Shots fired at Fort Lauderdale Airport

[BushMasterBoy]

Seems there are multiple victims at Fort Lauderdale Airport. I would wager that is another religion of peace attack.


http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/01/06/reports-shots-fired-ft-lauderdale-airport/96248086/

[CS1983]

But it's illegal to shoot people. How could this happen?

[Joe_K]

5 Dead, 8 wounded. Amazed at how ignorant people are about safety, security, and danger.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[Monky]

No description of the man in custody... should we take bets?

[Dave_L]

Esteban Santiago has been identified as the gunman who opened fire at Fort Lauderdale-Hollywood International Airport, according to Senator Bill Nelson of Florida. Nelson told MSNBC that Santiago had a military ID and handgun with him when he shot up the baggage claim, killing several people and wounding more.

[CS1983]

I would have lost that bet... unless Esteban Santiago decided to go Moorish native.

[XC700116]

The senator, a Florida Democrat, tells MSNBC that the initial gunman was identified as 26-year-old Estaban Santiago and was carrying a military I.D.

[Fmedges]

Oooooooo they can start the all vets are broken and crazy narrative though.

[BushMasterBoy]

My other thought was, it was drug related. Disgruntled vet? It never occurred to me.

[sniper7]

Convert? Has happened before.

[spqrzilla]

Remember José Padilla, also known as Abdullah al-Muhajir or Muhajir Abdullah, convicted of plotting an Al Queda radiological bomb attack?

[CS1983]

Convert? Has happened before.


Remember José Padilla, also known as Abdullah al-Muhajir or Muhajir Abdullah, convicted of plotting an Al Queda radiological bomb attack?


I would have lost that bet... unless Esteban Santiago decided to go Moorish native.

[Blowby]

We have to ban all Star Wars movies too.


Witness John Schichler described the shooter as slender and wearing a blue Star Wars T-shirt.

The Alleged Shooter Was From New Jersey

[Scanker19]

I would have lost that bet... unless Esteban Santiago decided to go Moorish native.

68675

[Jonsey]

Shepard Smith reported that the shooter's affiliation with the military is unconfirmed. I am hoping that they find he is not.

[Joe_K]

CNN is reporting checked firearm in bag, got off of plane, picked up gun out of bag and started shooting. CNN former Secret Service guest and others already screeching to "close the checked gun in a bag loophole!"

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[XC700116]

Interesting quote from my fb feed - NOTE- NO CONFIRMATION OF SOURCE but I trust the guy that posted it as he is in the local LE community down there.


* Updated * Sheriff reports, there is no second shooter at this time, but they are not 100% Certain.

The shooter was a passenger on a Canadian Flight, with a check weapon which he declared. He claimed his baggage, took his weapon from the baggage, loaded it in the bathroom, exited the bathroom and began firing on people.

I REALLY hope this is bad info, could cause a lot of problems with the chicken little crowd.

[Jonsey]

CNN is reporting checked firearm in bag, got off of plane, picked up gun out of bag and started shooting. CNN former Secret Service guest and others already screeching to "close the checked gun in a bag loophole!"

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

I was noticing this last time I flew. I was thinking it might be better to pick up your declared firearm at some point that is not baggage claim.

[Joe_K]

Still nothing to prevent someone from walking into baggage claim from outside and gunning folks down at any U.S. Airport. Or loading a taxi up with exsplosives and detonating it right outside. Or any number of things that show how easy it is to kill human beings in the 21st century.
The TSA security theatre doesn't work, and likely neither will whatever the .gov dresms up next to keep us "safe"

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[Jonsey]

Still nothing to prevent someone from walking into baggage claim from outside and gunning folks down at any U.S. Airport. Or loading a taxi up with exsplosives and detonating it right outside. Or any number of things that show how easy it is to kill human beings in the 21st century.
The TSA security theatre doesn't work, and likely neither will whatever the .gov dresms up next to keep us "safe"

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

Well I think you are correct. I am so tired of impotent lords making the rules.

[CS1983]

Well I think you are correct. I am so tired of impotent lords making the rules.

Flaccidity can inspire a certain kind of hardness.

[Dave_L]

Tsa is good for bunching people up in large groups.

[Zundfolge]

Still nothing to prevent someone from walking into baggage claim from outside and gunning folks down at any U.S. Airport.

Of course the solution from the statists and graboids will be to demand we outlaw guns within 10 miles of any airport.

[Joe_K]

Maybe this deserves its own thread, but here goes.

