Advice on Buying Land

[glocktoberfest]

I've been looking at land listings a while and am contemplating buying something up in the mountains. Can the experienced outdoorsman/landowners offer me some advice? What i want is tricky since some things conflict with each other, but here's my ideal list.

1. max 2-3 hrs from Denver
2. Backs to BLM so i can hike/atv right into nowhere
3. Near ski slopes so i can sleep there instead of a hotel during ski season [FORGET THIS ONE. IT DOESNT APPEAR COMPATIBLE WITH REST OF REQUIREMENTS]
4. max of 100k for a reasonable size piece of land (5 acres min)
5. Accessible to an RV. Maybe even water/electric to the property line

Is this list impossible? I'd really appreciate hearing from anybody who's gone down this road before. I see some listings that may work, but appear impassible towing an RV. I also see listings that are way over 100k.

Thanks in advance for your advice.

[Great-Kazoo]

I've been looking at land listings a while and am contemplating buying something up in the mountains. Can the experienced outdoorsman/landowners offer me some advice? What i want is tricky since some things conflict with each other, but here's my ideal list.

1. max 2-3 hrs from Denver
2. Backs to BLM so i can hike/atv right into nowhere
3. Near ski slopes so i can sleep there instead of a hotel during ski season
4. max of 100k for a reasonable size piece of land (5 acres min)
5. Accessible to an RV. Maybe even water/electric to the property line

Is this list impossible? I'd really appreciate hearing from anybody who's gone down this road before. I see some listings that may work, but appear impassible towing an RV. I also see listings that are way over 100k.

Thanks in advance for your advice.


Yes for everything listed. We had a similar list back in 85. Found property for (at the time) $5k (10 ac)
BUT....
While listed as 30 minutes from Morrison. It was another hour of switchbacks on dirt. That one would be stuck in, or prevented from accessing, during snow or heavy rains.

If you're near power, so are a few hundred to a thousand other people.

The only people near ski slopes are the ones who work there, unable to find a place to split housing cost . OR Squatters.


IMO 2-3 hrs from Denver is Idaho Springs, during rush hour and constantly getting worse


IF one were to find a place as you describe. You need to see the county records for what's platted there the next 5-25 years.
Will it stay rural, or does some developer have sections of land purchased for development ?

IF improvements come to the area. How much will taxes go up, or you be responsible for paying in to the road improvement , septic/sewer and water?

Honestly you want a lot of those, look out of state. NM, western Wy N. Az still have places you can buy land to drop an RV and be away from people in 30 min or less.

[Delfuego]

Depends on how you ski and what you want to ski too. If your just sliding, look near Ski Granby Ranch (Silverlight). It's also close to Winter Park. If you are a hammerhead you might need to be further away and near a big mountain (Crested Butte/Telluride/Silverton). Either way, property near Denver and local ski resorts is big bucks.

[glocktoberfest]

OK forget near ski slopes. what i'm really envisioning is something i can park an RV on and ride an ATV into BLM land from for hiking/hunting/camping. Thanks for the suggestions so far. If you can suggest some areas you'd recommend or even a realtor you have used that knows where to buy land up there, that'd be great too.

[Delfuego]

Wyoming :)

[Lurch]

Look up around Terryall Reservoir or down by Cripple Creek. There is a area on CR 1 in Teller County that has lots with water and power at property lines. Some back to National forest or BLM. Also taxes in Teller county are low because of the gaming revenue. Another thing when looking is dirt work is cheap so making a drive and a level spot is pretty simple. PM if you want and I can give you more details on the area. We spent 4 years looking in that area to find our place.

[BushMasterBoy]

Look up around Terryall Reservoir or down by Cripple Creek. There is a area on CR 1 in Teller County that has lots with water and power at property lines. Some back to National forest or BLM. Also taxes in Teller county are low because of the gaming revenue. Another thing when looking is dirt work is cheap so making a drive and a level spot is pretty simple. PM if you want and I can give you more details on the area. We spent 4 years looking in that area to find our place.

This!

[glocktoberfest]

ok thanks again for all this info. That Cripple Creek area wasn't even on my radar, so i'll be PM'ing you Lurch.

