View Full Version : I screwed up.
jscwerve
08-22-2016, 12:46
I've been taking the train to work for the last few weeks to avoid parking my truck downtown. Id doing so I keep my little bodyguard in a pocket of my backpack instead of my truck center console.
I also travel a lot for work.
Brain farted today coming to the airport and forgot to remve said little .380.
Yup. They caught it in TSA precheck line.
I know I'm going to lose my preferred TSA status with a nice $3000.00 fine from them.
My concern is for other problems stemming from my stupidity.
Anyone have experience with this? Were you charged by the Denver DA, and of so, what was the charge?
Am I going to lose my concealed permit?
I do have to say the Denver PD was very understanding of the situation. I was detained, got to take a nice long walk through the airport in cuffs, sit in a holding cell that smelled like years of old piss. It didn't take long, they were actually concerned about what time my flight left and were expedient in getting me through. Miranda rights, questioning, confiscated the pistol of course, and on my way.
I would have even made my flight, they took me right to the front of the line to make it. They failed to mention that they unloaded the magazine and put it back into my backpack. So, whole process again, TSA finds magazine, calls supervisor, then calls PD. Missed my flight, cop was apologetic about the magazine thing. Funny I guess.
Again, my main concern is what charge I might catch from the Denver VA and if I'm gonna lose my permit.
Should I lawyer up?
Any advice is appreciated.
J.C.
newracer
08-22-2016, 13:00
I would at least start looking for a lawyer.
Bailey Guns
08-22-2016, 13:22
That sucks for sure.
Never happened to me so I can't tell you what to expect. I seriously doubt you're going to hurt yourself by cooperating in this case. At leasr initially. Pretty hard to argue they didn't find your gun. But I'd at least get a consult with one or more attorneys.
jscwerve
08-22-2016, 13:30
I'm making a list of a few attorneys to call when I get the time. I can't see that it will be a huge criminal charge, just curious as to what. I would think that if it was a big deal they would have arrested me and actually taken me to jail, not 45 minutes start to finish and off to my flight.
Getting my gun back is I'm certain a whole other can of worms.
Strangest question they asked me though was "who is this gun registered to?". My answer was no one, gun databases are illegal in Colorado.
I have family that was arrested for concealed carry without a permit where the gun was confiscated. The police department eventually offered the pistol back.
That sucks, sorry to hear about this. I've heard that some of the fines have dropped to $500 because it is such a common occurance, I can't say that is from a great source but let's hope it's true. Let us know how you do.
StagLefty
08-22-2016, 14:47
I have family that was arrested for concealed carry without a permit where the gun was confiscated. The police department eventually offered the pistol back.
I've always been curious about that. Is that SOP confiscating the gun ?
Yup. They caught it in TSA precheck line.
I know I'm going to lose my preferred TSA status with a nice $3000.00 fine from them.
I have a buddy that this happened to about 2 years ago. Wasn't in the pre-check line, but the normal one. Same thing, he got detained, cops were very nice, he made his flight. In the end he got a follow-up question from the DA (written response required), asking about his version of what happened, which he filled out and sent back. Couple of months later he got a letter saying no charges were going to be filed. Got his LCP back about 11 months after the incident. Never got a fine. Flew again out of DIA a couple of weeks later and saw the same cops - they were nice and joked about it. Didn't loose his permit (Elbert county).
Having a lawyer wouldn't be a bad thing, but I wouldn't sweat it that much. Unless they try and make an example out of you.
Great-Kazoo
08-22-2016, 15:51
#1 : talk to an attorney
#2 : If you were not charged then, i doubt there would be any charges down the road.
#3 : refer to #1
BlasterBob
08-22-2016, 16:35
I have family that was arrested for concealed carry without a permit where the gun was confiscated. The police department eventually offered the pistol back.
My younger brother's home in Chicago was burglarized some years ago and a bunch of silver coins were stolen along with his S&W snubbie .38. A couple years later, he actually got the revolver returned to him but had the arresting officers initials scratched into the frame for identification. The brother had a good friend - a Chicago Judge who apparently "pulled a few strings" since normally these recovered guns are dumped far out in Lake Michigan. Lucky guy and yes, it had been REGISTERED in the City.
funkymonkey1111
08-22-2016, 20:15
Were youbarrested or just detained?
mahabali
08-22-2016, 21:13
Faaack! That sucks. I fly every couple of weeks and I cant tell you how many times I have almost done this. My laptop bag that I travel with is also my weekend bag so there is usually a gun in it when I am not travelling. I have been walking into the airport and have realized that my carry gun is in my bag, and have turned around and put it back in the car.
