View Full Version : DougCO K9 attacks and kills small dog
Sad all around. According to the SO the deputy was on call while watching his daughter's soccer practice and was authorized to be in his patrol vehicle, have his dog along in case he needed to respond to a situation.
http://www.dcsheriff.net/newsroom/dcso-thornton-police-investigating-dcso-k-9-incident-another-dog/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=dcso-thornton-police-investigating-dcso-k-9-incident-another-dog
My own dog doesn't like small dogs, I do everything I can to keep her away from them-I don't go to dog parks, I don't walk her near small dogs, this would kill me if my dog ever did something like that. She likes one small dog-my older son and d-i-l have a little puggle that she loves and she loves puppies. Small dogs though drive her nuts even if they never see her-if she's them she turns into a completely different creature from her normal loving self.
Sad, sad, sad. Can't imagine what the owner of the little thing is going through. I can only imagine how hard it is for the K9 officer-everyone I've known is a huge animal lover.
Sad. I wonder how the incident came about? :(
The K9, a Belgian Malinois apparently jumped out of the window of the police vehicle and killed a Shih Tzu that was walking past. It happened in a park near 136th and Holly in Thornton. The K9 handler was cited for loose dog and the K9 has been removed from police service.
I couldn't find any information about why the K9 attacked the little dog.
So, this got me thinking, as I walk my dogs when I take my kid to the park. I've always thought I'd have to use my CCW on a dog long before a person. So in this scenario, the K9 attacks your dog, your kid right nearby. I would shoot the K9. Justified?
Doubt it. Dogs are considered property and you could take your kid and run while your dog is running interference.
So, this got me thinking, as I walk my dogs when I take my kid to the park. I've always thought I'd have to use my CCW on a dog long before a person. So in this scenario, the K9 attacks your dog, your kid right nearby. I would shoot the K9. Justified?
Pulled the thought right out of my head! A dog attacks your dog, you shoot it in defense, turns out to be a cop dog.....now what?
Great-Kazoo
12-22-2014, 20:02
There will be a protest tomorrow , we're asking all pets to rally at the park for a non-violent protest. The pups will proceed towards the denver humane society, asking once again for a peaceful resolve to the ongoing attacks against non le pups.
The media has been alerted. If contacted by any right wing media PLEASE let them know we are calling this a Pee In.
Posters with the slogan PAWS UP, DON'T POOP among others will be visible throughout the procession. Hopefully it will remain a peaceful protest.
HOWEVER we have been informed an outside elemenbt consisting of pitbulls and other viscious dogs may try disrupting the event. Doing what they can to give the Peaceful pups a pigment enhanced eye.
Remember if it will spay one life isn't it worth it.
[Sarcasm2] included for the sensitive members among us. Who might take offense for including pitbulls as outside agitators.
[MOD: Edited. Not here]. [panic]
If it's like a number of the Shih Tzus I've been around, it thought it was the toughest dog looking for a fight.
Doubt it. Dogs are considered property and you could take your kid and run while your dog is running interference.
So then if one piece of property is destroying another piece of property, can I destroy that piece of property?
SideShow Bob
12-22-2014, 21:07
"I can't Bark.......I can't Bark.........
So then if one piece of property is destroying another piece of property, can I destroy that piece of property?
I suppose if a riding lawn mower was on the loose, and heading straight for your Bose outdoor speaker that looks like a rock, and you felt confident enough to explain to the police why you unloaded a mag on the latest model mower with a 42" blade and zero degree turning radius; then you might as well be able to explain why you shot a police dog.
I honestly ask myself the same question when I'm out running with my dog. I'd more than likely attempt to engage the offending dog into a River Dance to the death first; and if my calf accidentally hit the dog in the teeth and got stuck there, I may deploy the pistol in order to free myself.
SideShow Bob
12-22-2014, 21:14
Isn't there a recent case here in the Metro area where someone used his CCW to shoot a large dog attacking his small dog while he was walking it ? And no charges were filed. Both civilian dogs though.
And also, don't the PoPo charge you with assaulting an officer if you injure a K9 while it is chomping the crap out of you ?
Isn't there a recent case here in the Metro area where someone used his CCW to shoot a large dog attacking his small dog while he was walking it ? And no charges were filed. Both civilian dogs though.
And also, don't the PoPo charge you with assaulting an officer if you injure a K9 while it is chomping the crap out of you ?
First part happened in Commerce City, twice.
As for the second question, I think so, but don't know for sure and don't want to find out.
Not that the decision should be solely based on a monetary basis, but here are the options as I see them:
Draw and shoot at K9 in order to save your dog. If all goes well, you hit the K9 on the first shot and put the K9 down without any collateral damage. Then you hire an attorney to defend your actions and it only costs you attorney fees and you are cleared of any charges, if any.
Fail to draw and the K9 seriously injures or kills your dog. The employing agency and jurisdiction then begin negotiations on what type of settlement they can provide to avoid a lengthy civil suit.