Five Questions to ask Yourself About Airport Security.

1. Would zero security screening be better than what we have have now?

2. How SHOULD airport security be handled here in the U.S.? (Lets first assume we actually want some form of screening to occur before anyone steps onto an aircraft.)

3. Should the TSA be: Eliminated? Improved? Armed/unarmed? Replaced, and if so by whom?

4. Would your system violate more or less constitutional rights than the current system?

5. If the only thing you would change to the current system is the way in which firearms are transported, what changes would you make?





Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[Skip]

Official: Suspected Gunman Told FBI He Was Being Forced To Fight For ISIS

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2017/01/06/sen-bill-nelson-identifies-suspected-fll-gunman/

---

AirCanadia is claiming he wasn't a passenger and there were no checked firearms on the reported flight.

See what the media did there?

Canned narrative/disinfo, ready to go hoping it stayed alive throughout the news cycle. Now it will be dropped by tomorrow and the victims will be forgotten.

[roberth]

So he was your basic dirtbag nutbar.


They add that in November 2016, he walked into an FBI office in Anchorage claiming that he was being forced to fight for ISIS. He was sent to a psychiatric hospital.

In 2011 or 2012, he was investigated by Homeland Security Investigations for child porn. Three weapons and a computer were seized, but there was not enough evidence to prosecute, according to law enforcement sources.

Santiago also has a record for minor traffic violations and was evicted in 2015 for not paying rent.

[Dave_L]

I loathe the media.

[Jonsey]

Maybe this deserves its own thread, but here goes.

Five Questions to ask Yourself About Airport Security.

1. Would zero security screening be better than what we have have now?

2. How SHOULD airport security be handled here in the U.S.? (Lets first assume we actually want some form of screening to occur before anyone steps onto an aircraft.)

3. Should the TSA be: Eliminated? Improved? Armed/unarmed? Replaced, and if so by whom?

4. Would your system violate more or less constitutional rights than the current system?

5. If the only thing you would change to the current system is the way in which firearms are transported, what changes would you make?





Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

These are really good questions. My first thoughts are that we should be allowed to create our own "safe spaces" by not being stripped of our arms. This only answers #5. I am curious what other ideas you guys come up with.

[drew890]

He flew Delta, so AirCanada wouldn't have a record of him.
See what the media did there... they investigated and reported.


Official: Suspected Gunman Told FBI He Was Being Forced To Fight For ISIS

http://miami.cbslocal.com/2017/01/06/sen-bill-nelson-identifies-suspected-fll-gunman/

---

AirCanadia is claiming he wasn't a passenger and there were no checked firearms on the reported flight.

See what the media did there?

Canned narrative/disinfo, ready to go hoping it stayed alive throughout the news cycle. Now it will be dropped by tomorrow and the victims will be forgotten.

[Skip]

He flew Delta, so AirCanada wouldn't have a record of him.
See what the media did there... they investigated and reported.

That's not what they "reported."

Also not being "reported" until all gun owners could indicted...

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/01/06/21/3BE81C3000000578-4095720-image-a-107_1483739983238.jpg

[drew890]

That's why you need to calm down and not start with unfounded "media" blaming. It's a fluid situation where naturally there will be mistakes being made in the initial police and media response. It's a fact of early response and the instant news reporting that we live in. Miss identifying an airline in the initial aftermath of an incident is not an indication of some "media" conspiracy.
After 24 hours and they are still misreporting, then by all means sound the conspiracy horns.

[ray1970]

Still nothing to prevent someone from walking into baggage claim from outside and gunning folks down at any U.S. Airport. Or loading a taxi up with exsplosives and detonating it right outside. Or any number of things that show how easy it is to kill human beings in the 21st century.
The TSA security theatre doesn't work, and likely neither will whatever the .gov dresms up next to keep us "safe"

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

Yep. Wouldn't be anything for some nut job to pack a backpack full of explosives, walk into a busy airport like DIA, get in that long, crowded security checkpoint, and then detonate the damn thing. Probably take out a couple hundred people if the explosion was big enough.

[Irving]

That's not what they "reported."

Also not being "reported" until all gun owners could indicted...

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/01/06/21/3BE81C3000000578-4095720-image-a-107_1483739983238.jpg

I have that same scarf.

