Taco vs Frontier: Your Thoughts, Please

[ZERO THEORY]

Those of you who browse the Trading Post know that I'm in the process of getting rid of my 3/4 Ram for something a little more...nimble for camping and light/medium trail use. I'm debating between the Taco and the Frontier from '05-'11. For background, I spend my time running around the big four national forests in Colorado (Pike, Arapaho, Roosevelt, and White River). I'm not going to be trying to transform either truck into a SAS'd monster, but need to be able to navigate over/around mid-grade trails. I will be lifting either option mildly (~3"), so any insight on the best options there is also welcome.
Nissan and their faithful don't seem nearly as 'proud' of their resale values, which is a huge plus in the Frontier's favor. I've also heard a lot of positives about the 4.0L. I know the Nismo/Pro 4X come with a factory rear locker just like the Taco, so I can't seem to find anything either truck really has over the other. What can you guys tell me that makes the Frontier a more attractive option?
On the flipside, the Toyota is the more popular platform for a reason, and from what I can tell, there is a LOT more aftermarket support. So leaving the sales numbers behind, what can you guys tell me from a technical and usage standpoint that makes you feel like the Taco is the better option?

"Get a *insert vehicle here* instead" in 3...2...1...

[wyome]

Tacos respond well to salsa and pico de gallo mods....the frontier, not so much

[Zundfolge]

Anything made by Toyota is going to outlast most anything made by Nissan (and I say this as owner of an S13 240sx ... probably the best car they ever built).

[Martinjmpr]

I'm not aware of any specific problems for the Frontier that aren't related to abuse (I've heard of the "exploding front diff" but my understanding is that trucks that suffer this are being used pretty hard.)

I got tired of paying the "Toyota Tax" last year and sold my 4runner. Toyotas are nice, don't get me wrong, but I think the prices on the used market are outrageous, especially for the Tacoma.

Since you're looking at used, have you considered maybe one of the last of the Rangers? I owned a '99 Ranger (albeit a 2wd) for several years and liked it. In fact, my DD is a Ranger (it's a Mazda B2300 but that's actually a Ranger.) Again, a 2wd but solid and reliable even at 20 years old (its a 1996.)

If you can live without a true crew cab (the Ranger crew cab was offered in other markets but never in the US, sadly) then you might add the Ranger to your list. You can probably find one for half the price of a Tacoma. Otherwise I think a good condition Frontier would be fine for what you intend to do.

ALSO remember that the Tacoma's of that vintage are all plastic after the cab. Frontier, Ranger and Colorado all have metal beds.

[Honey Badger282.8]

I own a 2012 Frontier SV Crew Cab 4x4 and I love it. My only complaint is that the turning radius sucks. I'd recommend driving both because they are fairly different aside from the Taco being grossly overpriced for what you get, new or used. I bought my Frontier new for less than I'd get a comparable used Tacoma for.

Frontier Pros
- Fully Boxed frame vs C-channel for the Taco.
- Metal bed vs plastic for the Taco.
- More powerful than Taco.
- Truck like seating position vs car like in Taco.
- More affordable

Taco Pros
- Better aftermarket
- Slightly better fuel economy

The Frontier has a decent aftermarket though, even if it is smaller than the Tacoma. Nisstec Lifts and Hefty Fabworks are both Colorado companies and two of the larger aftermarket vendors. Boulder Nissan is also one of the biggest proponents of the platform, to include the Xterra, in the off road community.

The only real issue with the X and Frontier was called the strawberry milkshake of death. It was radiator and transmission cross contamination but that issue was fixed for the 2009 model year.

[sniper7]

Go new!
How about a chevy Colorado. The new diesel model is a 2.8L duramax. 31 mpg.


here is a comparison:
http://www.chevrolet.com/colorado-small-truck/colorado-vs-tacoma.html

2016 comparison:
http://www.barkauautomotive.com/blog/2016-chevy-colorado-vs-2016-toyota-tacoma/

or here is a 2015 comparison of the gas versions:
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2015-chevrolet-colorado-lt-crew-cab-4wd-vs-2016-toyota-tacoma-trd-off-road-double-cab-4x4-final-scoring-performance-data-and-complete-specs-page-4

[Martinjmpr]

Go new!
How about a chevy Colorado. The new diesel model is a 2.8L duramax. 31 mpg.


here is a comparison:
http://www.chevrolet.com/colorado-small-truck/colorado-vs-tacoma.html

2016 comparison:
http://www.barkauautomotive.com/blog/2016-chevy-colorado-vs-2016-toyota-tacoma/

or here is a 2015 comparison of the gas versions:
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2015-chevrolet-colorado-lt-crew-cab-4wd-vs-2016-toyota-tacoma-trd-off-road-double-cab-4x4-final-scoring-performance-data-and-complete-specs-page-4

OP is looking to buy an 05-11 so I'm assuming a new vehicle is not an option.

[Irving]

I'd also recommend at least looking at the new diesel Colorado, if I thought you were irresponsible enough to buy something new.

[hurley842002]

Honestly, the current model of Frontier is pretty solid, and other than resale and aftermarket support, I don't think the Tacoma brings anything to the table over the Frontier. You will pay more for the Tacoma (which is why I own an Xterra instead of a 4runner). I loved my Tacoma, and planned to stay with Toyota, but when I started looking at newer 4runners, they were just more than I could dish out. Unless you are used to driving souped up diesels or sports cars, the Nissan 4.0 has more than enough power. At the end of the day you can't go wrong with either IMO.

As for the new Colorado, those things are huge, you may as well buy another 1/2 ton.

[TRnCO]

I don't know anything about Nissan, but I bought my 07 DC TRD Taco used back in 07 and so far all I've done is change fluids as scheduled, including anti-freeze and hoses and did belt at the same time. And I had one rear wheel seal go out that I changed. Still on original brake pads. About 166,000 miles and I can't find anything bad to say about it. One wish I have is that they would put a larger gas tank on. In the winter I run mud tires and they do cut mileage down considerably, but that really only bothers me when I take a road trip through multiple states.
I don't use mine to tow, and quite frankly don't think it would do very good if I did. If I put four full grown men and about 10 dead coyotes in the back, it don't take much of a bump to bottom out. [Eek2]

[blacklabel]

I have a 2008 NISMO Frontier with 102k miles on it. It's been perfectly reliable, has handled Pole Hill Road, Johnny Park Road, Pierson Park, etc. without much of a complaint. I prefer the seating position to my buddy's 2 year old Tacoma.

My primary reason for buying the Frontier vs a Tacoma was used pricing. I wasn't going to pony up the cash for a Tacoma and I'm happy I didn't.

