Hurricane Harvey

[buffalobo]

Reported loss of life has been pretty low so far. Looks like property damage will be huge.

Wonder how much thought about this type of thing folks put into the decision to reside along the coast lines where hurricanes are not uncommon.


If you're unarmed, you are a victim

[Great-Kazoo]

Some things could have been avoided, like the massive evacuations under way. Had the Mayor not done a New Orleans mayors stance. While i agree a massive evacuation might put some in danger. Had the mayor stated (numerous times) An Orderly Evacuation must be followed, the over taxed ERS may not have been in the position it is now.

http://www.houstonpress.com/news/as-harvey-becomes-category-3-hurricane-abbott-and-turner-differ-on-evac-plans-9734833

At a 4 p.m. press conference, Mayor Turner and County Judge Ed Emmett re-emphasized that there has not been nor will be any evacuation order for Houston, nor would they recommend voluntarily evacuating. Turner had recalled the disaster that a mandatory evacuation order during Hurricane Rita created in 2005, when people died of heat exhaustion on the highway and had to be rescued during the immense gridlock. At the presser, he and Emmett said that, given Houston is not in Harvey’s hurricane path and is dealing instead with a large rain event, this is not the type of storm that would prompt evacuations.

“In the City of Houston, this is a rain maker,” Turner said of the tropical storm that Harvey is bringing to Houston. “There’s no need for people to be thinking about leaving, getting on the road and putting themselves in danger. Quite frankly, you can be putting yourself in more danger by getting on the road.”

[BladesNBarrels]

Houston Evacuation Plan B after 20 hours:

71805

[glenncal1]

You are the lowest form of scum, trying to rob people who are already in a world of hurt. I hope that some of you come across home/business owners that take the approach that a lot of Korean shop owners did during the LA riots. Special place place in hell for you asshats.

[buffalobo]

You are the lowest form of scum, trying to rob people who are already in a world of hurt. I hope that some of you come across home/business owners that take the approach that a lot of Korean shop owners did during the LA riots. Special place place in hell for you asshats.Care to expand on this? I can usually ferret out the point posters are trying make. No clue on this one. Throw me a bone.

If you're unarmed, you are a victim

[Not_A_Llama]

He put the initial portion of the post as a subtitle: "Open Message to Harvey looters"

I was also confused.

[ray1970]

Having grown up and lived the first 28 years of my life just southeast Houston I can tell you events like this aren't as big of a deal to the people living there as they are to the outside world. It's not like the people living down there aren't aware that this type thing happens. If you live anywhere along the coast anywhere on the Gulf of Mexico or the southeast coast of the Atlantic Ocean you can expect this sort thing. Just like earthquakes in California or blizzards in the northeast. Just part of life.

[BushMasterBoy]

Moved here from Cocoa Beach. After a few hurricanes, most insurance companies refused to write home owner policies. If you live near the beach, the house needs to be made of reinforced concrete. You almost have to evacuate every time they warn you. If you stay, then expect no power for a week at least. No clean water either. If you leave the city limits after, the police might not let you back in the city. Some people come back to find their house is nothing but a slab. No trees have foliage, no stores have signs on their facade. Dumpsters behind grocery stores full of rotting meat. The poor suffer the worst. I remember the evacuees of Homestead AFB after hurricane Andrew. They all had the thousand yard stare. Homestead AFB was so badly damaged they basically closed it. If I had a lot of money, I would love to live there.

https://accuweather.brightspotcdn.com/dims4/default/9520b94/2147483647/resize/590x/quality/90/?url=http%3A%2F%2Faccuweather-bsp.s3.amazonaws.com%2F50%2F50f8f6be72f30d43d660e6 29108757f0%2F650x366_08241700_hd29.jpg

[cstone]

I just drove through Homestead, FL this past January. The AF closed the base and moved, but that just made room for development. I don't know if it has already happened or when it will happen, but there are or soon will be more houses in Homestead than there were in 1992.

People are a lot like ants living in their colonies. Regardless of how many times the colony is destroyed, as long as there is a desire by people to live there, we rebuild. It isn't often that we don't rebuild and we have an amazing ability to work around or ignore the difficulties involved with living in some very precarious locations.

I wonder how many Katricians are living in hard hit parts of Houston today. My prayers go out to the people affected.

Be safe.

[Teufelhund]

Grew up in Santa Fe, just south of Houston. My parents and sisters are still there. My parents' house is on relatively high ground, so they're still dry, if somewhat stranded with road closures. One of my sister's house and cars flooded, but they're all ok.

Growing up with this kind of thing, you just prepare the best you can when it comes along, but it really doesn't happen that often. Alisha back in '83 is the only major one I remember going through. We lived in a trailer home at that time, and rode out the storm in a friend's house down the street, but no major damage occurred and we went home the next day. Every region is prone to some natural disaster or another, be it hurricanes, tornadoes, earthquakes, or blizzards. You learn how to prepare and how to adapt.

[JohnTRourke]

50 (fifty) inches of rain expected

that's 4 feet

that's insane

[Gman]

Alvin, TX holds the US record for the most rainfall in a 24-hour period (tropical storm Claudette, 7-25-79, 43 inches). This isn't a new phenomenon, just the most recent. I lived in Houston for a while and later Spring, TX in my yoot.

Was just reading that it's estimated 52% of the damage will be uninsured, since many residents don't live in "federally designated flood zones".

Prayers go out to those folks.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Houston official announced today that "Texas has never seen a storm like this".......? the fukc?

[ray1970]

Houston official announced today that "Texas has never seen a storm like this".......? the fukc?

I'm surprised. I thought everything was bigger in Texas.

[Zundfolge]

Houston official announced today that "Texas has never seen a storm like this".......? the fukc?

I'm sick of these idiots that think history began on the day they were born ... Galveston 1900 motherfucker ... six to twelve THOUSAND dead ... sheesh.

[OtterbatHellcat]

I know, right?

wtf?

