AR 10 Pistol

[KevDen2005]

Wondering if anyone has experience with a 10.5 inch AR 10? It appears that 10.5 inches of barrel is not great for .308, but wondering if anyone has one or has shot one and what they think.

[ray1970]

No experience but I bet it will make a fireball the size of a Volkswagen.

[KevDen2005]

No experience but I bet it will make a fireball the size of a Volkswagen.

Fahrvergnügen?

[DireWolf]

Wondering if anyone has experience with a 10.5 inch AR 10? It appears that 10.5 inches of barrel is not great for .308, but wondering if anyone has one or has shot one and what they think.
Based on my research (which may possibly be incomplete/inaccurate) anything shorter than a 12.5" barreled .308 didn't make much sense ballistically, and all around better/cheaper options would be available in an AR15 frame...

I used to have a 13.7" AR10 (w/ pinned brake) which was really nice and shot well, and was planning to build a 12.5" .308 and welding a F1 reflex can on the end of it, but have decided to pass on that build for now...

The 12.5" should be more solid from a velocity perspective, and have better barrel harmonics and be every bit as accurate as something longer (prior to transsonic velocity threshold which will be hit sooner ala reduced MV, hence a reduced effective range)...

Not exactly what the OP referenced, but hopefully at least a little helpful...

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[TFOGGER]

Hybrid flame thrower/pistol combo?

[KevDen2005]

Based on my research (which may be incomplete/inaccurate) anything shorter than a 12.5" barreled .308 didn't make much sense ballistically, and all around better/cheaper options would be available in an AR15 frame...

I used to have a 13.7" AR10 (w/ pinned brake) which was really nice and shot well, and was planning to build a 12.5" .308 and welding a F1 reflex can on the end of it, but have decided to pass on that build for now...

The 12.5" should be more solid from a velocity perspective, and have better barrel harmonics and be every bit as accurate as something longer (prior to transsonic velocity threshold which will be hit sooner ala reduced MV, hence a reduced effective range)...

Not exactly what the OP referenced, but hopefully at least a little helpful...

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Thanks, very helpful

[KevDen2005]

Hybrid flame thrower/pistol combo?

Yeah I was thinking a little short of a barrel for .308

[00tec]

I say go for it.

[DireWolf]

Hybrid flame thrower/pistol combo?

Sort of like a larger version of this?

....edited....



Yeah I was thinking a little short of a barrel for .308

If you do build it, may I suggest a Franklin trigger and some pics/vid? [emoji6]

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[KevDen2005]

Sort of like a larger version of this?

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180129/6dab22c34e86e92acef7561b0c74f348.jpg




If you do build it, may I suggest a Franklin trigger and some pics/vid? [emoji6]

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.308 with any type of binary trigger set up or bump fire stock is well out of my price range.

[TFOGGER]

.308 with any type of binary trigger set up or bump fire stock is well out of my price range.

yeah, me too... the sound they make is "buckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbu ckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuck..."

[KevDen2005]

yeah, me too... the sound they make is "buckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbu ckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuckbuck..."

I laughed entirely too hard at this....I made the noise too

[DireWolf]

But you have to figure, being a bit of a money-hose is what a 10.5" .308 is likely to be best at, so if that's the build-spec, might as well unleash the awesome while you're at it!

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[KevDen2005]

But you have to figure, being a bit of a money-hose is what a 10.5" .308 is likely to be best at, so if that's the build-spec, might as well unleash the awesome while you're at it!

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You guys aren't doing a great job of talking me out of this build.

[ray1970]

I’d be curious to see some 308 ballistics out of that barrel compared to the same bullet weight in something like a 300 Blackout.

I did get to fire a few shots from a 30-06 pistol once. I wasn’t really kidding about the Volkswagen reference earlier. Powder burning beyond the barrel can be pretty impressive.

[buffalobo]

Fireballs from the end of a barrel are cool.

If you're unarmed, you are a victim

[DireWolf]

I’d be curious to see some 308 ballistics out of that barrel compared to the same bullet weight in something like a 300 Blackout.

The SBR in that pic is actually a 5.56 w/ linear comp...

If memory serves, I recall the ballistics for a .308 with that short of a barrel being pretty close to a 300BO (which is going to be all-around cheaper to build/run, and way lighter), particularly with lighter (supersonic) bullet weights....

That said, it's always possible that I'm mis-remembering or otherwise have some error/miscalculation in my understanding (its been a while since looking into this)...I know that a number of our members have far greater knowledge in this area than my own, and hopefully someone can chime in on-topic if my above statement is incorrect...

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[Grant H.]

I have the parts to assemble one some day, when I get some free time, but I haven't gotten there yet. I bought a 12.5" Noveske Leonidas bbl right around when they first introduced the project/idea, and it's still sitting in the wrapper in the parts cabinet.

.308 Pistol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=EUx7Rqtv5zo


LEONIDAS
Project Leonidas is a 7.62mm weapon system designed by operators for use in a CQB support role. The barrel is a proprietary design, 12.5" long, stainless, with 1 in 10" polygonal rifling. The rifle runs smooth with minimal felt recoil and concussion.