[BushMasterBoy]

Pretty comprehensive report here. Seems the shooter may have had "PTSD" or some other psychosis. Makes me think of Major Hasan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nidal_Hasan

http://heavy.com/news/2017/01/esteban-santiago-fort-lauderdale-airport-shooter-shooting-active-gunman-suspect-photo-citizen-isis-florida-facebook-new-jersey-victims-military/

[Rucker61]

According to reports I've read, he picked up his gun in the locked case at baggage claim, took it into the bathroom, loaded it and came out firing. How would TSA be involved at all outside of the security area?

[Great-Kazoo]

According to reports I've read, he picked up his gun in the locked case at baggage claim, took it into the bathroom, loaded it and came out firing. How would TSA be involved at all outside of the security area?

They're not. Every airport handles checked in firearms differently when picking up from baggage. Here in CO it's not an issue (till now) in NY when i pick up a long gun, it's to the transit authority office, show ID open for inspection then leave. In places like Fresno no one cares, @ LAX, bring lube.

[Joe_K]

1. Would zero security screening be better than what we have have now?

No. I believe there should be some form of physical and technological screening methods employed, even if its profile based "random" screening.

2. How SHOULD airport security be handled here in the U.S.? (Lets first assume we actually want some form of screening to occur before anyone steps onto an aircraft.)

A. Limit of one carry on item per person which is screened separate to eliminate the bogged down TSA checkpoints.
B. All checked bags dropped off and picked up outside the airport and each bag individually screened before shipment.... see bullet point I.
C. Bomb sniffing animals employed at all gates, and roving patrols.
D. SRT/ERT/SWAT/ insert your favorite Acronym and EMS on 24/7/365 on site at all major passenger airports.
E. Minimum of one armed Federal Air Marshall at every gate.
F. All US Pilots Marshaled and trained in the use of firearms.
G. All cockpits bulletproofed.
H. All checked bags are sent to your destination address - (Hotel, House, Business etc.)
3. Should the TSA be: Eliminated? Improved? Armed/unarmed? Replaced, and if so by whom?

Eliminated completely and replaced by FAMS.

4. Would your system violate more or less constitutional rights than the current system?

I do not believe so, and even if it did marginally I believe it would keep us safer.

5. If the only thing you would change to the current system is the way in which firearms are transported, what changes would you make?

None. Crazy will do crazy.

[funkymonkey1111]

I have that same scarf.

Because you want to be like an A-rab?

[Irving]

Nope, because they are useful and match the color of the landscape of where I was often shooting at the time of purchase. I don't think I have that exact color.

[CS1983]

The single raised finger is a jihadi gesture. Means a few things, depending on your source... one umma, the Shahada (La illaha illa Allah, Mohammad rasul Allah -- there is no god but Allah and Mohammad is his messenger), etc.

The scarf is only really material in that context.

[DireWolf]

2. How SHOULD airport security be handled here in the U.S.? (Lets first assume we actually want some form of screening to occur before anyone steps onto an aircraft.)

A. Limit of one carry on item per person which is screened separate to eliminate the bogged down TSA checkpoints.
B. All checked bags dropped off and picked up outside the airport and each bag individually screened before shipment.... see bullet point I.
C. Bomb sniffing animals employed at all gates, and roving patrols.
D. SRT/ERT/SWAT/ insert your favorite Acronym and EMS on 24/7/365 on site at all major passenger airports.
E. Minimum of one armed Federal Air Marshall at every gate.
F. All US Pilots Marshaled and trained in the use of firearms.
G. All cockpits bulletproofed.
H. Make seat belts that cannot be released by the passenger when wheels are up in the event of an on board threat.
I. All checked bags are sent to your destination address - (Hotel, House, Business etc.)


As someone who spends a good bit of time on commercial flights, I STRONGLY disagree with items A, B, H, and I....The rest aren't too bad.

Reason - A, B, and I would be MASSIVE inconveniences and infringements for anyone who travels frequently, (unless for A you're not counting a "personal" item such as a backpack, which is the way it is now - I, and many people I know, almost never check bags unless travelling for vacation with family), and offer almost no real risk mitigation benefits whatsoever - those who would give up essential liberties for temporary (and false in this case) security deserve neither....

As for H, well, it would have to be an electronic system....Imagine if the first thing an attacker did was hack the airplane control systems and PLCs in question (really not that hard to do with the right skillset - ANYTHING can be hacked, including security/anti-malware software which is specifically designed to prevent that from happening), and did a positive-override of the locking mechanism...Now air marshall (if on plane), as well as all passengers, with the exception of the attackers, are locked in their seats and cannot take defensive actions or try to overwhelm the attackers....Are we going to ban laptops on planes? Smartphones? See comment above....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

[davsel]

Airport/Airline Security?

