12v photocell wiring

[Irving]

I'm trying to set-up my chicken coop with an automatic door. I'm using a power antenna from a Cadillac to open the door. I was going to use one of those garden led lights with a small solar panel to turn on and off the car antenna. I found this wiring diagram from a YouTube video that should have worked fine, BUT the garden light was old and crappy and broke on me. So now I've purchased a 12v photocell, but I can't wrap my head around the wiring.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/MR4QRFItYFO4St03P7Z1g0IrAOevkzH4V7k7hbvkh2MPxmhwDg 7eAw43suBzAUQFvbJHzhtBdVk8e-LofJI_NU3d87EThntEhwPLjWOIs5i_mWgNHRM2N52rd89YUHmg KYfiHa5QhIgXqma10dzkhW5EfrzbuVA6z8Wig7gId-T8ZHHOoiKVp9ajo53-BO7w2XzY9Pu1B_xwHYeDpUB9QprlMvaigwHHDNU1HhKONlncqt qrZq6ZjPNau6GDUb5jte4pfZQT_7VkyCYi1BOVQEGFoe64oHBs ktp5kmw0BzzWsP_JZyxPsP74ANPAuzDElM3j0kS4hR__emtvJp nRpZ28U5eDWguqJVyfmoae8r_mwaA-Ag62ciysD9h2u1xgu9FEdUptECw3XUThtawES-WTmO1m6B-TWeFK4vbyWRP-WBsvsZRx7BTrRX4PyaH056GGLRAHIyPLw-g2DbmhWpCxs_QAyLvAyotpHOtAJf-NpVeLotTHZVwl6UQsABJ3UUDSwQ8mL-M5bIJwfDMnmzFmVAV8rPHEqf_eb7TZGBWaqpSRfzI0q_IUfTOw bLjZ4ozkNtuUrOXxqU5YoaT-4y4c-Cf3BMh6putrT1EQA2UERQTMbJBExeA70Nf0tjsf_C7cip9zkUc KzeAoMbVMsn5W_xBno8zZRuZKZ4jKDr0ZyXphQOovP0yyDLtN1 h3-QY9_4SglVee7NunkNkAQVEhXiw=w837-h626-no

With my set-up, the battery and the solar panels are run through a solar charger, so I imagine those two figures can be put together. The 12v photo cell that I bought only has three wires, black, red, and white. The way the antenna works is that power is always run to the red wire and the black is the ground. When 12v go to the green wire (in addition to the red) then the antenna extends. The antenna extending (just like turning on the car radio) will extend the antenna and open the door. I've got the power source, the antenna, a relay, and the photocell. Can I properly wire this set-up to work with the components that I have? I've tried a couple ways without the relay and just managed to blow a couple of fuses. Please help me out. I've tried to figure this out on my own several times and I just don't have the experience or education to get there on my own. Let me know if there is any more information needed. Here is the photocell https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07JMYHJ9L/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o04__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

[SideShow Bob]

Post up a picture of the 12V photo cell wiring diagram and wire colors.I don’t want to tell you wrong by telling you a 120 VAC photo cell.

[SideShow Bob]

Just read your post, are you sure you have a 12 VDC photo cell ? It sounds like a 12 VAC photo cell.

If it is a 12 VAC photo cell, white wire is neutral, black wire is hot and red wire is the switched load.

[DFBrews]

You need a limit switch as well so it knows when the door is all the way open and closed

[Irving]