[GeorgeandSugar]

If you are looking to stay in CO, you can look at South Park. Jefferson Real Estate in Jefferson, CO. Land prices still reasonable.

There are several areas to pick from that meet your needs. Land and subdivision areas off Hwy 77 all the way to Lake George. Guffey is another area. I'd look off of Hwy 77 to start. Paved road. Flat properties suitable for a RV.

They have several area maps they will give you.

We live in Elkhorn Ranches (south on Elkhorn Rd to Remington). From our home, 5 miles to USFS/BLM land where you can ATV and shoot.

Property taxes on raw land would be $300-800 depending on lot size. If you plan on building get at least 2.5 acres preferably 5ac to meet all setbacks on well and leach field. You'll need 200 foot separation between leach field and well on your property and adjoining neighbor properties already developed.

Ask about HOA's. Hwy 285 can and does get busy and especially on holiday weekends in summer.

Eventually, we'll be heading to AZ.


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[Great-Kazoo]

If you are looking to stay in CO, you can look at South Park. Jefferson Real Estate in Jefferson, CO. Land prices still reasonable.

There are several areas to pick from that meet your needs. Land and subdivision areas off Hwy 77 all the way to Lake George. Guffey is another area. I'd look off of Hwy 77 to start. Paved road. Flat properties suitable for a RV.

They have several area maps they will give you.

We live in Elkhorn Ranches (south on Elkhorn Rd to Remington). From our home, 5 miles to USFS/BLM land where you can ATV and shoot.

Property taxes on raw land would be $300-800 depending on lot size. If you plan on building get at least 2.5 acres preferably 5ac to meet all setbacks on well and leach field. You'll need 200 foot separation between leach field and well on your property and adjoining neighbor properties already developed.

Ask about HOA's. Hwy 285 can and does get busy and especially on holiday weekends in summer.

Eventually, we'll be heading to AZ.


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Good Move.

[Hummer]

The farther your getaway place is from your home the less often you will go there. I suggest 2 hours max. If you plan on building, land cost is a tiny fraction of planning, development and construction. Remote properties can double construction costs. If the land you're looking at is not part of a subdivision development you should verify with the county whether you will have enough acreage to build. That will affect your use and future marketability.

When you have an area in mind look up nearby land/lot listings on Zillow for a quick idea of land costs and availability. Also check out the online county treasurer records of land/lot sales over the past year or two to know what different types of properties actually sell for. I'm looking to buy land near our cabin and we're sorting through 320 land sales records from the past two years. Once I remove all the outliers we can build a spreadsheet of comparables to determine a reasonable cost for what we're looking at.

[BladesNBarrels]

If you want to shoot on your own land, look for 10+ acres and check the county restrictions.
A lot of counties in Colorado are at the 10 acre requirement.
Most counties tax undeveloped land higher than places with a residence. The savvy buyers look for land with an old house or structure.
Good hunting - that is half the adventure!

[DDT951]

OK forget near ski slopes. what i'm really envisioning is something i can park an RV on and ride an ATV into BLM land from for hiking/hunting/camping. Thanks for the suggestions so far. If you can suggest some areas you'd recommend or even a realtor you have used that knows where to buy land up there, that'd be great too.


Look at county zoning and land use laws.

Many of the mountain counties dont allow more than 30 days per camping and you can't store your RV on the land. Many also dont allow cabins without full certificates of occupancy to be built. That means well/water/sewer/septic/power/etc all have to be addressed.

[Jim B]

Have you checked Texas Creek/Cotopaxi?

[MED]

I've been looking at land listings a while and am contemplating buying something up in the mountains. Can the experienced outdoorsman/landowners offer me some advice? What i want is tricky since some things conflict with each other, but here's my ideal list.

1. max 2-3 hrs from Denver
2. Backs to BLM so i can hike/atv right into nowhere
3. Near ski slopes so i can sleep there instead of a hotel during ski season [FORGET THIS ONE. IT DOESNT APPEAR COMPATIBLE WITH REST OF REQUIREMENTS]
4. max of 100k for a reasonable size piece of land (5 acres min)
5. Accessible to an RV. Maybe even water/electric to the property line

Is this list impossible? I'd really appreciate hearing from anybody who's gone down this road before. I see some listings that may work, but appear impassible towing an RV. I also see listings that are way over 100k.