Super easy to have this happen. Hopefully wont turn into too big of a deal for you. Good luck with everything.
This is my most common gun related anxiety dream. I some how get my carry gun to Japan or something, and only realize it as I'm in the security line in a foreign country. I don't even travel.
hurley842002
08-22-2016, 21:20
Super easy to have this happen. Hopefully wont turn into too big of a deal for you. Good luck with everything.
I wasn't going to direct anything negatively at the OP, as I'm sure he's overwhelmed with stress, and lesson has been learned, but NO it shouldn't be super easy to have this happen. If it's so easy to do something like this, I'd say your equipment accountability isn't very good, and you have become dangerously complacent with carrying.
To the OP, I'm sorry this happened, and hope it works out for the best.
DenverGP
08-22-2016, 21:48
I flew to chicago last week, first time flying in a few years. Used one of my backpacks as my carry-on. Same backpack that I often use for a quicky range trip when I don't want to lug the big range bag. So before packing I dumped backpack out, and turned it inside out to make sure it was completely empty. Flight to chicago was uneventful, but when I got to my hotel, I couldn't find my comb in the bag, so I dumped it out... found the comb and single 45acp round that must have been stuck in some corner of the bag. Gave it to a co-worker who lives in chicago to dispose of for me, didn't want to try testing TSA a second time.
jscwerve
08-22-2016, 23:45
Were youbarrested or just detained?
Just detained I guess. Was read my rights and gave a statement. I think of I was arrested they would have taken me to jail. They let me go and I made another flight.
I guess it may be complacency, definitely my fault, can't make excuses for that. I don't typically have it in the bag unless I'm taking the train to work downtown and the Rockies were in town all last week is why it was in there. Didn't leave the house really this weekend, so it stayed in the bag.
It'll be a hard lesson learned.
I used to wonder how people could lose track of guns or gun accessories, until I ended up with enough guns to not remember where I put them all and started finding random magazines in places I had forgot I placed them.
Snowman78
08-23-2016, 08:02
If they took your fingerprints you were arrested, this guy is good with gun stuff but he is expensive:
Robert B Wareham Esq
Attorney
Address: 300 Plaza Dr, Highlands Ranch, CO 80129
Phone: (303) 991-5280
Actually with Hurley on this one. And no undue judgment at op since he is already got the post incident grief to give himself. But for others, Leaving the house to me, you should be on body carrying or not at all. Exception being left on vehicle due to a prohibited location.
I get if you fly a lot is easier to be complacent on screening yourself for loose rounds and magazines. But losing track of guns is scary. I certainly don't "safely" store all my guns, but i know what room and what place i put everything when not in use.
Hopefully, someone will use common sense and realize it was just a mistake, no charges, no fine, and they give you your weapon back in the condition they received it in, in a reasonable amount of time. Hope for the best, plan for the worst: probably the best advice here is to at least have a chat with an attorney.
Burn OP on a stake!
I know a few people it has happened to. Nothing ever came of it. One @ DIA, one in Louisiana..
According to the Constitution of the United States, the OP did nothing wrong.
I can see it happening, sort of.
I'm often in a situation where carry on body isn't prudent as we're technically not allowed to carry while working. If I'm wearing a polo shirt and in close proximity to the client or anyone that may see my print as I move, reach, bend, it's just not workable.
In those cases, I always have my P938 in my backpack. However, it always comes out and goes back on-body when I leave the client location.
Due to this practice, I did find myself in the TSA line with a magazine in the side pouch of the backpack. Return to the car wasn't possible as the wife and I always park off-site when we travel for pleasure, nor would I have had time due to the delays getting the firearms checked through TSA to begin with. Had I had more time to get to a less conspicuous area, I could have possibly stashed it in a planter and tried retrieving it on my return, but ended up just dropping it in the trash, something nobody would give a second glance to.
HoneyBadger
08-23-2016, 14:06
Due to this practice, I did find myself in the TSA line with a magazine in the side pouch of the backpack. Return to the car wasn't possible as the wife and I always park off-site when we travel for pleasure, nor would I have had time due to the delays getting the firearms checked through TSA to begin with. Had I had more time to get to a less conspicuous area, I could have possibly stashed it in a planter and tried retrieving it on my return, but ended up just dropping it in the trash, something nobody would give a second glance to.