[Graves]

Having grown up and lived the first 28 years of my life just southeast Houston I can tell you events like this aren't as big of a deal to the people living there as they are to the outside world. It's not like the people living down there aren't aware that this type thing happens. If you live anywhere along the coast anywhere on the Gulf of Mexico or the southeast coast of the Atlantic Ocean you can expect this sort thing. Just like earthquakes in California or blizzards in the northeast. Just part of life.


https://www.instagram.com/p/BYXAj60DDZI/

LOL

[GilpinGuy]

I feel for those that are on their rooftops waving for help. I really do and I hope they get help.

But WTF are you doing there, you asshole? It's 2017, not 1900, so you knew this was coming. It's not like it a was big surprise. If you listened to the Mayor and stayed put, you're a moron. Katrina anyone?

I don't wish harm on any of these people, but come on man...TAKE CARE OF YOURSELF and get the fuck out of there BEFORE you need to be rescued. Jeeeeeeeez.

[ray1970]

I bet StagLefty wouldn't have any problem selling his belly boat in Houston.

[buffalobo]

https://www.instagram.com/p/BYXAj60DDZI/

LOL

Some lemonade success there.

[StagLefty]

I bet StagLefty wouldn't have any problem selling his belly boat in Houston.

Hahaha should I post on Houston Craig's List Ray ?

[Skip]

So rescuers (Cajun Navy) are being shot at, taking their boats, and going home? Nice.

The threat of living near trash isn't just the trash itself, but keeping decent folks from coming in and helping when something like this happens. There's a lesson in this.

[Spdu4ia]

Funny, I thought we learned that lesson after Katrina ...

[davsel]

Katrina trash evacuated to Texas and never went back.

Grew up in Spring Branch, west side of Houston.
Floods and hurricanes are what happens there.
Choose your home site accordingly.
Don't drive into deep water.

[Aloha_Shooter]

On the lighter side of things:

http://i.imgur.com/8tKCZwi.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/9Xooadx.jpg


The image below is titled "F*ck you Harvey, you can't have my car" on Imgur:

http://i.imgur.com/r4SPssx.png

but then there is reality and everyday Americans helping each other out:

http://i.imgur.com/Tt8lJI1.png

and some businesses responding with compassion: http://imgur.com/gallery/024Im

[sellersm]

Article about cajun navy's adventures:

https://fellowshipoftheminds.com/2017/08/29/houston-looters-shoot-volunteer-rescuers-target-whites-and-trump-supporters/

[Zundfolge]

http://www.breitbart.com/video/2017/08/29/hurricane-survivor-slams-cnn-still-putting-microphone-face/

ha ha ... CNN called out by a black lady

[OtterbatHellcat]

I'm still laughing at Ray and Stags belly boat sales ideas.

I agree with GG's post, and I also dig folks helping those in need. However, there is a lot of stupidity going on down there directly related to just that. Stupidity.
I heard a 35 year LE died last night trying to help someone who probably should have evacuated in the first place.

And Davesel is right...I forgot that a shit ton of Katrina folks got shipped off to TX and a few other states as I remember. I think we (CO) took many as well.

[Gman]

Mmmm....Whataburger.[Dinner]

[00tec]

Mmmm....Whataburger.[Dinner]
https://www.ar-15.co/attachment.php?attachmentid=71824&d=1504060398
71824

[davsel]

Fire Ants: The most evil bastards in the insect world

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4833342/Islands-fire-ants-floating-Houston-floodwaters.html
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/08/29/14/43AD8F8D00000578-0-image-a-8_1504014020214.jpg

Brings back memories of these rafts of fire floating down the street when we played in the flood waters.
Even had individual demons snorkeling out to the middle of the lake and stinging you while water skiing.

We would blowtorch the floating rafts with aerosol, or drown them in wasp spray.

[Bailey Guns]

Mmmm....Whataburger.[Dinner]

Hell yeah! Gonna take a lot more than biblical floods to keep me away from Whataburger.

[Bailey Guns]

Grew up in Spring Branch, west side of Houston.

Ha! So did I. Went to Benbrook Elementary, Spring Woods Jr Hi and Northbrook High School. Still remember my first phone number from my early years...HO2-5460.

[USMC88-93]

Have a couple of friends with their houses under water down there. Lived there for 8 years.

[Fentonite]

I grew up in SW Houston, remember playing in the floods of Hurricane Allen. We used to stand on a bedsheet on our skateboards and hold it up like a sail and catch some crazy wind before the storm hit, the play in the flood afterword. My nephew is there now, luckily his house is dry (but he can't get out of the neighborhood), nice little staycation. And now I'm craving Whataburger.

[davsel]

Ha! So did I. Went to Benbrook Elementary, Spring Woods Jr Hi and Northbrook High School. Still remember my first phone number from my early years...HO2-5460.

No way. Shadow Oaks Elementary, Spring Oaks Jr, and Spring Woods High School. Parents still live there and have the same phone number from when I was 4. Talked to them yesterday and the neighborhood is safely above water. They are concerned about the reservoirs going over the spillway now will flow into the same drainage their neighborhood is flowing into and may start to back-up.

[Great-Kazoo]

I'm craving Whataburger.

AND and ice cold long neck ;)

[Bailey Guns]

No way. Shadow Oaks Elementary, Spring Oaks Jr, and Spring Woods High School. Parents still live there and have the same phone number from when I was 4. Talked to them yesterday and the neighborhood is safely above water. They are concerned about the reservoirs going over the spillway now will flow into the same drainage their neighborhood is flowing into and may start to back-up.

Yep...small world.

I remember the floods after rains, then ant swarms clinging to anything that would float...and riding our bikes in the fog from the mosquito truck! Some damn good memories of those days.

[davsel]

Ah yes, the mosquito foggers in the evenings.
Wonder if they still have those, or if they're going to bring them back out soon, as the impending plague of mosquitoes will be epic.

[Zundfolge]

Fire Ants: The most evil bastards in the insect world
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/08/29/14/43AD8F8D00000578-0-image-a-8_1504014020214.jpg

Nope nope nope nope nope ... that's it ... time to take off and nuke Houston from orbit. its the only way to be sure.

