Legal to carry in shopping malls?

[Batteriesnare]

Over heard some other CCW holders arguing over whether or not is is legal to carry in a shopping mall, ie Park Meadows. Went though the laws on RMGO, couldn't find anything. Can anyone point me in the right direction? I've not seen anything posted at PM, or any other mall. Thoughts?

Thanks!
[Beer]

[Mtn.man]

What did they teach you in CC school.

Cannot Carry:

1) Public school grounds, (weapon cannot leave vehicle)
2) Federal Property where prohibited.
3) Public buildings where electronic scanning devices and/or guards posted at entrance.
4) PRIVATE property where Prohibited. (malls would fall under this catagory)

[Irving]

Didn't they also teach you that if you DO carry on private property where Prohibited, that they just ask you to leave, or ticket you for trespassing? You're not breaking any laws by carrying there right? No more than you are breaking the law by having long hair while living under your father's roof. lol

[Mtn.man]

Maybe leave the T shirt that says

I HAVE A
CCW


at home,,, might help. LOL

[jackmode9316]

So they ARE prohibited at shopping malls? I would assume they would have a sign or something?

[RRD3]

I think there has to be a sign posted saying you can't.

[Irving]

Haha, that's what I was thinking, but wasn't going to say anything.

[jackmode9316]

Everytime I go pay my water bill at the lakewood city hall thingamajig, I see the big sign posted everywhere saying you cant carry a gun unless you are LEO. I cant think of one other place ive seen that and just assumed if they didnt want you to carry, they would make sure to let you know.

[bellavite1]

The movie theater at the Pavillions on 16th st. mall has the sign.
I politely espressed my feelings to the manager and left.

[Irving]

The question is whether it is legal to carry in a private establishment that doesn't allow it. I would say that it is legal on the premise that you are not breaking any laws.

You can't smoke in a mall either, but what is the worst thing that will happen to you?

P.S. Just because you might not be breaking any laws, I still wouldn't encourage it.

[Bailey Guns]

A shopping mall is private property. If it's posted "no concealed carry" or you're otherwise informed concealed carry is prohibited, then you cannot legally carry there and you are trespassing if you carry in spite of the notification. Same as if it's not posted and you're carrying - someone in charge of the property finds out you're carrying and informs you it's prohibited. If they then ask you to leave, you must comply or you are trespassing.

Any government building (excluding federal property) - for example Lakewood City Hall - cannot prohibit concealed carry unless they have security personnel and electronic screening devices permanently posted at each entrance. The statute is very clear on that. They can put up all the signs they want but unless they have personnel and equipment in place and actually screen for weapons, they're not in compliance with the law.

There's no state standard on signage (for example like there is in Texas) or notification that a specific location prohibits concealed carry.

[Irving]

What about the sign at the Arvada Tennis Center that says no open carry, and the similar sign at the park at 120th and Grant that says no open carry? I've always wondered.

[Bailey Guns]

Didn't they also teach you that if you DO carry on private property where Prohibited, that they just ask you to leave, or ticket you for trespassing? You're not breaking any laws by carrying there right? No more than you are breaking the law by having long hair while living under your father's roof. lol

Trespassing is a crime. Carrying where prohibited (for example on private property) would probably fall under 18-4-504 Third Degree Criminal Trespass, which states:

18-4-504. Third degree criminal trespass. (http://www.michie.com/colorado/lpext.dll?f=FifLink&t=document-frame.htm&l=query&iid=5ae26baf.54ec967d.0.0&q=%5BGroup%20%2718-4-504%27%5D)
(1) A person commits the crime of third degree criminal trespass if such person unlawfully enters or remains in or upon premises of another.
(2) Third degree criminal trespass is a class 1 petty offense, but:
(a) It is a class 3 misdemeanor if the premises have been classified by the county assessor for the county in which the land is situated as agricultural land pursuant to section 39-1-102 (http://www.michie.com/colorado/lpext.dll?f=FifLink&t=document-frame.htm&l=jump&iid=COCODE&d=39-1-102&sid=5ae26baf.54ec967d.0.0#JD_39-1-102) (1.6), C.R.S.; and
(b) It is a class 5 felony if the person trespasses on premises so classified as agricultural land with the intent to commit a felony thereon.

And BTW...the long hair thing was a felony in my house.

[Bailey Guns]

State law doesn't really address open carry...it's not specifically allowed or prohibited. The state leaves it up to local jurisdictions for the most part.

[Irving]

Oh yeah, thank you for the answer Bailey.

[kwando]

what i love is places that will post signs only on a few doors. i still carry regardless, i just find a door or entrance that does not have a sign and if i get stopped say i never saw a sign.

[jackmode9316]

Any government building (excluding federal property) - for example Lakewood City Hall - cannot prohibit concealed carry unless they have security personnel and electronic screening devices permanently posted at each entrance. The statute is very clear on that. They can put up all the signs they want but unless they have personnel and equipment in place and actually screen for weapons, they're not in compliance with the law.

Thats pretty interesting actually. I'll have to take a better look around at what the building actually is when I go pay my water bill. They certainly dont screen for weapons, so its got me wondering.

[Eow]

A shopping mall is private property. If it's posted "no concealed carry" or you're otherwise informed concealed carry is prohibited, then you cannot legally carry there and you are trespassing if you carry in spite of the notification. Same as if it's not posted and you're carrying - someone in charge of the property finds out you're carrying and informs you it's prohibited. If they then ask you to leave, you must comply or you are trespassing.

Good summary Bailey. Fundamentally, I believe that anyone should be free to do anything they like as long as they don't infringe on the rights of others. On private property (like a mall), an owner is (and should be) free to ban firearms if he doesn't want them on his property. Of course, we are also free not to shop in that mall. RMGO has a campaign to inform property owners that they are losing business when they ban guns in their buildings: http://www.rmgo.org/merchant/

[FromMyColdDeadHand]

Whenever I see those signs, I just thank my lucky stars that I didn't bring my red cartoon gun that day.


I had hjst had gotten my CCW and was carrying a P226 in a Raven IWB. Not the most concealable and I feel I'm printing like a Jennifer Aniston's nipples after a cool breeze. I had made a concerted effort to look for the signs at Cherry Creek mall the last time I had visited and hadn't seen anything. As the fam and I roll up the ramp to go in, I still don't see any signs, but as I hold the door open I see a huge sign with small print by the entrance. Too late now. My 4 year old ends up throwing a hissy and the whole mall is looking at me and I figure I'm done for. One guy is really eye-balling me, and I'm sure he's UC security. I read the sign on the way out and I don't see anything about weapons. GTG it looks like.