View Full Version : Your opinion about a discussion I'm having on FB.
So I'm having a discussion about all the school shootings on FB and a lot of the people are blaming the ease of access to firearms as the problem.
My opinion is I would be all for universal background checks if they gave back all the other things they have taken away like the mag capacity ban etc. back. Private sales should have a check just make it easier and cheaper. Also I believe if you own a gun you should lock it up if you have children in the house. If you don't have children they should be locked up when you are not at home.
What are your opinions?
My opinion is you are real quick to give up my rights and impose restrictions, that have absolutely nothing to do with school incidents involving firearms. Also My home is not a gun free zone.
BPTactical
01-22-2014, 08:35
Uhmm, no Lurch...
"Shall Not be Infringed" is pretty damn clear.
I'm not a fan of Quid Pro Quo, or tit for tat.
I am sick and tired of our rights, regardless of what they are being used for bargaining chips.
UncleDave
01-22-2014, 08:36
It is not a problem of ease of access to firearms, or anything but a parenting problem. You can't handle your kid? We have a pill for that! Kids have too much energy? We have a pill for that! Start holding the parents accountable for the job that they do. I grew up with every kind of weapon, explosive, and heavy equipment at my disposal. However, if any stupid thoughts came into my head there was the assurance that my old man would quite possibly kill me. I was raised with respect. For my parents, the family name, and myself. Put the blame where it belongs. You wanted that cute baby, then take the responsibility and raise them to be responsible and productive members of society. If you do not the you need to be held accountable. Just my .02 [soap]
I'm not giving up any more of my rights and I want the ones taken from me given back. It changes nothing. People breaking the law intent on hurting and killing are going to do just that.
what laws are you going to be okay with when some crazed manic drives a truck into the playground at an elementary?
What laws are you going to be okay with when someone goes on a stabbing spree in a school, or maybe uses a chainsaw?
what tools are you going to ban? What restrictions on those tools should there be when it comes to purchasing? Are you going to do a background check on everybody buying a chainsaw or a set of knives or a collectible sword? What large vehicles should have restrictions. The bigger they are the more killing power they have.
what about airplanes, like the guy who crashed a Cessna into the IRS building in I believe California last year or the year before? Should be ban air travel and only allow drones to fly above?
how deep does the rabbit hole go....
muddywings
01-22-2014, 08:40
America doesn't have a gun problem. It doesn't have a drug problem. It doesn't have a drunk driving problem, an obesity problem, a gang problem or an unwed teenage mothers problem. America has a responsibility problem and until we as a nation can relearn what it is to be a responsible society, no amount of government control will fix our woes.
And don't give in on UBGCs. That won't do anything but lead to registration. So don't allow people to think that it will solve anything. In fact make sure you go out there and show how UBGCs won't solve the problem.
Airplane into building was in Texas.
It hasn't come up yet, but any sentence that begins with, "There should be a law..." should be disregarded in its entirety. Facebool is like those Comcast commercials where the guys asks a table full of kindergarteners why faster is better. That was my opinion before I even opened the thread.
muddywings
01-22-2014, 08:46
also...Facebook is the devil!
I knew most people on here would have these types of opinions and I'm all for parents doing their jobs and I do. But it was mentioned that parents should be held responsible for there kids where does that stop? What if your home is broken into and one of your AR's is stolen and used in a school shooting? Would you like the alphabet agencies crawling around your house asking a bunch of questions about everything else you own?
Granted most laws don't change a thing but it's only going to get worse I believe and the uneducated public is going to start to demand more and more rights be taken away.
America doesn't have a gun problem. It doesn't have a drug problem. It doesn't have a drunk driving problem, an obesity problem, a gang problem or an unwed teenage mothers problem. America has a responsibility problem and until we as a nation can relearn what it is to be a responsible society, no amount of government control will fix our woes.