[hollohas]

Fire Ants: The most evil bastards in the insect world

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4833342/Islands-fire-ants-floating-Houston-floodwaters.html
http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2017/08/29/14/43AD8F8D00000578-0-image-a-8_1504014020214.jpg



Hell to the NO.

Fire ants are the devil's insect.

[OtterbatHellcat]

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/08/30/547428167/chemicals-at-flooded-texas-plant-in-danger-of-exploding

Texas chemical plant warns of potential fire and explosion......real or fake news?

[Gman]

Peroxides are some serious stuff, and Arkema makes a lot of them. Real news.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Might be some fireworks then I suppose, hope not.

[theGinsue]

Hopefully, WHEN it explodes, they'll be able to find some water to put the fire out.

Too soon?

[Great-Kazoo]

Hopefully, WHEN it explodes, they'll be able to find some water to put the fire out.

Too soon?

Float it past the mods, see what they say

[Gman]

Yeah, probably too soon. This could be gasoline on the fire and make a bad situation that much worse.

[SideShow Bob]

Yeah, probably too soon. This could be gasoline on the fire and make a bad situation that much worse.

As long as those fire ants are in it, who cares....

[hollohas]

But seriously, this flood in INSANE. It's almost unbelievable. I've got some friends from Texas and they keep sharing videos from down there. It's crazy sad. The whole freaking area is under a shit ton on water. It's damn near apocalyptic. I can't even begin to image the amount of loss that is happening. This isn't just a hundred year flood. This is truly historic.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Hopefully, WHEN it explodes, they'll be able to find some water to put the fire out.

Too soon?


Float it past the mods, see what they say

I lol'd at these two remarks......that was some funny stuff.

Seriously though, I hope something like a chemical factory exploding doesn't actually happen after all the shit they've already been through.

[cmailliard]

Ironically, it can be an issue. I was in NOLA after Katrina and Rita. When there was a fire it was one New Orleans Engine and then a bunch from out of state (Chicago, New York, etc.) then a bunch of 3000 gallon water trucks. The water infrastructure was damaged so bad very few hydrants were working (this was after the flood waters receded). Not sure how bad the infrastructure is in Houston. If there is still high flood waters they can do what they did in Fargo many years ago put fire trucks on flatbed trucks and draft out of flood waters.

We setup in Belles Chase area and the guy in charge of fire response, basically south of New Orleans was a Battalion Chief from Minneapolis Fire. He had like 2 engines and a handful firefighters to fight everything including refinery fires and water was his biggest issue.

[Gman]

Organic Peroxides - Hazards (https://www.ccohs.ca/oshanswers/chemicals/organic/organic_peroxide.html)

How are organic peroxides hazardous?

The main hazard related to organic peroxides are their fire and explosion hazards. Organic peroxides may also be toxic or corrosive. Depending on the material, route of exposure (inhalation, eye or skin contact, or swallowing) and dose or amount of exposure, they could harm the body. Corrosive organic peroxides can also attack and destroy metals.

It is the double oxygen of the "peroxy" group that makes organic peroxides both useful and hazardous. The peroxy group is chemically unstable. It can easily decompose, giving off heat at a rate that increases as the temperature rises. Many organic peroxides give off flammable vapours when they decompose. These vapours can easily catch fire.

Most undiluted organic peroxides can catch fire easily and burn very rapidly and intensely. This is because they combine both fuel (carbon) and oxygen in the same compound. Some organic peroxides are dangerously reactive. They can decompose very rapidly or explosively if they are exposed to only slight heat, friction, mechanical shock or contamination with incompatible materials.

Organic peroxides can also be strong oxidizing agents. Combustible materials contaminated with most organic peroxides can catch fire very easily and burn very intensely (i.e., deflagrate). This means that the burn rate is very fast: it can vary from 1 m/sec to hundreds of metres per second. Also the combustion rate increases as the pressure increases and the combustion (or reaction) zone can travel through air or a gaseous medium faster than the speed of sound. However, the speed of combustion in a solid medium does not exceed the speed of sound.

This is one characteristic that distinguishes deflagration from detonation. We mention these two terms because they are used in classifying organic peroxide formulations (see next question). Deflagrations and detonations are similar chemical reactions except that in detonations the burn rate in a solid medium is faster than the speed of sound. This supersonic speed results in a shock wave being produced. They can transmit the shock wave at speeds of about 2,000 to 9,000 m/sec and is not dependent on the surrounding pressure. This is another difference between detonation and deflagration: deflagration rates increase as the pressure becomes greater.

Explosive decomposition is a rapid chemical reaction resulting in almost instantaneous release of energy. This term includes both deflagration and detonation.

Organic peroxides may also have a self accelerating decomposition temperature (SADT). SADT represents the lowest temperature in which that particular organic peroxide formulation in its commercial packaging will undergo self-accelerating decomposition (begin the chemical process that leads to explosion). The SADT value will vary with each organic peroxide formulation and the size and shape of its packaging. Storage requirements will generally be 10 to 20 degrees below the SADT.


What is an example of an organic peroxide?

An example of an organic peroxide is methyl ethyl ketone peroxide (also known as 2-butanone peroxide, ethyl methyl ketone peroxide, or MEKP). It is used as a polymerization catalyst in the manufacture of polyester and acrylic resins and as a hardening agent for fiberglass reinforced plastics. It is a colourless liquid with a characteristic odour. It is considered a combustible liquid and vapour. There is an extreme risk of an explosion from exposure to shock, friction, flame, or other sources of ignition. It is dangerously reactive and may decompose violently. Contact with water or moist air liberates irritating gases. Contents may develop pressure if exposed to water. It is also very toxic. It may be fatal if inhaled, absorbed through the skin or swallowed and it is corrosive to the eyes, skin and respiratory tract. It may cause lung injury although the effects may be delayed.

Yeah, serious stuff. I sure hope they don't have to figure out how serious.

[Bailey Guns]

"The fire will happen. It will resemble a gasoline fire. It will be explosive and intense in nature," spokeswoman Janet Smith told The Associated Press late Wednesday.