No problem.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/32cYnim8cSaUknClX_xEQ2r1q_jxi2jpZ8NbLo_V6BjIS2nz5k zfvOVMBDdWp6wNclsS4qxTGIcwG5hUNJq1mU5Yp_exSm3p2lAx Ws6k7ouU6T-qCFPBadcfBAUqo1YBPNhPNywWooj5OCAWkOQf9WLYlWN_wa29T X8juCzatx7hb8kbM_y0eBxsCyizTEeT1PzLHeitL-11eqkgfYG_Ey2rSqvSLb2b7phypS6CiWyDUcxLgIxvq1AGNe58 tZjr6MFbw5bXvgOvFl-MV_wQr_3M9-V5rdWZi2Veq9bLNjw7VuNDL7VGX7Z5pQ-MT75guSwcoiVIu6_aufqWB9UoX7WLVf_GZYGYntfcKh5Xav32X lyTi3IVTAfLe2KAcF4vOOuVNSVxb1aGTeEDodXUL6rZiXNafhU 6IwEkauiGY904t4dElnNkBxE_aEo6SczqpJ1Sc9lchdLI7QROm qbrbT1EFwOXw4IAH12MQeQ0EmrHfqGzwvAXonRzqg-Mwq5drE4rChpviiYxaOdCAlQ3BVwpaw0D_wTRjMXwlSdpTqcpn H2WZ0qtbhnhMjxeVLIfXzhWSBU-SJWE6aTa9nM6ASrS22A3v12STwnlzkLFMFCDhCJ8zSwlqduFgm h_RgrvF3AK-QW2TKYh2I9R-in1nGkEmSjAO6qMNcSanwdW0YGjf0E3X4FaelVmaaPCpp1DeLx 7nDj0JurbhYG6OZc=w1113-h626-no

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/0YYXzlRmZGg5vSJgsljm-67loMYgfTY70v7EDxnIQQJSqmnlw7y7tvwFRGdZHrqA7poi2BD 9gKm5EoZjRMWbprS5yjqzsKcuEXnbtuKc8TwZwoTJgqDd3iQ9J W_ZMGFwfOpzy9zsy9qAeOLUc4g8g1w_LMmqtsJAD2I1E8pp4Y_ mdvoC8L5bNRxVH2tEQogbGjD3468jsQaEJDWznxrnYqNsN8fTO-KMKpI3tdvq-JtxuMADYWthGpRLrJeZ1wlJuM5Gf1N5pfKhjipR07AVfx2fMv0 fBl_reEg6R7WnccYJi91x1Ei2pJf_VR__AkpeIQUt0r4k1z1Mt D-b_C9pX6DLLhgYFN4fMI21b9gLa9KDrTs12uI8ObScEwEOm5mNF h_NL21yaUAXJuxM9a2uFxAUY0BYfB8UiKTrGBP1Zj9kejMdfxf fUKPAEoI1STOnxsu6BFcke4g3a-4PpnsNXJDL6PVinbc77N3bME052xEO41Xnil_JgMH36eDzr_c_ tv3brA1jbeE4rQgpAjYAD685Rgz2svjynjL3hG8Nxuneia1IAK K5BR-BSrEUewgLl4wFAJJJmk2ugZ2ekcBzoxCesZvtOLgIoWjkMV7Wp ZRRmWPzLauYWtD3ISUB4v84WZX_LiUe0AQPVPi4T8IXVlvU2dz XQToqCBXgv7tiYFfdr6Z4c1H-t9OPoQtg_ZYWVIMjUf-gJNrlIVa2lh-SoLBeRg=w1113-h626-no
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/87ks1TUyNkr62h3tNB2o7Ct6jIsbFRdchJBv6-wscIRjpP_UiH2CYKnp0EyiFDQIQ-XPGEfhR0zrFu7RSElwbN7mkG1_cOx6OQ_btxNsM-9_vBxZC1meF6ct8IZZN0Xk5ApCK1gRoDJ2qJ2NN7P-JDX1W_xlVYn-RAxdeasVRbM2d1ibHRldMfx-hzkE6DcgoPTg9sYFWVYGs-j5_E_Q9GRnyf_vre71No7mag5fZ8DbL2oxNPA5AifTDyZWHVhT Wn1pgEDXUbMZw9f-WARvOGk6YqjxU7RAInpMKf03Xpy5fBBBGkFKlX2D3MkOqnW3vu v_b21a8CrHTNPQn2Xk-KdIzD-YMFsVZojFncdfQH5AUhQoKAsk0Nu2M7N2TIKPgvZarMspuB6Nm pPfTlfoyQ50r2gacLo7BGCfL6ZDpXY9kBfugvq1WG7DhKYJNyO AzeKBy6N2QP6yAnLmAvN4bvIJsxz55mjh3N1-Th11wYK3mi3YghpOhtClFRsRex0skWTKtE79zOsz9hx-__eKujFX_OSeBz7D9pYQsenEqZN8SK9K3r5sPTtaHbrL9SV1U4 GqKqdQV0WA5yO4a0BV8ZYuZF-2_cpA1I9sRdbuHF8KsIzjMibZu5yoAmcBBCCEhUmO45LONaso5 kgUPSWlpGbbTY9N8uCuZvnHH1LxxzSRF3AvHn--Q4ziBIWgZdy7NwWdfmMyt4I_N_OGiuU=w1113-h626-no

