9mm AR Pistol

[Marine24]

Had a chance to shoot a Sig PM400 AR pistol, which got me to thinking about building a one in 9mm. I already have a 9mm AR rifle and a number of Colt/Metalform magazines and some modified Uzi mags, which makes this proposition much easier to accomplish.

Prefer to use a dedicated lower instead of a mag block. With the Colt/Metalform magazines, I have no issues running production or reloads through my AR. Little less reliable with the modified Uzi mags.

CMMG looks to be a good place to start with the pistol version of the Mk9 PDW (http://www.cmmginc.com/product_p/90a3bad.htm), but finding one is proving very difficult. Building one seems easy enough and sounds like I need to start with the lower.

Appreciate any comments/recommendations from those that have gone down this road before with either a CMMG build or possible alternatives to a 9mm AR pistol.

[sako55]

I have been happy with my Rock River dedicated but if I had it to do over I would have got the lower with the mag well machined down.

[ThunderSquirrel]

Building one is pretty straight forward.
I run a CMMG 9mm Ramped bolt and a standard AR hammer and have had no issues.
I went with a 9mm Upper, only because I didn't want the Forward Assist (no cuts on the bolt anyways) and no gas tube hole in the front of the upper.
My build was on a DDLES Lower. The lower is absolutely fantastic, but I think DDLES is still having production issues / ownership issues / etc, so getting one is near impossible.
CMMG may be your best bet. I don't think Oly sells just the 9mm lower, but I could be wrong on that.
Barrel wise I would check ADCO out, I have a 5" threaded barrel that I got from them and it has been great. They offer an assortment of lengths as well.

[fullmann]

DDLES is where it's at for a dedicated lower, too bad they are now defunct.

Fortunately for you, these guys picked up the design and ran with it....

http://www.qcircle10.com

so far everybody likes em, and they actually deliver.

[Great-Kazoo]

DDLES is where it's at for a dedicated lower, too bad they are now defunct.

Fortunately for you, these guys picked up the design and ran with it....

http://www.qcircle10.com

so far everybody likes em, and they actually deliver.

QC10 has good CS. There's another place producing also beside them which completely evades me at this time. Both offer dedicated Glock or Colt style units.

[RCCrawler]

While mine is an SBR and not a pistol everything but the stock is the same. I was lucky enough to get a ddles lower and I love it. It's a very solid shooter.

I personally do not like the looks of a mag block or even the companies that leave the magwell .223 size. Just looks bad to me to have this giant magwell with a tiny mag sticking out of it.

[Marine24]

Okay so that is what everyone has been talking about on the milled down mag wells. That does look better compared to the stick magazine coming out of a AR sized magwell.

[ray1970]

If you do decide to go with a factory model, I'm fairly certain Bowers Tactical had one of the CMMG 9mm pistols last time I was in there.

[Marine24]

Thanks. Lobbed an e-mail to QC10 on the lowers, plus made a call in to Bowers yesterday on what he had available or could put together. They helped me with my 9mm AR rifle.

[fullmann]

Fuel for your fire on the colt pattern lower...

http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t417/fullmann/91FFC751-7B98-4CF8-9ADF-CE98BE0CFBA8-784-0000004E02A14C62_zps4261ca50.jpg (http://s1058.photobucket.com/user/fullmann/media/91FFC751-7B98-4CF8-9ADF-CE98BE0CFBA8-784-0000004E02A14C62_zps4261ca50.jpg.html)

[sako55]

Fuel for your fire on the colt pattern lower...

http://i1058.photobucket.com/albums/t417/fullmann/91FFC751-7B98-4CF8-9ADF-CE98BE0CFBA8-784-0000004E02A14C62_zps4261ca50.jpg (http://s1058.photobucket.com/user/fullmann/media/91FFC751-7B98-4CF8-9ADF-CE98BE0CFBA8-784-0000004E02A14C62_zps4261ca50.jpg.html)



Since I have two short uppers, I am real tempted to buy one of those lowers and bar that one as well. Damn stamp collecting!!!

[Marine24]

Hard to argue that the QC10 lowers look better that the CMMG version with the full size magwells. Mike at Bowers thinks he may have a line on one direct from CMMG, plus there are a couple on GB. I can see a Form 1 in the future.

[ThunderSquirrel]

More fuel for a colt pattern lower.
52819

[Marine24]

The one I have coming in. Upgraded CMMG 9mm AR with 8.5" barrel and faux suppressor.

http://i598.photobucket.com/albums/tt67/Marine24_1911/a63419b6-4c13-443b-be72-47b6c07ee221_zps25c22e8b.jpg (http://s598.photobucket.com/user/Marine24_1911/media/a63419b6-4c13-443b-be72-47b6c07ee221_zps25c22e8b.jpg.html)

[CareyH]

More fuel for a colt pattern lower.
52819

Oh why did you post that....now I want to do one!!!

[mtnrider]

I have a QC 10 lower on the way as we speak (Colt pattern). Can't wait to start this build. Form 1 to be filed as soon as I get the lower. Pics to follow once I start the build

[longhunter]

When I was looking to do a 9mm build I went with a standard lower with a mag block. Although, at the time, there were dedicated 9mm lowers I was looking for an SBR that was not a one-trick pony. I was looking for the ability to change it up later down the line (to a different caliber if I wanted).
I still think that this has merit for the guy that has only one or two registered SBR lowers, but for a guy that has several (or plans to have several) then a dedicated pistol caliber lower might be the way to go. They certainly look nicer (important to some).
To the OP question, a pistol build has all the advantages of the small OAL of a SBR without the hassle/expense of the tax stamp and the out of state travel papperwork. Like the old west I appreciate the handgun/rifle ammo comparability, but most of all I like how a pistol caliber carbine in the hands of a new shooter, kid, or smaller statutured adult can be running it quickly/confidently in a shorter period of time(due to its lesser muzzle blast, lower muzzle rise, etc) as apposed to a intermediate rifle caliber.

