View Full Version : Just go the fuck away
Started a stone job that Im on for the second day. Finding out the homeowner wants to stand behind me and watch over my shoulder. Driving me fucking nuts. I lay one stone and he runs around the scaffolding to take a look.
Then its right back to hawking over my shoulder.
Hes been through two general contractors and I assumed it was them being shitty contractors...............
That's always annoying. I'm always interested in learning what trades people are doing, but really do my best to not hang out while they are doing it. In his case it's like, "If you think you can do better, then do it yourself." Hope you don't lose too much time or money on this.
Bummer.
My dad has two rates. One for getting the job done. The other for when the customer wants to watch and help.
Delfuego
05-29-2019, 10:26
I used to help a buddy do demo for kitchens and bath. When the home owners started to hover, one of us would climb under a cabinet and just start to hammer randomly as loud as possible. That would usually get them to leave :)
" no no no no no no no! That is not how you do it. YouTube does it differently!"
Strict "No customers in the shop while work is being performed" policy here. As soon as they walk in uninvited, ALL work ceases. Customers that try to work on their own stuff in my shop are invited to leave so we can continue to work. Those that can't take the hint are bluntly told to get out.
My wife does that to me . . . makes me crazy. She likes to watch me work on things . . . but, especially if it's something new to me, I can't stand having those extra eyes on me when I am trying to learn or figure something out. And when I get frustrated, it just makes me more frustrated that she's sitting/standing there watching me being frustrated.
Zundfolge
05-29-2019, 12:48
I'm reminded of those labor rate signs you see in some auto shops.
http://www.pmslweb.com/the-blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/19-funny-labor-rates-sign.jpeg
I check on work but don't hover.
I have so many stories of work gone wrong.
Had a drywall guy that talked my ear off. Wouldn't let me leave. I know all about his family, his house, his vacations. Did amazing work! Still use him and have more work lined up for him if I can complete some other projects.
If I've worked with you and know you're solid, I leave you alone 100%, other then the offer for cold drinks. But it's getting so hard to find people you can trust.
I check on work but don't hover.
I have so many stories of work gone wrong.
Had a drywall guy that talked my ear off. Wouldn't let me leave. I know all about his family, his house, his vacations. Did amazing work! Still use him and have more work lined up for him if I can complete some other projects.
If I've worked with you and know you're solid, I leave you alone 100%, other then the offer for cold drinks. But it's getting so hard to find people you can trust.
This.
Even with this, I had a couple do-overs in my kitchen last year.
It helps if you can recognize that someone really doesn't know WTF they're doing - like the guy they put on my stone backsplash. Completely fucked up even after I tried discussing my concerns with him. They had to rip the whole thing out and send in a real tile guy.
The granite countertop edges were a mess.
The flooring actually went in a little crooked because I didn't check on them enough. I'm probably the only one that would ever notice, and the finished product looks amazing but still...
The electrician and I solved a dilemma together because we communicated. Avoided punching a hole in my brand new cabinets for a switch when I offered up a remote mount solution using my home automation switches.
SuperiorDG
05-29-2019, 13:47
"had to fire the last two contractors" = Red Flag.
StagLefty
05-29-2019, 14:02
This reminded me of the time I started working at my last full time job,I had a school manager following me around like a puppy dog. I finally asked her if there was a problem and she said she didn't trust contractors. To which I replied "you realize we both work for the same company". She went away haha !!!
Unless I have someone helping me I never could abide with an over the shoulder supervisor.
SouthPaw
05-29-2019, 14:37
Inform him that he must wear full PPE to be near the work being completed. Additionally, a release waiver must be signed. I bet that will scare him off.
Aloha_Shooter
05-29-2019, 14:47
When my dad rebuilt the family home about 20 years ago (or, more accurately, had it rebuilt), he would go monitor the construction progress daily but he was careful to stay outside the work area and not interrupt the crew. He was also sure to have a filled cooler for the end of the day pau hana -- mostly sodas, although I think he did beers on the last day when everything was complete.
.455_Hunter
05-29-2019, 16:26
If only it were true that homeowners didn't need to supervise trade work.
ChickNorris
05-29-2019, 16:33
I don't mind when folks watch me work.
I mind when folks interrupt /distract me.
Having gone through several major house renovations in the past 3 years I learned that you need to trust but verify. Letting contractors do their job uninterrupted is important and I can respect that. But you also need to set the expectation up front that their work will be verified and they will be held accountable for quality work.
I usually keep an eye on things by seeing what has been done at the end of the day. I don't interrupt the work. Issues/questions go to the contractor.