Your story reminded me of this:
http://i.imgur.com/zyPADFi.png
Chief_of_Scouts
08-24-2016, 02:07
I fly a lot, not just as a pilot. My work involves international travel, and I carry at work overseas and at home. Before heading to the airport, on either end, the first thing I do is the bag dump. As already recommended, I completely shake out and inspect any pack or bag that I will be flying with, just in case. Additionally, I NEVER use my traveling bags as range bags, or vice versa.
jscwerve
08-24-2016, 07:47
Quick update. TSA database must be slow to update. Still got precheck clearance on my flights today. Guess I'll see if it gets me on the naughty list when I fly again on Friday.
People in this thread that are pointing fingers about complacency and due diligence are absolutely right. I don't argue with that at all. It is however given me a new perspective and determination to jot ever let something this stupid happen again.
Unfortunately at the moment the pistol they took from me is the only one I own that is a carry piece. Have to buy something in the mean time until (if ever) I get it back.
Back in '87 I flew from Syracuse to Oklahoma, my carry-on was my huge camera bag full of Nikon gear. That bag went thru 2 xray machines and one hand inspection. When I got home I found the little Rohn RG10 revolver that I forgot was in there, fully loaded. I had it in there when I was in Texas to pop at rabbits with, drove from there to Syracuse.
Scared the living shit out of me when I found it!
jscwerve
09-02-2016, 10:47
Update time.
Received a call this morning from a DPD detective. He said he just got word from the DA. No charges. I can get my pistol back, not today, but probably next week. It's been given release from evidence.
No word yet from the TSA. I'm waiting on that 3k fine to show up soon enough.
Ive been on 5 flights since then and no harassment or problems.
newracer
09-02-2016, 10:53
That is great news.
kidicarus13
09-02-2016, 11:18
I highly doubt you'll be fined $3K or anything for that matter but let us know.
HoneyBadger
09-02-2016, 11:18
That is great news.
Yes it is. The local and federal authorities could have each burned the OP at the stake. Hopefully the TSA doesn't bring down the hammer.
Back in '87 I flew from Syracuse to Oklahoma, my carry-on was my huge camera bag full of Nikon gear. That bag went thru 2 xray machines and one hand inspection. When I got home I found the little Rohn RG10 revolver that I forgot was in there, fully loaded. I had it in there when I was in Texas to pop at rabbits with, drove from there to Syracuse.
Scared the living shit out of me when I found it!
A friend of mine did pretty much the same thing with a 6 inch 629 in his briefcase from Louisville to Denver in 84 or 85.
When did it change where people were no longer allowed to fly with guns?
When did it change where people were no longer allowed to fly with guns?
I assume you mean packing in the passenger cabin?
I sat next to one not too long ago, but he was "special."
Strangely enough, that gun did not kill everyone on board.
Quick search shows sometime in the late 60's when hijackings became more frequent.
"Take me to Cuba!"...That's when.
RCCrawler
09-02-2016, 21:04
I didn't know TSA had the authority to issue fines?
kidicarus13
09-02-2016, 21:10
I didn't know TSA had the authority to issue fines?
https://www.tsa.gov/travel/civil-enforcement
funkymonkey1111
09-02-2016, 22:03
I didn't know TSA had the authority to issue fines?
Yes, the "civil fine," assessed without a judge or jury
spongejosh
09-02-2016, 22:39
I hope there was a background check and transfer fees were paid when DPD took possession of the firearm....
Glad it's worked out for you so far.
ClangClang
09-02-2016, 22:52
Glad it ended well. I travel a ton (finished up 2015 with ~80 flights) and early on, I made a rule that my main travel/work bag NEVER gets any guns or ammo.
jscwerve
09-05-2016, 11:09
Another quick update:
I've still not heard from the TSA and their ridiculous fine. I have found a few specialist lawyers that deal specifically with the TSA and these types of things. I may call them, I haven't decided yet. I guess it depends if they issue a fine of 3k vs 6k.
I don't have time tomorrow, but I should be able to get my pistol back this week sometime. I'm not sure how that works yet, I can't believe that I'd be able to just walk into the police station and them hand it back to me and walk out. I'm almost certain that I'm not getting the ammo back. Oh well.