And don't give in on UBGCs. That won't do anything but lead to registration. So don't allow people to think that it will solve anything. In fact make sure you go out there and show how UBGCs won't solve the problem.
You are absolutely correct and that is a very good statement.
HBARleatherneck
01-22-2014, 08:55
your house is private property. if someone is going to break in (a crime) and steal your stuff(a crime), do you think locking your stuff up again (which you did by locking your door) it is going to stop anyone? i bet 98% of you own a residential security container that someone could break into in a couple minutes or less and steal your guns anyway. Now, should the government mandate gun Vaults? how about TL30 safes? (weigh at least 6000 pounds) or maybe for safety all guns should be kept in the local Armory? thinking that any amount of giving in or locking up is going to lower crime rates is ridiculous thinking. close home depot, sears, lowes they all sell blunt instruments, close all the car dealerships they sell automobiles, close the damn borders they flood our country with criminals. (because we didnt have enough already)
friends are to facebook what cheese is to cheez whiz
Pass more laws...that seems to be working. Do you feel safer yet?
You just had to walk up to that beehive and whack it with a bat didn't you.
I might be willing to even entertain your ideas if compromise didn't mean "You give us something" to the other side. There is no give & take, it is all take.
So UBCs, there are states that have UBCs and even more restrictive licensing schemes for a long time. They still have all their crime issues, gun control does not seem to help there. The argument there is that guns are easily transported so they move in from less restrictive areas but that was debunked as well. I'll dig up the report on where guns recovered from crime scenes came from. Most were stolen or straw purchases which leads us to the second part, safe storage.
Locking valuable or dangerous items away from children is a good idea, there are latches for cupboards, outlets covers, etc. Just because something is a good idea dies not mean there should be a law mandating it. Irresponsible people ill be irresponsible even if there is a law.
Locking away my guns when I'm not home? We all do that, it is called a door. Most of them have locks. Most of us use them.
UncleDave
01-22-2014, 09:07
Name one school shooting that would have been prevented by a UBGC, securing the weapons, or any other harebrained law that is being proposed. Adam Lanza got the weapons he used out of mom's gun safe. Responsibility on the part of the parents could have prevented some of these issues. How about don't put you kids with undeveloped brains on psychotropic drugs that severely damage them. How about raising them with love, attention, and discipline so they don't feel the need to take control in a violent way? Novel idea I know.
Bailey Guns
01-22-2014, 09:12
Most of the recent mass shooters (not just school shooters) passed background checks. I'm sick and tired for being punished for the illegal and/or irresponsible actions of others. Requiring background checks is a "gateway" to further gun restrictions on the law-abiding. When "universal background checks" doesn't stop the problem of mass shootings, the anti-gun liberals will demand some other "fix". It will be apparent the background check solution didn't stop the problem (as it should be now to any rational person) but will we get that back? Of course not. Then we'll be stuck with something else sure to solve the problem...like mandatory storage laws. And that won't work, either. But after that's enacted we won't get back that little bit of freedom, either.
Don't be fooled by the tactics of the left. It's not about stopping criminals. It's about ending your right and mine to freely exercise our 2A rights. It's just easier for most people to agree to "common sense" gun laws like universal background checks rather than just an outright ban on guns. It's called incrementalism. Once we give up something, we never get it back.
"Universal background check" is liberal code talk for "one more link in the gun-ban chain".
I think we should have checks for those that post on FB.
I mean FB needs to be monitored anf edited for stupid shit like this.
People are inherently stupid as proven by the media every morning and evening. FB is an extension of that stupidity.
"Oh i feel sick today"
" My SO left me,"
" I am going to take a shit now, better tell my FB friends"
We will likely NEVER see a mass shooting that originates from a random home break-in where a firearm is found and taken. The first step of a public shooting is very unlikely to be breaking into random houses looking for guns. So what I'm saying is, don't use that as an argument .
hghclsswhitetrsh
01-22-2014, 09:19
Step 1 - Delete Facebook.