USMC88-93
05-29-2019, 20:00
I let my siding contractor put up all 4 sides of my house before I went back and had them pull two sides back off and start over. Issues were obvious but I chose to talk to the foreman on a walk through rather than point it out to the worker bees... (Came to find out foreman had seen the issue and had already ordered the replacement materials to re-do the two sides.)
BPTactical
05-29-2019, 20:35
"Are you sure your supposed to do it that way?"
Great-Kazoo
05-29-2019, 20:40
When my dad rebuilt the family home about 20 years ago (or, more accurately, had it rebuilt), he would go monitor the construction progress daily but he was careful to stay outside the work area and not interrupt the crew. He was also sure to have a filled cooler for the end of the day pau hana -- mostly sodas, although I think he did beers on the last day when everything was complete.
No Pipi-Kaula ?
Aloha_Shooter
05-29-2019, 21:26
No Pipi-Kaula ?
At 5 PM after working in the sun all day, all the crew wanted was to rehydrate. I think Dad actually made the sodas available before pau hana but he defiintely wasn't offering any beer during work hours!
This is why I stopped working for homeowners.
How about people just assuming it's okay to climb up your ladder? Home owners kind of get a pass because they 1) assume it's their house so they must be entitled, and 2) usually don't really understand the industry. When other contractors do it, it's annoying though.
Made it through yesterday. Going to try and keep the customer happy. Smile through gritted teeth.
My laborer told him to stop doing his job in a polite way yesterday. Said that he had to appear busy doing something while I was around. LOL.
It was nice to vent out even here instead of being rude to a customer. I will work the weekend if needed and it will all be over.
I had an old man once pull up a camping chair and watch me work all day once. Was an engineer that did work on the hoover dam. I swear the old man wasnt half as bad as this guy is.
Engineers are the worst when it comes to that.
"Well this isn't exactly what I do, but I am an engineer..."
You should have stopped talking at "this isn't what I do."
StagLefty
05-30-2019, 07:35
I never told you Caplock but the park hired me to talk to you when you built the front entrance [Sarcasm2][ROFL2]
SuperiorDG
05-30-2019, 08:25
Had a lady homeowner who climbed in the shower with me, we do shower doors BTW, to look at something. I turned and come down, not meaning to, and elbowed her right in the shoulder blade. She was like why TF did you do that? I was like WTF are you doing in the shower I'm working in? Told the remodel contractor she can't be in there and to handle it, that's why I give a contractor discount.
Funny thing is she worked from home and was some coordinator for Moms Demand Action for Guns. Listening to her talk to people on the phone about how to argue for gun control almost made my head explode.
I'm reminded of those labor rate signs you see in some auto shops.
http://www.pmslweb.com/the-blog/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/19-funny-labor-rates-sign.jpeg
The problem is sometimes it's really justified. Between my circle track car building and restoration experience, I'm pretty knowledgable; I just don't do it for a living, and sometimes I don't have time for some servicing tasks so I reluctantly take it in. Anyhow, here is a great example that happened a couple of years ago. I brought my vehicle to a shop that I once trusted, and asked them to fix the clunk that was happening when I came to a stop; I told them exactly what was happening and that it was in the driveline. Instead of listening to me, they came back and said I needed a new transmission. I asked what troubleshooting they did and what codes they found to support that conclusion, and they got real defensive. I picked up my vehicle and diagnosed it myself even though I didn't have the time. What do you know....an obviously bad u-joint that any mechanic should easily recognize as the rusted needle bearings and bulge were obvious; I installed a new one and problem solved...$20 instead of $4,000. I was annoyed of course so I went back to the shop with the bad u-joint and talked to the general manager. Yeah, there were some people who didn't like being called out on their BS. At best they made an assumption without doing a proper diagnostic because of the miles on my vehicle; at worst, they were being deceitful. Regardless, it is really hard to trust people because shit like this happens all the time. I don't hover because that is annoying and I don't like people shoulder surfing me when I work. However, a person doing work for me should expect me to validate their work, and be challenged if I call BS. If a person is being truthful, and doing what they were hired to do with a reasonable amount of quality, then they will never see me. I don't know about the customer in this thread, but a lot of people get screwed by people doing work for them resulting in them be overly cautious.
BladesNBarrels
05-30-2019, 08:54
How about people just assuming it's okay to climb up your ladder? Home owners kind of get a pass because they 1) assume it's their house so they must be entitled, and 2) usually don't really understand the industry. When other contractors do it, it's annoying though.
Last time I had the roof replaced, the Jeffco Inspector required the roofing contractor to leave a ladder for him to use to inspect the roof. Jeffco quit allowing the inspectors to use their own.
Say what?
ChickNorris
05-30-2019, 09:11
Last time I had the roof replaced, the Jeffco Inspector required the roofing contractor to leave a ladder for him to use to inspect the roof. Jeffco quit allowing the inspectors to use their own.