Copy Israel

[Joe_K]

As someone who spends a good bit of time on commercial flights, I STRONGLY disagree with items A, B, H, and I....The rest aren't too bad.

Reason - A, B, and I would be MASSIVE inconveniences and infringements for anyone who travels frequently, (unless for A you're not counting a "personal" item such as a backpack, which is the way it is now - I, and many people I know, almost never check bags unless travelling for vacation with family), and offer almost no real risk mitigation benefits whatsoever - those who would give up essential liberties for temporary (and false in this case) security deserve neither....

As for H, well, it would have to be an electronic system....Imagine if the first thing an attacker did was hack the airplane control systems and PLCs in question (really not that hard to do with the right skillset - ANYTHING can be hacked, including security/anti-malware software which is specifically designed to prevent that from happening), and did a positive-override of the locking mechanism...Now air marshall (if on plane), as well as all passengers, with the exception of the attackers, are locked in their seats and cannot take defensive actions or try to overwhelm the attackers....Are we going to ban laptops on planes? Smartphones? See comment above....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

The idea was to see what ideas might actually make us safer. In retrospect the seat belt idea is pretty cruddy, I was thinking about it more along the lines of an amusement park ride.

For me persinally I would prefer the bag dropoff/delivery deal. And I would set the carry - on bag size limit pretty generous. Personal or needed items like strollers, purses, backpacks, laptop bags all good to go.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[hurley842002]

For me persinally I would prefer the bag dropoff/delivery deal. And I would set the carry - on bag size limit pretty generous. Personal or needed items like strollers, purses, backpacks, laptop bags all good to go.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

And for me, personally, this was the worst idea of them all. Forcing me to be unarmed from the airport to wherever the drop-off or home destination might be, is unacceptable, then again I've been called crazy for wanting to be armed EVERYWHERE.

ETA: I'm NOT willing to give up anymore freedom for "security".

[CS1983]

Step 1: Completely eliminate TSA security theater.
Step 2: Implement Israel style mental screens (which is largely automated for the majority of people at this point unless they hit for further screening).
Step 3: Provide immunity against suits alleging profiling.
Step 4: Permit profiling.

Step 5: Do away with Islam completely. [Pipe dream]. Can't argue the entire human population wouldn't be better off though.

But muh diversities!

[TFOGGER]

Step 1: Completely eliminate TSA security theater.
Step 2: Implement Israel style mental screens (which is largely automated for the majority of people at this point unless they hit for further screening).
Step 3: Provide immunity against suits alleging profiling.
Step 4: Permit profiling.

Step 5: Do away with Islam completely. [Pipe dream]. Can't argue the entire human population wouldn't be better off though.

If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck...

The Israelis have been doing this for 30+ years. They also have bombproofed their airport screening areas and regulate vehicle traffic outside to minimize the risks before the formal screening process begins. I other words, real security that isn't horribly intrusive, without the theater.

https://www.quora.com/What-is-it-like-to-go-through-airport-security-in-Israel

[funkymonkey1111]

So by reading the list of ideas, I assume you guys dont mind paying a shit ton more taxes and much higher airline ticket prices. Personally I hope I never fly again. I havent in a dozen years.

i think there's only one guy with these hairbrained ideas--who sounds like not much of a traveler

[bobbyfairbanks]

No matter the actions taken by gov bad people will find a way to cause terror. Let's ban all potty objects and anything that can travel over 5 mph as well as any slippery surfaces[blah-blah]

[Joe_K]

i think there's only one guy with these hairbrained ideas--who sounds like not much of a traveler
If your talking about me then no, I have flown, and do fly quite a bit. I'm looking at this from the perspective of;

How do we prevent large crowds at any one area of an Airport.

How do protect the gates and flights?

How do we prevent with near 100% certainty an airliner being used as an air to ground missle?

By eliminating the TSA completely and allocating those funds to the FAMS and armed react teams who can actually stop an attack inside an airport or on a flight we will break even or even save money on Airport security.



Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[Jonsey]

If your talking about me then no, I have flown, and do fly quite a bit. I'm looking at this from the perspective of;

How do we prevent large crowds at any one area of an Airport.

How do protect the gates and flights?

How do we prevent with near 100% certainty an airliner being used as an air to ground missle?