[Irving]

You need a limit switch as well so it knows when the door is all the way open and closed

Through my amazing engineering ability (luck) the antenna moves 30" which is the same amount of movement the rope that hoists the door moves with the current number of pulleys I have it running through.

[SideShow Bob]

White will be DC+, Red on your drawing
Black will be DC -, black on your drawing
Red will be DC+ switched, blue on your drawing

(The far left colors are the wires for your photo cell.)

[Irving]

Per the drawing, the wire that goes to 86 on the relay, is no longer present. Does that matter? How does the photocell tell the relay which direction to run the motor?

[DFBrews]

https://i.imgur.com/oV9kXie.jpg


Try this focus on battery side right now then solar charging

[Irving]

Thank you so far, by the way.

EDIT: I'll be trying again tomorrow in the daylight. I'll let everyone know.

[SideShow Bob]

When the green wire on your drawing is energized, the antenna goes up.
When the green wire is deenergized, the antenna goes down.
The red wire to the antenna in your drawing is constantly hot. That is why DFB mentioned limit switches.

[Irving]

When I just hook the antenna straight to the battery to test function, the antenna stops itself. I assume this to mean that it has it's own limit function. Will powering through a relay change this?

[SideShow Bob]

When I just hook the antenna straight to the battery to test function, the antenna stops itself. I assume this to mean that it has it's own limit function. Will powering through a relay change this?

No as long as the relay stays pulled in. as soon as the relay opens the green wire de-energizes the antenna will retract. But you are constantly pulling power from the battery in either extended or retracted position.

[DFBrews]

When I just hook the antenna straight to the battery to test function, the antenna stops itself. I assume this to mean that it has it's own limit function. Will powering through a relay change this?

Relays are used to allow a lower amp control circuit to switch a high amp load depending on what your motor pulls and what your Pv switch can handle amp wise you could potentially do without the relay. Also sensitivity of the switch may be an issue would
A dark cloud cause it to close?

[SideShow Bob]

Relays are used to allow a lower amp control circuit to switch a high amp load depending on what your motor pulls and what your Pv switch can handle amp wise you could potentially do without the relay. Also sensitivity of the switch may be an issue would
A dark cloud cause it to close?

Location of the photo cell in a brightly lit area with no shadows and pointed north will eliminate that, and not pointed at any light source at night will prevent false opening.

[ray1970]

Leave it to Irving to incorporate a photocell. I?d just stick it on a timer.

[SideShow Bob]

If I were Irving, I’d do the dad thing and make the kid go out and shut the coop door at night, then make the kid go out and open the coop door every morning.......

[ray1970]

You?re showing your age, Bob.

[DFBrews]

If I were Irving, I’d do the dad thing and make the kid go out and shut the coop door at night, then make the kid go out and open the coop door every morning.......

As a childless keeper of hens on my end it’s a no go with the delegating

[Irving]

It should be kid duty, since when she gets up for school, it's time to let them out. The problem with the timer is I'd have to source a 12v one, and adjust it several times a year. The reason I'm doing this is so we can go out of town and not rely on our neighbors to let them in and out every day. They have enough food and water for at least a week, and realistically two, but it's all under the coop so they have to be able to get out.