Say what?
I had to do the same in Denver recently too.
buffalobo
05-30-2019, 09:31
I discuss the work to be competed with home owner before starting, the spiel includes the expectation that they(and their kids, pets, employees etc) will stay out of the work area for their safety and mine and multiple opportunities to discuss and inspect progress are built in. At those points I stop and seek out customer for inspection and approval. If those circumstances are not acceptable then I am not the guy for the job. If they do it after work starts then work stops until they agree. They are also told if they see something that concerns them they are welcome to call a stop and discuss issue.
Great-Kazoo
05-30-2019, 09:40
. Most if not all in CO were forum members, or referrals from. Those i stood over like a prison guard ;) .
Down here those i hired we sat and talked when they came out to bid a job. All of them were former CA residents who fled years ago due to liberal policies and gun laws. SO we've hit it off and been fortunate they were more than happy. After a price was agreed upon, to barter for items i may have had available.
So far i've had 1 installer who i told. Stop what you're doing, call your mgr or supervisor up and tell him i want them out here. Sooner than later, since you're not doing what was agreed upon, thanks. While we're waiting, if they cannot be here in the next hour, please clean up and leave. .
It needs to have the joints struck one more time and its killing him.
Hes had to bend over and close one eye 50 times
Thats him from yesterday. Same thing today.
ChickNorris
05-30-2019, 11:59
You're too funny taking pictures of him...
BPTactical
05-30-2019, 12:02
Had a lady homeowner who climbed in the shower with me, we do shower doors BTW, to look at something. I turned and come down, not meaning to, and elbowed her right in the shoulder blade. She was like why TF did you do that? I was like WTF are you doing in the shower I'm working in? Told the remodel contractor she can't be in there and to handle it, that's why I give a contractor discount.
Funny thing is she worked from home and was some coordinator for Moms Demand Action for Guns. Listening to her talk to people on the phone about how to argue for gun control almost made my head explode.
Needed the money that bad eh?
I would have walked out on principle.
RblDiver
05-30-2019, 13:03
Well, I've never had large work like that done, but if they didn't mind I would be interested in watching. Not from a "What are you doing no that's wrong do it like this" mindset, but from the view that I'm interested in how things work. Like, since it's not something I do normally, I'm just curious what goes into the process, like why I like talking to people about their jobs. I know mine, I am curious about yours!
n8tive97
05-30-2019, 16:11
Knock down a couple 12 packs, a dozen deviled eggs and 2 dozen wings! Let them rip all day man, make AOC ban eggs and beer!
Last time I had the roof replaced, the Jeffco Inspector required the roofing contractor to leave a ladder for him to use to inspect the roof. Jeffco quit allowing the inspectors to use their own.
Say what?
That's standard in most counties. Sometimes I get supplements for ladder rentals because of that. Haha
Not entirely the same, but the 2:05 mark is classic.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R2a8TRSgzZY
Caplock, if I have questions about brick stuff, can I direct them to you?
I thought this was going to be about the new Samuel L. Jackson-narrated children’s book about Jehovah’s Witnesses.
At one point today he thought my bricks were not level because it didnt line up with the tyvec moisture barrier the framers tacked on.....
My laborer tried flatulence, unfortunately I have to also be there.
At one point today he thought my bricks were not level because it didnt line up with the tyvec moisture barrier the framers tacked on.....
Face palm....
He was standing next to my scaffold looking at it when I pulled up. I hope to god he wasnt out there all night.
Told him I was going to wash it up Saturday morning.
He said he spends Saturdays at his mothers and wants to watch me wash it.......
I had this other customer tell me once that he loved me and wished he could prove it. Ill never stop hearing about that one from my brother, he was there.
That guy was less creepy. At least I know what he wanted.
ChickNorris
05-31-2019, 08:53
Can you hear me cackling all the way over there?!
ChickNorris
05-31-2019, 08:56
Told him I was going to wash it up Saturday morning. He said he spends Saturdays at his mothers and wants to watch me wash it... [snip] ... At least I know what he wanted.
~Oh me so foamy
~Oh ho, me so foamy
Me wash long time
~Oh me so...
Told him I was going to wash it up Saturday morning.
He said he spends Saturdays at his mothers and wants to watch me wash it.......
I had this other customer tell me once that he loved me and wished he could prove it. Ill never stop hearing about that one from my brother, he was there.
That guy was less creepy. At least I know what he wanted.
WTF? I think you should get the heck outta there.
I have a suspicion we're about to learn about mechanic liens in this thread.
ChickNorris
05-31-2019, 09:59
I have a suspicion we're about to learn about mechanic liens in this thread.
Let's hope not
Told him I was going to wash it up Saturday morning.