Step 2 - flip off hippies.
Hippies are running the country,,, Duh.
I knew most people on here would have these types of opinions and I'm all for parents doing their jobs and I do. But it was mentioned that parents should be held responsible for there kids where does that stop? What if your home is broken into and one of your AR's is stolen and used in a school shooting? Would you like the alphabet agencies crawling around your house asking a bunch of questions about everything else you own?
Granted most laws don't change a thing but it's only going to get worse I believe and the uneducated public is going to start to demand more and more rights be taken away.
I believe the 10 commandments cover the stealing and murdering part. Thou shall not steal. Thou shall not murder.
I actually believe more people are becoming educated on guns and laws relating to them based on the number of new gun sales in recent years.
Delfuego
01-22-2014, 09:29
also...Facebook is the devil!+1
Arguing on facebook is like dancing about architecture...
bjamar24
01-22-2014, 09:34
Who cares what they take and don't take, until our society starts holding people accountable for there actions , nothing gonna change. Guns aren't the problem. People are.
Sent from my SM-N900T using Tapatalk
blacklabel
01-22-2014, 09:34
Uhmm, no Lurch...
"Shall Not be Infringed" is pretty damn clear.
I'm not a fan of Quid Pro Quo, or tit for tat.
I am sick and tired of our rights, regardless of what they are being used for bargaining chips.
Sweet Jesus, this.
Great-Kazoo
01-22-2014, 09:40
Do you really want My Opinion?
blacklabel
01-22-2014, 09:45
Do you really want My Opinion?
Someone get me popcorn pronto!
sellersm
01-22-2014, 09:53
Do you really want My Opinion?
I sense the makings of another video.
Sent from my fat fingers using Tapatalk
sellersm
01-22-2014, 09:54
The problem is evil. Not rules, parents, UBC, or anything else.
Sent from my fat fingers using Tapatalk
UncleDave
01-22-2014, 09:55
God yes, kazoo! [Pop]
IMHO: No. Trading part of my natural rights away so that I am allowed to keep another portion of my natural rights is NOT ok. The biggest problem with this strategy is that those that are trying to strip me of my rights ARE NEVER SATISFIED. They merely ease up for a short time and then come back for another chunk, like some insatiable shark that takes a bite, swims off to swallow it, then returns to take another bite. We are currently subject to hundreds of gun laws restricting our natural right to self defense, and yet those that oppose gun rights still want more. It's worse than Rosie O'Donnell at an all-you-can-eat buffet...
UncleDave
01-22-2014, 10:00
The problem is evil. Not rules, parents, UBC, or anything else.
Sent from my fat fingers using Tapatalk
I agree in spirit, however evil has no place to thrive if kids are raised with respect for their fellow man. Or at least less of a place. The hippy crap of let children do what they want, and explore their individuality without consequences is why we are here. Dr. Spock at the end of his life had to admit that his ideas were wrong, and had created a generation of delinquents.
buying a gun should be like buying a hammer or a chain saw or any other tool
blacklabel
01-22-2014, 10:13
buying a gun should be like buying a hammer or a chain saw or any other tool
Don't worry, they'll eventually start trying to get restrictions in place for those tools too.
There should not be any laws other than the ones outlining consequences for someone infringing upon MY rights and YOUR rights. Other than that... Gov't get out of the citizens' business.
Opinions? Quit wasting your time on Facebook.
Sent from my tactical assault shmart phone
My opinion
Is the basis for how you should live your life.
I would be all for universal background checks
Do UBC's prevent YOU from going out and holding up a liquor store with a pistol? -they don't prevent anyone else from doing that either. Thugs aren't going to walk into Cabelas to buy a Glock, they'll buy it on the street whether we have background checks or not.
if they gave back all the other things they have taken away
They take, they don't give.
Private sales should have a check
The gun I bought in a private sale has not committed any crimes, neither have I. That gun would not be a safer tool had I filled out a 4473 for it.