[ZERO THEORY]

ALSO remember that the Tacoma's of that vintage are all plastic after the cab.

Hmmm...duly noted.


I own a 2012 Frontier SV Crew Cab 4x4 and I love it. My only complaint is that the turning radius sucks. I'd recommend driving both because they are fairly different aside from the Taco being grossly overpriced for what you get, new or used. I bought my Frontier new for less than I'd get a comparable used Tacoma for.

Frontier Pros
- Fully Boxed frame vs C-channel for the Taco.
- Metal bed vs plastic for the Taco.
- More powerful than Taco.
- Truck like seating position vs car like in Taco.
- More affordable

Taco Pros
- Better aftermarket
- Slightly better fuel economy

The Frontier has a decent aftermarket though, even if it is smaller than the Tacoma. Nisstec Lifts and Hefty Fabworks are both Colorado companies and two of the larger aftermarket vendors. Boulder Nissan is also one of the biggest proponents of the platform, to include the Xterra, in the off road community.

The only real issue with the X and Frontier was called the strawberry milkshake of death. It was radiator and transmission cross contamination but that issue was fixed for the 2009 model year.

I'm deadset on a manual, so any radiator/ATF mixture is a non-issue. Thanks for the heads-up, though. I will say that the Nissan was far more comfortable and naturally truck-feeling. However, the cab storage options in the Taco were awesome.


OP is looking to buy an 05-11 so I'm assuming a new vehicle is not an option.


if I thought you were irresponsible enough to buy something new.

Never understood the appeal of buying something new off the lot. My old man told me it was a no-no when I was younger and I have stuck to it.


I don't know anything about Nissan, but I bought my 07 DC TRD Taco used back in 07 and so far all I've done is change fluids as scheduled, including anti-freeze and hoses and did belt at the same time. And I had one rear wheel seal go out that I changed. Still on original brake pads. About 166,000 miles and I can't find anything bad to say about it. One wish I have is that they would put a larger gas tank on. In the winter I run mud tires and they do cut mileage down considerably, but that really only bothers me when I take a road trip through multiple states.
I don't use mine to tow, and quite frankly don't think it would do very good if I did. If I put four full grown men and about 10 dead coyotes in the back, it don't take much of a bump to bottom out. [Eek2]

Thanks for the insight. Bump stomps would definitely be part of the lift.

[ZERO THEORY]

I have a 2008 NISMO Frontier with 102k miles on it. It's been perfectly reliable, has handled Pole Hill Road, Johnny Park Road, Pierson Park, etc. without much of a complaint. I prefer the seating position to my buddy's 2 year old Tacoma.

My primary reason for buying the Frontier vs a Tacoma was used pricing. I wasn't going to pony up the cash for a Tacoma and I'm happy I didn't.

This is one of the biggest pros for the Frontier. Found an '06 from a private seller with 136K, a custom bumper, lifted, wheels and tires, new clutch, et. al. for under $15K. Meanwhile, there are guys selling '02 Tacos for the same price bone stock. WTF?!

[HoneyBadger]

I love the 4.0 engine in my 2014 Xterra (Pro-4X). I pulled a 6200lb trailer from Colorado to California and I was really impressed by the performance and power. Anyone that knows that route on 70 and 15 knows that its just one mountain pass after another. I towed about 5700lbs behind my 2001 Silverado extended cab (5.3L V8) on the same route from CA to CO back in 2012 and the Silverado couldn't maintain the speed limit over most of those mountain passes, while the Xterra could maintain and even accelerate well over the speed limit. Yes, different gearing and different situations with different aged vehicles, but I was really impressed with the Xterra's performance. I say this, because the Frontiers and Xterras are nearly identical under the body (and inside the cab).

I don't think the Xterra/Frontier is terribly comfortable or fun to drive on the highway - probably less so than other vehicles in this class - but I do think it is set up well for driving trails and off-road. I've only driven a Taco a few times, but I think the Taco handled better at highway speeds. Off road, I don't have any experience with the Taco, but I would guess that the Taco and Frontier are pretty similar in handling and capability.




Never understood the appeal of buying something new off the lot. My old man told me it was a no-no when I was younger and I have stuck to it.


Good for you. I wish my old man would have advised me the same way. Although even if he did, I'm not sure I would have listened. [LOL]

[Sawin]

Zero Theory, thanks for posing the question... While not specifically between Frontier and Tacoma, I'm in a similar debate to you....
By and large, I agree with everything everyone is saying about both models.

The one thing I might add against the frontier is the ugly factor... I just think they're ugly; certainly uglier than the Tacoma, but I'm a nobody so what does my opinion matter?!

The new Chevy Colorado looks great in person and on paper. I saw one yesterday as a matter of fact... in the light drizzling snow... it's not that much wider than a Tacoma, really... and certainly not taller if you get yours lifted 3"+. but i cannot justify a new one either...

[Great-Kazoo]

IBJ

In before Jer


Taco's +'s resale, aftermarket support, almost bullet proof.
Negatives, Over priced when trying to buy a good used one. Same body style for how long? Fanbois will never let it go ;)

Frontier +'s good market share, lower resale making them more affordable than taco's, good drive train
Negatives, less aftermarket support, resale

If i were in the mid size truck market working within a budget. Would have no problem buying a frontier. Buy what works for you.

[hurley842002]

IBJ

In before Jer


Taco's +'s resale, aftermarket support, almost bullet proof.
Negatives, Over priced when trying to buy a good used one. Same body style for how long? Fanbois will never let it go ;)

Frontier +'s good market share, lower resale making them more affordable than taco's, good drive train
Negatives, less aftermarket support, resale

If i were in the mid size truck market working within a budget. Would have no problem buying a frontier. Buy what works for you.

IBJ haaaaa!

[Honey Badger282.8]

Zero Theory, thanks for posing the question... While not specifically between Frontier and Tacoma, I'm in a similar debate to you....
By and large, I agree with everything everyone is saying about both models.

The one thing I might add against the frontier is the ugly factor... I just think they're ugly; certainly uglier than the Tacoma, but I'm a nobody so what does my opinion matter?!

The new Chevy Colorado looks great in person and on paper. I saw one yesterday as a matter of fact... in the light drizzling snow... it's not that much wider than a Tacoma, really... and certainly not taller if you get yours lifted 3"+. but i cannot justify a new one either...

I much prefer the styling of the Frontier over the Tacoma. To me the Tacoma looks like some teenager designed it to look overly aggressive, almost to the point of compensation. The Colorado does nothing for me either, too bulbous and I hate that rake they designed into the belt line. The Canyon doesn't look bad imo.