I've made the decision now that if I'm going to be carrying, it will be on my hip or in my pocket from now on. No more "in the bag" carry for me. Although convenient, I now see that it promotes complacency and a lackadaisical attitude while carrying.
I've been on 6 flights since then and the TSA has caught up. I no longer get precheck. To me that is going to be the biggest blow as much as I travel. Having to use the security lines with idiots that don't know how to travel efficiently and families without a clue. At least there is a premium passenger line at the airport that gets me up front.
I will update on how the process is when I go to pick up my gun from the PD.
gnihcraes
09-05-2016, 20:05
I don't have time tomorrow, but I should be able to get my pistol back this week sometime. I'm not sure how that works yet, I can't believe that I'd be able to just walk into the police station and them hand it back to me and walk out.
ya never know..
I had a stolen gun recovered and shipped back to my local PD. They called me to come get it, walked me out the door, handed me the pistol and said have a good day. Nothing like walking to my car through the city/PD parking lot with the pistol. (years before having ccw permit too)
hurley842002
09-05-2016, 20:40
I'm almost certain that I'm not getting the ammo back. Oh well.
What leads you to believe that? It's your personal property, why would you not get it back?
kidicarus13
09-05-2016, 22:45
To me that is going to be the biggest blow as much as I travel. Having to use the security lines with idiots that don't know how to travel efficiently
I had to chuckle at the irony.
hurley842002
09-05-2016, 22:46
I had to chuckle at the irony.
LOL
ClangClang
09-05-2016, 23:19
I had to chuckle at the irony.
Savage. [Score]
I had to chuckle at the irony.
Ouch! No mercy.
jscwerve
09-07-2016, 07:37
I had to chuckle at the irony.
Lol. Guess I deserved that one!
As it turns out, I will get back my ammo as well. For an extra trip to the PD. They will not release it the same day as the pistol. They said it would take a week for the background check to complete then I can pick it up. [facepalm]
I had a business associate lose his gun/ammo at DIA when he'd forgotten that he'd put his carry gun in his backpack so as not to leave it in his car when valet parking. Yep, DIA found it, cost him 7 grand to resolve, this has been a couple of years ago. He flies a lot. That seems to be a common denominator in these cases...and YES the feds know it. They pretend to be shocked at how often this happens, but they actually know that many of the free citizens of the late USA carry all of the time, and will occasionally forget what they have on board. I had a mag full of 9mm hollowpoints follow me to Chicago once. Nobody noticed, but I wasn't about to try to fool them twice. I actually don't know how I got it back home, but I imagine I probably had my sister-in-law send it back to me sans ammo.
Sorry for being late to the party- did the PD confiscate your CCW permit? We were instructed to do that at the courthouse I work at if someone brings a pistol in (we have signage). They have to surrender the permit and firearm. We return the firearm from our substation, but the permit is given to our CCW detective; what happens from there is beyond my knowledge, but I doubt the permit holder gets it back without having to explain themselves.
jscwerve
09-22-2016, 15:41
Sorry for being late to the party- did the PD confiscate your CCW permit? We were instructed to do that at the courthouse I work at if someone brings a pistol in (we have signage). They have to surrender the permit and firearm. We return the firearm from our substation, but the permit is given to our CCW detective; what happens from there is beyond my knowledge, but I doubt the permit holder gets it back without having to explain themselves.
Sorry for the late response. No, they did not take my permit. If they did and I had to explain, oh well. Not like they can grill me like I'm still in the military or something. If I did lose my permit, much like before I got my permit, it would absolutely not stop me from carrying.
Update. I've been traveling for the past few weeks, so I haven't even had time to get the paperwork in until Monday this week. They called on Tuesday and said that it was all good and to come pick up my pistol.
The whole trip was worth it to see the look on peoples faces when the officer comes out from the back into the waiting area and proceeds to say "Here's your holster sir, and here's the pistol". Then Hands them right to me. He said of course if I want my ammo back I could come back another day, I said to scrap it. Not worth the trip.
Still waiting on the TSA "civil fine" paperwork to arrive.