"As the temperature rises, the natural state of these materials will decompose. A white smoke will result, and that will catch fire," Smith said. "So the fire is imminent. The question is when."

At least 2 explosions already reported. 1 police officer injured, possibly more. This is at the Arkema plant in Crosby.

[Rumline]

I'm not sure which is stronger...the rainfall from Harvey, or the Lib blowhards harping on "climate change," "told you so" etc. I've read more than a few comments from people who are happy this happened to a red state, because it's their fault that we have climate change. [facepalm]

[Aloha_Shooter]

Heard the press conference this morning. What a shit pack of trash the so-called journalists are. Nothing but a bunch of rabid rats trying to make up crap to scare the public and smear the company.

"Do you think you should have done more to protect against this situation?"
"We have generators and back-up generators and back-ups to the back-ups. I"m not sure what more we could have done. We never anticipated six feet of water."

Trying to pin the company down on calling the smoke "toxic" versus "noxious" ("there are levels of toxicity ... this will irritate your eyes, your lungs, etc. so get outside the radius established by the fire marshal.").

There are times when the term "act of God" applies. I would think a 1-in-1000-years storm would qualify for that. Freaking media ... no wonder their approval rating is worse than Trump's or Congress's.

[Bailey Guns]

An approval rating worse than congress at 15%? That takes some skill.

[hollohas]

I'm not sure which is stronger...the rainfall from Harvey, or the Lib blowhards harping on "climate change," "told you so" etc. I've read more than a few comments from people who are happy this happened to a red state, because it's their fault that we have climate change. [facepalm]Seriously.

They seem to forget this is the only major hurricane here in the last 12 years. I thought Al told us that global warming would make these things common???

[GilpinGuy]

Seriously.

They seem to forget this is the only major hurricane here in the last 12 years. I thought Al told us that global warming would make these things common???

Baaaah! Facts mean nothing!

[sellersm]

Apparently rescuing a woman and child is now considered................................... sexist!

https://fellowshipoftheminds.com/2017/09/01/feminists-are-insufferable-man-rescuing-a-woman-and-child-is-sexist/

[00tec]

Let's politicize this shit....

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/08/31/charlie-hebdo-cover-portraying-harvey-victims-as-neo-nazis-shocks-twitter-evil/23192506/

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DIgmyEGUEAA-iEj?format=jpg

[Skip]

Apparently rescuing a woman and child is now considered................................... sexist!

https://fellowshipoftheminds.com/2017/09/01/feminists-are-insufferable-man-rescuing-a-woman-and-child-is-sexist/

Equality demands they drown, I guess.

[cstone]

Women and children first...then the bisexuals, transexuals, questioning, non-binary, lesbians, etc....

No room on the boat for cis-gendered majority race members.

Equality means what they say it means. [Sarcasm2]

[Gman]

Let's politicize this shit....

https://www.aol.com/article/news/2017/08/31/charlie-hebdo-cover-portraying-harvey-victims-as-neo-nazis-shocks-twitter-evil/23192506/

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DIgmyEGUEAA-iEj?format=jpg
I felt bad for them after the terror attacks. After that idiotic move, not so much.

[GilpinGuy]

The French...making fun of the US...[LOL]

[Great-Kazoo]

The French...making fun of the US...[LOL]

Know what the French asked the Germans as they rolled in to Paris?

























Table for forty thousand ?

[CapLock]

It's a sweet sweet life living by the salty sea.
One day you could be as lost as me.
Change your geography.
Maybe you might be!!
Knee deep in the water some where

[ray1970]

I get to go to Houston in a couple of weeks for some training. I'm expecting to find things pretty much back to normal down there.

[JohnnyDrama]

Now that it seems the Texans have the rescue under control the media has changed focus to LA. The juxtaposition should be interesting.

[hurley842002]

Now that it seems the Texans have the rescue under control the media has changed focus to LA. The juxtaposition should be interesting.
My mother-in-law's house is in the path of that fire, it's pretty bad.

[Great-Kazoo]

My mother-in-law's house is in the path of that fire, it's pretty bad.

Our daughter is in central CA. They were put on Be Prepared to Evacuate notice, yesterday.



https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/7dcthmWXV2H1uXnBpLv8Komt_54VCdvM3aC_6BBT9u6Aw80bto xOZTtPYoaXl3hxyDXa2jiBvTY4o6t3DAAFBN0NjcuML4QIBNWE mbG0uLAg_3lhPjYEDUuR-c5AcrEFkmYUTl6kS8rnLd4SokpGPkZnuJD96P8bRkkgPrGdTZn l2WEtC8j1MSB-rBUTctpbA-JkDwY6eWnRDf5y9YodJORf5u5qXsj4U6_HS_V5JViEQWfopE4r 7bqBVdE7Lcx7jz4PL79j7f841aFTRuA3ratJLxPJbW_PXBQ_-p-BkvNpTEvKzFiQ3wxN0mGAQ0YYNs_T1aKXFXrOvangDSWrqlW7T iHLRLeXM0MfUh2Dj_kvxc3PgnXIWCwgSb31vUBHXXSkjLwdRz_ 4z3dBbzOkOH1Q69mTqlOGttFLWHAuAvazaBEm1ZflaftQ3wMfk ZE8x5o2uNoSWr3VkreC_tuCYu3uc5DjR8zrgABUpowlx2mrlui EeN-1Xg80B7KLGRWavsfEXac5s3qn1FeN1l955eGzEHezxtLiTiywk-Aa_yBKaE7qdChAGBNW4gP63sHlMkCYBu_IqsjuXLFvcS9kU0CL _anJg9Ujrh_PVSSbv0ZvBBNRPyl8=w868-h651-no

[Gman]

This article was pretty cool; Texans’ do-it-ourselves rescue effort defines Hurricane Harvey (http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/texans%E2%80%99-do-it-ourselves-rescue-effort-defines-hurricane-harvey/ar-AAr84tY)

HOUSTON — As a torrential rain poured from the sky last Sunday, Keri Henry sat in her snug West University Place living room nervously checking Facebook. Floodwaters were rising, emergency lines were jammed, and people were posting desperate pleas for help: “Two elderly people trapped in a one story on their kitchen counters since noon.” “Seven people trapped in second floor.”

