6.5CM vs .308

[fitz19d]

I know some other noobs and I are slavering over the new Ruger rifle. And figured since I didnt see it in search, throw one on here for what locals think. I know the 6.5CM sounds popular on snipershide and with other comp shooters.

I was kinda wondering, though, is it still the bee's knee's for someone that might want to hunt too?

I hear the match 6.5 cheaper than match .308. But if one wants to go closer to just plinking or close enough it doesn't matter, does 6.5 have any cheap options to match the blaster .308?

I understand that reloading 6.5 doesn't have any major hurdles? Basically a resized .308 case? Less powder too? Obviously the 6.5cm is standing out to be the more accurate round, but are there reasons from a cost to reload or simplicity to favor one over the other?


And finally, let's say that all around the 6.5cm is agreed to be superior. That good to be worth the extra cost/logistics of a new round if one already has a semi 308? (And in the case of the Ruger PR, I think I'd prefer 20 inch .308 over the heavier and more unwieldly 24inch 6.5cm)

[Zach O]

Depends on what your hunting I suppose. It would be fine for deer and such. Elk, that's debatable. Some say yes, others say no. Distance on an elk will be critical along with shot placement. Ballistically speaking, the CM will win hands down, from drop to wind. Cost wise? Not sure, as I've done a lot of research and I will never have a need for a .308. Hornady match CM is not to pricy if you don't reload. It can be found for $28 ish for 20 rounds that are pretty accurate. Accurate enough a buddy was able to ring steel at 1k with 80% on target. If you have a .308 gas gun, I'd go with a flatter shooting cartridge and youll see why!!Hope that help a little bit.

[Lars]

I'll take the 6.5 over the .308 any day. The 6.5 is crazy accurate and extremely easy to reload, it was a pain for awhile to find bullets but that has since past and I can find 6.5 pills a lot easier now. The factory ammo is also excellent, both my gas gun and bolt gun eat them up as well as they do my reloads (well almost as good). Your worried about the extra 4 inches of barrel length but look at the rifle, it's not meant to be a back country rifle, it is intended for the bench and long range shooting.

[Buff]

I found a forum dedicated to the 6.5, has some good reading in it.

[Dave_L]

I've been reading up on this topic since Ruger revealed their new rifle. I think I'm leaningt towards the 6.5 at this point. Flatter and les wind effect. I don't have any .308 so either way, it'll be another caliber to get into so why not get something a little different.

[Spdu4ia]

Been researching rebarreling my .308 and 6.5cm is on the short list if that tells you anything .

[Great-Kazoo]

I want something i can plink with and shoot some distance. I'm not a hunter, or competitive LD shooter. I do reload so that's a plus either way.

[Zombie Steve]

The 6.5 CM isn't a necked down .308 - that would be a .260.

The CM is a really efficient cartridge, and has a lot going for it in terms of barrel life (compared to other skinny bullet target cartridges like 6.5-284 - 308 would win out here), trajectory and accuracy potential. If I was doing a target gun, I'd go this route (if not 6.5x47 Lapua).

BUT - if you're asking if it's the bee's knees for someone that might want to hunt too, I don't see it as an improvement over the .308. Although the two cartridges aren't tremendously different, I tend to prefer heavier bullets for game, and there's going to be a much larger hunting bullet selection in the 30 caliber cartridges. .308 has the ability to shoot bigger bullets and it has a bigger powder column.

The flat trajectory advantage the CM has at normal hunting ranges is almost irrelevant.

[Great-Kazoo]

After doing some brief component search & pricing, it looks like the 308 would be a better purchase for me.

[Delfuego]

6.5 is better in almost every way.

[fitz19d]

So is it is own brass you got to use from spent our but new? I agree sounds better in most ways but if I can't use leftover.308 would hurt the economics a bit.

[Delfuego]

Brass is different, the dies are different, so are the powders. Almost any caliber will require new dies/powder/brass/bullets/etc. Brass is also a consumable and as such should be accounted for.

It's the performance that is the advantage. I wouldn't feed a precision rifle "blaster" ammo ever, it's a precision rifle after all. Even at 200y-300y I want accurate hits. I think this would be even more important while hunting.

