Hanguard over suppressor.

[mattiooo]

I have a 300 blackout upper with an 8.5" bbl and a can. I'd like to replace the 7" handguard with a new one that goes over the can in a Honey Badger style.
Something along the lines of this: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1569/7921/products/Q-TP-HoneyBadger-Right-Closed_2048x2048.jpg?v=1517931242 (without all the Cerakote)

So far I have found the Aero Precision and Midwest Industries handguards that will fit over the can.

Any other's I should check out? Or stay away from?

Outside diameter of my can is 1.375" and length is 7.6" - Gemtech GM-45

[Great-Kazoo]

While those look nice, unless you're going to run suppressed full time. You may run in to issues with muzzle blast inside the tube.

[mattiooo]

While those look nice, unless you're going to run suppressed full time. You may run in to issues with muzzle blast inside the tube.

Yep. The suppressor lives on that upper unless I borrow it for use on a pistol.

[To Bear Arms]

I have a similar set-up. I am running a Seekins rail.

http://www.seekinsprecision.com/mcsr-rail.html

[Wolfshoon]

As kazoo said, the muzzleblast can destroy handguards. The other BIG consideration is heat transfer, that rifle handguard pictured is going to get HOT! I'll try to find the thread, but this was explored at length over at m4carbine.net and they had pics of alum handguards that had been cracked, split and separated by non-suppressed muzzle brakes under the handguards.

With that said, Daniel Defense has an integral SBR offering (that is heavier than it looks) and Spikes has the Compressor. US military is also fielding proposals for a new rifle cartridge with a integral suppressor built in the host, a la larue's Surg entry among others.

[mattiooo]

As kazoo said, the muzzleblast can destroy handguards. The other BIG consideration is heat transfer, that rifle handguard pictured is going to get HOT! I'll try to find the thread, but this was explored at length over at m4carbine.net and they had pics of alum handguards that had been cracked, split and separated by non-suppressed muzzle brakes under the handguards.

Thanks Wolfshoon. As I replied to Kazoo, the suppressor lives on that upper. It doesn't come off unless I'm borrowing it for a pistol. That upper will never (never say never, I know) normally be used without the suppressor. The adapter stays on the upper even when I use the suppressor on a pistol.

[To Bear Arms]

He did say the suppressor lives on it.
Spikes is another option.
https://www.spikestactical.com/products/parts-rails-bar2

[Grant H.]

I like SLR Rifleworks, but I don't see that they are big enough internally...

[To Bear Arms]

I like SLR Rifleworks, but I don't see that they are big enough internally...

I like SLR as well but like you said I think all of the rails are 1.3"ID. I know there are more manufactures out there that make some bigger ID rails.

[Irving]

Isn't there a picture in the WTF Were They Thinking?! thread of a guy that mounted a battery powered computer fan to his handguard to keep it cool?

[KevDen2005]

I know you have already said the suppressor lives on it. I really think the idea is cool and the pictures look cool. But for me I like knowing I have the option to run without one if I chose to do so.

[XC700116]

I have the Primary arms branded version of the Seekins one linked above, works good and is very stiff without any stability or deflection issues of having the hand guard touch the can.

[mattiooo]

I know you have already said the suppressor lives on it. I really think the idea is cool and the pictures look cool. But for me I like knowing I have the option to run without one if I chose to do so.

I have a few others I use for everything else.

[Wolfshoon]

I have a 300 blackout upper with an 8.5" bbl and a can. I'd like to replace the 7" handguard with a new one that goes over the can in a Honey Badger style.

Any other's I should check out? Or stay away from?

Outside diameter of my can is 1.375" and length is 7.6" - Gemtech GM-45

Since your diameter is only 1.375 an ALG rail will easily fit and is one of the best barrel nut systems around (Geisseile's wife's company). I have 3 of these rails. Lifted from my post at m4carbine.net:


12.5" BCMSS with an ALG EMR 12" tube and a silencerco saker trifecta mount. The mount sits about .210" deep into the tube so I had the tube clearanced with a .100" radial cut .315 "(5/16") deep. This gave me a 1.620" diameter opening to fit the 556 saker's 1.500" diameter MAAD mount in there. I have about .050-.060 clearance all around the saker and I still have an .080" thick wall on the EMR tube so I'm not worried about damaging it and heat transfer has not been an issue either. Granted I haven't done mag dumps through it but we've gotten it pretty hot with the 660 rounds through it so far. The only burn I got from it was the base of my thumb protruding through the rail top onto the gas block, got to make a plate to cover that hole!