Also I believe if you own a gun you should lock it up if you have children in the house.
Your children, your house, your rules. Don't force your ideas on others, there's already far too much of that going on.
If you don't have children they should be locked up when you are not at home.
You'd love California, they already have pretty much all the laws you want.
What are your opinions?
My opinions are just that: mine.
BlasterBob
01-22-2014, 10:43
1. If the Ten Commandments were taught, observed and obeyed, there would be a hell of a lot fewer crimes committed.
2. Punishment for crimes should be swift and lawyers should not be allowed to "drag their feet" in getting their subjects to a Quick trial.
3. Let the punishments fit the crime. Publicize the hell out of those punishments. Our great Country is being over run by a huge number of liberal "candy asses".[Mad]
Holger Danske
01-22-2014, 10:54
As stated above delete fb. If you are looking for discussion points then how about a law to arm children on schools. The crazy folks will have to think hard before shooting up a school and the fringe benefit is most bullying problems go away (armed society, polite society).
I say thos tongue im cheek but I imagine a good fb discussion would follow.
newracer
01-22-2014, 10:55
I am tired of giving.
UBCs do nothing.
I have two kids (12 and 15) and feel totally safe leaving firearms unsecured around my house. Matter of fact I know they are more responsible with firearms than many adults. The only reason I keep my firearms secure is I don't always know what friends they will have over and what their experience with firearms is.
This image seems appropriate for this discussion.
http://hsgca.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/compromise_v21.png
newracer
01-22-2014, 10:56
Also no firearms were involved with the worst school massacre in US history.
HBARleatherneck
01-22-2014, 11:02
I dont remember any firearms used in the 9-11 attacks or Oklahoma city. Legislation can not stop evil.
Also no firearms were involved with the worst school massacre in US history.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster)
Also no firearms were involved with the worst school massacre in US history.
??
??
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster
BlasterBob
01-22-2014, 11:25
As long as we have evil people, there will be no way of really stopping their evil deeds. [Evil]
I dont remember any firearms used in the 9-11 attacks or Oklahoma city. Legislation can not stop evil.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bath_School_disaster)
wow thats fucking terrible :(
Great-Kazoo
01-22-2014, 12:02
MY OPINION. SHUT DOWN FB, STOP COMPROMISING, ANYWHERE, ANYTIME, EVER
DON'T IMPOSE WHAT YOU FEEL IS REASONABLE ON ME. My idea of reasonable is to kick the living shit out of people who want me to COMPROMISE. So should i tune you up, because you and i don't agree. OF COURSE NOT. I don't care what you think, or how you want to run your life, hobbies, sex life, ANYTHING.
YOU SHOULD RESPECT THE SAME IDEALS I HAVE AS I DO YOURS. Whether we agree on those ideals or not.
sooner or later, when the ballot box stops working, the bullet box will.
Great-Kazoo
01-22-2014, 12:03
wow thats fucking terrible :(
You need to get up to speed. They allow women to vote i hear, not that i like that idea.
You need to get up to speed. They allow women to vote i hear, not that i like that idea.
We need to get that repealed along with these other b.s. laws :)
HoneyBadger
01-22-2014, 12:10
We need to get that repealed along with these other b.s. laws :)
Yeah, Women's suffrage is awful. Why would anyone want women to suffer?
[facepalm]
Husker95
01-22-2014, 12:12
America doesn't have a gun problem. It doesn't have a drug problem. It doesn't have a drunk driving problem, an obesity problem, a gang problem or an unwed teenage mothers problem. America has a responsibility problem and until we as a nation can relearn what it is to be a responsible society, no amount of government control will fix our woes.
And don't give in on UBGCs. That won't do anything but lead to registration. So don't allow people to think that it will solve anything. In fact make sure you go out there and show how UBGCs won't solve the problem.
Concur with your statement. We do have a little bit of a crazy MF problem. Not sure what the cure is for that.
