Open-Carrier Attacked in Wal-Mart; Will Never Carry Openly Again

[Ranger353]

Open-Carrier Attacked in Wal-Mart; Will Never Carry Openly Again


Bat-wielding bad guy apparently wanted his pistol.

http://www.alloutdoor.com/2015/04/21/open-carrier-attacked-wal-mart-carry-openly/?utm_source=Newsletter&utm_medium=Email&utm_content=2015-04-25&utm_campaign=Weekly+Newsletter

Yakima, WA – As I’ve noted before, open carry of guns is usually a bad idea for many reasons. When you advertise your firearm, you create opportunity–for others. Opportunities for the leery to get freaked out and for potential criminals to target you first in a violent crime or to try and steal your gun from you.


As I reported last October, that happened to an Oregon man who proudly toted his brand-new popper exposed–and then had it stolen from him at gunpoint.


Once again, open carry seems to have been the impetus for a crime against the carrier. Bearing Arms reports that a Yakima father was attacked while shopping with three children in Wal-Mart while openly carrying a pistol.


The victim, Brandon Walker, was attacked by a “disheveled” man who, after making eye contact with him several times, pulled a metal baseball bat from a rack and swung it hard at Walker’s head.


Walker stepped towards his attacker, leading with his shoulder to deflect the blow. He then stepped away from the bat man, drew his pistol and chambered a round, then told the bad guy to get down onto the floor. He complied.


Store employees helped contain the assailant until police arrived to arrest him, reportedly charging him with second degree assault (felony, max penalty ten years prison and $20,000 fine).


The attacker, who had been arrested before, said very little and never revealed his intentions in attacking Walker. Walker believes that the guy had to be coming after him to he could steal the gun, a Sig Sauer Model P226 in 357 Sig.


Bearing Arms reported that, in a phone interview, Walker stated that he would only carry concealed from now on.

[Irving]

Good luck getting a round chambered if the bat landed any where. Hope he learned two lessons. Glad he got off as light as he did. Nice work on the quick thinking by stepping into the bat.

[Ronin13]

Good luck getting a round chambered if the bat landed any where. Hope he learned two lessons. Glad he got off as light as he did. Nice work on the quick thinking by stepping into the bat.
I was just about to say, I bet he no longer carries with an empty chamber. Haven't we tackled this tactic before? IIRC, isn't this called "Israeli Carry"?

[Hound]

How is this a lesson against carrying "Israeli"? He was able to chamber a round and take care of the situation by thinking first and then using his sidearm. Playing "what if" games here says nothing to support carrying chambered. If he had been carrying chambered and the guy had gotten the gun what if he tried to pull the trigger and it worked instead of not realizing he needed to chamber a round giving his target time to figure out they were under fire. That could have saved somebody while he tried to figure out how to work the gun. What if the guy did not know how to operate the gun to chamber a round? What if, what if..... What if..... If you carry chambered good for you, if you don't same thing. Practice how you carry and be safe.

[USMC_5-Echo]

How is this a lesson against carrying "Israeli"? He was able to chamber a round and take care of the situation by thinking first and then using his sidearm. Playing "what if" games here says nothing to support carrying chambered. If he had been carrying chambered and the guy had gotten the gun what if he tried to pull the trigger and it worked instead of not realizing he needed to chamber a round giving his target time to figure out they were under fire. That could have saved somebody while he tried to figure out how to work the gun. What if the guy did not know how to operate the gun to chamber a round? What if, what if..... What if..... If you carry chambered good for you, if you don't same thing. Practice how you carry and be safe.

It's a lesson because the guy doesn't carry like they do and they're perfect as I've seen all over this site. So he doesn't carry like you do, big deal there are many different ways to do things and technically no one right way.

[lex137]

Good story, this is getting ugly fast, lol!

[Irving]

How is this a lesson against carrying "Israeli"? He was able to chamber a round and take care of the situation by thinking first and then using his sidearm. Playing "what if" games here says nothing to support carrying chambered. If he had been carrying chambered and the guy had gotten the gun what if he tried to pull the trigger and it worked instead of not realizing he needed to chamber a round giving his target time to figure out they were under fire. That could have saved somebody while he tried to figure out how to work the gun. What if the guy did not know how to operate the gun to chamber a round? What if, what if..... What if..... If you carry chambered good for you, if you don't same thing. Practice how you carry and be safe.

As I recently took issue with someone else on the site for playing the what-if game, and since I'm nearly perfect, I will concede to your point. He obviously changed his mind about open carrying, I don't see why it's unreasonable to wonder if he's changed his mind about carrying without a round chambered.