[blacklabel]

I don't mind the last generation Tacomas. The 2016s look like a sqished F150.

[Calculated]

I've been down the gnarliest road I've ever seen on the face of a mountain in my buddy's 2009 Frontier. There were guys climbing asking how the hell we got there. It was a mistake made by following a GPS. We thought, hey, instead of driving 30 miles back around this way, it's only 1.5 miles this way, let's go that way. Like I said, turns out it was down the face of a mountain. I was going to buy a Taco but after that, I decided the Frontier was legit.

Bought a 2011 Pro-4x and have taken it to Moab, deep woods camping, mountain road exploring etc. and it flat out takes anything I throw at it. 45k miles and no issues whatsoever. Drives like a car on the road and off roads like a jeep. I love it. The one drawback I can say is I average around 16-18 mpg with the blend of highway and city driving I do, wish it was better. Mines got the same powerplant as the 350z so you can add the factory twin turbo to it if you want more power.

Pretty much everything Honey Badger 282.8 said.

Oh yea, one thing I forgot. The damn things heats up in like 2 miles, really nice in the dead of winter going to work at 1 am. All new cars may do that I don't know, but his truck and my truck both do. I've never had or ridden in a vehicle that warms up as quickly. Small perk.

[blacklabel]

Yep, I average about 17 in mine driving it to work and home in my Frontier. Roadtrips work out to 21-22 depending on the wind.

[fitz19d]

Personal preference is taco (actually tundra, but yeah not as adept at the offroad camper scenario) Tundra is easy to sleep in or do the bed thing, but tight trails is the killer. Taco so many aftermarket camping stuff on top of the usual off road stuff.

But really in your situation and age, it's mostly a wash. I'd look for both and go with what you find a deal you like on.

[Honey Badger282.8]

I'm getting 18-19 mix.

[HoneyBadger]

Oh yea, one thing I forgot. The damn things heats up in like 2 miles, really nice in the dead of winter going to work at 1 am. All new cars may do that I don't know, but his truck and my truck both do. I've never had or ridden in a vehicle that warms up as quickly. Small perk.
Your Pro-4X didn't come with heated seats? :D


I'm getting 18-19 mix.
I got also got 18-19 in Colorado. Out here, I get about 15-16 because of the several small mountain passes (not Colorado mountains - each one is 600 to 800ft) I commute over every day.

[Jimmy]

For me, it was aesthetics. The only Frontier that appealed to me was the Pro 4x, and (at the time I was looking a couple years ago) the prices for those were not too much different that Tacomas. I test drove a one-owner 2009 TRD Offroad, 18,500 miles, with the nTRD supercharger and exhaust... and was sold. Paid a pile for it (as has been covered), but it always puts a smile on my face.

[Irving]

My TRD factory supercharged Tacoma turned my smile into a frown when it flipped me upside down.

Speaking of which, is there a "grey wire mod" equivalent with the Nissan trucks?

[Dave_L]

My TRD factory supercharged Tacoma turned my smile into a frown when it flipped me upside down.

Speaking of which, is there a "grey wire mod" equivalent with the Nissan trucks?

But when you flipped, it turned that frown upside down?

[hurley842002]

My TRD factory supercharged Tacoma turned my smile into a frown when it flipped me upside down.

Speaking of which, is there a "grey wire mod" equivalent with the Nissan trucks?

Yeah there is a GWM for the Nissans, I plan on doing it on my Xterra when I get a chance, was the best thing I did to my Taco.

[Irving]

It was some pretty cool damage. I would have driven it home had I known how to reset the switch that shuts the motor off after a rollover.

[Fentonite]

I have an '05 Taco (TRD Off-road). It's been just fine, reliable, good off-road, pulled many trailers many miles without complaint, mediocre gas mileage (~17). Although initially skeptical, I've actually found the "plastic" bed to be great. I've abused and overloaded it, and it's stood up to everything I've thrown at it. I like the tie-down rails in the bed.

I also had a '93 Nissan pickup, and it was also good, except the turning radius was about three city blocks. I'm not sure how that generation compares to current. It drove more like a "truck" than the Taco.

I really think either one would serve you fine, depends which one just feels better to you.

[Honey Badger282.8]

I will say that the cargo management system in the Frontier and Titan are leaps ad bounds better than any offering from any other OEM.

[Dave_L]

I had a 2006 Tacoma SR5 and had no complaints about. I just opted to get a 2500 duramax to tow a camper trailer. Otherwise, I would have kept my Tacoma.

[asmo]

I love my Taco ('12 access cab). I hate my gas mileage - 16-18.... Also, its a tad loud inside.

[blacklabel]

I will say that the cargo management system in the Frontier and Titan are leaps ad bounds better than any offering from any other OEM.

The utili-track system is awesom.

[Martinjmpr]

I have an '05 Taco (TRD Off-road). It's been just fine, reliable, good off-road, pulled many trailers many miles without complaint, mediocre gas mileage (~17).


I love my Taco ('12 access cab). I hate my gas mileage - 16-18.... Also, its a tad loud inside.

16 -18 is what you can realistically expect from anything in this class. From my experience of owning trucks and SUVs, it's difficult to break the 18 - 19 barrier with a modern gas engine. The good news is that while MPG has stayed the same, power has gone up considerably. My 1990 Mitsubishi Montero had a 3.0 V6 that barely put out 150hp and still got the same 17 MPG on the highway.

I was able to consistently get in the low 20's in my 1985 Toyota 4x4 pickup. Of course, that thing had tiny 15" wheels and 29" tires, the 22R engine was good for about 100hp on a good day and the doors were as thin as beer cans. It was gutless on the highway and it had no AC, no airbags, and manual steering. When you look at what trucks have today compared to what they had 20 or 30 years ago in terms of power, towing capacity, comfortable seats, safety, electronics, etc, the 7 -9 MPG hit isn't that bad.

EDITED TO ADD: One of the reasons I just made the jump from mid-sized (4runner) to full size (Suburban) was that I was willing to take the MPG hit in return for a bigger, more capable vehicle. So far I'm happy with my decision but then again gas is only $1.44 today. When it hits $3.50 I might be singing a different tune. :D

[KS63]

I'm not aware of any specific problems for the Frontier that aren't related to abuse (I've heard of the "exploding front diff" but my understanding is that trucks that suffer this are being used pretty hard.)

I got tired of paying the "Toyota Tax" last year and sold my 4runner. Toyotas are nice, don't get me wrong, but I think the prices on the used market are outrageous, especially for the Tacoma.