[Marine24]

I'm with you on that last point. My son was always a little intimidated by my AR, but handed him the 9mm AR and I couldn't get it away from him. Now he is shooting my 308 AR and 1911s like they are nothing.

AR pistol still has a lot of noise and concussion but expect the 9mm AR pistol will be a great fit.

I'll pull the faux suppressor and replace it with either a Vortex or Wilson Accu-tech


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Great-Kazoo]

PLAN B
Been waiting on a QC10 lower for a few. After reading reviews & feed back from owners i pick this JRC unit up.

Start with the cons: It's not an AR, so that negates a bare receiver pistol build. They are also hard to locate and depending who stocks them, are damn proud of their pricing.

Pros: Like QC10 uses glock mags.
Yes you can get a Colt pattern 9mm lower, Unless you have a nice pile of colt, uzi or other compatible mags, it's off the radar. I have a nice Oly 10.5 upper / sbr with plenty of those once $5 or less per Sten mags.

Anyway back to the JRC

Smooth action, feeds any 9mil i had. Small mag well lower, which some folks prefer (cosmetics) i guess. Threaded bbl (1/2 - 28) from factory, flat top receiver and quad rail, ORC .

AMBIDEXTROUS w /out having to buy or send to factory your gun for right - left hand operation. Perfect for our needs.

Without a flash hider follow up shots were no problem. Need to do a range trip so we can shoot at targets, instead of the area we shot today.

SUPPRESSED... it needs a blast shield, being an ambi unit to keep that sand storm of fired rounds away from your face. I'll fab a few ideas i have to see what works without looking like , well something i fab'd up ;)

Another + for the JRC, The carbine is offered in 9, 45 & 40 S&W. They also offer conversion kits. Off comes the stock and hand guards. Remove BCG , BBL and mag well. Install conversion kit and re-assemble.

Outside of the Non-AR upper & lower. This carbine uses AR furniture. You can magpul, tapco, utg away your butt stock and hand guards. The trigger group, again AR. I went from the stock unit to an ALG QMS before shooting .

Optics definitely something that co-witness' with Irons. anything on the rail is too low (for me) with comfortable cheek weld.

Did i mention it takes glock mags. This 9 works with 10rd G26 to the 33rd ones. Other reviews say the KCI mags function w/out issues. If i can find the one i have we shall see. YMMV

52995 52997

[cstone]

I once wanted a .40 S&W AR that used Glock mags. I settled on the Kel Tec Sub2k, and got a carbine that folded in half and fits in a pretty small bag. It is a bit of an ugly duckling, but is surprisingly accurate out to 100-150 yards on silhouette targets. Also, the $300 price makes the only close competitor a Hi-Point carbine which takes proprietary magazines.

[mtnrider]

I once wanted a .40 S&W AR that used Glock mags. I settled on the Kel Tec Sub2k, and got a carbine that folded in half and fits in a pretty small bag. It is a bit of an ugly duckling, but is surprisingly accurate out to 100-150 yards on silhouette targets. Also, the $300 price makes the only close competitor a Hi-Point carbine which takes proprietary magazines.

When's the last time you saw a sub-2K for $300? They are just now starting to get down to the $450-$600 range. I've seen them as high as $800+

I had one. Mine was not near as accurate as yours though.

[cstone]

Just like AR prices, they are coming down. Kel Tec makes some interesting firearms, but they often create far more demand than their production can keep up with. I wouldn't pay more than $400 for one, but haven't kept track of current prices.

Did you have a 9mm or .40 S&W? Could you hit 10" paper plates at 100 yards? Mine is good for 10" to 12" groups, off hand out to 150 yards with maybe a flier here or there. I would never consider it a tack driver, but I would definitely take the 16" barrel of the S2K over my Glock 22 at 150 yards.

I don't keep guns in trucks, but the S2K would definitely fit that role nicely.

[mtnrider]

You'll never find one for $400 now Lol!

I had a 9mm. Cool design either way but mine was not a great shooter at all.

[Great-Kazoo]

You'll never find one for $400 now Lol!

I had a 9mm. Cool design either way but mine was not a great shooter at all.

Neither the spouse or i like the extra effort needed to charge it vs an AR or the JRC. Sights are so - so. But each to their own. There are deals out there, IF you act quick, just like the trading post.



http://www.armslist.com/posts/3750056/colorado-springs-colorado-rifles-for-sale--new-kel-tec-sub-2000-40s-w-semi-auto-rifle-for-glock-mags-sub2k

not a bad price, considering it has the Keltec rail
http://www.armslist.com/posts/3731666/fort-collins-colorado-rifles-for-sale-trade--kel-tec-sub-2000-9mm-w--upgraded-kel-tec-quad-rail-and-red-dot-sight

[Sixgun]

I put 500 rds through mine today and it ran perfect. Ate everything I feed it..
CMNG MK9 pistol.
30-35yrd groups
http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac59/Sixgunjr/Mobile%20Uploads/946FDA6D-7BEA-448A-86F5-BF50561847A8.jpg (http://s885.photobucket.com/user/Sixgunjr/media/Mobile%20Uploads/946FDA6D-7BEA-448A-86F5-BF50561847A8.jpg.html)