Thanks in advance for your advice.

If you go Jefferson, Fairplay, Como, Alma; you can drive Hoosier pass to Breckenridge when it is open. However, you may run into closures over Kensosha pass on occasion going back to Denver. Land down by Hartzel is cheap...Park County is pretty nice on the west side of Kensosha pass. However, they did put in some new ordinances regarding how long an RV can be parked without moving. I drive down to the Chaffee County range all the time; it's two hours from my house...that's the maximum limit based on your requirements. It is really nice down there.

[Jim B]

Most counties tax undeveloped land higher than places with a residence. The savvy buyers look for land with an old house or structure.
Didn't know that; thanks for the info! [Awesom]

[.455_Hunter]

If you want to shoot on your own land, look for 10+ acres and check the county restrictions. A lot of counties in Colorado are at the 10 acre requirement.


That went away with the 2003 state carry law pre-emption clause. Unincorporated county residents can shoot on their property as long as projectiles don't leave the property, regardless of county ordinance.

I have been through this with Jeffereon and Boulder County and it's not a joke, just not well publicized.

[BladesNBarrels]

That went away with the 2003 state carry law pre-emption clause. Unincorporated county residents can shoot on their property as long as projectiles don't leave the property, regardless of county ordinance.

I have been through this with Jeffereon and Boulder County and it's not a joke, just not well publicized.

Great! Do you have a citation that I can quote?
When I was looking at land in Park, Custer, and Fremont counties, I talked with the sheriff's offices and they were the source of the 10+ acre information.
I also asked about shooting Class 3 and they all said to give them a courtesy call before I started shooting. That was so they could give educated responses to anyone who called in.
They all stated that projectiles could not leave the property.
I did buy the land prior to 2003.

[Mtneer]

If you're planning on building, also consider the threat of wildfire. You can mitigate your own property but not BLM or Forest land, or neighbor's property, which could increase your risk. This is looking to be a good year due to snowpack but dry years are inevitable.

[glocktoberfest]

well, i wish i was a wealthy man, but the reality is i will probably never be able to afford to build on this land, so just having a place to park an RV and head into more remote areas or camp would probably be it. I'll be checking out all your suggestions. Thanks

[Bailey Guns]

I lived in Park Co for 25 years and was a Reserve Deputy there for almost 4 years. I was a JeffCo deputy for almost 10 years. There has NEVER been any sort of minimum lot size for shooting on your own property in Park or JeffCo since I've lived/worked there at least. .455's info is correct...at least for Jefferson and Park counties. Don't know about Boulder.

There may be HOA restrictions re: shooting on your property. But that's a civil issue between you and the HOA, not a criminal issue.

As far as I can remember there isn't a statute that specifically says it's legal to shoot on your own property. There are only those that state what is illegal...such as being under the influence, shooting recklessly, etc...

[bkincaid]

If you are considering Teller County, beware, might want to make sure your planned uses coincide with what the County has recently adopted regarding some new camping rules: http://www.mountainjackpot.com/2019/02/18/tellers-new-camping-rules-may-clash-with-pro-homeless-relief-plan/
http://www.mountainjackpot.com/2018/12/19/new-camping-rules-approved-by-commissioners/

[BladesNBarrels]

Jefferson County seems to have clarified their position in 2017:

"Sheriff?s spokesman Mark Techmeyer said questions about the legality of discharging firearms on private property have been raised frequently in the mountain area, including after the most recent incident.
Crime prevention Deputy Janie Gonda clarified that the reasonable precautions include:
? The property must have a proper backdrop ? specifically, something that projectiles cannot go through, over or under.
? The firearm must always be pointed in a safe direction.
? No people can be in the line of fire.
? No property, other than specific targets, can be in the line of fire.
? A person cannot be intoxicated by drugs or alcohol while shooting.
? Shooting must occur during reasonable hours, so as not to disturb the peace or violate noise ordinances.
In addition, there is no rule governing how large or small a property must be in order to shoot on it, Gonda stated.
In regard to hunting, Gonda said that if a resident is hunting on his own property and is following all the hunting, licensing and safety laws, it is legal to do so.
While there are areas in Jeffco where the discharge of firearms is prohibited ? sometimes referred to as ?no-shoot zones? ? Gonda said these do not apply to private property.
According to Russell Clark, planning supervisor for Jeffco Planning & Zoning, the county commissioners can restrict where firearms can be discharged. However, ?those restrictions do not do what a lot of people think they do by the title of them,? he said.
?You can put up a (private) shooting range on your own property and shoot in it as long as it does not leave your shooting range,? Clark said.
There are restrictions, he clarified, as to ?where people would be able to shoot at a public or for-profit shooting gallery.?
?(The restrictions) are more structures-focused rather than action- or behavior-focused,? he said."