Since you're looking at used, have you considered maybe one of the last of the Rangers? I owned a '99 Ranger (albeit a 2wd) for several years and liked it. In fact, my DD is a Ranger (it's a Mazda B2300 but that's actually a Ranger.) Again, a 2wd but solid and reliable even at 20 years old (its a 1996.)

If you can live without a true crew cab (the Ranger crew cab was offered in other markets but never in the US, sadly) then you might add the Ranger to your list. You can probably find one for half the price of a Tacoma. Otherwise I think a good condition Frontier would be fine for what you intend to do.

ALSO remember that the Tacoma's of that vintage are all plastic after the cab. Frontier, Ranger and Colorado all have metal beds.
My 2005 TRD Taco has a plastic bed, but steel fenders, bumpers and tow hitch. Somethings wrong with mine I guess.....

[Calculated]

Your Pro-4X didn't come with heated seats? :D

Yes it did, and it's a real ball burner! But my vents are warm first, surprisingly!

[hurley842002]

For me, it was aesthetics. The only Frontier that appealed to me was the Pro 4x, and (at the time I was looking a couple years ago) the prices for those were not too much different that Tacomas. I test drove a one-owner 2009 TRD Offroad, 18,500 miles, with the nTRD supercharger and exhaust... and was sold. Paid a pile for it (as has been covered), but it always puts a smile on my face.

Very different experience than mine (although it was Xterra vs 4runner). 4runners of the same era were around $10k more than the Pro4x Xterras I looked at.

[HoneyBadger]

I love my Taco ('12 access cab). I hate my gas mileage - 16-18.... Also, its a tad loud inside.
Now that you mention it, the Xterra is very loud inside on the highway, so I think its probably safe to assume that the Frontier is as well.

[blacklabel]

Now that you mention it, the Xterra is very loud inside on the highway, so I think its probably safe to assume that the Frontier is as well.

It's definitely not quiet. I mainly catch tire noise.

[ray1970]

I had a Frontier. Perfectly good truck. Stick shift with the off road package and 31" tires. It was awesome in the snow. Never did much off roading with it. My only real gripe was it got shitty gas mileage. Figured if I was only going to get 16mpg I might as well be driving something bigger so I sold it and bought a 3/4 ton GMC. Lol.

[Great-Kazoo]

WTF JER get a time out? Or he still writing a full consumer report analis then C&P from word ??

[SouthPaw]

The Tacoma will have a better resale value and aftermarket support. When my dad was looking for a newer used Tacoma he ended buying new because it was a few thousand more for a brand new one. The 2015 and prior are getting snatched up pretty quick since the release of the 2016.

Im not sure how equipped the Nissans are now a days but the Tacomas are pretty limited. Nav is about the only thing can get that isn't standard. Some look at as less to go wrong other looks at as outdated technology. I purchased the Tacoma from my dad (2014) and only had it a month or so before I realized it wasn't for me. Great for trails, decent fuel mileage, excellent in the snow etc. In the end it was just too small for my needs and I upgraded to a 2015 Silverado 1500 LTZ. Tacoma has my vote.

[coop68]

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/colorado-trading-post.148930/page-317

I would check here there was a guy selling a clean first gen for 13k under 100,000 miles. Ive seen some go for 13 k with 200,000 miles.

I bought a 2014 tacoma Double cab OR, cant say anything bad about it love the truck. When my exploder died this was the one i liked the most. Been slowly building it up the way i want it.

63862

[rock_castle]

Consumer Reports consistantly ranks the Frontier and Tacoma about the same and both are very highly rated. We bought the Frontier because it was easier to get in and out of and it had a smoother ride. It's a 2010 and we love it. You can't go wrong with either.

[ZERO THEORY]

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/colorado-trading-post.148930/page-317

I would check here there was a guy selling a clean first gen for 13k under 100,000 miles. Ive seen some go for 13 k with 200,000 miles.

I bought a 2014 tacoma Double cab OR, cant say anything bad about it love the truck. When my exploder died this was the one i liked the most. Been slowly building it up the way i want it.

63862

Just PM'd him. You may be the MVP of this thread yet, coop.

[Honey Badger282.8]

2005 w/ lift and armor $15k, and local
http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/5428606204.html

[Honey Badger282.8]

Another local one already lifted w/ armor
http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/5399852597.html

[ZERO THEORY]

2005 w/ lift and armor $15k, and local
http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/5428606204.html

All it needs is a paintjob. Might call him in the morning.


Another local one already lifted w/ armor
http://denver.craigslist.org/cto/5399852597.html

Saw that. Called him yesterday and left a voicemail. Tried another call this afternoon. Nothing.

[hurley842002]

It's definitely not quiet. I mainly catch tire noise.


Now that you mention it, the Xterra is very loud inside on the highway, so I think its probably safe to assume that the Frontier is as well.

You guys must be accustomed to plush rides, my Xterra is quiet compared to my previous vehicles.

[Gman]

The good news is that while MPG has stayed the same, power has gone up considerably.
Ain't that the truth. Based on the SUVs in my life;

2004 5.3l V8 - 295hp - 330lb-ft - 4 speed trans - 14city/18hwy - 7,400 max towing
2016 3.0l V6 - 362hp - 369lb-ft - 7 speed trans - 17city/21hwy - 7,500 max towing

[HoneyBadger]

Ain't that the truth. Based on the SUVs in my life;

2004 5.3l V8 - 295hp - 330lb-ft - 4 speed trans - 14city/18hwy - 7,400 max towing
2016 3.0l V6 - 362hp - 369lb-ft - 7 speed trans - 17city/21hwy - 7,500 max towing
That likely explains my towing experience.

[ben4372]

A guy A work has a first gen Tundra with the baby V8 and he take it everywhere. Has a shell on it and and camps in it. And they seem to be the same or even less than Tacomas.

[ColoradoTJ]

I have always had a Toyota in my driveway for at least one of my vehicles. This way I can ensure not walking.


I was was lucky in buying my 14 TRD Sport Longbed for what we did new. Looking at used Tacoma trucks with 30k on them were more in most cases.

Other areas to to look at:

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/frontier/2006/safety/
http://www.edmunds.com/toyota/tacoma/2006/safety/

Nobody wakes up in the morning and says "I think today is accident day...." and high fives themselves.

[HoneyBadger]

Other areas to to look at:

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/frontier/2006/safety/
http://www.edmunds.com/toyota/tacoma/2006/safety/

Nobody wakes up in the morning and says "I think today is accident day...." and high fives themselves.
Depends on which year you look at:

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/frontier/2010/safety/
http://www.edmunds.com/toyota/tacoma/2010/safety/

[davsel]

Just PM'd him. You may be the MVP of this thread yet, coop.
Further down the thread, the owner/seller posted his phone number.