Unless your life or the life of another human being is threatened, deadly force would probably not be the wisest decision. Obviously, the decision will be yours.
Be safe.
Real question is, is this aggressive dog going to be protected by the blue brotherhood? Or treated as every other aggressive dog and ordered to be put down?
The was a case a few years ago in the Springs where a guy (ccw permit & carrying) was walking his dog, it was attacked by a loose dog and the guy shot/killed that dog. No charges against the guy, I'll dig around and see if I can find more.
This Mal obviously has issues with small dogs. I'm curious how it was able to jump out a window as I thought there is a barrier surrounding the dog area in the truck (it's a Tahoe fyi).
In my opinion:
This attack was the fault of the handler...not the dog. The handler was cited for the offense, and the DCSO will be paying some hefty settlement when all is said and done.
I would not like to see any animal put down based on one instance of a negligent owner or in this case a handler.
Very interesting points. I'm curious to see what the settlement figure ends up being.
The was a case a few years ago in the Springs where a guy (ccw permit & carrying) was walking his dog, it was attacked by a loose dog and the guy shot/killed that dog. No charges against the guy, I'll dig around and see if I can find more.
This Mal obviously has issues with small dogs. I'm curious how it was able to jump out a window as I thought there is a barrier surrounding the dog area in the truck (it's a Tahoe fyi).
That permit carrier may have just read your post...
Did the dog properly identify itself as a law enforcement officer?
On a side note, all the stories from this summer, where the homeowner shot the neighbors dog who attacked his dog seem to be gone.
Great-Kazoo
12-23-2014, 00:08
"I can't Bark.......I can't Bark.........
#puppies ;)
So, this got me thinking, as I walk my dogs when I take my kid to the park. I've always thought I'd have to use my CCW on a dog long before a person. So in this scenario, the K9 attacks your dog, your kid right nearby. I would shoot the K9. Justified?
Absolutely. I Hope I never have to shoot a dog due to owner's negligence since I'm such a dog lover and understand it's not the dog's fault but either way my dog trusts me and would do anything to protect me so I return that level of trust and commitment because I'm emotionally drawn to. My dogs are a part of my small family that I would do anything for. This is why I get so mad at other dog owners who ignore leash laws because their dog is good and would never do that. Meanwhile, every dog that has ever attacked has an owner who shockingly claims they've never done that before and they never suspected it was even possible. If I had to shoot someone's dog to protect me, my wife or my dogs I would promptly holster my firearm and locate the owner for the ass kickin' of the decade for forcing me to do such a thing since it was ultimately his fault.
Police K9s tend to be Alphas (goes with the job), particularly those that serve dual duty as detection dogs and "police" dogs. My stepkid is partnered with one of DSD's bomb dogs, and she is quite dog aggressive, so she has never met our Shihtzu princesses. FWIW, I will(and have) position myself between any large dog moving in an aggressive manner towards our girls, placing myself in the "line of fire", so to speak. 999 times out of a thousand, they are merely curious. That one time, though, steel toes and copper jackets are among the options.
Link to a dog shooting here in the Springs in Feb 2012 - http://www.denverpost.com/ci_20041343
And another one: http://www.fox21news.com/news/story.aspx?list=194968&id=589008#.VJtaCZCcA
airborneranger
12-25-2014, 07:21
We had some white to trash kids move into our Springs neighborhood a while back. They decided to get a Great Dane and let it run the hood. When my girls were little it would tear out of their yard straight towards my girls. As the dog got older, it got bigger and more aggressive. One day it tore across the street towards my girls. I was able to snag it by its collar and drag it back to its house. I explained to the idiots that I always had my CCW and that if their stupid dog came charging into my yard again that I was going to put a bullet in its head. I never had a problem again.
Merry Christmas!!!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
bobbyfairbanks
12-25-2014, 07:40
My dog is like a son to me this officer should face criminal charges. Stop the double standard
My dog is like a son to me this officer should face criminal charges. Stop the double standard
I tend to agree with this statement & unfortunately an example needs to be made. People need to realize that properly restraining your dog is not only important but it's the law... for everyone.
My dog is like a son to me this officer should face criminal charges. Stop the double standard
I understand and agree with the sentiment. The handler was cited by Thornton PD for failure to maintain control of the K9. The DCSO and the handler are likely to both be sued. There will likely be significant impact on the future employment for the handler.
I'm unclear on the "double standard" you would like stopped.
bobbyfairbanks
12-25-2014, 10:51
A K9 is treated as a officer. A family dog is treated as property.
I understand and agree with the sentiment. The handler was cited by Thornton PD for failure to maintain control of the K9. The DCSO and the handler are likely to both be sued. There will likely be significant impact on the future employment for the handler.
I'm unclear on the "double standard" you would like stopped.
The "double standard" is the "no fault" treatment of cop dogs that do wrong, just like the no fault treatment of so many cops that do wrong. The "blue wall" of protection, or whatever it's called. The police union's stance that no officer's actions while on duty is wrong.
theGinsue
12-25-2014, 11:31
#puppies ;)
Took me 1/2 a second to get that. Very funny & well played.