The photocell will be mounted more north than south, and on the opposite side of the coop as the back porch light. The garden light I was using wasn't sensitive enough that a cloud would cause it to come on. Even if that were the case, having the door shut for a few minutes for a cloud wouldn't be too big of a deal. Not as big of a deal as opening the door for a raccoon if a neighbor's porch light comes on anyway. Fortunately, the back fence is higher than the coop and would block the back neighbor's lights, AND They have crappy LED battery lights. The neighbor next to me with bright porch lights that go on when wildlife is around would be blocked by the coop, fence, and eave of the coop roof. I'm pretty excited to get this up and running though. I'll need to go from paracord to a slightly larger rope to make sure it doesn't slip out of the pulleys and bind up as it occasionally does. It never does it when I open the coop, and I tried to make it R-tard proof, but when wife, kids, or grandma open the door, something always seems to go wrong.

[Erni]

The relay will need to stay on for the antenna to be up as stated. You could conserve power by shutting off the antenna and then turning off the green wire relay. But I think you will need a microcontoller to get that done.

Have you thought about an Aduino?

https://www.instructables.com/id/Automatic-Chicken-Coop-Door-2/

[Irving]

Yes I thought about a an Aduino, but if I can't even figure out how to wire this, an Aduino seems beyond my skill set. I've got a couple of small panels that charge up an 18 amp hour deep cycle battery that is powering nothing at this time. Based on my experience with the near identical solar set-up in my van, this should have no problem running the door for probably a few days with no sun. Since it will require power during the day, the panels should be charging the battery the whole time anyway. Granted, right now I have some tiny free panels charging the battery, but at some point I'll increase the capacity of the system and go a little crazy.

[Irving]

Brews, where is the third wire on the photocell on your diagram?

Nevermind. Looks like you left off the ground and I'm supposed to be smart enough to figure that out. I'll give it a shot.

[SideShow Bob]

Brews, where is the third wire on the photocell on your diagram?

Nevermind. Looks like you left off the ground and I'm supposed to be smart enough to figure that out. I'll give it a shot.

You do realize that the photo cell that you have is controlling (switching ) the DC - on the diagram printed on it don’t you ?

You will have to adjust the wiring to the relay accordingly.

[Irving]

No, I don't understand what you mean. I had assumed that the white wire of the photocell is what turns on and off depending on the open and close of the photocell. I was going to wire it up just like Brews diagram.

[SideShow Bob]

If you look at the diagram on the photo cell, the DC+ is supplied to the lamp (load) base side. The the lamp (load) center pin is “switched” by the photo cell which would have to be DC-.

Just run one relay coil terminal (85) to DC+ and the other relay coil terminal (86) to the red load wire of the photo cell.

Then wire the black wire of the photo cell to DC-, and the white wire of the photo cell to DC+ .
This will allow you to actuate the relay from the photo cell, just be aware there may be a delay built into the photo cell, and you will need to wait the appropriate time while the photo cell is covered over.

[Irving]

Perfect, thanks. One day I'll probably buy your a beer, or give you a fresh egg.

[SideShow Bob]

I have a 12 VDC power supply I can give you if want it to do wiring tests and prototyping of DC projects so that you don’t have to hump your battery to and fro.

And when you are testing, use a low amp fuse on your battery, you don’t want to have a full current short.

[Irving]

I don't move anything around, I just stand on a barrel and stick my head in the trap door, really.

I am out of fuses. Right now it is fused between the panel and charge controller, and battery and charge controller. Once I get this set-up I'll go get another fuse.

[SideShow Bob]

I don't move anything around, I just stand on a barrel and stick my head in the trap door, really.

I am out of fuses. Right now it is fused between the panel and charge controller, and battery and charge controller. Once I get this set-up I'll go get another fuse.

What ? You don’t have a work shop or at least a work bench to lay out parts and do prototype projects ?
Playing around on your actual field equipment is a good way to end up with flaming chickens running around your back yard.....

[ChickNorris]

Buh GUCK!!

[SideShow Bob]

77198

[Irving]

Well, I tested the antenna just off my 18v Ryobi batteries in the garage. I definitely brought my fire extinguisher outside and the chickens are wandering around in the yard.