He said he spends Saturdays at his mothers and wants to watch me wash it.......
I had this other customer tell me once that he loved me and wished he could prove it. Ill never stop hearing about that one from my brother, he was there.
That guy was less creepy. At least I know what he wanted.
[ROFL3]
Sounds like tomorrow is a drama free day if you can access the property without him. ;)
ETA: Maybe you should branch out your advertising to include more than just the local gay bars?
Bailey Guns
05-31-2019, 10:22
I've got a guy coming Monday to do a rather challenging garage door opener install. I'm learning all sorts of new ways to irritate him from this thread.
I've got a guy coming Monday to do a rather challenging garage door opener install. I'm learning all sorts of new ways to irritate him from this thread.
Maybe you could also inquire what he's "open to"?
Maybe you could also inquire what he's "open to"?
That is 'closed'.
Told him I was going to wash it up Saturday morning.
He said he spends Saturdays at his mothers and wants to watch me wash it.......
I had this other customer tell me once that he loved me and wished he could prove it. Ill never stop hearing about that one from my brother, he was there.
That guy was less creepy. At least I know what he wanted.
That's what you deserve for working in shorty bibs with one strap undone.
SuperiorDG
05-31-2019, 16:03
I had a pilot that was off on certain days and said I had to give notice a day or two a head so he could get his kid to daycare so he could supervise us. We had to go back a second time and he was upset he had to pay for two days of daycare.
whitewalrus
05-31-2019, 17:51
At one point today he thought my bricks were not level because it didnt line up with the tyvec moisture barrier the framers tacked on.....
My laborer tried flatulence, unfortunately I have to also be there.
They may not be level as they don?t match the slope away from the house of the dirt. Guess you should have asked him to make sure they are level and put a level in his hands. Gives him something useful to do
I will admit, there's certain rare jobs that I will do a degree of helping/hovering. But they may or may not involve english as a unavailable language laborers, and a hastily drawn sketch of plans. Kinda have to be there to guide the direction it takes and answer questions before it's all permanent-like. Then again though, I don't hover, I'm working on my own shit nearby, just available mostly, and occasionally checking to make sure it's my plan we're building, not theirs, because I can't afford to fix mistakes and neither can they. I call this "Champagne on a beer budget", for other reasons too [ROFL1]
Have rarely hired many guys to do things, but when I have I guess I'm guilty of being "that guy" to a small extent. Not to criticize or hover, just mainly because I'm a curious ass and just wanna learn something. As a lifelong DIY guy, I'm always interested in things I don't have experience with. But I do have the sense to keep the exposure to minutes, not hours. I know enough to ask a question or two and then go away.
But parking my ass and being a heckling spectator? Oh hell no.
I took a couple pictures that day. This one had him running.
I made it through the job and was polite the whole time. Got paid in full.
Someone on meds turned his kitchen into a garage.
Now its a kitchen again.
The stone was to replace bricks that were destroyed.
Did you just detach and reset the top bricks then?
StagLefty
06-01-2019, 10:23
Looks good !!!
whitewalrus
06-01-2019, 10:36
Looks good. I?m sure you are happy it?s over with.
Looks good !!!
+1
And a much better solution than just siding over it.
78126
Doesn't look level.
j/k
OtterbatHellcat
06-01-2019, 16:06
I noticed that as well.
ChickNorris
06-02-2019, 06:04
I took a couple pictures that day. This one had him running.
I made it through the job and was polite the whole time. Got paid in full.
So it was a happy ending after all.
;-)
No the bricks were all separated and old mortar chiseled off/cleaned up
Early Friday morning I drove to Castle Rock to meet a general contractor. We went over details like columns(they install 4x4 post first) on the porch. Fireplace face is up to the homeowners. Hes supposed to pencil dimentions and details on the wall. Get there this morning and not one gawd damn thing had been done. No phone call, nothing. I love loading a bunch of tools and driving around for shits and giggles.
StagLefty
06-03-2019, 11:40
^ Can you charge him for your time and travel ?
I know charging more will piss people off. They are so slow at building anything, the money is gone. A kid watched this house burn down while he was in High School. Went out learned a trade. Got certified and installed the fireplace in this house...thats pretty slow.
I called the next customer on my schedule. I explained that a General Contractor wasnt ready and I could start her project tomorrow.
She tells me she spent all of her money on landscaping and wouldnt have the money for several weeks. Then asked how I felt about that. LOL. I never answered knowing she wouldnt like my answer. About 30 minutes ago she text me saying she "found" the money and am I still coming tomorrow. I guess Im going....dont have anything else going on.
Last customer before I started posting invited me to go shoot at Colorado Rifle Club with him, didnt bug me, and had his money. Why cant they all be like that.
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