[fitz19d]

Guess I'm spoiled any seeing powders that are pretty good for multiple caliber. Do the cases hold up pretty well or high pressure enough only last a couple times.

Some might be semantics, if talking about the rpr, I wouldn't be trying to just throw rounds asap thru it at 6moa. But if I can load something that's 1.25 vs .75 moa for 3/4 to half the cost that's a good trade off to me since I mainly sit more reactive than paper.

[Delfuego]

Guess I'm spoiled any seeing powders that are pretty good for multiple caliber. Do the cases hold up pretty well or high pressure enough only last a couple times. The powders will work for different calibers, but, they will really work best for 6.5 type calibers (with the exception of Varget possibly). 6.5mm powders are 4350/4831/RL17/Varget/etc; 308 powders are 4064/RL15/BL-C2/Varget/etc. There are of course exceptions and cross-over powders too.

The brass is pretty good (not quite the quality as Lapua) but still good. I know people with many (5-10x) firings on their brass with no complaints. You really don't need to chase high velocity/pressure with 6.5CM, that is the advantage. 2700fps still produces great ballistics and can extend barrel-life too. No real need to chase that 2900fps node.

[Dave_L]

Im in line to pick up one of these in 6.5 CM. I don't have any .308's so either way, I was going to jump into another caliber. Figure I'd try out something different out. The only downside i've really read so far is barrel life.

[Great-Kazoo]

Im in line to pick up one of these in 6.5 CM. I don't have any .308's so either way, I was going to jump into another caliber. Figure I'd try out something different out. The only downside i've really read so far is barrel life.

For me i have everything but bullets for .308. Getting in to 6.5 puts me out of the running, as everything would need to be purchased. Too bad as the 6.5 is definitely the way to go for reaching out there.

[XC700116]

The nice thing about the new Ruger is the relatively easy barrel swap so if you do go that route you can always change your mind at some point and put a 308, 243, or 6.5cm barrel on it, and at some point I'm sure there will be aftermarket companies offering prefit barrels in virtually any SA chambering. So at least you're not locked in too hard with it.

As to the original question, I'd go 6.5 CM or 243 any day, but then I have no need, want, or use for a 308 personally, don't own one and most likely never will again. My game of choice is long range and 308 is flat out classed in that world.

Dies are relatively cheap and a one time cost, shell holders and other misc items are the same as 308, good bullets are cheaper for a 6 or 6.5mm, primers and powder are a wash, and when you boil it all down the only plus side to the 308 is brass and barrel life. You can get Hornady 6.5 cm brass relatively cheap, and match grade ammo is cheaper for the 6.5 cm. Bonus is that the Match 6.5 ammo is all loaded with Hornady a-max bullets which work great on game as well.

[Delfuego]

To be honest, I am not sold on these Rugers. Who know if they will even shoot? They are vapor-ware currently with no track record. If Hoser tested it out and endorsed it then I would, but right now I would wait and see...


I have no need, want, or use for a 308 personallyI want one for "Gaming" the 308 class at matches! [rockon]

[XC700116]

To be honest, I am not sold on these Rugers. Who know if they will even shoot? They are vapor-ware currently with no track record. If Hoser tested it out and endorsed it then I would, but right now I would wait and see...

I want one for "Gaming" the 308 class at matches! [rockon]
Agreed, it sounds a little too good to be all its hyped to be, but its gotta happen sooner or later, its probably one of the fastest growing segments of shooting sports. Sooner or later for that growth to continue someone besides savage had to put their hat in the ring for a less expensive intro Rifle for the masses. Hell just to get a Rifle built with no budget in mind from a premium Smith you're going to have a huge wait time. Add that to the price and you've got a big barrier to entry for the sport. Whereas for the same money you can go into any sportsman's warehouse and get all 3 guns to get a good start in 3-gun over the counter. So i applaud what they are trying to do with it. How well the production rifles shoot has yet to be seen, but if savage can get it done, ruger can too. We'll have to wait and see if they accomplished that mission or not, but if it shoots, they've blown everyone else out of the water when it comes to feature set vs price. I wouldn't expect a sub 1/2 moa (consistently) Rifle from it, but sub moa is definitely attainable.