Anyway, I feel like I'm getting mixed messages between Brews diagram and what you are saying. So based off of your (SSB) last post, here is a new diagram I've drawn. Looks like I still need to know where to take the switch wire from the antenna and which port on the relay to run the DC -

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-DtquTcyztOXI_nf3UMpA-UYFKdklIotU80Z5UpX7MOBKyTmASIe9F63IKX1Dh1Mps8YTZ9h a5b1qC07_9j3SANcuQJ4jjct12CDT3a3_HWdcvYf2DXoLSvDhG VuRIsWVoi8n7OAGuHUUts89YzkH38l-ruLqmJZabdYvaFwD-ZdEQLlEqS5lXX9VLq3t6YGDdSE6MJuS83zcOHmUoG5TrQuZrCn vxVyXaKYvl7LbTki6haHlssj40dfmYnj2SUdNca_m2bBX_Am4b 1sDzCsFuVzQy2JNp1xJuUU4iu5C6owlSoMkNq5RXjEQHzsJMUX KevQl7UO_gD0kl3O6YwVlARKECp0jzHZOESApm19DaPcLAgXWX NjteJ14KKKdCndd9gjUHvGLvg_XpMXzvP46SerL3Ex1X7CdVV_ Apa3FK1ArYHOpvoskWfQDknwe0AhAl7Mz3evXIbRqmA2n-zOVCRqwJ3yykJ4B-aACEmb01vZhuI7N_EBcONBodZPN_Wz_0y5MH6CgPVjAMbPwHzh pjZT0iPfBzkYkDA8aAP2kRKfY5Fboi2UTsOqrCaypZgd0iNXjA BOeiwEyICGUzZ7oki_tmTq5lRivPVXG4_YscpQ7Dw4E38OU0Oe mMAgbW7OzK7kguUQya0LbciUU647dJszss5hGZD_O-I_mdOJTr4ipelDBBItH8cOu7AlvGFfxGcA8kaMEftY2PeQjvg= w1026-h577-no

[SideShow Bob]

Try this to see (hear) the relay switch (click) when the photo cell is covered.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190202/f6e5096bef36c01aac7b36b437efc8fe.jpg

[SideShow Bob]

If the relay works when the photo cell is covered, then wire in the antenna.
Then test the antenna operation.

You really need a work space to prototype your mad scientist inventions.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190202/7f84bc9711ada46c210964a589c7cc89.jpg

[Irving]

Then add those two diagrams together once everything tests correctly?

[SideShow Bob]

Yes sir. I just split it up for simplicity.

[Irving]

I'm going to go run those tests, then I'll need help completing the combined diagram on the bottom. For anyone else interested in this project, once I have this working, I'm going to delete every other diagram in this thread.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/aU5_m6HtiwaH1SgSPTxcngLCvhsb0q-daxVLSRGJQWfdFGY6opZ5KFHg_TF3TyzR0ErsAzcETNO7p5yhf QUb2988UDjrD9vpFupor2gkS7jZG6jVn2_MncfnCjyl0uo4pBB PzmuxeZXEw9z9g1FURXoP80OX0uA-Qyqy9TWm0ClZ9dGLR5B-eeY63iS0ws_Vf0cHofx-cfMWwrdyIL3UhgOEmN0F_CnAXP8buDOQP2zHIAPGJap4sA5985 BKs-Ybt02ZeKK-91lGW5g29NzWQocLlAPteqVWNe8d8CDcORPYO6BL1kUzUfVEO9 ITtsR1Q5oQHxyBQkkMJyZcBdUSr2CrqXN9u2_kIRxlEhmWMuzU dDEGHhXPnCmKIkkO9ju5edKM-98Ze6s5-aLSkQ3X37_1q9WNEDEdRDUcPEknfrGxdThde4vKfLpn3efWAbP 20S4cFZYQbdn74cEAGjFp2xrPgLsV0CPMf2YVR8TJYWrYwg7uM wxkD4n_ljZvW1CUBK1yDhwfD_p_Yx2osc80As5GBVoC6l58_Ux yMbpREZPlsAqR10Ld8sO2Dvkq6uCciOrmas9iAUw8NW8ycqNWv HReJpforK8qTwdADU0tt8himw0LzF0PuShQBthUyU1Azecza1v S8QyaiFGtsxQ0npWC-gG57WhKwhgjzQHBfnA_jMlTQMBPMEgof92SCYvshTm5n4V9dbI 9kJvwbt4AAGvXUg=w1026-h577-no

[SideShow Bob]

Correction: the antenna circuit will not operate until the photo cell circuit is operating first. It takes the relay closing to supply current through the contacts to the antenna control wire.