- Average 10 ft velocities with M118-LR 175gr 2417 fps, high, and 2365 fps, low.

- Average 5 shot average with 120 gr 7.62 2839 fps.

Another helpful article that sheds some light on short barrel .308.
https://rifleshooter.com/2016/02/308-winchester-7-62x51mm-nato-short-barrel-length-and-velocity-a-six-inch-308-bolt-gun/

My vote? Build one!

[gta_spec]

While a 308 pistol would be a fun toy, keep this in mind:
10" barreled AR10 pistol OAL =
18" barreled Keltec RFB OAL
Both just over 26"

[Grant H.]

While a 308 pistol would be a fun toy, keep this in mind:
10" barreled AR10 pistol OAL =
18" barreled Keltec RFB OAL
Both just over 26"

Yes, but then you have to admit you own a Keltec, and that advertising like this worked on you...

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-1Dx5KmlaHmo/WkPnTiZJKEI/AAAAAAAANPk/YmAXfcLx6PsSlxqaLy6LG1NoHyqEvY7swCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_0675.jpg

Sorry, couldn't resist...

[KevDen2005]

Yes, but then you have to admit you own a Keltec, and that advertising like this worked on you...

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-1Dx5KmlaHmo/WkPnTiZJKEI/AAAAAAAANPk/YmAXfcLx6PsSlxqaLy6LG1NoHyqEvY7swCLcBGAs/s1600/IMG_0675.jpg

Sorry, couldn't resist...

LOL!!!

This advertising is quite hilarious.

But I wouldn't mind shooting one. A major factor in me not purchasing one....the advertising.

[Great-Kazoo]

You guys aren't doing a great job of talking me out of this build.

I put a binary in my x39 project, if you want to road test it ;)

[KevDen2005]

I put a binary in my x39 project, if you want to road test it ;)

Got your text, yeah we'll need to meet up when the weather gets nice and try it out. Never got to see one in person thus far.

[SA Friday]

Velocity based on barrel length is a linear relationship. Very predictable. This site is a good representation of velocity vs barrel length.
https://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308-winchester-7-62x51mm-nato-barrel-length-versus-velocity-28-to-16-5/
Basically, You are getting into 300 Blackout with a 10.5-12.5" barrel. Waaaaaaaaaaaay cheaper to build yourself a Blackout.

[KevDen2005]

Velocity based on barrel length is a linear relationship. Very predictable. This site is a good representation of velocity vs barrel length.
https://rifleshooter.com/2014/12/308-winchester-7-62x51mm-nato-barrel-length-versus-velocity-28-to-16-5/
Basically, You are getting into 300 Blackout with a 10.5-12.5" barrel. Waaaaaaaaaaaay cheaper to build yourself a Blackout.

That's what I'm thinking....

And I can't believe you're posting, I was wondering if you were still alive?!

[SA Friday]

That's what I'm thinking....

And I can't believe you're posting, I was wondering if you were still alive?!

My relationship with social media has been love and hate like a bitch with borderline personality disorder.

[KevDen2005]

My relationship with social media has been love and hate like a bitch with borderline personality disorder.

I hear you. I got rid of FB over a year and a half ago and have been very happy about it.

[KevDen2005]

Do you reload? Would open up options. You would also want the absolute fastest twist bbl you can get..or you will be stuck shooting 110 grain vmax all day. (Which tbh, might be the perfect round for such a gun in any circumstances). If you load...you can make those pretty cheap. Also round nose 110 grain carbine would be excellent with a fast burning powder (plinking). You'll still have a mad fireball but at least they will be stable and your effective range increases. Pulling it out of my ass here but I bet 110 vmax would stay supersonic to at least 700/750. Which if you can do that with an AR10 pistol..you dah boss. Heavy bullets are going to make it an expensive 300 blackout (and less-stable/inaccurate)...but light bullets properly loaded would be a fun niche.

I think I've decided away from such a short barrel. I think I wouldn't mind a pistol build of around 12 to 13 barrel in .308, but I think I'm gonna head down the 300 Blackout road first. It seems like a better way to go and I know members on this very board have hunted elk with one.

[68Charger]

I thought of this... (but it's even more extreme in length)
73582

[KevDen2005]

I thought of this... (but it's even more extreme in length)
73582

I like the setting the clothes on fire part

[68Charger]

I like the setting the clothes on fire part

Plus it's got history... which is nice.

[BPTactical]

http://adjunct.diodon349.com/serious_rilfe_caliber_pistols/serious_rifle_caliber_pistols.htm

[osok-308]

Honestly, I don't see the reason for having such a short .308. I've got a 16" bbl 308. Honestly, it took a long time for me to even accept a .308 in this short of a barrel. If you're just looking for something fun that kicks more than your average ar-15, then by all means, go for it. I couldn't justify that much of a performance drop from a .308. As stated by others, if you drop the barrel length that much, it's closer to a 300 blk in performance, which is lighter, cheaper, and able to suppress much easier. I have a 5.56 AR in a 12.5 inch barrel and I love that.