By eliminating the TSA completely and allocating those funds to the FAMS and armed react teams who can actually stop an attack inside an airport or on a flight we will break even or even save money on Airport security.



Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

I think I might be in favor of actual armed security, and also don't like to be parted from my weapon. Most of the "security" currently in place makes me feel insecure.

[Joe_K]

In principle I'm in favor of survival of the fittest, removing warning labels, everyone carries a sidearm wherever they want including on a commercial Airlines, no lawsuits or lawyers, ban Islam, no licensing for anything. Period.

But I am a realist. We live in the time period we do, small, significant changes to regain what we lost over a period of time.

The airport and air travel is already highly inconvenient, unsafe, and theatre security instead of real security.

How would YOU do it, while still having a foot planted on terra - firma. As in realistic ways to provide REAL security while realizing there is no way to guarantee absolute safety, whether in a true libertarian state, or a completely authoritarian state.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[OldFogey]

Maybe this deserves its own thread, but here goes.

Five Questions to ask Yourself About Airport Security.

1. Would zero security screening be better than what we have have now?

2. How SHOULD airport security be handled here in the U.S.? (Lets first assume we actually want some form of screening to occur before anyone steps onto an aircraft.)

3. Should the TSA be: Eliminated? Improved? Armed/unarmed? Replaced, and if so by whom?

4. Would your system violate more or less constitutional rights than the current system?

5. If the only thing you would change to the current system is the way in which firearms are transported, what changes would you make?





Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

Answer - Do whatever El Al does.

[Gman]

Life has risks and there are no guarantees of safety.

[Great-Kazoo]

AS much as i agree in theory to some of the suggestions. replace airlines & airport with GUN. This is the left of center agenda for gun owners.

There is no sure proof way to eliminate anyone bent on violence. Until we as a society institute swift justice for any offender of such, we're spinning our wheels.

[TFOGGER]

AS much as i agree in theory to some of the suggestions. replace airlines & airport with GUN. This is the left of center agenda for gun owners.

There is no sure proof way to eliminate anyone bent on violence. Until we as a society institute swift justice for any offender of such, we're spinning our wheels.

Gallows on the tarmac sounds like a start. Instigate violence at an airport and somehow don't get shot? The actor doesn't see the next sunrise. Due process consists of a review of the video footage by a drafted jury of people at the airport, a simple majority needed for conviction.

[BushMasterBoy]

I would have put two in the chest area and one in the head. The guy could have had a bomb. Now we have to endure his "trial". The Global War on Terror is not over.

[Irving]

Gallows on the tarmac sounds like a start. Instigate violence at an airport and somehow don't get shot? The actor doesn't see the next sunrise. Due process consists of a review of the video footage by a drafted jury of people at the airport, a simple majority needed for conviction.

I feel the same way about people talking at the movie theater...

[kidicarus13]

I would have put two in the chest area and one in the head.




I feel the same way about people talking at the movie theater...

I know right?

[JohnnyDrama]

Gallows on the tarmac sounds like a start. Instigate violence at an airport and somehow don't get shot? The actor doesn't see the next sunrise. Due process consists of a review of the video footage by a drafted jury of people at the airport, a simple majority needed for conviction.

+1

Arrgh! Hang 'em in irons near the departure terminal!

[DireWolf]

Was just reading the Israeli process, and I think the tech is now at a point where we can greatly improve on that....Plus, it wasn't apparent if they even allow carry-on at all, which would be an issue.

Maybe some of the following:

1. I like the idea of armed security in airports, but screw TSA, they suck ass and in many cases have some severe power-trip complexes (e.g. people who shouldn't even have as much authority as a door checker at walmart), and when they violate your rights there is almost no recourse possible . Make it private, keep them accountable, and nail them to the fucking wall if they get too uppity....

2. Also very much like the idea of profiling w/ immunity...Granny Sweetrolls most likely doesn't have a package of HE and ball bearings tucked into her wheelchair, and HE/Chem/Bio is what would worry me the most...

3. Place within all airports some "decorative" cover points (e.g. tall flower pots, other unobtrusive waist/chest-high structures scattered through large open areas), and provide the public with general information (i.e. on video monitors in airports) on leveraging cover in the event of an attack while armed responders are en-route (plan/train for sub-60 second response time to public areas).