[Ronin13]

I always carry based on how I train, with a round in the chamber. I can't say for someone else how they choose to carry, carry the way you are comfortable carrying. However, when I teach I offer the suggestion that they carry with a round in the chamber because that's how I was trained, that's how I practice, and I have never incorporated "Israeli" carry into my drills or when I teach. Train how you fight, and I intend to fight on the premise of fast draw, quick target identification and acquisition so I have more time to slow down and get good hits on target. If others choose a different method, good on them, practice practice practice.

[BPTactical]

I see a couple of failures:
Unchambered pistol is nothing more than a fistpack.
Article said the perp made eye contact several times (red flag). Carriers situational awareness lacking.
I have said it a gazillion times: if your going to make the choice to open carry, you had best be prepared for what may come with it, be it good or bad.

[HoneyBadger]

I don't know if it contributes to the discussion here, but I rarely carry with a round chambered. Times when I carry chambered include: Showing my house to strangers while trying to find a renter; when I get myself into a situation I am not comfortable with, like being stranded downtown at night with zombies everywhere; If I have to go somewhere sketchy for something, like a craigslist meetup; any time I'm in the mountains, etc.

This probably goes against the popular opinion, but I have different "modes" that I carry in. Most of the time, I carry unchambered and racking the slide is a part of my draw stroke - one fluid motion (I regularly practice racking the slide with 1 hand against my belt). If I am carrying chambered, I am very aware of that status, and have heightened SA anyway, so drawing without racking the slide is an unconscious effort - just another part of my mission planning cycle. If that whole idea fails and I rack the slide anyway, I still have at least 14 more rounds in the mag. [Dunno]

[Hound]

This is pretty much my stance. I don't think there is a "right" way to carry. There is only your way. If you practice how you carry, you are good-ta-go. The only "wrong" is thinking your way is the only way. We each make our decisions and live with the results. Carrying chambered in a low risk environment assumes a higher risk to those around me and lowers situational awareness since I would be used to it. Chambering a round means I know something is wrong. I practice drawing and sliding the rack as a single motion with good accuracy in case I am caught off gaurd. This is my way.


I don't know if it contributes to the discussion here, but I rarely carry with a round chambered. Times when I carry chambered include: Showing my house to strangers while trying to find a renter; when I get myself into a situation I am not comfortable with, like being stranded downtown at night with zombies everywhere; If I have to go somewhere sketchy for something, like a craigslist meetup; any time I'm in the mountains, etc.

This probably goes against the popular opinion, but I have different "modes" that I carry in. Most of the time, I carry unchambered and racking the slide is a part of my draw stroke - one fluid motion (I regularly practice racking the slide with 1 hand against my belt). If I am carrying chambered, I am very aware of that status, and have heightened SA anyway, so drawing without racking the slide is an unconscious effort - just another part of my mission planning cycle. If that whole idea fails and I rack the slide anyway, I still have at least 14 more rounds in the mag. [Dunno]

[muddywings]

One drill we did in my short LEO career was a close quarter/gaining distance from a threat drill (I don't know if there is a proper name for it--probably). We would stand directly up against our target, on command, step back, draw, shoot two rounds from a protected stance with the pistol at a 45 degree from our armpit with the support hand up near our head (so we don't shoot our own hand), take another step back and one to the head with both hands. I'm not sure if that is part of the POST test or not but I still practice that with dry fire and at the range.
This type of scenario is more on my mind than having to make a 25 yard shot in an open field. Racking one with this type of engagement would be rather difficult. Carrying concealed gives me an element of surprise I might not of had. I'd rather not loose the element to have to rack one no matter how fast I can do it.
+1 chambered
to each their own of course

[dan512]

+1 for what muddywings said...
I think there is something eye opening about practicing at "bad breath distance" taking into account that this paper target may be trying to grab your gun or knock you unconscious, either with a hand or with a tool.

[HoneyBadger]

I think the biggest take-away from this poor-guy's story is that your mind is your biggest, most important, and most effective tool. Use it.

[muddywings]

Of course because it's a badass scene:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiqwF_Y9S5Q

ETA: I'd let them keep the briefcase ;)

[n2877]

Of course because it's a badass scene:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UiqwF_Y9S5Q

ETA: I'd let them keep the briefcase ;)

that is a bad ass scene. Really the one true reason I don't open carry, outside off being in the woods hunting or something to that extent, is because I don't want anyone to know that I am carrying. I feel it makes me I prime target. But I say to each his own. And practice, practice, practice. What good is it to carry if you don't practice.