Henry grabbed a notepad and began scratching down details, thinking she would connect the people in trouble with other Facebook users offering boats and high-water vehicles. Within hours, the 36-year-old freelance food stylist was running a one-woman command center from her sofa.

“I see some people commenting on one post and other people commenting on another post, and it just clicked,” Henry said. “I had no idea what I was doing but no choice except to do it.”

Henry was part of an unprecedented do-it-yourself relief effort that came to define Hurricane Harvey. After the storm blew into Houston, a remarkable network of boat owners with smartphones, worried neighbors with laptops and digital wizards with mapping software popped up to summon and support an army of Good Samaritans who motored, rowed and waded into dangerous waters to save family, friends and total strangers.

The “We the People” response seemed distinctly Texan, an outgrowth of the state’s almost genetic disinclination to rely on the government for anything — and in some cases, resolute willingness to defy it. Just as some Texans defied mandatory evacuation orders ahead of the storm, many rescuers ignored repeated official warnings to stay off streets flooded with treacherous and fast-flowing waters.

Texas officials, in turn, repeatedly emphasized the importance of personal responsibility. They warned people not to call 911 unless their life was in immediate peril. The top elected official in Tyler County, northeast of Houston, told people not to expect a rescue if they defied evacuation orders. His subtle-as-buckshot words on Facebook: “GET OUT OR DIE!”

Police were working nonstop, “but we can’t do it all,” Bashir said. “It’s because of the citizens that we were able to get everyone out.”

The citizen rescue campaign was made possible by technology that didn’t exist in 2005 when Hurricane Katrina devastated New Orleans. Then, people listened to AM radio for news and organized rescues by ham radio or by calling reporters, who posted their cries for help on local news blogs.

In 2007, Apple introduced the iPhone, accelerating the rise of social media. Today, more than three-quarters of Americans carry a smartphone in their pocket, according to the Pew Research Center. Harvey is the largest natural disaster to play out in the United States since the dawn of this hyper-connected era.

Because Harvey’s strongest winds hit the Texas coast far to the south, near Corpus Christi, Houston didn’t suffer the blanket power outages that hit New Orleans during Katrina. As a result, in more places than not, cellphones worked, laptops stayed charged and people could log in to neighborhood Facebook groups and message boards, Twitter, Instagram, Nextdoor and Snapchat.

Rescuers also relied heavily on Zello, a free “walkie-talkie” app that has become popular among activists in conflict zones around the world. The app works on cellphone data plans or WiFi and was designed to operate in places where signals are weak, making it particularly useful in disaster areas. It allows victims and rescuers to post voice messages to specific channels, such as “The Cajun Navy” and “Harvey Animal Rescue.”

Bill Moore, chief executive of Zello, a start-up based in Austin, said the app has seen a 20-fold increase in usage in Houston since Harvey hit.

Houstonians also improvised their own digital tools as the floodwaters rose. Three buddies created the website “Houston Harvey Rescue,” according to the site, “in under 3 hours, in a leaky office, with intermittent power, [and] a 2 GB server.” The site allowed users to drop a pin on a Google map to alert rescuers to people in trouble. The color of the pin could be changed to indicate the degree of urgency, and the pin could be removed when the rescue was completed, giving rescuers a real-time view of needs across the city.

The site, which claims credit for “over 7,600 active rescues,” was no longer operational on Saturday. “Long story short: We aren’t needed anymore,” read a post from its three creators, Matthew Marchetti, Nate Larson, and Oliver Carter. “Houston saved Houston by open sourcing its own rescue.”

Even Texas National Guardsmen sometimes found their cellphones more useful than radios, which have limited range. During patrols this week, soldiers said Facebook became a vital tool for receiving civilian reports of people in need of rescue. Spc. Justin Snow said a responding unit found and rescued dozens of people trapped in a flooded building from a Facebook post.

“Hats off to Google Maps and dropping pins on iPhone,” Snow said.

There were the inevitable wild goose chases. In Port Arthur on Thursday, a Facebook post said a rescuer had been electrocuted in the Montrose subdivision. Firefighters rushed out but found no one — one of dozens of false reports.

“Social media has allowed us to process so much information. But it’s almost information overload,” said Shawn Boudreaux, vice president of Cajun Navy Relief, a volunteer rescue operation, from the command post in Lake Charles, La. “We have trolls. We have hoaxes.”

The information overload also led at times to volunteer overload, and some would-be citizen rescuers were turned away from areas where there were already too many boats in the water. The Texas Department of Public Safety reported having to rescue some overeager but undertrained volunteers whose boats overturned in the swift current.

Still, for the most part, the improvisational effort was successful.

When Andrew Brenneise saw his West Houston neighborhood flooding at a ferocious pace last Saturday, his first thought was Facebook Live. He pulled out his smartphone in the punishing rain and pleaded for volunteers with boats.

Forty-five minutes later, the first truck arrived with a boat on a trailer. Then 10 more. Then 20. Then Brenneise had a flotilla of fishing boats, kayaks, canoes and flat-bottomed skiffs which, over the next six days, rescued hundreds of people and animals.

“This is who we are,” said Brenneise, 31, a business development manager at a chemical company. “The police and firefighters can’t be everywhere, so the community has to step in and take control.”

Tanner Montgomery, 39, a real estate agent, and two friends drove three hours from San Antonio with a canoe on a trailer to help in Brenneise’s neighborhood, known as Westchase, where tree-lined streets of elegant homes were threatened throughout the week by releases from nearby Barker Reservoir. Montgomery didn’t hear Brenneise’s appeal but was alerted through posts on Facebook and Zello, as well as text messages from other volunteers.

“There’s way too many people who need help for just the emergency services,” Montgomery said. “There’s only so many government employees, and there’s a lot more of us.”

Indeed, emergency services were stretched so thin that police didn’t arrive to take control of the rescue operation in Westchase until Thursday. Even then, they had no boats, so they had to hitch rides with the citizen navy, including Montgomery’s canoe.