APEXgunparts
09-22-2016, 22:31
I had a business associate lose his gun/ammo at DIA when he'd forgotten that he'd put his carry gun in his backpack so as not to leave it in his car when valet parking. Yep, DIA found it, cost him 7 grand to resolve, this has been a couple of years ago. He flies a lot. That seems to be a common denominator in these cases...and YES the feds know it. They pretend to be shocked at how often this happens, but they actually know that many of the free citizens of the late USA carry all of the time, and will occasionally forget what they have on board. I had a mag full of 9mm hollowpoints follow me to Chicago once. Nobody noticed, but I wasn't about to try to fool them twice. I actually don't know how I got it back home, but I imagine I probably had my sister-in-law send it back to me sans ammo.
The TSA actually has a blog where they publish their "findings"...
http://blog.tsa.gov/
There is also plenty of statistics and some reports about particularly "odd" events.
Richard
jscwerve
09-23-2016, 06:16
The TSA actually has a blog where they publish their "findings"...
http://blog.tsa.gov/
There is also plenty of statistics and some reports about particularly "odd" events.
Richard
Wow. It is mind boggling (to me, maybe I'm weird) how many people carry without a round chambered. What good does that do? Interesting to see the statistic.
Aloha_Shooter
09-23-2016, 18:26
Glad you got your piece back.
Wow. It is mind boggling (to me, maybe I'm weird) how many people carry without a round chambered. What good does that do? Interesting to see the statistic.
A lot people agree with you but I will point out 1) the number of cases where the average person will have time to get their CCW out and aim it properly but not have time to rack the slide is a very small percentage (espeically for slower shooters) and 2) carrying your firearm in an easily reached place with a loaded magazine but not chambered will likely be more useful than having the same piece with a round chambered but inside a backpack.
I can think of a number of cases where someone might choose to not have a round chambered for safety (most involving being around a lot of kids). For me, the argument is on the level of bitching because I have a first aid kit in each vehicle and a more extensive one in the house but I don't have a trauma kit or tracheotomy kit.
KevDen2005
09-26-2016, 18:14
Update time.
Received a call this morning from a DPD detective. He said he just got word from the DA. No charges. I can get my pistol back, not today, but probably next week. It's been given release from evidence.
No word yet from the TSA. I'm waiting on that 3k fine to show up soon enough.
Ive been on 5 flights since then and no harassment or problems.
Same thing happened to my father in law. Got his gun back. No charges, no fines. The DPD detective said people make mistakes and they are looking to actually charge people like criminals and gang members that do it, not law abiding citizens that didn't intend on taking a gun on a plane.
Something similar happened to a friend of mine who is a cheap guy and a SWAT officer. He chose to use the same bag for SWAT that he did for travel because he didn't want to buy another one. He brought a flash bang past security. The TSA was not happy.
OneGuy67
09-27-2016, 08:55
Have you received your TSA letter yet?
Zundfolge
09-27-2016, 09:08
All this reinforces my resolve to never fly again until my CHL is good on the plane.
All this reinforces my resolve to never fly again until my CHL is good on the plane.
Don't hold your breath, blue is a lousy skin color unless you happen to be a Smurf...
KevDen2005
09-27-2016, 19:42
Sorry for being late to the party- did the PD confiscate your CCW permit? We were instructed to do that at the courthouse I work at if someone brings a pistol in (we have signage). They have to surrender the permit and firearm. We return the firearm from our substation, but the permit is given to our CCW detective; what happens from there is beyond my knowledge, but I doubt the permit holder gets it back without having to explain themselves.
My Father in Law didn't lose his CCW either. I feel like ACSO policies reflect how much Doug Darr hated CCW carriers.
hghclsswhitetrsh
09-27-2016, 19:45
My Father in Law didn't lose his CCW either. I feel like ACSO policies reflect how much Doug Darr hated CCW carriers.
Still do.
My Father in Law didn't lose his CCW either. I feel like ACSO policies reflect how much Doug Darr hated CCW carriers.
Still do.
Not so much... Mack is pretty pro-gun. I'm not entirely sure he has too much of his hands in what goes on with CCW other than signing off.
Not so much... Mack is pretty pro-gun. I'm not entirely sure he has too much of his hands in what goes on with CCW other than signing off.
Their application acceptance policies are far less than convenient: Tuesdays and Thursdays during very limited hours, make an appointment, but no guaranteed time. Contrast that with Jeffco: First come, first serve, 8 hours a day, five days a week.