4. In the spirit of defensive perimiter layers while neither increasing the level of inconvenience nor comptetely trashing the 4th Amendment, build the following:

A.) At airport far outer perimiter, implement LPRs (licence plate readers) with DMV/Threat-Intel integration, which can flag known/unknown vehicles/entities from miles away and flag for early response if necessary, including automatic gate-based traffic routing

B.) Forced air particulate scanners (HE/Chem/Bio), optical weight/ride inspection, thermal sensors, and mass/density analysis at automated gate points, with threat indicator stacking and real-time analysis. For example, just like you have to stop momentarily to get ticket/pay toll when parking, or as is the case with some airports, when entering/leaving the terminal entrance roads. A short 30-60 second stop at an automated inspection gantry would not be overly invasive, and if any elevated threat indicators/profiles are presented, then vehicle can be held or rerouted for further inspection while still well away from the terminals or other aggregation points....

C.) Camera which cover all secure areas within perimiter (e.g. runways, etc.), with facial recognition. If unknown/unrecognized persons detected, flagged for increased/manual scrutiny or response team activation.

These measures could drastically reduce the ability to reach terminals/drop-off points or other high population density locations with any VBIED or breaching force without early detection & response, and do it in a very unobtrusive way...

More mundane issues, such as individual threat actors, can be addressed through items 1, 2, and 3 above....


Also, as was mentioned previously, shitcan the TSA and redirect funds to pay for things that work.



Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

[Skip]

Harden airports all you want. They'll pick another target.

Next time you're at Chipolte, waiting in line, look around and ask yourself if there's anything unique about a target of opportunity in which five people are murdered and anywhere else in real life.

We'll have the same victims, same tragedy, same media narratives/manipulation.

Quite frankly I am surprised the jihadists lack creativity because there are many other opportunities. Guns/air travel keep giving lending credibility to people who believe there is another agenda in addition to terror. These are the things the media hypes up so it's no surprise to me.

[DireWolf]

I hope all the steps you mentioned are paid for by Private Airlines via ticket prices. I know I dont want my taxes to go up. Im guessing here, but I think there is a significant part of the populace who doesnt use air transportation. Its like all of us paying so you can have the broncos and rtd. Im against it.
While I haven't run the numbers even at a high level, my initial gut assumption (based on some actual observations/data) on this is that between redirecting TSA funding, small increase in airline/airport-transit fees (no big deal, the "add-on" fees are already a bit ridiculous), and possibly a small per-vehicle road-toll, these could be funded without additional general tax dollars, especially for major airports...

I'm not opposed to small traveller-specific fee increases, as long as I'm getting value on investment and not paying to fund my own figurative assraping......

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

[DireWolf]

Harden airports all you want. They'll pick another target.

Next time you're at Chipolte, waiting in line, look around and ask yourself if there's anything unique about a target of opportunity in which five people are murdered and anywhere else in real life.

We'll have the same victims, same tragedy, same media narratives/manipulation.

Quite frankly I am surprised the jihadists lack creativity because there are many other opportunities. Guns/air travel keep giving lending credibility to people who believe there is another agenda in addition to terror. These are the things the media hypes up so it's no surprise to me.
I agree, and really you can only just push the low-hanging-fruit around so much, but there are some actual differences.

For example, I'm not going to be forcably (voluntarily as per the law) disarmed while standing in line at Chipotles like I am in an airport walking up to the checkpoint or baggage claim (and everywhere in between). Now while that doesn't provide any defense against EID/VBIED threats, etc., it does give me potential risk mitigation for other threats as long as my situational awareness hasn't gone in the crapper, which in turn leads to at least some potential level of overall risk reduction....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

[CS1983]

To be honest, that there hasn't a string of successful muslim attacks at the ground level (a few spread out isn't a string) since makes me think 1 or 2 of 3 things is the case:

1) the DHS/FBI/NSA etc. are REALLY FREAKING GOOD (unlikely)
2) there's really not as much of a domestic threat as we have been kowed into believing there is
3) or they're REALLY BAD at being terrorists.

Given they're REALLY GOOD at being terrorists in the Middle East, the latter of the 3 is less likely. Given that there's been very few "we stopped em!" incidents (and very few successful attacks), I doubt that 1 is likely. That leaves #2 as the most likely.

No IEDs going off on the 5 freeway at rush hour (any idiot with internet access can build one), mass shootings are fairly ineffective compared to a bombing and given how rare they are compared to ability ..., etc.

http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html

look at the link since Sept 11 and focus on the Islamic ones. All really low grade BS for the most part.

