't buy that (since you are establishing the line as "limits placed on government") then the first wound was 1919 with the passage of the 18th amendment (which used the constitution to limit the rights of the people instead of the power of the government for the first time).

My only point is that America has been infected with the disease of the left for longer than people realize. At this point the damage is what it is so it's somewhat academic to argue when the first wound was inflicted.

[MED]

The first wounds on the constitution were in 1913 with the 16th and 17th amendments ... which came about because of the rise of the Progressive movement and the Wilson presidency.

If you don't buy that (since you are establishing the line as "limits placed on government") then the first wound was 1919 with the passage of the 18th amendment (which used the constitution to limit the rights of the people instead of the power of the government for the first time).

My only point is that America has been infected with the disease of the left for longer than people realize. At this point the damage is what it is so it's somewhat academic to argue when the first wound was inflicted.

This would be an interesting discussion. The progressive movement and women's suffrage was a progression from the abolitionist movement. It is rather interesting to trace it back. At least the amendments followed a process, and I am OK with that even though I may or may not agree with them. If the programs in the New Deal followed the same process where say Social Security was created and limited to a program authorized by an amendment to the constitution, I might disagree but a least it would be defined and limited. However, by circumventing this process, anything can happen and it has. By opening the Commerce Clause as a catch all to any government program, we now have a multi-trillion dollar budget full of entitlement programs, the EPA, etc. I understand that this is the Nirvana of the people you mention, but it is their victory and the foundation of what we have today. And yes, the 16th amendment was a really stupid move!

[<MADDOG>]

OK...maybe I should have expanded on that because I think you can be against the war and fully support our troops. But to keep this response to a manageable level let me just give you the reader's digest version: when it's said by a solid leftist it's probably going to be apparent in the rest of their behavior and lifestyle. When someone like you or I say it (because frankly I'm way past my tolerance level for the BS in Afghanistan) it's for other reasons. I think you'll get my overall drift with having said that. Because a real explanation would take pages.

A leftist will talk to a soldier and say: "Wow. I, like, really support you and all but how can you follow orders from someone like Bush who's killed millions of innocent people by lying about WMDs, blah, blah, blah". It'll all be bullshit, but, yeah, he supports the troops.

A righty (who's against the war) will say: "I'm glad I never had to serve under a fuck-stick CinC like Obama under those bullshit ROEs that are getting our guys killed for no reason. We should be going in to win the war or we shouldn't be going in."

The left generally has no understanding of honor, duty and sacrifice.

Does that help you understand what I meant?

[Beer]

[earplug]

Lincoln sucked my patriotic fever out.

[blacklabel]

Lincoln sucked my patriotic fever out.

[ROFL1]

[Mtn.man]

Revolution ..... Says Jefferson.

[Ronin13]

Is there any credence to what I just heard... Paul Ryan voted for reducing pay for active duty and disabled vets? I feel dirty having voted for that man to be VP if it's true...

[spqrzilla]

I was just thinking about this earlier today... I was reading a bunch of stuff about the whole Robertson fiasco and thought back to 2001. Remember after 9/11 how our nation came together as one? Everyone waved their flags, stickers and those yellow ribbons adorned nearly every car. Fast forward just a few years and we've become the most split I've seen in my nearly 30 years of being alive.

Didn't happen. There were left wing political attacks immediately.

[spqrzilla]

Woodrow Wilson was certainly a douch, but the first wound on the constitution was in 1937. Until then, limits were placed on government. The consequences of the civil war and the move to federalism is an interesting area of study.

Woodrow Wilson had people rounded up and jailed for advocating resistance to the WWI era draft. It was the most repressive time in modern US history. Wilson was the worst President in modern history - the current douche is just crowded him in second place.

[Aloha_Shooter]

Woodrow Wilson had people rounded up and jailed for advocating resistance to the WWI era draft. It was the most repressive time in modern US history. Wilson was the worst President in modern history - the current douche is just crowded him in second place.

Woodrow Wilson had the worst foreign policy of any President in American history ... until Barack Obama.
FDR had the worst economic policy of any President in American history ... until Barack Obama.
FDR had the most unConstitutional Presidency in American history ... until Barack Obama.
Jimmy Carter was the most incompetent President in American history ... until Barack Obama.

Hey, BHO is #1 in four different categories!