BlasterBob
01-22-2014, 12:13
We need to get that repealed along with these other b.s. laws :)
As long as we continue having such Legislators as "jail bird/jump suit Rhonda" making our laws, we will continue having [pileoshit]Laws in Colorado.... IMHO.....
blacklabel
01-22-2014, 12:34
MY OPINION. SHUT DOWN FB, STOP COMPROMISING, ANYWHERE, ANYTIME, EVER
DON'T IMPOSE WHAT YOU FEEL IS REASONABLE ON ME. My idea of reasonable is to kick the living shit out of people who want me to COMPROMISE. So should i tune you up, because you and i don't agree. OF COURSE NOT. I don't care what you think, or how you want to run your life, hobbies, sex life, ANYTHING.
YOU SHOULD RESPECT THE SAME IDEALS I HAVE AS I DO YOURS. Whether we agree on those ideals or not.
sooner or later, when the ballot box stops working, the bullet box will.
It was even better than I expected.
Great-Kazoo
01-22-2014, 13:10
It was even better than I expected.
Give the man a Kewpie Doll
ANADRILL
01-22-2014, 13:15
It is not a problem of ease of access to firearms, or anything but a parenting problem. You can't handle your kid? We have a pill for that! Kids have too much energy? We have a pill for that! Start holding the parents accountable for the job that they do. I grew up with every kind of weapon, explosive, and heavy equipment at my disposal. However, if any stupid thoughts came into my head there was the assurance that my old man would quite possibly kill me. I was raised with respect. For my parents, the family name, and myself. Put the blame where it belongs. You wanted that cute baby, then take the responsibility and raise them to be responsible and productive members of society. If you do not the you need to be held accountable. Just my .02 [soap]
Can't handle your state's populous? We have a plant for that....hahahaha
UrbanWolf
01-22-2014, 13:20
Do you really think they will give us some of our right back to trade a Universal background check? No way, they are not here to share powers. The bottom line is made clear by Cuomo-NY governor, they want us gone, DEAD.
KestrelBike
01-22-2014, 14:25
Let me throw this on the fire: Would you.... agree to all items being off NFA, but you still have to pay the $200/ea fee to buy them?
So silencers, select-fire sears, SBRs (& sbs's/aow) would no longer require CLEO/Trust/Corp paperwork and a 6-11mo wait, you can buy and receive them immediately "over the counter" or online but have to pay a magical $200 fee each time.
The boring alternative is hoping some day, some how, executive and legislative branches are stacked hardcore (R) and 1934 & 68/etc acts get repealed.
The boring alternative is hoping some day, some how, executive and legislative branches are stacked hardcore (R) and 1934 & 68/etc acts get repealed.
will never ever happen same way co will never repeal there BC law once those sort of controls are in place there here to stay
n8tive97
01-22-2014, 14:38
Never COMPROMISE!!!
When I am having these types of arguments with people I first frame the discussion. I frame it with gun laws have already gone too far and we (Gun community) have compromised too much already. Then I cite an a perfect example of this.....
The silencer/can/suppressor - is actually a medical device designed to prevent hearing loss. They are REQUIRED in many locations in Europe but ILLEGAL in America thanks to these same dumb people pushing for more laws.
So NO I will not compromise, in fact I want to liberalize the laws so that I can have a medical device which will save my hearing.
(They are usually get speechless then)
wctriumph
01-22-2014, 15:06
TEA baby, TEA!
III
newracer
01-22-2014, 16:04
When I am having these types of arguments with people I first frame the discussion. I frame it with gun laws have already gone too far and we (Gun community) have compromised too much already. Then I cite an a perfect example of this.....
The silencer/can/suppressor - is actually a medical device designed to prevent hearing loss. They are REQUIRED in many locations in Europe but ILLEGAL in America thanks to these same dumb people pushing for more laws.
So NO I will not compromise, in fact I want to liberalize the laws so that I can have a medical device which will save my hearing.