[DFBrews]

Do research wherever you decide obviously a prime example is all the 5-10 acre lots for sale in costilla county in the 3-12k range. It’s scrub brush with crap alkaline soil harsh winters high winds and no potential for electric. water is cistern or 1000 foot wells some sub divisions near crestone are cistern only The whole area used to be old ranchs that was bought up and sub divided farmers are being paid to leave fields barren these days because the aquifers are so valuable

[fitz19d]

Might make my own post later, but to tag in. A brief search on like redfin was depressing.
We Work/will work off mulberry/prospect and I25.

Wanted to get like 1-10 acres and do a simple ranch home or fancy prefab. Seems like everything surrounding ft collins for quite a distance is all 100 acre lots. Many remote enough im assuming I'd have to be doing septic/nat gas power and who knows for water?

Hate seeing so many little properties I would buy but never spot any for sale. Seems like all live in it till they die flies then pass to family.

Trying to look at homes yields nothing much in between Trailer parks and full family homes 4+bed like we have now and want to downsize from and take some equity with us.

Pretty much was going to Eaton or east of piece to find anything reasonable and that's actually farther commute time wise than frederick and wise weather.

[BushMasterBoy]

Have you checked Texas Creek/Cotopaxi?

A lot of crime there. Some places, mostly along US50, there is no cell service. Great place to fish.

[Ah Pook]

Water and mineral rights.

[.455_Hunter]

Jefferson County seems to have clarified their position in 2017:

"Sheriff?s spokesman Mark Techmeyer said questions about the legality of discharging firearms on private property have been raised frequently in the mountain area, including after the most recent incident.
Crime prevention Deputy Janie Gonda clarified that the reasonable precautions include:
? The property must have a proper backdrop ? specifically, something that projectiles cannot go through, over or under.
? The firearm must always be pointed in a safe direction.
? No people can be in the line of fire.
? No property, other than specific targets, can be in the line of fire.
? A person cannot be intoxicated by drugs or alcohol while shooting.
? Shooting must occur during reasonable hours, so as not to disturb the peace or violate noise ordinances.
In addition, there is no rule governing how large or small a property must be in order to shoot on it, Gonda stated.
In regard to hunting, Gonda said that if a resident is hunting on his own property and is following all the hunting, licensing and safety laws, it is legal to do so.
While there are areas in Jeffco where the discharge of firearms is prohibited ? sometimes referred to as ?no-shoot zones? ? Gonda said these do not apply to private property.
According to Russell Clark, planning supervisor for Jeffco Planning & Zoning, the county commissioners can restrict where firearms can be discharged. However, ?those restrictions do not do what a lot of people think they do by the title of them,? he said.
?You can put up a (private) shooting range on your own property and shoot in it as long as it does not leave your shooting range,? Clark said.
There are restrictions, he clarified, as to ?where people would be able to shoot at a public or for-profit shooting gallery.?
?(The restrictions) are more structures-focused rather than action- or behavior-focused,? he said."

Good stuff. This is exactly what was determined when the issue was pushed about 10 years ago.

[Great-Kazoo]

Water and mineral rights.

I doubt for his price range they are included. If so he'd be smart to buy it on the spot.

[Ah Pook]

I doubt for his price range they are included. If so he'd be smart to buy it on the spot.
Minerals, not so much. Water? If you can't sink a well...

[Great-Kazoo]

Minerals, not so much. Water? If you can't sink a well...