Their application acceptance policies are far less than convenient: Tuesdays and Thursdays during very limited hours, make an appointment, but no guaranteed time. Contrast that with Jeffco: First come, first serve, 8 hours a day, five days a week.
Jeffco also has about 100 more certified deputies than we do. IIRC, they have 4 clerks and three detectives to handle all of that, we have only 1 clerk, 2 detectives. It's really a matter of manpower.
Jeffco also has about 100 more certified deputies than we do. IIRC, they have 4 clerks and three detectives to handle all of that, we have only 1 clerk, 2 detectives. It's really a matter of manpower.
If that's the case, then perhaps the detectives shouldn't waste their, and my, time personally calling me and making weak threats to revoke my ccw for "too many speeding tickets."
All that so I can wear a jacket over my perfectly legal firearm. SMH [facepalm]
Being a citizen means that I am presumed to be innocent and therefore my rights should not be infringed by governments who presume to know better and try to protect me from myself.
I have a dream that I live in a world where if one man pulls out a gun and points it at someone else, there will be thirty or more other people taking cover and pointing guns right back at him. Any man in that position who pulls the trigger will soon find himself a former problem for society. The police can come and take a report after the fact.
Snowman78
09-30-2016, 17:04
If that's the case, then perhaps the detectives shouldn't waste their, and my, time personally calling me and making weak threats to revoke my ccw for "too many speeding tickets."
How many tickets have you had?
How many tickets have you had?
At the time he called, he told me I had ten speeding tickets in 10 years. I pulled my MVR, and that wasn't quite true, I think it was 8 in ten years. He was telling me that it could be considered a form of aggressive behavior. But how was I supposed to respond to that? "I am NOT aggressive you SOB!" Haha. I never heard from him after that, nor did I expect to.
At the time he called, he told me I had ten speeding tickets in 10 years. I pulled my MVR, and that wasn't quite true, I think it was 8 in ten years. He was telling me that it could be considered a form of aggressive behavior. But how was I supposed to respond to that? "I am NOT aggressive you SOB!" Haha. I never heard from him after that, nor did I expect to.
Outlaw.....
fportmen45
09-30-2016, 21:00
If that's the case, then perhaps the detectives shouldn't waste their, and my, time personally calling me and making weak threats to revoke my ccw for "too many speeding tickets."
They do that? Are you kidding?
KevDen2005
09-30-2016, 22:39
Not so much... Mack is pretty pro-gun. I'm not entirely sure he has too much of his hands in what goes on with CCW other than signing off.
He does sign off on the policies surrounding ccw for his agency. I do like Mac, as I got to have beers with the guy and had a great conversation. It was no secret Darr did not like CCW and made it difficult as much as possible to get. I'm sure everyone remembers when ACSO would regularly take as long as 110 days or more to approve CCW even though statute requires 90 and when you call to find out the status of it after 90 days you get threatened to just have it not approved. There were other things Darr would do to as I recall. I'm sure Mac is "cooler" but ACSO hasn't changed in the CCW department very much. Along with charging full price for a CCW when renewing from another county and they say, "yeah it's a different county so we need full price." But if you go from Adams to Jeffco they only charge the renewal fee and not full price.
They do that? Are you kidding?
Not kidding, I got the call. I've never heard of anyone else ever getting special like that before, and I never heard back from the detective either. He honestly sounded like he didn't want to be making that phone call Any more than I wanted to receive it. This was right as I was renewing, if that counts for anything. There are so few people who handle the ccw stuff in Adams County that they really don't have the time for petty stuff like that. Everyone I've dealt with each time is genuinely polite as well, so I wouldn't worry about it. My driving record was likely worse back when I first applied amd it was never an issue.
KevDen2005
10-01-2016, 15:28
Not kidding, I got the call. I've never heard of anyone else ever getting special like that before, and I never heard back from the detective either. He honestly sounded like he didn't want to be making that phone call Any more than I wanted to receive it. This was right as I was renewing, if that counts for anything. There are so few people who handle the ccw stuff in Adams County that they really don't have the time for petty stuff like that. Everyone I've dealt with each time is genuinely polite as well, so I wouldn't worry about it. My driving record was likely worse back when I first applied amd it was never an issue.