https://algdefense.com/rails.html

http://vtsupply.com/alg-ergonomic-modular-rail-emr-v2-mlok-free-float-handguard-ar15-p-1819.html 1.46" inner diameter

[nogaroheli]

I have a Samson Evo on my 300BO with about 5" of my can being under the hand guard, it has an ID of 1.56 and would fit your can inside. My can also lives on that rifle and I haven't shot it without the suppressor.

[mattiooo]

Thanks for all of the suggestions. I really appreciate it.

Follow-up question - some of the suggestions have an ID of as small as 1.46" and as big as 1.8". Is it better to have more air around the suppressor or less?

[mattiooo]

I'm liking the look of that ALG and also the Midwest Industries SP series. Any feedback on MI handguards?

[nogaroheli]

Thanks for all of the suggestions. I really appreciate it.

Follow-up question - some of the suggestions have an ID of as small as 1.46" and as big as 1.8". Is it better to have more air around the suppressor or less?

More air around between the suppressor and the hand guard will reduce heat that is transferred to the hand guard and allow the suppressor to cool more. Both good things!

[Wolfshoon]

Thanks for all of the suggestions. I really appreciate it.

Follow-up question - some of the suggestions have an ID of as small as 1.46" and as big as 1.8". Is it better to have more air around the suppressor or less?

More is generally better, but for the bombproof Geisseile barrel mounting nut system I'd make sacrifices. How much of an overlap do you want (how long of a handguard) ? Shortest rail from ALG is 10" which would give you a 2.0" overlap if the suppressor direct threads or uses a mount on the barrel of 8.5". If it is 2.5-3" or longer overlap I'd start looking at a larger I.D. opening to delay heat transfer into the rail. Suppressors are generally hottest in the expansion chamber area closest to the muzzle exit. My saker is only under the handguard by 5/16" but I'm running a 12.5" barrel.

Bowers Tactical usually has a bunch of different rails in stock and only carries quality components, so that would be a good hands on shopping comparison.

[electronman1729]

I'd stay away. Heat transfer into hand guard plus in my opinion high chance of cross threading if you remove your suppressor.

[Wolfshoon]

I'd stay away. Heat transfer into hand guard plus in my opinion high chance of cross threading if you remove your suppressor.

That is another reason I'd go with the ALG, if for whatever reason the suppressor got stuck you could undo the screws that hold the handguard to the barrel nut and slide it out over the suppressor and have full access to the barrel and suppressor.

[To Bear Arms]

That is another reason I'd go with the ALG, if for whatever reason the suppressor got stuck you could undo the screws that hold the handguard to the barrel nut and slide it out over the suppressor and have full access to the barrel and suppressor.

I am pretty sure the majority of rails out mount in a similar fashion.

Odin Works is another rail that will clear you suppressor. I am not a fan of how the rail mounts to the nut. It has slotted screw holes and if you are not careful you can have the rail mounted somewhat crooked.
https://www.odinworks.com/M_LOK_Forends_p/f-12-ml.htm

[Shooter45]

I'm running the BAR2 rail from spikes on mine as another said already. While I have only shot it a few times with the suppressor off, I didn't notice any muzzle blast coming onto my hand because of the heat shield in place.

[mattiooo]

My upper is a 300 AAC upper, and that apparently doesn't heat up the same way a 5.56 upper would. At least according to the folks on 300 Blackout Talk. School me if this is wrong too. I'm not planning on doing mag dumps on it. I'm not that good or that rich.

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=95375

[Shooter45]

My upper is a 300 AAC upper, and that apparently doesn't heat up the same way a 5.56 upper would. At least according to the folks on 300 Blackout Talk. School me if this is wrong too. I'm not planning on doing mag dumps on it. I'm not that good or that rich.

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=95375

You are correct on that, the 300 AAC definitely runs cooler than the 556. I've noticed I get no target distortion in relation to the suppressor becoming hot. With a 300 AAC I don't have to use a wrap on the suppressor. Not to say it doesn't get hot from extended shooting, but it does not heat up like any other rifle caliber I've shot before.