In Memorial, one of Houston’s older communities, Denver Courtney and Alex Claymon spent days using their personal boats to rescue stranded neighbors.

“I was sitting there just chewing my fingers off, going, ‘I can’t watch this and not go help,’ ” said Claymon, 44, an insurance agent who drove 2½ hours from Palestine, Tex.

“Basically, as a Texan, you know, you’re called to duty when something like this happens,” added Courtney, 48, an interior designer from Houston. “If you’re a hunter and a fisherman and a redneck, man, then you got your boat out here. And if you don’t, we don’t claim you as a Texan.”

Henry launched her personal rescue operation around lunchtime last Sunday from her cozy sectional in West University Place, an independent city near downtown Houston.

“It turns out my Facebook addiction actually had a purpose,” she said. With the water rising, she divided the pleas for help into three categories in her notebook: “BABIES.” “Elderly.” “Families.”

On Sunday night, she slept for barely two hours.

“I don’t know how many lives I could’ve saved while I slept,” she said. “It was hard to make yourself sleep.”

At first, she focused on linking boaters and victims in the closest neighborhoods — Bellaire, Braeswood, Meyerland. But as word of her work spread online, she began receiving tags and private messages from strangers farther away in Memorial and Katy and, eventually, all over Houston.

Boaters arriving from as far away as Florida found their way to her on Facebook as well, seeking guidance about where to deploy. Then Henry linked up with a Houston lawyer, Thomas J. Holmes III, who was commanding his own fleet of boats.

Holmes had something else to offer: online emergency forms. Created through Google Docs, the forms allowed victims and volunteers to provide rescuers with crucial details about their location and health. That information was then uploaded to a master spreadsheet that let rescuers know whether to expect a large family, pets or a victim weighing more than 300 pounds.

“So many random boaters were filling out my Google dispatch form that I realized they could be dispatched almost anywhere there were needs,” Henry said. “Our operation just kept growing.”

From last Sunday through Thursday, she worked, aided at times by a friend who listened to Zello from her home in Hawaii. At the height of the effort, Henry estimates that she was helping to direct 39 teams of three or four boats each — well over 100 good Samaritans saving an untold number of lives.

“Once I got a few people rescued and things started gaining momentum, I couldn’t just look away,” she said. “Who was I going to pass the torch to? The 911 dispatch? No way. That wasn’t an option.”

[hurley842002]

Our daughter is in central CA. They were put on Be Prepared to Evacuate notice, yesterday.



https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/7dcthmWXV2H1uXnBpLv8Komt_54VCdvM3aC_6BBT9u6Aw80bto xOZTtPYoaXl3hxyDXa2jiBvTY4o6t3DAAFBN0NjcuML4QIBNWE mbG0uLAg_3lhPjYEDUuR-c5AcrEFkmYUTl6kS8rnLd4SokpGPkZnuJD96P8bRkkgPrGdTZn l2WEtC8j1MSB-rBUTctpbA-JkDwY6eWnRDf5y9YodJORf5u5qXsj4U6_HS_V5JViEQWfopE4r 7bqBVdE7Lcx7jz4PL79j7f841aFTRuA3ratJLxPJbW_PXBQ_-p-BkvNpTEvKzFiQ3wxN0mGAQ0YYNs_T1aKXFXrOvangDSWrqlW7T iHLRLeXM0MfUh2Dj_kvxc3PgnXIWCwgSb31vUBHXXSkjLwdRz_ 4z3dBbzOkOH1Q69mTqlOGttFLWHAuAvazaBEm1ZflaftQ3wMfk ZE8x5o2uNoSWr3VkreC_tuCYu3uc5DjR8zrgABUpowlx2mrlui EeN-1Xg80B7KLGRWavsfEXac5s3qn1FeN1l955eGzEHezxtLiTiywk-Aa_yBKaE7qdChAGBNW4gP63sHlMkCYBu_IqsjuXLFvcS9kU0CL _anJg9Ujrh_PVSSbv0ZvBBNRPyl8=w868-h651-no
Sorry to hear, I hope everything turns out good for them.

This was my MIL's place earlier

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170903/f4fe6a6febf506bf00bc0989034a45f2.jpg

And just a bit ago

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170903/63d8b975be46f799a9cfc6c5a2b47609.jpg

[OtterbatHellcat]

Yeah...time to worry.

I hope the best for the folks dealing with that for sure.

[GilpinGuy]

No shit. Prepare to evacuate means "Get the fuck out of dodge before everyone is trying to at the same time".

We had that call once up here and I about shit myself.

[OtterbatHellcat]

I've never had a call like that....so I can't relate. I get it, but never having been in that spot myself spares me the panic and worry that everyone in that position has already felt....and the unfortunate ones that come back to ashes and complete ruins of what their life was recently all about.

[Great-Kazoo]

No shit. Prepare to evacuate means "Get the fuck out of dodge before everyone is trying to at the same time".

We had that call once up here and I about shit myself.


When you're lending the livestock trailer to people who are in more danger then you, you prioritize who needs assistance .

[GilpinGuy]

When you're lending the livestock trailer to people who are in more danger then you, you prioritize who needs assistance .

Not sure what this means. If my neighbor needs to borrow the trailer, here you go. If he needs help, I'll help. Otherwise, I'm gone.

[TheGrey]

Fire evacuations are terrifying. :(

[Great-Kazoo]

Not sure what this means. If my neighbor needs to borrow the trailer, here you go. If he needs help, I'll help. Otherwise, I'm gone.

Those closer to the fires path get help first.

[Gman]

I get to go to Houston in a couple of weeks for some training. I'm expecting to find things pretty much back to normal down there.
Call ahead. With all of the people displaced, your options for a hotel are likely pretty thin.

[ray1970]

Call ahead. With all of the people displaced, your options for a hotel are likely pretty thin.

Eh. I wasn't planning on staying at Motel 6. Hopefully the places with the $250 a night rooms will have a vacancy. If not I'll just stay with my dad.