Biggest ones were Nidal Hassan, San Bernardino, Orlando Florida (which was really effective, but they were fith in a barrel), and that's it for deaths in any appreciable number.

NYC in Sept 2016 has 29 injured, so they made a valiant attempt but we should be seeing such effectiveness a lot more if the threat was really there in any appreciable level -- particularly for the $ spent on "fighting terrorism". I simply cannot believe the various agencies are THAT effective at prevention.

The terries are much more effective overseas with small teams. They're not any smarter overseas. The cost of bomb making materials to have IEDs all over the interstates and in shopping malls can be purchased on a 7/11 clerk's salary.

Just doesn't make any sense.

[Skip]

I agree, and really you can only just push the low-hanging-fruit around so much, but there are some actual differences.

For example, I'm not going to be forcably (voluntarily as per the law) disarmed while standing in line at Chipotles like I am in an airport walking up to the checkpoint or baggage claim (and everywhere in between). Now while that doesn't provide any defense against EID/VBIED threats, etc., it does give me potential risk mitigation for other threats as long as my situational awareness hasn't gone in the crapper, which in turn leads to at least some potential level of overall risk reduction....

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

That's a good point.

The lack of creativity does make a monopoly on violence an important factor. If they do get creative it becomes less of an obstacle and that is my fear.

The moment the media stops hyping certain things, or, they expand beyond the jihadist template, we are really in trouble. I've often said we are sometimes lucky that a firearm is used in these attacks because they become a handicap for those who aren't trained.

[janenewman2]

Sounds like he was an ISIS convert.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

[KestrelBike]

To be honest, that there hasn't a string of successful muslim attacks at the ground level (a few spread out isn't a string) since makes me think 1 or 2 of 3 things is the case:

1) the DHS/FBI/NSA etc. are REALLY FREAKING GOOD (unlikely)
2) there's really not as much of a domestic threat as we have been kowed into believing there is
3) or they're REALLY BAD at being terrorists.

Given they're REALLY GOOD at being terrorists in the Middle East, the latter of the 3 is less likely. Given that there's been very few "we stopped em!" incidents (and very few successful attacks), I doubt that 1 is likely. That leaves #2 as the most likely.

No IEDs going off on the 5 freeway at rush hour (any idiot with internet access can build one), mass shootings are fairly ineffective compared to a bombing and given how rare they are compared to ability ..., etc.

http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/terrorism/wrjp255a.html

look at the link since Sept 11 and focus on the Islamic ones. All really low grade BS for the most part.

Biggest ones were Nidal Hassan, San Bernardino, Orlando Florida (which was really effective, but they were fith in a barrel), and that's it for deaths in any appreciable number.

NYC in Sept 2016 has 29 injured, so they made a valiant attempt but we should be seeing such effectiveness a lot more if the threat was really there in any appreciable level -- particularly for the $ spent on "fighting terrorism". I simply cannot believe the various agencies are THAT effective at prevention.

The terries are much more effective overseas with small teams. They're not any smarter overseas. The cost of bomb making materials to have IEDs all over the interstates and in shopping malls can be purchased on a 7/11 clerk's salary.

Just doesn't make any sense.

It's strange no matter which way it's looked at. The DC snipers (muhammad and the malvo kid) had quite the reign of terror going, and that was just with a stolen semi-AR w/ an [unmagnified] EoTech red-dot in the trunk of a chevy caprice. 10 killed in the DC area, 7 killed in other states, all in a 10-month period. Those two weren't exactly geniuses, and they had people sprinting around their cars just to fill up on gas. Just 2-5 guys could use similar, coordinated tactics and really put a city on edge.

The DHS/FBI could never be good enough to stop something like that from happening, and it'd probably take them some time to put a stop to such a group, especially if said group were a bit more careful than the DC snipers. So it's not #1. And I don't think it's #3, given how simple doing something like this would be, especially if tactics were refined (makes me sick to say this, but imagine if they used a silencer and subsonics?) I guess that leaves it as #2 most likely.

[Skip]

Possibility #4: They intercept far more as far as communications are concerned than they let on, and they don't advertise when they "catch" potential "future criminals" under guises of other charges and/or investigations. Virtually everybody talks to somebody utilizing some medium.

[snip]

Which touches on one of the fears since 9/11: de-centralized network of "sleeper cells" that could act simultaneously.