Water rights, as in shares of water. But yes for purposes of a potable water supply. I'd also check to see what average well depth is. a deal for 10 ac of land, may cost 4-5x as much for the well.

[Jim B]

A lot of crime there.
Illegal gardening?

[OtterbatHellcat]

Water rights, as in shares of water. But yes for purposes of a potable water supply. I'd also check to see what average well depth is. a deal for 10 ac of land, may cost 4-5x as much for the well.

Yeah, that's a big deal if you're out and away from the masses. Drill and bust?...you still eat the cost. Drill again, and so on. I think drill fails still cost in the neighborhood of up to 5K each attempt.

I might be corrected on that.

[dorsum]

Wyoming :)

I would love to buy some land in the middle of nowhere Wyoming.

[BushMasterBoy]

Illegal gardening?

https://www.chieftain.com/4a3b2e27-1041-53fb-ab54-ace0d8880d15.html

[Great-Kazoo]

I would love to buy some land in the middle of nowhere Wyoming.

Unfortunately the middle of nowhere Wyo is owned by either O&G interest, private ownership or BLM.

[Grant H.]

Unfortunately the middle of nowhere Wyo is owned by either O&G interest, private ownership or BLM.

Lots of rail road owned land there too...

[def90]

Most of the “camping” laws are based on continuous days in a row of use. If you plop your camper down they dont want you there more than 14 days without moving. If you put a camper pad on your property and come up for 2 or 3 days on the weekend once or twice a month and the RV comes and goes with you no one is going to complain.. well, unless that lot is in the middle of a subdivision or something. These laws are so that people dont build or inhabit non conforming structures as a permanent place of residence as well as to discourage squatters from filling up the woods.

[BladesNBarrels]

Unfortunately the middle of nowhere Wyo is owned by either O&G interest, private ownership or BLM.

Ted Turner got it all for bison ranching.

[glocktoberfest]

What do you guys think about this?
https://www.landwatch.com/Lake-County-Colorado-Land-for-sale/pid/332205942

[Firehaus]

What do you guys think about this?
https://www.landwatch.com/Lake-County-Colorado-Land-for-sale/pid/332205942

11,500 ft.

How well do you do at treeline and how many months of the year do you want to use it?


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[glocktoberfest]

11,500 ft.

do you mean altitude sickness? i'd probably use it 3 seasons

How well do you do at treeline and how many months of the year do you want to use it?


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[Lurch]

I would find out if the road in is maintained, if not you may only get 5 months of use. If you plan on building I would be worried about water. The ad says electricity available but how close. I have heard that getting power to land can cost as much as $10,000 per pole.

[Irving]

Just getting around at timber line in general tends to make you out of breath.

[.455_Hunter]

What do you guys think about this?
https://www.landwatch.com/Lake-County-Colorado-Land-for-sale/pid/332205942

Interesting. Off the west side of Weston Pass. Looks like pretty steep terrain. Way to close to the "beaten path" for me. I would expect a 100% trespassing rate on summer and fall weekends with hikers, bikes, ATVs and other "explorers". Heck, I think I have even driven up the access road there before myself.

[roberth]

I would find out if the road in is maintained, if not you may only get 5 months of use. If you plan on building I would be worried about water. The ad says electricity available but how close. I have heard that getting power to land can cost as much as $10,000 per pole.

Is the property on a south facing slope or north facing, south will dry out sooner.

ETA I looked at the pix again, it is on the south side of the hill.


Just getting around at timber line in general tends to make you out of breath.

I suppose that would depend on a persons physical conditioning. Most people do very poorly with even a small amount of exertion at this altitude.


Interesting. Off the west side of Weston Pass. Looks like pretty steep terrain. Way to close to the "beaten path" for me. I would expect a 100% trespassing rate on summer and fall weekends with hikers, bikes, ATVs and other "explorers". Heck, I think I have even driven up the access road there before myself.

Terrific views, ask for pixs of the property instead of the views and get some winter pix.

Weston Pass is busy, there is a little community at the base too, maybe people will stay on the road and not trespass.

[CS1983]

Well that would certainly put one close enough to Ski Cooper...