[Aloha_Shooter]

Eh. I wasn't planning on staying at Motel 6. Hopefully the places with the $250 a night rooms will have a vacancy. If not I'll just stay with my dad.

I suspect everything available is going to be filled to capacity. If your company is smart, they should cancel training in Houston until they have a chance to recover a bit.

[BladesNBarrels]

I suspect everything available is going to be filled to capacity. If your company is smart, they should cancel training in Houston until they have a chance to recover a bit.

Stayed in Mobile, AL, 7 months after Katrina, at a Ramada Inn.
It was rated 4 Diamonds in AAA book when we had to make the unplanned stop due to lights failing on a trailer I was towing.
Since the publication of the AAA Guide, it had been designated a FEMA emergency housing facility and 60% of the rooms were allocated to Flood Victims.
Entire families, 4-7 people, were living in each of the rooms without kitchenettes, etc.
They had been there since Katrina hit and adapted to grilling in the parking lot, gathering around a fire in a stock tank, and sharing stories.
It was no longer a 4 Diamond hotel, but it did provide a glimpse into the lives of the displaced victims.

[ray1970]

I suspect everything available is going to be filled to capacity. If your company is smart, they should cancel training in Houston until they have a chance to recover a bit.

Got in touch with the lady in charge of enrollment for the training. She said everything is just fine where they are and the class is still a go. She said to go ahead and book my flight and hotel. Thinking about canceling anyways. Nothing to do with the hurricane but I have a ton of work to get done before the end of October so my time might be better spent working.

[OtterbatHellcat]

I think Irma is going to make Harvey look like just a bad down pour.

[Gman]

I think Irma is going to make Harvey look like just a bad down pour.
Nah, the High pressure system that held Harvey in place for so long made for a really bad situation. At least Irma will move along.

[Great-Kazoo]

Nah, the High pressure system that held Harvey in place for so long made for a really bad situation. At least Irma will move along.

Up the rest of the east coast.

[68Charger]

I think Irma is going to make Harvey look like just a bad down pour.

For heavily populated areas like Houston- there wasn't wind damage... but calling it a "bad down pour" is a gross understatement.. it was an EPIC downpour- 40-52" of rain in the most concentrated areas.
All-time continental U.S. tropical cyclone rain records were broken.
The areal coverage of locations picking up at least 20 inches of rain was greater than the state of West Virginia, while the 40-inch-plus zone was larger than Delaware.
Source: https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/news/tropical-storm-harvey-forecast-texas-louisiana-arkansas


Nah, the High pressure system that held Harvey in place for so long made for a really bad situation. At least Irma will move along.


^^^^ THIS!!
look at Harvey's storm track- it made landfall at Rockport- there was significant wind damage in that area- the high school collapsed for one.

it headed NNW, then went around in a circle, then headed back out to the Gulf, picked up MORE moisture, headed for Houston, then before landfall went further out to get MORE moisture, and eventually made landfall again just East of the TX-LA border.

The description above doesn't really show the carnage... will try to post a huge GIF showing the radar for 7 days- but I'll post a link, too...

http://andrew.rsmas.miami.edu/bmcnoldy/tropics/harvey17/Harvey_25-31Aug17_regional.gif

http://andrew.rsmas.miami.edu/bmcnoldy/tropics/harvey17/Harvey_25-31Aug17_regional.gif
If you watch that, you'll get an idea why Houston is so flooded
Parts of that area got OVER 50 INCHES of rain in that 7 day period... and there were over 3600 Sq Miles that got 40+ inches of rain, over 11,000 Sq Miles with 30+, and nearly 29,000 Sq Miles with 20+ inches of rain


Another good article (from East Coast source)
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/08/24/us/hurricane-harvey-texas.html?mcubz=0


Up the rest of the east coast.

All the above being said- Irma is also set to be a possibly historic hurricane... maybe those that predicted the Solar eclipse was an indicator of the end of the world weren't so wrong... [hahhah-no]

[Gman]

All the rain that Hurricane Harvey dumped on Texas and Louisiana, in one massive water drop (https://www.vox.com/science-and-health/2017/8/28/16217626/harvey-houston-flood-water-visualized)
https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/nrXsa_pgAbDj9MV5GtHGQBnz3g4=/1600x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/9161515/HOUSTON_2x_80.jpg


It’s all because over six days, 27 trillion gallons of water fell over Texas and Louisiana, as Ryan Maue, a meteorologist with WeatherBell, told (http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/31/us/harvey-houston-texas-flood/index.html) CNN. (The calculation is simple, he says on Twitter: It’s depth of rain multiplied by the number of square miles covered (https://twitter.com/RyanMaue/status/902237427548516356).) That’s one million gallons of water for nearly every person who lives in Texas (https://www.google.com/search?q=population+of+texas&oq=population+of+texas&aqs=chrome.0.69i59j0l5.2513j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8).

[OtterbatHellcat]

Concise stats, thank you. In no way would I have tried to say that Harvey "wasn't extremely destructive or unique".

My comment about Irma was more about it's category 5 condition and incredible sustained wind speeds at the time of the post. I was envisioning 180 mph eyewall winds devastating both sides of Fla. all the way up the state....and the 20-30 ft high storm surge they were talking about at the time as well.

Irma has since decreased it's intensity, for now. Unfortunately we're going to find out how much damage it will have produced. I pray for the upcoming victims in Fla.......right along with our friends in Tx. in their aftermath.

[Skip]

Irma is going to wreck FL.

My old house in Jacksonville is under mandatory evacuation starting Saturday night. I was 20 miles inland from the Atlantic but close to the St John's. They are expecting a massive surge.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Thought this was kind of interesting...

http://fox8.com/2017/09/08/harvey-and-irma-couple-marries-75-years-before-major-hurricanes-that-share-their-names/

[gnihcraes]

My Brother is in the center of FL, north of Orlando.

They aren't expecting too much flooding, worried more about 100+ mph winds.

Interesting too, they took all the county service vehicles home with them. They apparently can bill FEMA for the vehicle time, persons time etc just by having the vehicle "out" and available if needed vs. it sitting at the county shops. Hopefully they won't need to use any of them to rescue folks.