[ZERO THEORY]

Further down the thread, the owner/seller posted his phone number.
Found that. Already set up a meet for Saturday. Everything's coming up Melhouse.

[ColoradoTJ]

Depends on which year you look at:

http://www.edmunds.com/nissan/frontier/2010/safety/
http://www.edmunds.com/toyota/tacoma/2010/safety/

Very True and Good point.

[coop68]

Found that. Already set up a meet for Saturday. Everything's coming up Melhouse.

Glade you got in touch if i had 13k would be a nice first gen to have. Hope it all works out!

[ZERO THEORY]

Glade you got in touch if i had 13k would be a nice first gen to have. Hope it all works out!

Thanks again for the link. I was big on the 2nd gens, but after seeing that thing, I'm all in. Can't wait to get eyes on it in person. I will really put that tent to use.

[Irving]

Glade you got in touch if i had 13k would be a nice first gen to have. Hope it all works out!

I've got 15k, what's that guy's number?

[ZERO THEORY]

I've got 15k, what's that guy's number?

http://i.imgur.com/mndZWAD.gif

[TheSparkens]

I just purchased a 2014 Taco with 6000 miles and this one has all the bells and for what I got for the Ridgeline and after looking and driving both the Tacoma and Frontier for me the Taco fit. I grew up in a " Toyota " family and beside the normal maintenance items I have never personally been stranded by one and I have had many with over 100,000. For work its a full sizes truck and Ford is the one for me, I can't wait for the F-150 diesel.

[Ronin13]

I own a 2014 Nissan Frontier Pro-4x (IIRC, Pre-2012 it was the NISMO off road), with about 23K on it, purchased brand new at the end of '14. I love it! Great truck, well built, relatively unstoppable, and gets decent MPG for a V6. I was looking into either the '14 Frontier or the '14 Tacoma, and the reason I opted for the Frontier was due to the more powerful engine and the better price point. Everyone touts the resale value for the Toyotas as a reason for going for them, but that's like saying you picked a fit blonde for the divorce factor that she'd easily go for another guy when you're tired of her. I'm not concerned with the time I'm done with the truck, I'm concerned with actually using the thing. It does all I ask of it and more- it works well in the winter when there is snow on the unplowed Denver roads (and my condo complex parking lot), it transports my guns to the mountains to go shooting, and it hits trails just fine. I can also load up and move my motorcycle just fine with the 4.75' bed. The Pro-4X has heated cloth seats, something I don't mind, and locking rear diff, 4WD, backup camera, and the ever useful in-bed rail system with modular cleats so I can tie down pretty much anything anyway I need. I love it, and have yet to have an issue with it. Can't say anything for the Taco, as I've never owned one, but as far as from the 'san perspective I hope this helps. [Beer]

[COcz]

Don't forget to check for frame rot on the Toyotas.

[Grant H.]

What I want to know is what trailers are you guys towing with mini-trucks???

There isn't a trailer in our family that I would trust a Tacoma or Frontier to pull/stop responsibly. Not even the small-ish enclosed motorcycle trailer.

I hope you all have little tiny trailers...

[Dave_L]

What I want to know is what trailers are you guys towing with mini-trucks???

There isn't a trailer in our family that I would trust a Tacoma or Frontier to pull/stop responsibly. Not even the small-ish enclosed motorcycle trailer.

I hope you all have little tiny trailers...

But tow capacity says 7000lb. ;)

[hurley842002]

What I want to know is what trailers are you guys towing with mini-trucks???

There isn't a trailer in our family that I would trust a Tacoma or Frontier to pull/stop responsibly. Not even the small-ish enclosed motorcycle trailer.

I hope you all have little tiny trailers...

Plenty of trailers that can be towed with a "mini" truck. I'd be more curious to know what massive trailers the majority of the metro area folks need monster diesels for....

[Ronin13]

What I want to know is what trailers are you guys towing with mini-trucks???

There isn't a trailer in our family that I would trust a Tacoma or Frontier to pull/stop responsibly. Not even the small-ish enclosed motorcycle trailer.

I hope you all have little tiny trailers...
I don't own a trailer, so it's immaterial. I would trust my truck to pull a small enclosed MC trailer, if I were to ever get one. Apparently you're a size queen... [Flower]

[Dave_L]

I did tow a '67 mustang on a flatbed trailer from Grand Junction to Denver in my Tacoma once. It did it...but I was struggling up Vail pass (downshift to second, redline, upshift, slow down til I could downshift again. Repeat) and it got dicey once when trying to slow down. I wouldn't want to do it on a regular basis.

I had a buddy buy a 26' camper and tow it with his Frontier. He towed it home from the dealer and then went and bought a 2500. He learned his lesson.

[SouthPaw]

The newer Tacomas have a tow capacity of 6,400lbs IIRC.

[Ronin13]

My guess is that most people with smaller trucks (even the Dakota V6) don't really tow many trailers. I can only speak for myself, but I needed the bed for hauling firewood and misc building supplies, otherwise I would have bought an SUV; I imagine it's somewhat of a similar story for others.

[Monky]

The newer Tacomas have a tow capacity of 6,400lbs IIRC.

My friend pulled his Wake boat with a Taco once.. he then went out and bought an F250.. then a Dodge 2500... then a Tundra.. then back to the F250.. he's also a toyota mechanic

[Grant H.]

I did tow a '67 mustang on a flatbed trailer from Grand Junction to Denver in my Tacoma once. It did it...but I was struggling up Vail pass (downshift to second, redline, upshift, slow down til I could downshift again. Repeat) and it got dicey once when trying to slow down. I wouldn't want to do it on a regular basis.

I had a buddy buy a 26' camper and tow it with his Frontier. He towed it home from the dealer and then went and bought a 2500. He learned his lesson.

This was more my point.

You can technically pull a trailer with lots of things. That doesn't make it a good idea. A 67 mustang is 2600-2700lbs, and a trailer for it, depends on the trailer, probably 1500 or less. 4200lbs, well within the listed "towing capacity" of the truck, but towing it was to infer from Dave's post, not a good idea.

There is a LOT more that goes into towing something than whether you can hook it up and get it rolling. Tongue weight, pulling power, stopping power, suspension roll, frame strength, etc...

I'm not a "size queen" at all.

I have just spent too much time pulling a trailer to not get worried when I see people talking about towing with a little "run-about with a bed" truck. I've seen too many people have really poor outcomes from trying to pull something with the wrong vehicle.

Hopefully, Ronin's supposition of mostly needing the bed (not towing) with the mini-trucks is true.

[ColoradoTJ]

Best of both worlds.....