[glocktoberfest]

the catch 22 seems to be if it's too remote, and i store anything there, nobody's around to notice. If it's close to population, there's more traffic and more eyes on what i would leave there. Not sure how other people handle this. I guess the easy answer is, don't leave anything valuable there.

[davsel]

the catch 22 seems to be if it's too remote, and i store anything there, nobody's around to notice. If it's close to population, there's more traffic and more eyes on what i would leave there. Not sure how other people handle this. I guess the easy answer is, don't leave anything valuable there.

Locked shipping container and trail cams.

[Great-Kazoo]

the catch 22 seems to be if it's too remote, and i store anything there, nobody's around to notice. If it's close to population, there's more traffic and more eyes on what i would leave there. Not sure how other people handle this. I guess the easy answer is, don't leave anything valuable there.

Pack it in, pack it out. OR rethink where you want to buy land. Alo consider IF there were a medical emergency. How does one get to hospital? Would local fire rescue handle it . Or will flight for life be needed.


Locked shipping container and trail cams.

Most, if not all LE's would consider theft of property a very low priority.

[Frac]

It may or may not be a consideration for you since you don?t plan to build, but 35 acres brings you some extra freedom for a well. In some areas (South Park included) you will have to purchase augmentation to offset the water you use from your well on less than 35 acres. This has me hesitating, because I can envision a future where the very cost of augmented water means I couldn?t afford to keep my property. The cost isn?t prohibitive now, but I want freedom with my land.


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[glocktoberfest]

i'm glad i asked for advice from everybody. Water augmentation? i didn't even know that was a thing.

[Frac]

Yea, that was news to me too. To put it in rough terms, it sounds like you pay someone else to release their water into a creek to offset what you pump out of the ground. I understand the idea is to protect the more senior water rights to those downstream/down mountain.


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[Mtneer]

It may or may not be a consideration for you since you don?t plan to build, but 35 acres brings you some extra freedom for a well. In some areas (South Park included) you will have to purchase augmentation to offset the water you use from your well on less than 35 acres. This has me hesitating, because I can envision a future where the very cost of augmented water means I couldn?t afford to keep my property. The cost isn?t prohibitive now, but I want freedom with my land.

It's a state law. If you have less than 35 acres, well water can only be used inside the house; no outside faucets allowed. Any water for gardening, car washing, etc is supposed to be hauled in. http://www.watercolorado.com/resources/articles/article4.shtml

[.455_Hunter]

It's a state law. If you have less than 35 acres, well water can only be used inside the house; no outside faucets allowed. Any water for gardening, car washing, etc is supposed to be hauled in. http://www.watercolorado.com/resources/articles/article4.shtml

And percentage compliance with that requirement is zero. Where do people come up with this crap?

[Hummer]

And percentage compliance with that requirement is zero. Where do people come up with this crap?

It's coming, along with tighter regulation, fees and taxes. The water districts around CO are taking names and numbers. The pressures of population are coming down on us. Eventually we'll have to decide whether we want grow food or more people.

A water source is a very valuable thing to have on a property for habitat, growing things and survival. We're lucky to have senior water rights to a canal meandering through our farm, and a natural underground spring that feeds our mountain home adjacent to a river. If in a SHTF or TEOTWAWKI event we'd still have running water in our house without power. I'd be very hesitant to buy any property that doesn't have a reliable natural water source.

[.455_Hunter]

A water source is a very valuable thing to have on a property for habitat, growing things and survival. We're lucky to have senior water rights to a canal meandering through our farm, and a natural underground spring that feeds our mountain home adjacent to a river. If in a SHTF or TEOTWAWKI event we'd still have running water in our house without power. I'd be very hesitant to buy any property that doesn't have a reliable natural water source.

We source most of our water from the well, but there is a artesian spring close-by on a neighbors property. Better than nothing, I guess.

[Hummer]

We source most of our water from the well, but there is a artesian spring close-by on a neighbors property. Better than nothing, I guess.

Yep, take them a fruit cake every Christmas. Consider installing a hand pump on the well pipe.

[Hummer]

Fwiw, both Ward and Allenspark have potable running water available to the public, but Ward's is natural flowing, clean and untreated. Allenspark pumps and treats the Crystal Spring water. I don't know about any open sources south around Ned and beyond.