Further why I feel that CCW stuff is below ACSO or they feel that they will make it difficult by overloading the staff and not giving them the resources to make it efficient.
fportmen45
10-02-2016, 13:45
Not kidding, I got the call. I've never heard of anyone else ever getting special like that before, and I never heard back from the detective either. He honestly sounded like he didn't want to be making that phone call Any more than I wanted to receive it. This was right as I was renewing, if that counts for anything. There are so few people who handle the ccw stuff in Adams County that they really don't have the time for petty stuff like that. Everyone I've dealt with each time is genuinely polite as well, so I wouldn't worry about it. My driving record was likely worse back when I first applied amd it was never an issue.
Wow...
jscwerve
10-07-2016, 07:08
Latest update:
I got back from another work trip yesterday to finally receive my TSA "Notice of violation" and "civil penalty" assessment. They batch send out these things at the end of every month.
As anticipated, The fine is $3000. $1500 if I pay within 30 days. There are also other options, formal hearing, informal hearing, financial hardship application, etc.
I have found an attorney that deals with TSA regularly and is quite affordable. He can't get the fine eliminated, but he guarantees he can get it down to $750. That plus his flat rate fee of $350 brings it to a total of $1100. The lawyer is formerly a chief counsel in the TSA NOV office. Before that he worked at the DOJ. I did as much research that I needed to satisfy my curiosity that he is legit and found quite a lot of info on him (mostly about him representing the TSA in court cases). His website is a bit basic, but oh well. If for some reason he is some extremely elaborate con artist that is targeting a VERY niche market of people with firearm TSA violations, I guess I'll be losing a few dollars. I sent him an email this morning for information and he called me within 5 minutes. After talking to him for a bit I feel this is the right way to go. It will save me a few hundred bucks and he takes care of all the paperwork, communication with the TSA, etc.
I will update once again next week once the case is settled as to how it goes.
Too bad your last name isn't Clinton or Kennedy :(
KevDen2005
10-07-2016, 08:19
Write off the fine as a travel expense
jscwerve
10-12-2016, 12:26
Final update on the case.
The lawyer I hired handled the informal hearing for me. All I had to do was a phone consultation with him and he took care of the rest.
My fine was reduced to $700. A far cry less than the $3000 the TSA letter initially assessed. I contacted the lawyer on Friday, the case was settled this afternoon. Not too bad considering Monday was a holiday. I'll be paying it off ASAP and will now have to continue to use the plebe line at the airport for the next three years, but it's my own fault.
It ended up better than I thought it would. Thankfully.
Just in case anyone else needs his services:
Scott Klippel
http://tsanovdefense.com/
Final update on the case.
The lawyer I hired handled the informal hearing for me. All I had to do was a phone consultation with him and he took care of the rest.
My fine was reduced to $700. A far cry less than the $3000 the TSA letter initially assessed. I contacted the lawyer on Friday, the case was settled this afternoon. Not too bad considering Monday was a holiday. I'll be paying it off ASAP and will now have to continue to use the plebe line at the airport for the next three years, but it's my own fault.
It ended up better than I thought it would. Thankfully.
Just in case anyone else needs his services:
Scott Klippel
http://tsanovdefense.com/
Glad it worked out in the best way it could have!
Final update on the case.
The lawyer I hired handled the informal hearing for me. All I had to do was a phone consultation with him and he took care of the rest.
My fine was reduced to $700. A far cry less than the $3000 the TSA letter initially assessed. I contacted the lawyer on Friday, the case was settled this afternoon. Not too bad considering Monday was a holiday. I'll be paying it off ASAP and will now have to continue to use the plebe line at the airport for the next three years, but it's my own fault.
It ended up better than I thought it would. Thankfully.
Just in case anyone else needs his services:
Scott Klippel
http://tsanovdefense.com/
Assuming you can't pay for clear?
jscwerve
10-12-2016, 18:22
Assuming you can't pay for clear?
Yes, I have clear. Works well for long lines, but still have to the whole remove the shoes, jacket, laptop, etc thing. And all the non-travelers in those lines.
68Charger
10-12-2016, 18:30
Yes, I have clear. Works well for long lines, but still have to the whole remove the shoes, jacket, laptop, etc thing. And all the non-travelers in those lines.
I travel significantly, but not enough that I have bothered with pre-shit...
welcome to normal- it's not THAT bad, I have gotten thru Denver airport in <20min, and COS in <5min... DFW in <20min if I plan ahead (not booking prime-time flights,etc)
Come to think of it, this is more of a PSA for those that don't travel all the time...