(They are usually get speechless then)
They are not a medical device. They can be considered and engineering control but they are not a medical device. Another point is that with any safety situation dealing with exposure (weather it be noise or contaminants) usually the first thing to consider is engineering controls. The next is administrative controls ie limiting the amount of time of the exposure. The last resort is PPE (personal protective equipment) like hearing protection. I have always wished someone would take this approach with suppressors. I think I saw something a few months ago that the NRA was starting to think about it.
Its all on how you frame them (sales). Silencers when used properly do in fact protect hearing. That is their main function. Which can be stretched to say they are medical in nature as to preserve someones health. Sell the emotional positive and that will win more. I would like to have a suppressor in addition the hearing protection. Because even with my hearing protection it still is not enough sometimes.
I agree no more compromises. You don't like my guns, then don't come to my house! And get off my lawn!
newracer
01-22-2014, 17:09
Its all on how you frame them (sales). Silencers when used properly do in fact protect hearing. That is their main function. Which can be stretched to say they are medical in nature as to preserve someones health. Sell the emotional positive and that will win more. I would like to have a suppressor in addition the hearing protection. Because even with my hearing protection it still is not enough sometimes.
I agree they can protect hearing but to call them a medical device is just plain wrong, they are an engineering control. I deal with the concepts of engineering controls, administrative controls, and PPE everyday with the work I do.
Aloha_Shooter
01-22-2014, 17:31
Absolutely not. Anyone who thinks these kinds of shootings are caused by access rather than lack of moral character (which is a direct result of the education "reforms", societal "changes", and unfounded "hope" of the last 40-50 years) needs a swift kick in the head. If ease of access is the primary factor, why didn't we see these 50-60 years ago or a 100 years ago when the rifles were stored in the closet or hung on the wall?
These kinds of postulations come from pustules who seek a scapegoat for the failures in their social engineering and indoctrination campaigns.
Tell your Facebook "friends" to grow up, read some history (preferably from first hand sources instead of the "progressive" pap they're handing out in schools these days), and learn to think critically.
spqrzilla
01-22-2014, 17:38
Sixty years ago, insane people were involuntarily committed to mental hospitals. Since then, we elect them to office. Clayton Cramer has found that almost no states had laws forbidding insane people from possessing firearms before 1968 .... because they didn't need such laws to restrain people who were already locked up in mental hospitals.
Let me throw this on the fire: Would you.... agree to all items being off NFA, but you still have to pay the $200/ea fee to buy them?
So silencers, select-fire sears, SBRs (& sbs's/aow) would no longer require CLEO/Trust/Corp paperwork and a 6-11mo wait, you can buy and receive them immediately "over the counter" or online but have to pay a magical $200 fee each time.
The boring alternative is hoping some day, some how, executive and legislative branches are stacked hardcore (R) and 1934 & 68/etc acts get repealed.
Versus what we have now, sure I'd take that. That deal would be all gain no loss for us.
I agree they can protect hearing but to call them a medical device is just plain wrong, they are an engineering control. I deal with the concepts of engineering controls, administrative controls, and PPE everyday with the work I do.
Ok so you are coming at this from a scientific mindset. Sadly facts sell a person on an idea or product about 10% of the time. The rest is emotional appeal or triggers. I don't care how I get to a point as long as I win and winning in this regards will save peoples hearing.
DavieD55
01-22-2014, 19:19
Universal background checks will be used to deny people of their rights for any reason the state sees fit, such as a heart condition that one has to take meds for in order to survive. Another scenario would be for someone whose doctor prescibed them the sleep aide Ambien for a better nights sleep. Even something as minor as a f------ parking/turn signal ticket could be used against you. It will also be used to bring about gun registration. (Just like every communist country in the world)
There is zero room for compromise in these times or any other times. We have been compromising for decades and where has it lead us too other than more bureaucracy and loss of liberty... As it was stated on post #3 by BPTactical, The Bill of Rights are not to be used as bargaining chips period.