[Eric P]

Just finished a 9mm build with the muffler 90% covered by a midwest industries hand guard. Need to take it to the range to see how hot it gets. It did have a kak extended can before the muffler was installed and the hand guard didn't get hot.

I did have to take the magpul angled for grip off and add washers to keep the screws from extending too far in and contacting the muffler.

[JohnnyEgo]

I'm going to go in the other direction and say you will be just fine. Do a couple mag dumps, and the handguard will get pretty hot. But just shooting, even at a fairly rapid clip in 2-gun or 3-gun, isn't going to melt your hand guard off. And it will have plenty of time to cool between stages. I ran a 7.5" beast in 2-gun back in Florida for many years. I wore gloves, because it did get hot. But it was also Florida, so everything was hot and people often wore gloves. That's not to say bad things can't or don't happen, but life is full of calculated risks, and this one wouldn't keep me up at night in the least.

https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/ars/morears3/sf6.jpg
https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/friends/me/fdcc065.JPG

For cans with a direct attach option, you can always sub out an extended flash hider for the can. I do it with my 5" barrelled 9mm all the time.
https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/ars/morears5/arrifles19.JPG
https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/ars/morears5/febguns33.JPG

[mattiooo]

Bowers Tactical usually has a bunch of different rails in stock and only carries quality components, so that would be a good hands on shopping comparison.

Went there today at lunch. First time there. Seems like nice guys. They tried to talk me out of doing it but were happy to sell me one if I insisted. They didn't have any in stock and would have to order one.

I hem and haw about simple decisions. It's really annoying. So now I'm back to square one.

I did stop at Ark yesterday and that was helpful. I got to look at some handguard lengths and decide where they would fall. Added the Strike Rail to the possible list. I thought 12" was what I was after, but I think 14" would be perfect, but nobody makes a 14" version. So I'm also leaning towards the Strike Rail because they have a 13.5".

Whatever you have, who doesn't want a couple more inches?

[Wolfshoon]

I'm going to go in the other direction and say you will be just fine. Do a couple mag dumps, and the handguard will get pretty hot. But just shooting, even at a fairly rapid clip in 2-gun or 3-gun, isn't going to melt your hand guard off. And it will have plenty of time to cool between stages. I ran a 7.5" beast in 2-gun back in Florida for many years. I wore gloves, because it did get hot. But it was also Florida, so everything was hot and people often wore gloves. That's not to say bad things can't or don't happen, but life is full of calculated risks, and this one wouldn't keep me up at night in the least.

https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/ars/morears3/sf6.jpg


Wow, is that actually a can or Noveske k3 flame pig? What is the barrel length and is it 5.56? That is one of the shortest rifle caliber AR's I've seen, very compact package there, nice job.

[Shooter45]

Here's the Spike's I'm running in 300 AAC and I don't notice any heat from the handguards or much if any from the suppressor itself.


73644

73645

73646

73647

73648

[Wolfshoon]

Oh neat, is that an actual Spikes Compressor? Has the wrapped gas tube on it. How many rounds have you run through it so far and what has reliability been?

[Shooter45]

So far it's been 100% but it came with the tax stamps in December. I'm going out again this weekend doing some load development on it.

[JohnnyEgo]

Wow, is that actually a can or Noveske k3 flame pig? What is the barrel length and is it 5.56? That is one of the shortest rifle caliber AR's I've seen, very compact package there, nice job.

It's odder then that. It is a 7.5" Noveske barrel profiled for the Ops M4S, back when John used to be willing to do that sort of thing. I heard over and over again how such a rifle would never work, or how I'd need a pigtail gas tube, etc... But it all went together perfectly and has run incredibly well for almost a decade now. It's loud though, suppressed or not.

https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/ars/morears2/shorty75.JPG

Same gun wearing an Ops 15:
https://www.johnnyego.com/firearms/ars/morears2/vtaca.jpg

[mattiooo]

Okay....I went with the ALG handguard in the end (probably would have done the Strike, but it was out of stock everywhere). Just picked it up and it looks fantastic. I've still got the old handguard in case I really hate the heat, so I can still go back if I need to.

Time to get to loading 300AAC subs now.

Pictures coming soon, but I'm happy.