63934

I have towed my flatbed with the 14' LB Sport. Not bad actually. It was only 4K lbs and did just fine.


So I am a Toyota fan boy, but I would buy a Nissan product in a NY minute.

[Grant H.]

My friend pulled his Wake boat with a Taco once.. he then went out and bought an F250.. then a Dodge 2500... then a Tundra.. then back to the F250.. he's also a toyota mechanic

Our wake boat and trailer is ~4700 no fuel/gear. Even the 1500 pickup seems undersized for it.

[ColoradoTJ]

This was more my point.

You can technically pull a trailer with lots of things. That doesn't make it a good idea. A 67 mustang is 2600-2700lbs, and a trailer for it, depends on the trailer, probably 1500 or less. 4200lbs, well within the listed "towing capacity" of the truck, but towing it was to infer from Dave's post, not a good idea.

There is a LOT more that goes into towing something than whether you can hook it up and get it rolling. Tongue weight, pulling power, stopping power, suspension roll, frame strength, etc...

I'm not a "size queen" at all.

I have just spent too much time pulling a trailer to not get worried when I see people talking about towing with a little "run-about with a bed" truck. I've seen too many people have really poor outcomes from trying to pull something with the wrong vehicle.

Hopefully, Ronin's supposition of mostly needing the bed (not towing) with the mini-trucks is true.


You our should post up some of your trailers Grant. Lol. They might understand. Ever sell your enclosed you had for sale on colorado4x4?

[ColoradoTJ]

My guess is that most people with smaller trucks (even the Dakota V6) don't really tow many trailers. I can only speak for myself, but I needed the bed for hauling firewood and misc building supplies, otherwise I would have bought an SUV; I imagine it's somewhat of a similar story for others.

I would have to agree. Most people that buy smaller trucks do not plan on towing much. The ones that do get very disappointed after 4500-5500 lbs if they even hit a hill.

[Grant H.]

You our should post up some of your trailers Grant. Lol. They might understand. Ever sell your enclosed you had for sale on colorado4x4?

I know, my trailer selection is a little different than most.

It did, finally, thankfully. It's nice to have it out of my driveway.

For reference:

Enclosed trailer I just sold off:
32' Enclosed Trailer, all steel construction...
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/671/21594175812_8156861459_c.jpg (https://flic.kr/p/yUcN95)0806151909 (https://flic.kr/p/yUcN95) by ARNEWB (https://www.flickr.com/photos/61071044@N08/), on Flickr

[ColoradoTJ]

That was such a good deal too. Glad it sold.

[ZERO THEORY]

Welp, the 1st gen sold today, so I didn't even get a chance to get eyes on it. Automotive Avenues has a '10 Frontier on the lot for me to check out in the morning first thing, then I'm going down to meet a guy from Salida in Monument to show him my Dodge.

Back to the drawing board.

[hurley842002]

Welp, the 1st gen sold today, so I didn't even get a chance to get eyes on it. Automotive Avenues has a '10 Frontier on the lot for me to check out in the morning first thing, then I'm going down to meet a guy from Salida in Monument to show him my Dodge.

Back to the drawing board.

Dang, that's too bad. What trim level is the Frontier you are looking at?

[ZERO THEORY]

Dang, that's too bad. What trim level is the Frontier you are looking at?
Pro 4X

[coop68]

Welp, the 1st gen sold today, so I didn't even get a chance to get eyes on it. Automotive Avenues has a '10 Frontier on the lot for me to check out in the morning first thing, then I'm going down to meet a guy from Salida in Monument to show him my Dodge.

Back to the drawing board.

Darn, it was a really good deal was suprised it lasted as long as it did!

I dont tow any trailers, but wanted a truck i could haul gear in when needing more storage and hit some trails up in the mountains.

[hurley842002]

Pro 4X

Nice! Definitely worth the extra $$ IMO.

[Irving]

Welp, the 1st gen sold today, so I didn't even get a chance to get eyes on it. Automotive Avenues has a '10 Frontier on the lot for me to check out in the morning first thing, then I'm going down to meet a guy from Salida in Monument to show him my Dodge.

Back to the drawing board.

Best 15k I ever spent!

[Honey Badger282.8]

What I want to know is what trailers are you guys towing with mini-trucks???

There isn't a trailer in our family that I would trust a Tacoma or Frontier to pull/stop responsibly. Not even the small-ish enclosed motorcycle trailer.

I hope you all have little tiny trailers...

I can't speak to the Tacoma but my Frontier did fine towing a Uhaul from VA to here. All loaded I was slightly over the max rated towing weight. If towing is your main concern there are better trucks out there but as an occasional tow rig they do fine.

[Martinjmpr]

I would have to agree. Most people that buy smaller trucks do not plan on towing much. The ones that do get very disappointed after 4500-5500 lbs if they even hit a hill.

I had a 2007 v6 4Runner (same running gear as a 2nd gen Tacoma) and for the last year we pulled a 2000lb trailer. We towed that trailer up to Canada, NY, down to Big Bend inTX.

It was pretty clear by our 2nd or 3rd trip that the v6 was not a great tow vehicle. It wasn't terrible, but it wasn't that good either. At the end of the year I sold it and got a proper tow vehicle with. V8.

If you're talking about occasionally pulling a little utility trailer or small camper, the v6 Frontier or Taco would be fine. But for pulling a 1 ton plus trailer on long trips on a regular basis I'd go for a more suitable tow vehicle.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[ZERO THEORY]

Well, the Dodge is gone. Haven't found a Tacoma that fits the bill and is affordable, but there's a Frontier the dealer's holding onto until I make a decision over the weekend while I'm looking at a Jeep tonight.

And to be honest, I'll probably be buying the Jeep. Despite my best efforts, I have found myself staring down the barrel of another Mopar machine. This would be the 5th. Thanks for the insight, all. I'll let you know if I go to the darkside or get another Heep.

[Martinjmpr]

Well, the Dodge is gone. Haven't found a Tacoma that fits the bill and is affordable, but there's a Frontier the dealer's holding onto until I make a decision over the weekend while I'm looking at a Jeep tonight.

And to be honest, I'll probably be buying the Jeep. Despite my best efforts, I have found myself staring down the barrel of another Mopar machine. This would be the 5th. Thanks for the insight, all. I'll let you know if I go to the darkside or get another Heep.

Masochist, huh? :D

[ZERO THEORY]

Masochist, huh? :D

Someone put a Chrysler curse on me.

[Great-Kazoo]

Well, the Dodge is gone. Haven't found a Tacoma that fits the bill and is affordable, but there's a Frontier the dealer's holding onto until I make a decision over the weekend while I'm looking at a Jeep tonight.