As to the 308 gaming, Strangely, that and a couple of 308 only matches have made me consider it from time to time, but I figure I can spend that money on more 260, and 6x47 barrels for the 2 LR rigs I'm already feeding ammo to.

[Grant H.]

6.5CM is a very enticing round, but I already have so darn many calibers to load for, that I am struggling with adding another.

My .308's have all smacked steel at 1k, and while I know the CM will get it done better/easier/sexier/more-high-speed-low-drag, I am just tired of buying more dies, different powders, different pills, etc, and laying in what I think is minimum stock of parts to have on hand plus operational quantities.

I put a lot of thought into a .260, but I still haven't made the leap. It at least is less investment to add into the safe...

[TheBelly]

I put a lot of thought into a .260, but I still haven't made the leap. It at least is less investment to add into the safe...

The investment of getting into a 6.5 creed is probably about the same as getting into a .260. I know you can form .260 brass out of .308 brass, but there's a lot of work involved in that. I had to anneal well, step down to 7mm-08, turn the necks, then size down to .260. Even then, I didn't get the best performance due to the really short cases. I tried bumping .243 UP to .260, but that wasn't feasible for me because I already had a crap-ton of .308 brass. The time to get the cases where they needed to be just wasn't worth it, but I found out after a year or so. I was just spending SOOO much time making and maintaining brass that I thought to myself, "there HAS to be a faster/better/more efficient way."

I am not loading up 6.5x47 Lapua. The brass is expensive, but it's very high quality and lasts for many loadings, possibly even more than Hornady's creedmore brass.

[XC700116]

I am not loading up 6.5x47 Lapua. The brass is expensive, but it's very high quality and lasts for many loadings, possibly even more than Hornady's creedmore brass.

6.5X47 Lapua Brass is well known to go in the the high teens and early twenties for load cycles. The PPC Flash hole and Small primer pocket make the case head STOUT. As long as you aren't over sizing it and thereby stretching it to cause a case head separation, that brass will outlast anything Hornady has ever made 2 to 1 at least. Hornady Creedmore brass is notoriously soft on the case head and will almost be guaranteed to lose the primer pocket long before you have problems with head separation. Even with relatively low pressure loads most guys only see about 4 or 5 loadings on the Hornady Creed brass.

I've got a few pieces of my 6.5X47 Brass that I overcooked pretty hard, enough to get a nasty ejector swipe and the pockets are still plenty tight. My Lapua 260 brass wasn't so forgiving, in fact most any large rifle primer brass is going to be that way.

[fitz19d]

How many times will 308 brass last on average?

[XC700116]

Depends on the load and the brass, and how abusive you are to it (over sizing, gas guns, etc) but typically 5-10 ish, of course some go more, and some go less than that range, but that's a pretty average spread. Obviously if you're loading ammo so soft that it barely gets out of the barrel it'll last a lot longer, but if you're talking about playing the long range game which is the context of the discussion in this thread for the most part, then you're going to be at least loading to an average pressure level and likely on the spicy side of things.

One nice thing with 308 is that there's also a small primer option there too in the Lapua Palma brass, that should get you a few more cycles out of it.

With the amount of time, and work that gets put into brass by us long range junkies, life cycle is more important to the work side of things than the expense, although $$$ is always a consideration.

Although I've backed off on a lot of my brass prep rituals, I still put a lot of work into my brass, and most of the time won't take virgin brass to a big match just because it's less uniform than what's been fired in my chamber and precisely re-sized, trimmed, and made as consistent as time allows. Most of my match prepped bolt gun brass is even neck turned, which I've come to regaurd as the definition of tedium.

It doesn't make a huge difference in accuracy, but I structure all of my gear and ammo around eliminating any possibilities that a miss is anything but my own fault. It makes for a much more uncluttered learning experience when you know damn well it wasn't your equipment that let you down.

[RonMexico]

I think I'm sold on the 6.5 creedmore.
Hands down its better at long range but it will knock down game too.

http://www.outdoorlife.com/photos/gallery/hunting/2012/02/shooting-65-creedmoor-african-safari/?image=7