Not a dang thing I can do for him, just sit and wait for him to report in through the weekend.

[OtterbatHellcat]

I hope he fares well....will you share his experience through this with us here?

[gnihcraes]

I hope he fares well....will you share his experience through this with us here?

I'll post up anything I know if he's able to communicate through any of it.

I know he had trouble finding fuel yesterday.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Firsthand info straight out of the Orlando area through this would be an interesting experience to hear about.

Again, I hope he fares well.

Evidently running into the northern coast of Cuba isn't hurting the strength of this monster at this time, it's sustained wind speed actually increased back to category five in the last hour or so, and soon will be over really warm water for several hours again before US landfall.

[hurley842002]

My father in law is headed to Orlando with the American Red cross, hope for the best.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Absolutely, Sir.

[OtterbatHellcat]

It just occurred to me, but if I wonder if a whole semi filled with Flex Seal installed on your home would help save you.

If successful and documented, what a sales tool that would be.

"It's like Irma repellent ....IN A CAN!"

[Gman]

It just occurred to me, but if I wonder if a whole semi filled with Flex Seal installed on your home would help save you.

If successful and documented, what a sales tool that would be.

"It's like Irma repellent ....IN A CAN!"
Just coat the whole place in Rhino coating. I'm sure it would please the HOA. [Coffee]

[OtterbatHellcat]

I know, right?

Props to the FLA AG BTW.....she's cute, but she's a viper. Gonna go after all the price gougers with fervor she says.

[Skip]

My father in law is headed to Orlando with the American Red cross, hope for the best.

Good on him for helping out!

Things looks better this morning. Sustained winds down to 130MPH. Cone is now shifting west which is good for some.


ETA: Here is the Irma page to look at probabilities/tracks/cone...


http://www.nhc.noaa.gov/#Irma

[Gman]

It just occurred to me, but if I wonder if a whole semi filled with Flex Seal installed on your home would help save you.

If successful and documented, what a sales tool that would be.

"It's like Irma repellent ....IN A CAN!"
Just saw a commercial for Flex Seal targeted toward uses during storm season. They're not missing out on these opportunities.

Watching coverage on Fox News. Irma is down to a Cat 3. Let's hope she keeps weakening.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Yeah, if you're on FOX right now, I saw it too. I been flippin around avoiding commercial breaks as needed.


I'm also watching RAPrealtime sat and upper air charts trying to watch and follow when, why and where the eye makes a new move. 15 to 30 minutes ago it went west again after it looked like it was starting to pull away from the Cuba coast.

[OtterbatHellcat]

14:15 / 14:45 UTC clearly show a westward movement again.

[OtterbatHellcat]

21:15 / 23:15....weird bobbling...but maybe the push north now it looks? It's gonna go soon.

A whole bunch of -75 reflectivity just popped up and donkey punched some unknown part of Cuba. That be some HEAVY happinens there right now.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Varadero Cuba, and Havana isn't that far to the west of it. Ass pounding.

[OtterbatHellcat]

It just happened again....I wonder if Havana is still standing....Jeezes.

[OtterbatHellcat]

It's getting stronger again, and I bet by morning it's a 4 again.

If you look at a lot of the upper air graphs and vapor imagery and a some other stuff....it really seems like this storm is fighting to stay alive if that makes any sense. There's a lot of atmospheric opposition to it, but it's winning for now against it's odds. They've already changed it's track distance and time it would take to get there.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Before anyone else says it, I know you might already be thinking it......I beg everyone's pardon for me being a weather geek and being so sucked into this Irma event.

That said, I hope everyone in the path of this storm survives it's fury. I'll reel it in a bit and be less "posty" about it.

Thank you....:)

[Bailey Guns]

Gonna go after all the price gougers with fervor she says.

Good. Disrupt capitalism and the free market at every chance with more gov't interference. That's my motto.

[OtterbatHellcat]

$100 for a case of bottled water is bullshit, brother.

[Bailey Guns]

Not gonna argue it again. It's been done too many times. Carry on.

BTW...I was a "weather geek" forecaster for years in the AF. Mostly secret squirrel ninja stuff...but I worked in the tropical section of AF Global Weather in Omaha for a while waiting on my clearance update. Did a lot of tropical storm forecasting. It was usually very tedious but was interesting and fun when working a big storm.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Sharing a common interest in boring weather data.....that's cool.

I don't ever remember arguing about capitalism with you, but okay. Carry on as well, Sir.

[Skip]

Woke up to very different cone/track this morning. I'm sure a lot of people are relieved by the west coast of Fl looks bad now.

130MPH sustained now.

[Bailey Guns]

There's a video on FoxNews of the ocean floor near an island in the Bahamas that's completely dry. Irma is so strong and pushed so much water ahead of it it's drained certain areas of water.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Impressive.

[Gman]

Making landfall at high tide, adding insult to injury.

[theGinsue]

There's a video on FoxNews of the ocean floor near an island in the Bahamas that's completely dry. Irma is so strong and pushed so much water ahead of it it's drained certain areas of water.

Looks lke the same thing is happening in Tampa Bay right now.

[gnihcraes]

Checked in on the brother. Just raining. Bit of wind. (Hour north of Orlando, middle from each coast)

He's just hanging out, still has power etc.

[OtterbatHellcat]

Good to hear.

[StagLefty]

My buddy has a son in Ft. Meyers and still hasn't heard from him today

[Gman]

Family was out of the area and their place in Coral Gables is not supposed to get much of a storm surge. Power is out all over the place and cell service is also affected.

[gnihcraes]

Update email/text from my brother:

Wind still blowing. Yard debris. No power. Call my cell phone to talk...

[SuperiorDG]

Took this screenshot yesterday. This is my ex's parents house location.

71924

[Gman]

Got word this morning on the fam situation in Coral Gables. Not much storm surge. A few inches of water in the charter fishing boat, but it's in good shape. Some trees down around the neighborhood and some loose shingles blowing around, but their house faired pretty well. Could have been worse.