KevDen2005
10-13-2016, 21:38
What was your lawyer fee?
What was your lawyer fee?
$2,300.
What was your lawyer fee?
Latest update:
I got back from another work trip yesterday to finally receive my TSA "Notice of violation" and "civil penalty" assessment. They batch send out these things at the end of every month.
As anticipated, The fine is $3000. $1500 if I pay within 30 days. There are also other options, formal hearing, informal hearing, financial hardship application, etc.
I have found an attorney that deals with TSA regularly and is quite affordable. He can't get the fine eliminated, but he guarantees he can get it down to $750. That plus his flat rate fee of $350 brings it to a total of $1100. The lawyer is formerly a chief counsel in the TSA NOV office. Before that he worked at the DOJ. I did as much research that I needed to satisfy my curiosity that he is legit and found quite a lot of info on him (mostly about him representing the TSA in court cases). His website is a bit basic, but oh well. If for some reason he is some extremely elaborate con artist that is targeting a VERY niche market of people with firearm TSA violations, I guess I'll be losing a few dollars. I sent him an email this morning for information and he called me within 5 minutes. After talking to him for a bit I feel this is the right way to go. It will save me a few hundred bucks and he takes care of all the paperwork, communication with the TSA, etc.
I will update once again next week once the case is settled as to how it goes.
I travel significantly, but not enough that I have bothered with pre-shit...
welcome to normal- it's not THAT bad, I have gotten thru Denver airport in <20min, and COS in <5min... DFW in <20min if I plan ahead (not booking prime-time flights,etc)
Come to think of it, this is more of a PSA for those that don't travel all the time...
We signed the whole family up for the Global Entry program, so we're in TSA Pre. I had been "randomly selected" for extra screening maybe twice in the decade before when going through the regular lines. I've been selected on both legs of my last trip and once on another trip before that since signing up. WTF? Wasn't that partially what the added hoops to jump through were for to get cleared for Pre?
Glad the whole thing seems to have worked out about as good as could be expected, OP.
funkymonkey1111
10-14-2016, 08:20
We signed the whole family up for the Global Entry program, so we're in TSA Pre. I had been "randomly selected" for extra screening maybe twice in the decade before when going through the regular lines. I've been selected on both legs of my last trip and once on another trip before that since signing up. WTF? Wasn't that partially what the added hoops to jump through were for to get cleared for Pre?
Glad the whole thing seems to have worked out about as good as could be expected, OP.
got pulled out of the orlando Pre Check line for "random" shaking down on Monday. at least the idiots at frontier have decided to join Pre Check.
funkymonkey1111
10-14-2016, 08:21
I travel significantly, but not enough that I have bothered with pre-shit...
welcome to normal- it's not THAT bad, I have gotten thru Denver airport in <20min, and COS in <5min... DFW in <20min if I plan ahead (not booking prime-time flights,etc)
Come to think of it, this is more of a PSA for those that don't travel all the time...
you must travel about once every five years, because frankly, that's about the threshold for pre-check to be worth it. and, so what if you have gotten through Denver in less than 20 minutes. How about Atlanta, Minneapolis, Phoenix, O'Hare, LAX, SFO, National...
KevDen2005
10-14-2016, 08:57
$2,300.
LOL, you kill me bro
jscwerve
10-14-2016, 09:04
Lol,
Bunch of comedians I see...[hahhah-no]
Seems to me that it is entirely luck of the draw.
I have two friends who have had essentially the same thing happen and there was no fine at all for either one. One case was handled entirely by Denver PD and the other, except for the handcuffs while he was walked to a room by Denver PD, was handled entirely by TSA.
Looks like you got a good lawyer that specializes in this TSA stuff.
I can second Snowman78 below. I have had good experiences with him and his law firm. Yes they are expensive.
If they took your fingerprints you were arrested, this guy is good with gun stuff but he is expensive:
Robert B Wareham Esq
Attorney
Address: 300 Plaza Dr, Highlands Ranch, CO 80129
Phone: (303) 991-5280
I had my CCW revoked during an issue. I got a letter from the County Sheriff (Arapahoe), and followed the instructions to appeal. Long story short I met face to face with the Sheriff, told him what happened, and I got to pick up my card a week later.
Sounds like things actually turned out well in the long run, kind of sucks about the carry rules at certain parts of the airport, but complaining about this will be like beating a dead horse
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