[Irving]

Okay, that sounds right because I can get the relay to open and close (but only once), but I can't get the antenna to do anything. So how about that combined, final wiring diagram?

[Irving]

What I'm confused about is if I combine the diagrams, I've got the DC (+) running to both the 87 and the 85 on the relay. Is that correct?

[SideShow Bob]

For the full app, please enter your CC number and security code for a one time charge of $299.99..........


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190202/24aca47db67923700dd8cf6e3c4e73a4.jpg

[SideShow Bob]

For you and only you Irving, you can pay this charge off in fresh eggs...

[Irving]

I can save up a dozen for you. That's doce in espanol.

[SideShow Bob]

I can save up a dozen for you. That's doce in espanol.

I’m joking about the eggs,.

Is the antenna coop door opener working ?

Or did you let the smoke out of one of the components ?

[Irving]

When I hook everything up per the latest diagram, then power on the system. The antenna opens all the way, stays open for five seconds, then closes all the way. This is what it seemed to be doing with just the PV connected to test. No amount of flashlight or thumb covering of sensor seems to change anything.

[Irving]

Okay, so with a photocell, I think that it is default set-up to be "off" during daylight, and "on" at night. Do we have it wired backward?

[SideShow Bob]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20190202/148de044b3e4b7c0b186ea6ae5a2c2c8.jpg


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[SideShow Bob]

Move the wire from terminal 87 on the relay to terminal 87A on the relay.

Now, after powering up the circuit and components, the antenna should extend and stay extended until the photo cell is covered up, then it should retract.... Sorry.

That’s what I get for trying to use my brain for so and so hard after being unused for 4 plus months.

[Irving]

When I do that the antenna opens when I power up the system, but then the only way I can get it to close is if I disconnect the antenna switch from 30 on the relay. We're almost there. I have to wrap it up today and go attend an event. I'll pick up tomorrow. To be fair, I never did get the PV test to work when it was just that and the relay. I'll have to mess around with that. At one point my alligator clip touched something it wasn't supposed to, so I'll have to check the relay for continuity tomorrow. If it's broke, I've got four more.

[SideShow Bob]

You probably blew out the photo cell. The relay is just basically just an electromagnet that pulls a switch to make contact between terminal 30 & terminal 87 when energized and terminal 30 & terminal 87A when de-energized. Unless t you fried the contact points with a full current dead short from your battery.

[Irving]

Can I test the photo cell with a multimeter?

[SideShow Bob]

You can test it using a small automotive lamp or flashlight lamp by hooking it up per the diagram on its side and a lesser amperage power source like your drill battery.
When hooked up the lamp will be off after all the circuitry powers up internally, then turn on when you cover the photo cell after a short delay unless it is an instant on circuit.

Being a solid state circuit, I couldn?t tell you what you should read on resistance meter in biased or reverse biased states.

Edit:
I did a little research on your photoelectric switch, it is rated for 3.5 amps, and a momentary short could have burned it up. So defiantly be cautious what you try to control with it. Controlling the relay is fine, but don’t try to control the antenna drive motor directly.

[SideShow Bob]

Any success or at least some progress on this ?

[Irving]

I just ordered a new photo cell and Amazon says Feb8-14th.

I blew a couple fuses trying to set everything up before I consulted you guys and before using the relay. I assume that I easily could have blown it out. Stand by for delivery of new one.

[SideShow Bob]

I just ordered a new photo cell and Amazon says Feb8-14th.

I blew a couple fuses trying to set everything up before I consulted you guys and before using the relay. I assume that I easily could have blown it out. Stand by for delivery of new one.

Hey Irving,
Didja ever finish getting this project up ?

[Irving]

It doesn't work with current schematics and new photocell. I've been sick lately and weather has been crap. I'll have to hook each photocell up to a light and a battery to see if they even work before I ask more questions.