And to be honest, I'll probably be buying the Jeep. Despite my best efforts, I have found myself staring down the barrel of another Mopar machine. This would be the 5th. Thanks for the insight, all. I'll let you know if I go to the darkside or get another Heep.


Unless you put a deposit on it...IMO the only reason he's holding it, it's been there too long with no buyers.
Over priced, bed creditor, something else may have played in to it. I don't know any sales folks that hold vehicles over the weekend. Saturday's payday for all automotive or mc business.
Knowing you're looking at other vehicles doesn't put too much stock you'll be a buyer, come monday morning.

[ZERO THEORY]

Dear Toyota/Nissan: make a Tacoma/Frontier with a solid front axle and I'm all in. Until then, I'm going down with the ship.


http://i.imgur.com/nbchebu.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/27GAgmu.jpg

[hurley842002]

Dear Toyota/Nissan: make a Tacoma/Frontier with a solid front axle and I'm all in. Until then, I'm going down with the ship.


http://i.imgur.com/nbchebu.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/27GAgmu.jpg

Did you buy that? If so, very nice!

I used to be a solid axle snob (owned 4 XJ's), and then realized with my 80/20 (on road/off road) driving habits (now more like 90/10), that a solid axle rig just wasn't necessary, and the IFS would take me anywhere I needed to go, in much more comfort.

I'm certainly not one for questioning why a person needs something, but for light to medium trails, is there a reason you are so adamant about solid axle? I understand the actual difference in off road handling between the two, but just curious.

[Irving]

The next Wrangler will be front and rear independent suspension.

[hurley842002]

The next Wrangler will be front and rear independent suspension.

That's what my brother was saying, say goodbye to the "real" Jeep.

[Irving]

I don't think so. If it came out all independent but with portal axles, hard core off-roaders will be waiting in line like a Krispy Kreme giving out iPhone 7 filled donughts.

[ZERO THEORY]

Did you buy that? If so, very nice!

I used to be a solid axle snob (owned 4 XJ's), and then realized with my 80/20 (on road/off road) driving habits (now more like 90/10), that a solid axle rig just wasn't necessary, and the IFS would take me anywhere I needed to go, in much more comfort.

I'm certainly not one for questioning why a person needs something, but for light to medium trails, is there a reason you are so adamant about solid axle? I understand the actual difference in off road handling between the two, but just curious.

Ease of use and durability, basically.

As it sits now, there's really nothing the Jeep can't do that a Tacoma with a 3" lift couldn't do. However, the ease and cost of getting the Jeep where it's at compared to coilovers, upper control arms, diff drops, diff armor, et. al. is significant. And in a couple of years when I'm in a position to buy another daily driver and use the JK as purely a trail project, there's no need to do a SAS and fabrication, blah, blah, blah.

And of course, the durability factor. I'm not going to be running out at the Hammers or anything over the summer, but it's nice knowing that on the rocky trails here in CO (Pickle Gulch, for example), I won't have to worry that if I miss a line I might rip the half shaft right off the truck, or bend the control arm. Not that a solid axle is impervious to damage obviously, but there is a obvious difference in durability.

I can carry spare shafts for the axles in the back and if I managed to spin one, replace it right there on the trail without wanting to jump off a cliff. I can add sleeves and gussets and increase the axle strength exponentially. I can find a Craigslist D60, build it, and mount it at home with just a bit of metalwork to relocate the mounts, new hubs, and a pair of driveshafts. Solid is really just a more forgiving and adaptable setup that saves a lot of headache down the road.


I don't think so. If it came out all independent but with portal axles, hard core off-roaders will be waiting in line like a Krispy Kreme giving out iPhone 7 filled donughts.

Portal axles would be amazing. It'd be like a giant Polaris Razr with 350 ft/lbs.

[Martinjmpr]

Dear Toyota/Nissan: make a Tacoma/Frontier with a solid front axle and I'm all in. Until then, I'm going down with the ship.



Dear Zero Theory: That ain't happening. IFS is here to stay. Coming soon to a platform you love: IRS too.

And BTW if you think you're punishing us by driving a jeep, rest assured that you're only punishing yourself.

Love, Toyota and Nissan. [ROFL2]

[hurley842002]

Ease of use and durability, basically.

As it sits now, there's really nothing the Jeep can't do that a Tacoma with a 3" lift couldn't do. However, the ease and cost of getting the Jeep where it's at compared to coilovers, upper control arms, diff drops, diff armor, et. al. is significant. And in a couple of years when I'm in a position to buy another daily driver and use the JK as purely a trail project, there's no need to do a SAS and fabrication, blah, blah, blah.

And of course, the durability factor. I'm not going to be running out at the Hammers or anything over the summer, but it's nice knowing that on the rocky trails here in CO (Pickle Gulch, for example), I won't have to worry that if I miss a line I might rip the half shaft right off the truck, or bend the control arm. Not that a solid axle is impervious to damage obviously, but there is a obvious difference in durability.

I can carry spare shafts for the axles in the back and if I managed to spin one, replace it right there on the trail without wanting to jump off a cliff. I can add sleeves and gussets and increase the axle strength exponentially. I can find a Craigslist D60, build it, and mount it at home with just a bit of metalwork to relocate the mounts, new hubs, and a pair of driveshafts. Solid is really just a more forgiving and adaptable setup that saves a lot of headache down the road.

So in other words, beyond light to medium trail use lol. Either way, sweet rig!

[TFOGGER]

Not to side track the thread, but my wife's 95 Rodeo is starting to show it's age, so we started shopping for a replacement. The criteria were (we thought) fairly straight forward: no more than 6 years old (flexible subject to mileage and condition), off road capable, under $20k, and manual transmission. The last one proved to be a total kicker. Basically, our choices are 8 year old FJ Cruisers (which she can't see out of), Wrangle Unlimiteds which are pushing the upper end of the budget, and Xterras. We're negotiating on a 2012 Xterra right now, but I'm blown away that it's so frickin hard to find something with a manual transmission. I've been out of the automotive aftermarket for a while, but back when, auto transmissions simply did not have the durability and reliability for four wheeling without major upgrades to clutches and cooling. Has that really changed?

[Martinjmpr]

Not to side track the thread, but my wife's 95 Rodeo is starting to show it's age, so we started shopping for a replacement. The criteria were (we thought) fairly straight forward: no more than 6 years old (flexible subject to mileage and condition), off road capable, under $20k, and manual transmission. The last one proved to be a total kicker. Basically, our choices are 8 year old FJ Cruisers (which she can't see out of), Wrangle Unlimiteds which are pushing the upper end of the budget, and Xterras. We're negotiating on a 2012 Xterra right now, but I'm blown away that it's so frickin hard to find something with a manual transmission. I've been out of the automotive aftermarket for a while, but back when, auto transmissions simply did not have the durability and reliability for four wheeling without major upgrades to clutches and cooling. Has that really changed?