Czech minister controversially says: Buy guns to protect from terrorist 'Super holocaust'

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/751325/Czech-Republic-terror-holocaust-gun-laws-European-Union-Berlin-Christmas-market-weapons

[BushMasterBoy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TC32b8FA_qs

[CS1983]

Well dang ole, Cletus, looks like we might got ourselves another gone native:

The Ft. Lauderdale Airport shooter is a Muslim convert who years before joining the U.S. Army took on an Islamic name (Aashiq Hammad), downloaded terrorist propaganda and recorded Islamic religious music online, according to public records dug up by the investigative news site of an award-winning, California journalist. This is pertinent information that the Obama administration apparently wants to keep quiet, bringing up memories of the Benghazi cover up, in which the president and his cohorts knowingly lied to conceal that Islamic terrorists attacked the U.S. Special Mission in Libya.

Information is slowly trickling out that links the Ft. Lauderdale Airport shooter to radical Islam while the official story from authorities is that the gunman is a mentally ill, Hispanic Army veteran named Esteban Santiago that became unhinged after a tour in Iraq. Only one mainstream media outlet mentions the possibility of Santiago’s “jihadist identity,” burying it in a piece about New York possibly being his initial target. A paragraph deep in the story mentions that investigators recovered Santiago’s computer from a pawn shop and the FBI is examining it to determine whether he created a “jihadist identity for himself using the name Aashiq Hammad…” The reset of the traditional mainstream media coverage promotes the government rhetoric that omits any ties to terrorism even though early on a photo surfaced of Santiago making an ISIS salute while wearing a keffiyeh, a Palestinian Arab scarf.

The public records uncovered in the days after the massacre suggest Santiago (Hammad) is a radical Islamic terrorist that’s seriously committed to Islam. Besides taking on a Muslim name, he recorded three Islamic religious songs, including the Muslim declaration faith (“there is no God but Allah and Muhammad is his messenger”) known as the Shahada. He also posted a thread about downloading propaganda videos from Islamic terrorists on a weapons and explosives forum. The investigative news site that unearthed this disturbing information connected the dots between Santiago, who is of Puerto Rican descent, and Hammad, an identity he created in 2007.
[snip]

More at link: http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2017/01/airport-shooter-converted-islam-identified-aashiq-hammad-years-joining-army/

Will be interesting to see how this shakes out.

[GilpinGuy]

Another isolated incident.

[roberth]

Another isolated incident.

Among many other isolated incidents.

[Great-Kazoo]

As words like gender neutral, I identify as, safe space, alt-right/left, and others get added to ones daily lexicon and definitions in websters & other word presses.
The word Terrorist will have been scrubbed, Unless said person aligns with any non-approved anglo .org

[Skip]

Well dang ole, Cletus, looks like we might got ourselves another gone native:

More at link: http://www.judicialwatch.org/blog/2017/01/airport-shooter-converted-islam-identified-aashiq-hammad-years-joining-army/

Will be interesting to see how this shakes out.

This was predicted on page one. But reaffirmed with the media narrative and how quickly the story was dropped.

[CS1983]

I would have lost that bet... unless Esteban Santiago decided to go Moorish native.


This was predicted on page one. But reaffirmed with the media narrative and how quickly the story was dropped.

[BushMasterBoy]

I swear I didn't know it was leaked...

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fort-lauderdale-hollywood-airport-shooting/fl-airport-shooting-deputy-suspended-20170110-story.html

[Joe_K]

https://youtu.be/YZM5hxF35No

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[liberty19]

^^^ Love this guy...and agree that K9s would do a lot more good than the body imaging machines at the airport. But I guess it is easier to train TSA to look at a monitor than handle a properly trained and vetted K9.

[Joe_K]

^^^ Love this guy...and agree that K9s would do a lot more good than the body imaging machines at the airport. But I guess it is easier to train TSA to look at a monitor than handle a properly trained and vetted K9.
In an ideal world TSA would go away and city/county/state LE and FAMS would run airport security.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

[JohnnyDrama]

In an ideal world TSA would go away and city/county/state LE and FAMS would run airport security.

Velocitas, Opprimere,
Violentia Operandi

Doing away with a government agency while streamlining law enforcement and security? It'll never happen.

[drew890]

So the suspect has been in custody for over a week and no media or LE updates or additional information.
Well isn't that just interest...

[roberth]

Yup, haven't heard anything because he is the face of the real enemy and TPTB don't want that to get out.

[drew890]

Well I stand corrected lol
http://us.cnn.com/2017/01/17/us/fort-lauderdale-shooter-isis-claim/index.html