+P+ Ammunition questions

[drumvudu]

I use a certain +P+ ammunition for defense in my Glocks and after function testing it with +P and +P+, I now only keep it in the guns I carry. What I am curios about though is, I have another gun that I carry that is a non glock but is rated for +P ammunition. Is it safe to have +P+ as defense ammo only in that gun after function testing the ammo with the lighter +P and then firing a few round of +P+ with it? I guess what I am asking is," will a gun that is +P rated handle +P+ factory loads ok"?

[hurley842002]

Kind of hard to give an opinion when you are super secretive about the ammo and gun you plan to use...

[KS63]

Most new manufacture pistols are fine with any ammo on the market. I personally don't really see a need to push chamber pressures if the projectile is tested to perform at a lower psi. What pistol(s) caliber and ammo are you using?

[cstone]

Will your engine last longer at a higher operating pressure? It may generate more torque or power, but for what purpose and for how long?

Find the ammunition that feeds well, cycles the action, and most importantly you shoot most accurately and can afford in quantity. IMO pressure ratings on self defense ammunition is mostly marketing hype.

Be safe.

[drumvudu]

I wasn't attempting to be super secretive, I just didn't think it mattered in order to answer my question. I use Underwood Extreme defense

[drumvudu]

Well, in this particular case, it's not hype. I sure wish that people that don't know or choose not to answer a posted question would just not post. Why? I know what I am talking about. I just wanted a plain answer to a plain question. If you don't want to answer, then don't. All of the testing on this ammunition shows a marked improvement in defensive performance between the +P and the +P+ types. That is why I am asking. I have shot both like I already said. I just wondered if now that I know I can shoot the +P+ in this particular gun, and since almost no guns are rated for +P+ ammunition until very recently, How dangerous is it to use this ammunition?

[drumvudu]

It's a 90grn Lehigh solid brass projectile. It's traveling at over 1500fps. I'm shooting it out of a Millennium G2. Here we go.

[cstone]

Contact the gun's manufacturer and ask them.

It isn't dangerous to use commercially manufactured ammunition. It is just more pressure per round for limited benefit.

"Defensive performance?" What standards are being used to make that claim?

I will answer what I choose to answer. Don't like the response? Don't read it.

[Alpha2]

+P is a Saami standard load. +P+ is not on the charts. Although there are "guidelines".

From Wickipedia: SAAMI does not have a +P+ pressure standard, but this indicates a pressure higher than the +P loading. In both cases this is below the pressure of proof test cartridge (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proof_shot), which all firearms are required to withstand before they may be sold. Proof pressure are established by the SAAMI, as a percentage of the working pressure, so this places an upper bound on the +P+ pressures of 30–40%
Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer chances.

[68Charger]

+P is a Saami standard load. +P+ is not on the charts. Although there are "guidelines".

^^^^ This is what I was going to post. you are in uncharted, undocumented territory- proceed at your own risk, nobody credible is going to guarantee it'll be fine.

The best you'll get is "you'll probably be ok", but since there is no +P+ standard, who knows where the pressure will wind up.

my suggestion: if you want more power, get a more powerful cartridge- 9x23 Winchester, 10mm or .460 Rowland come to mind.

[Irving]

Personally, I wouldn't sacrifice weight to reach higher fps. How does 90gr at 1500 fps compare to say 124gr or 147gr at only 1000fps, what do the charts say?

[sportbikeco]

Why not shoot actual defence ammo with a track record for working as intended not some 90gr thing.

[Great-Kazoo]

Well, in this particular case, it's not hype. I sure wish that people that don't know or choose not to answer a posted question would just not post. Why? I know what I am talking about. THEN WHY POST ASKING THE QUESTION IF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ?

I just wanted a plain answer to a plain question. If you don't want to answer, then don't. YEAH, YOU LEFT YOURSELF OPEN FOR THAT

All of the testing on this ammunition shows a marked improvement in defensive performance between the +P and the +P+ types. That is why I am asking. I have shot both like I already said. I just wondered if now that I know I can shoot the +P+ in this particular gun, and since almost no guns are rated for +P+ ammunition until very recently, How dangerous is it to use this ammunition? DIDN'T YOU ALREADY ANSWER THAT QUESTION IN PARAGRAPH 1 >

My QUESTION to you is . WHY the need for +P+ ammo? Especially with some of the "concerns" you mentioned.


It's a 90grn Lehigh solid brass projectile. It's traveling at over 1500fps. I'm shooting it out of a Millennium G2. Here we go.

PERHAPS..................... if one were to have included this info in the original post . It would have reduced the need to INQUIRE about the details on the ammo and gun.
Then again seeing how you did include this info (FINALLY) you might want to step back and re-read everything you posted to get to this point. Or not.

[hurley842002]

I wasn't attempting to be super secretive, I just didn't think it mattered in order to answer my question. I use Underwood Extreme defense

Want answers? Here is my answer... The ammo you are using is unproven, both in "street performance" and pressure standards, it is boutique ammo and I'd bet there are no credible sources using it. I'm guessing the Millennium G2 is a Taurus......?

[Great-Kazoo]

It's a 90grn Lehigh solid brass projectile. It's traveling at over 1500fps. I'm shooting it out of a Millennium G2. Here we go.


Want answers? Here is my answer... The ammo you are using is unproven, both in "street performance" and pressure standards, it is boutique ammo and I'd bet there are no credible sources using it. I'm guessing the Millennium G2 is a Taurus......?


You even read BRO?? [Beer]

[cstone]

https://www.underwoodammo.com/9mm-luger/

It is impressive ammunition, and at $1.65 per 9mm round it ought to be.

A steady diet of over pressure ammunition will lead to greater wear on any firearm over time.

[kidicarus13]

Shooting 9mm +P+? Buy a pistol chambered in .357 SIG and forget about it.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[drumvudu]

You are correct, you do. I should not have said that. For that, I apologize. You have every right to say anything you want. I just get really frustrated on these forums at times.

[68Charger]

Personally, I wouldn't sacrifice weight to reach higher fps. How does 90gr at 1500 fps compare to say 124gr or 147gr at only 1000fps, what do the charts say?

You can get more energy with velocity than with weight... but the short barrels of handguns don't gain velocity very well, so it don't result in a big increase in energy. That being said, the terminal performance of bullets doesn't really improve with velocity until it gets high enough to cause a temporary wound cavity (like rifle ammo generally does)... and it's debatable what increase in damage is caused by a temporary wound cavity (to me, it depends on where the temporary wound cavity is).

Liberty's Civil Defense line is 2000 ft/s for 9mm (50gr bullet), and 10mm is 2400 ft/s with a 60gr bullet.
2000 ft/s is borderline to cause a significant temporary wound cavity, but that 10mm at point blank is going to be similar energy as m855 ammo at 150-200 yards.

But in general, most +P+ ammo in a handgun is tilting at windmills, IMHO. If you want more power, get a more powerful caliber- Like the .357sig suggestion... or 10mm.