Pretty sure that changed a long time ago. Auto's are now generally preferred for off road use, especially the big rock crawling buggies. Transmission coolers are cheap and modern electronic auto transmissions are as reliable as anything else made today (which is pretty darn reliable.)

I'm a stick shift guy too (my DD 2wd Mazda pickup is a manual and so is my wife's YJ) but we're all going to have to accept that the day of the MT will soon be over.

Toyota dropped the MT from the 4runner way back in 2001, the FJC and Xterra have been dropped from their respective lineups. Full size 1/2 ton trucks haven't had MT's for a decade or so and for SUVs it's even worse - I think the last Suburban to have a manual was the old "square" body style that ended in 1991. Expedition, Tahoe, Sequoia, R51 Pathfinder (the 2005 - 2011 models) and Armada have never been sold in the US with manual transmissions.

The only way to get a 4x4 with a stick shift nowadays is either to go with a Jeep Wrangler or a Tacoma/Frontier (even the new Chevy Colorado/GMC Canyon is automatic only.) I suppose there's a slight possibility that IF Ford reintroduces the Ranger to the US market (there's been scuttlebutt about that) it might have a manual but I wouldn't bet on the truck even showing up in US markets - it would take sales away from the F150 and with cheap gas there's no incentive to build any more mid sized or compact trucks.

The only exception to the above I can think of is 3/4 - 1 ton and up 4x4 trucks from Ford and Dodge might be available with MTs. I don't really know.

EDITED TO ADD: I just remembered there were some models of the Jeep Liberty that were sold with MTs (6 speed I think.) I don't know how rare they are though, but they are a true body-on-frame SUV with a low range T-case. The first generation "Round eye" Libertys were a little - how can I say this? - "Girly looking" but the later ones looked OK. Not sure why Jeep dropped the Liberty, I always thought it was kind of a nice sized compact SUV. A few years back the wife and I rented a 2wd Dodge Nitro (same thing as the Liberty) and that thing was a tank. Solid as a rock.

Now they've replaced it with that "Cherokee" AWD crossover. Just what we needed, another crossover. :rolleyes:

[TFOGGER]

Yeah, her words were "I don't want a soccer mom SUV." We don't go off road more than maybe a half dozen times a year, but when we do, low range and skid plates are pretty useful. The "crossovers" all lack basic necessities, like ground clearance and low range. Currently, the motor home is the only thing we own with an auto trans, but maybe I can convince her...we'll see how it goes with the Xterra negotiations. They're currently about 2 grand more than we're willing to pay, but it has a 6 speed (Pro 4X package with the locking rear diff).

[hurley842002]

Yeah, her words were "I don't want a soccer mom SUV." We don't go off road more than maybe a half dozen times a year, but when we do, low range and skid plates are pretty useful. The "crossovers" all lack basic necessities, like ground clearance and low range. Currently, the motor home is the only thing we own with an auto trans, but maybe I can convince her...we'll see how it goes with the Xterra negotiations. They're currently about 2 grand more than we're willing to pay, but it has a 6 speed (Pro 4X package with the locking rear diff).

Can't beat 6 speed and Pro 4X.

[ZERO THEORY]

Pretty sure that changed a long time ago. Auto's are now generally preferred for off road use, especially the big rock crawling buggies. Transmission coolers are cheap and modern electronic auto transmissions are as reliable as anything else made today (which is pretty darn reliable.)

I'm a stick shift guy too (my DD 2wd Mazda pickup is a manual and so is my wife's YJ) but we're all going to have to accept that the day of the MT will soon be over.

Toyota dropped the MT from the 4runner way back in 2001, the FJC and Xterra have been dropped from their respective lineups. Full size 1/2 ton trucks haven't had MT's for a decade or so and for SUVs it's even worse - I think the last Suburban to have a manual was the old "square" body style that ended in 1991. Expedition, Tahoe, Sequoia, R51 Pathfinder (the 2005 - 2011 models) and Armada have never been sold in the US with manual transmissions.

The only way to get a 4x4 with a stick shift nowadays is either to go with a Jeep Wrangler or a Tacoma/Frontier (even the new Chevy Colorado/GMC Canyon is automatic only.) I suppose there's a slight possibility that IF Ford reintroduces the Ranger to the US market (there's been scuttlebutt about that) it might have a manual but I wouldn't bet on the truck even showing up in US markets - it would take sales away from the F150 and with cheap gas there's no incentive to build any more mid sized or compact trucks.

The only exception to the above I can think of is 3/4 - 1 ton and up 4x4 trucks from Ford and Dodge might be available with MTs. I don't really know.

EDITED TO ADD: I just remembered there were some models of the Jeep Liberty that were sold with MTs (6 speed I think.) I don't know how rare they are though, but they are a true body-on-frame SUV with a low range T-case. The first generation "Round eye" Libertys were a little - how can I say this? - "Girly looking" but the later ones looked OK. Not sure why Jeep dropped the Liberty, I always thought it was kind of a nice sized compact SUV. A few years back the wife and I rented a 2wd Dodge Nitro (same thing as the Liberty) and that thing was a tank. Solid as a rock.

Now they've replaced it with that "Cherokee" AWD crossover. Just what we needed, another crossover. :rolleyes:

Chrysler are really the only ones still giving the manual its due. The Ram 3/4 and 1 ton trucks have awesome manuals, and the JKs still have them. Other than that, there aren't a lot of 4x4 manual options left.

EDIT: And the Tacos/Frontiers as obviously mentioned ITT. Although even Toyota has cut the manual to only being a Sport or Off Road package option. The Limited config (most expensive at $34K+) won't even let you get one.

[Martinjmpr]

Although even Toyota has cut the manual to only being a Sport or Off Road package option. The Limited config (most expensive at $34K+) won't even let you get one.

From what I've read on the truck and 4x4 boards I'm on, the 6 speed manual in the Tacoma is crap. Well, not necessarily the transmission itself, but the transmission and gearing as it comes from the factory is not well liked. In fact, I think the EPA estimated MPG for the auto is higher than for the MT. Most people who try both the 6m and the 5a in the Tacoma end up liking the slushbox a lot more.

The 4 cyl/5 speed is a different matter, but I believe that's only available in the stripped down packages with either a regular cab or an extended cab - AFAIK no double cabs are available in that configuration (and the DC is the most popular of the Tacomas.)