The handler has been criminally cited. The K9 was removed from service. I don't know exactly how every case of a dog attack is handled, but so far this incident seems to have been handled consistent with other similar incidents, regardless of who owns the dog.
Obviously, if the K9 has a history of aggressive behavior, then the dog is likely to be put down. It has been my experience that K9 histories are much better documented than non-service dogs.
I guess we will see if this case is handled much differently than other similar cases, but up to the present it seems as it is being handled pretty much like most other dog on dog attacks.
Does anyone have additional information about the Thornton police or prosecutors giving preferential treatment to the K9, handler or DCSO?
The dog was only on the job for 6 months, she's 3 yrs old. The deputy has been a handler for a long time with a hiatus for other duties until this dog came along. I'm sure the sheriff has reached out to the owner, probably doing everything he can to have her not sue. Stay tuned.
More info on the deputy and dog (Freia) here:
http://k9friends.org/dc-k9-unit
A K9 is treated as a officer. A family dog is treated as property.
This should not be the case.
bobbyfairbanks
12-25-2014, 23:08
This should not be the case.
Exactly
Bailey Guns
12-26-2014, 06:10
This should not be the case.
It isn't the case. But, of course, if fits the anti-cop narrative of some here. If you kill a police K9 you won't be charged with murder of a police officer.
As has already been pointed out, the officer involved has been cited and the K9 removed from service. How is that special treatment?
The "double standard" is the "no fault" treatment of cop dogs that do wrong, just like the no fault treatment of so many cops that do wrong. The "blue wall" of protection, or whatever it's called. The police union's stance that no officer's actions while on duty is wrong.
Where do you get your information on this incident Rondog?
The officer was cited for a criminal investigation and is under investigation by his agency. The dog is not able to do his work for the agency and his ability to continue as a police dog is in jeopardy.
Please show me the source of your "no fault" treatment of this officer and the dog.
Where is that blue wall of protection in this case?
Please show me the police union quote on this incident.
bobbyfairbanks
12-26-2014, 08:54
If the roles where reversed and it was a private citizens dog that killed a police K9 that private citizen would be in jail. The cop was cited big deal.
jerrymrc
12-26-2014, 10:07
And I think this has run its course.
SideShow Bob
12-26-2014, 11:19
IBTL?
YEP !
If the roles where reversed and it was a private citizens dog that killed a police K9 that private citizen would be in jail. The cop was cited big deal.
Really?
Can you provide any examples where this has happened? The only police K9s killed on duty that I am aware of were killed by criminals. I have searched for information regarding death or attacks on police dogs and not found any examples of them being attacked by another dog. I'm not saying it has never happened, but I have never heard or read about such a case.
I realize that this thread has run it's useful course, but I wanted to point out that it seems like there is a difference between killing a police dog in the line of duty and not. As the officer in this case was just cruising by, it'd be difficult to argue that this happened while in the line of duty.
Bailey Guns
12-26-2014, 16:51
If the roles where reversed and it was a private citizens dog that killed a police K9 that private citizen would be in jail. The cop was cited big deal.
Bull. They'd be cited for the exact same thing the officer was.
You spout your nonsense that you can't support about police receiving special treatment and then dismiss the fact the officer was cited. When an officer receives a citation in the course of duty it IS a big deal. It's far more serious than if Joe Citizen received the same ticket. Joe Citizen doesn't have the added issues of departmental investigations and possible punishment along with the citation to worry about.
Kind of like getting a ticket if you are a CDL.
Where do you get your information on this incident Rondog?
The officer was cited for a criminal investigation and is under investigation by his agency. The dog is not able to do his work for the agency and his ability to continue as a police dog is in jeopardy.
Please show me the source of your "no fault" treatment of this officer and the dog.
Where is that blue wall of protection in this case?
Please show me the police union quote on this incident.
I wasn't speaking about this case specifically, just in general. I agree that this case seems to have been handled properly. But I've heard about people being charged with assaulting a police officer after hurting or killing a K9.
I wasn't speaking about this case specifically, just in general. I agree that this case seems to have been handled properly. But I've heard about people being charged with assaulting a police officer after hurting or killing a K9.
I think the "police dog" = "police officer" is an urban legend. The law has not determined that animals hold the legal equivalent of people. Hell, states vary in their determination as far as fetal (people) status is concerned in the eyes of the law; I'd expect it to be a very far day in the future before the courts can agree on anything regarding the status of animals.
After a little bit of research, I was able to come up with a number of states that can/will charge people with the offenses of causing injury or death to a police animal. Those states are: California, Indiana, Iowa, Massachusetts, New Jersey, Ohio, Oregon, Utah, and Texas (pending legislation.)
Can't find an instance of a non-criminal harming a k9 and being charged. Those charges are used when someone engaged in a criminal act harms or attempts to harm the dog. My word, this thread has certainly drifted.
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