Great-Kazoo
01-22-2014, 19:27
NEVER GIVE UP ----------------------------- NEVER SURRENDER
https://sp1.yimg.com/ib/th?id=H.4721377210732853&pid=15.1
NEVER GIVE UP ----------------------------- NEVER SURRENDER
https://sp1.yimg.com/ib/th?id=H.4721377210732853&pid=15.1
By Granthar's Hammer... Do I need a permit for that hammer?
My opinion.
NO on "gun-free" zones which aren't so gun-free after all now are they
NO on the UBC.
NO on the NFA
Like BPTactical said - shall not be infringed....period. No, nicht, nyet,
I got rid of my FB... Less stuff for my Clearance Investigator to deal with.
electronman1729
01-22-2014, 22:37
39717
osok-308
01-23-2014, 08:05
America doesn't have a gun problem. It doesn't have a drug problem. It doesn't have a drunk driving problem, an obesity problem, a gang problem or an unwed teenage mothers problem. America has a responsibility problem and until we as a nation can relearn what it is to be a responsible society, no amount of government control will fix our woes.
This is so accurate, I'd like to buy you a beer! [Beer]
rockhound
01-23-2014, 08:43
a school is a soft target, how many time does this have to happen before we as a country take our security in schools more seriously? I totally agree that parents are not teaching their kids respect, responsibility and a whole slew of other things that have been lost in the way we raise our kids, but the schools are sitting ducks.
the Arapahoe high school shooter entered through a door that routinely gets propped open by students and teachers because the locked entry door is too inconvenient. WTF, I hope claire's parents lawyers have a field day with this one. What does it take to get your attention. Every teacher who allowed this door to be propped open should be fired immediately. Why is there not a system theat tell the official, hey there is a door open that should not be.
Our schools are sitting ducks, we are so damned concerned about security in every f..... country but our own. We need to secure Iraq, Syria, Afg, they all need our help our funding, our military. No where in the constitution have i seen the requirement that we provide for the national defense of every nation on the planet. I have seen the requirement that we provide for our national defense.
If you think that school shootings will stop before we secure the schools you are crazy. Here is an idea, let's stop spending billion fighting wars in places that don't mean crap. War on terror ha, what a joke. If you think that going into Irag, Iran, AFG is going to put a stop to muslim extremists you are again crazy. Unless you kill every last one of them they will be back, They are already back in Iraq and all we have done is stir the pot.
So here is a novel idea, secure the schools and our borders. Every school in Israel is locked down as well as their borders. They get it, They understand it, Bring our military home, place an armed trained veteran, at least one, at every school. use the billions you spend on defending other countries on sensors for our schools. This kid at arapahoe walked through the parking lot and into the building with a shotgun. I highly doubt he had it in his pocket. The security personnel should have put him down before he ever got close to the building.
We give so much lip service to how much our schools need to be secure and have done nothing to change it. We spend billions everywhere, but where it should be spent. We dont have secure schools, we don't have secure borders, we don't have security anywhere it matters and taking guns away from law abiding citizens won't change that.
A back ground check will keep a gun out the criminals hands who is trying to buy a gun legally. How many felons are trying to buy a gun legally? very f...... few tha'ts how many. What will that accomplish as far as school security???? nothing
I don't want to hear about another gun law until we pull our heads out of our butts and secure the building. Let me tell you something, if you think the random kids getting pissed off and going after a bully or two in school is bad, wait until a terrorist decides that a school in this country will be a good target for him. Secure the building period,
a school is a soft target, how many time does this have to happen before we as a country take our security in schools more seriously? I totally agree that parents are not teaching their kids respect, responsibility and a whole slew of other things that have been lost in the way we raise our kids, but the schools are sitting ducks.
A back ground check will keep a gun out the criminals hands who is trying to buy a gun legally. How many felons are trying to buy a gun legally? very f...... few tha'ts how many. What will that accomplish as far as school security???? nothing
I don't want to hear about another gun law until we pull our heads out of our butts and secure the building. Let me tell you something, if you think the random kids getting pissed off and going after a bully or two in school is bad, wait until a terrorist decides that a school in this country will be a good target for him. Secure the building period,
Well said... Most schools I can guarantee can achieve a 100% survival rate in the event of a fire. Everyone drills for this event (which is very rare) over and over multiple times per year. We've gotten so good that if your kid's school caught fire today, sure you'd be worried, but you wouldn't be in paralyzing fear that they were killed. Now change that to a rare, but we still hear about it, case of a shooting. They have sprinklers to put out the fire, why not have armed teachers to put down the shooter? I agree with the SRO programs many LE agencies have, but one cop in one school may not have the best response time. Have you been in a large high school? If you're on one side, even at a dead sprint it could take 5min just to get to the other side. Meanwhile, 1 in 5 teachers armed could have a much better response time... Just my opinion on it.
And Rockhound, one other thing about laws and background checks- I'm sure you agree, what about those who want to do bad things that have no criminal history? We can't say it enough times and with enough volume: If they haven't been convicted of a crime a background check is 110% useless. If you can pass a BGC, it's impossible to predict that someone with a clean background won't buy a gun, then do bad with it. But those numbers are a fraction of a percent compared to the rest of us who buy guns and DON'T do anything wrong. Again, go figure, punish the law abiding citizens because some democrat lawmaker will "feel better." [Roll1]
clublights
01-23-2014, 16:45
Ease of Access ???
WHAT THE FUCK ?
The ease of access to firearms is the most restricted it has EVER BEEN in the history of the USA.
look back a number of years when you could buy them at any hardware store... or order them shipped to your doorstep or of the back of a magazine.. no back ground checks, no registration no bullshit. just here's your gun.
They have a " bunch" of school shootings back then ?
yeah I didn't think so.
The "ease of access" argument is pure bullshit.
So I'm having a discussion about all the school shootings on FB and a lot of the people are blaming the ease of access to firearms as the problem.
My opinion is I would be all for universal background checks if they gave back all the other things they have taken away like the mag capacity ban etc. back. Private sales should have a check just make it easier and cheaper. Also I believe if you own a gun you should lock it up if you have children in the house. If you don't have children they should be locked up when you are not at home.
What are your opinions?
^opinion : i thought this thread could not be any dumber until i read nynco's post
When I am having these types of arguments with people I first frame the discussion. I frame it with gun laws have already gone too far and we (Gun community) have compromised too much already. Then I cite an a perfect example of this.....
The silencer/can/suppressor - is actually a medical device designed to prevent hearing loss. They are REQUIRED in many locations in Europe but ILLEGAL in America thanks to these same dumb people pushing for more laws.
So NO I will not compromise, in fact I want to liberalize the laws so that I can have a medical device which will save my hearing.
(They are usually get speechless then)
[werdo][hahhah-no] [facepalm]
rockhound
01-23-2014, 19:26
And Rockhound, one other thing about laws and background checks- I'm sure you agree, what about those who want to do bad things that have no criminal history? We can't say it enough times and with enough volume: If they haven't been convicted of a crime a background check is 110% useless. If you can pass a BGC, it's impossible to predict that someone with a clean background won't buy a gun, then do bad with it. But those numbers are a fraction of a percent compared to the rest of us who buy guns and DON'T do anything wrong. Again, go figure, punish the law abiding citizens because some democrat lawmaker will "feel better." [Roll1]
too true.
Does anyone have a good link to a synopsis of the rights lost in those acts? I am not trying to dispute the loss of rights. I am just trying to learn more.
And what is wrong with my post? Are you taking issue with the world "liberalize"? Because I am referring to the textbook definition of that word which means to open up and left free. I chose that word on purpose to put it into the gun control freaks face.
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