View Full Version : Anyone using Amazon Business? Do they report to D&B?
Got an email from Amazon advertising Amazon Business. I called them to ask if they offer Net 30 billing and ask if they report to Experian and Dun & Bradstreet. The answers I got were not as concrete as I would have liked. It sounds like they do offer some sort of 30-day billing, and the guy said that everyone reports to the credit agencies. I'm under the impression that when it comes to business credit reporting, MOST businesses are not actively reporting. Anyone using Amazon Business and know if they report?
The only company that I can think of that offers Net 30 and reports is Quill.com, and maybe Uline. Anyone know of any other large companies that actively report business credit?
Some of my big vendors both report to and reference D&B...
But some, and not all, right?
Yeah, only the big 3 or 4
Trying to build credit or avoid ruining it [Muaha] ?
ETA: I think the chances though are pretty slim. Amazon's data > D&B's. Why would they spend the time?
ETA 2: Highly likely to somewhat require you to sign for the business obligation if they do have terms, which I highly doubt they even offer that, but you never know. They like to push CCs
You don't need a Dunn and Bradstreet number to do business with Amazon.
I've seen it required by Government, but that is because they are communist assholes.
-John
I started trying to build business credit a few years ago, but I've been slacking and I can hardly ever justify ordering from Quill. I got a credit card, but the limit is so low that I can't even use it for it's intended purpose. I forgot how it feels to have no credit. I tried to get my business credit card company to increase my limit by $500-$1,000, and because I'd had the card for less than two years, they wouldn't do it, even temporarily. On my personal lines of credit, I went through a period of about two years where I would just double the amount of credit every six months and they never blinked an eye. Such a difference.
You don't need a Dunn and Bradstreet number to do business with Amazon.
I've seen it required by Government, but that is because they are communist assholes.
-John
See above, the point is to build credit. I don't really need credit at all, I just want it.
Dunn and Bradstreet are not credit reporting, by the way... they are more of just identifying a business.
Experian, Transunion, Equifax, are the Credit reporters.
-John
The best way to build credit, other than being responsible for the loans you take on, is to ask one of the credit bureaus to help you monitor your credit.
I started paying Transunion $10/month, and my credit shot up.
-John
I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing. Are you talking about business credit?
Dun & Bradstreet, Experian, and Equifax are the business credit bureaus, with D&B being the major of the three.
buffalobo
02-19-2020, 22:11
Irving, make an appt with small biz rep at your bank. Even if they don't have what you looking for it will be worth your time.
No, Dunn & Bradstreet, or DNB, is just an identifying number. Nothing to do with your credit rating. Either you have a DNB or you don't.
Transunion, Equifax, and Experian, are the credit agencies.
-John
Irving, make an appt with small biz rep at your bank. Even if they don't have what you looking for it will be worth your time.
I sat down with someone, but it wasn't as helpful as I wanted. They asked how much money I needed, and I told them I didn't need any money, but wanted to build business credit, and had already started years ago. They suggested I get a business credit card, then told me that they would pull my personal credit score. I asked why they would do that, since I thought the two weren't related. They said they had to start with something. So I let them do their thing, and my very high personal credit score got me a shitty business card with something like a $2,000 credit limit, from a shitty company that I've had in the past and had a bad experience with. So far, the experience has been poor and that company hasn't changed it's tune in the decade or so since I last dealt with them. I think I'm going to cancel that card and call Amex and see what they can do for me. Generally I would not recommend canceling a card, but this company is shady and I don't want an association with them. I know it's easier/faster to build business credit than it is personal credit, but I don't know if canceling a card is more or less difficult to overcome in the business world.
I went to look and see if I have a DUNS number, and I do. NAV is one of the credit monitoring services and I can find credit rating from D&B and Experian, but not Equifax. So far stuff is looking good, so I'm happy. I'm still interested in knowing about companies that specifically report to the business credit bureaus though. Most people have no idea what you are talking about when asking about business credit, so it's a bit of a difficult road.
No, Dunn & Bradstreet, or DNB, is just an identifying number. Nothing to do with your credit rating. Either you have a DNB or you don't.
Transunion, Equifax, and Experian, are the credit agencies.
-John
I'm not going to beat a dead horse, but you are mistaken. D&B puts out a PAYDEX score.
They can put out any score they care to, nobody cares about a D&B Paydex score.
I've never heard about it before, and I have been in business for 40 years.
I am telling you, it is immaterial.
-John
You were telling me that D&B wasn't a credit bureau. If you shift your goal posts, you win every time.
I don't know if it's important or not. What I do know, is that every time I've ever gone down the rabbit hole of researching business credit, only three names are ever mentioned, Dun & Bradstreet, Experian, and Equifax. Business credit is different than personal credit. I'm under the impression that most small businesses don't even really understand that there is a difference and make no effort to produce, or improve their business scores. Since I don't know what the future holds, it's important to me to try and make sure I have a good business credit rating, in the case that I ever need it.
On another note, while looking up this stuff, I see that my personal score has dropped over the last two months and I'm not happy about that. Grrr.
I was amazed at how much of a boost I got when I signed up for Transunion's Credit monitoring service.
I also locked down my credit at each of the credit bureaus, so they have to ask me, before giving people credit decisions on my behalf.
-John
Then you just need to unlock it before you do anything that looks at your credit right? Basically applying for new cards or getting any loans.
Yup, just bought a $50,000 truck. You can imagine my panic when I realized all my credit was locked down. ;)
Anyway, I got enough credit unlocked (hint: transunion, the credit service I subscribe to) and was able to buy the truck.
-John
I went on a personal credit building rampage a few years ago where I increased all my lines of credit every six months for as long as they would let me. Increasing credit ups scores faster than paying down credit, but it's dangerous if you aren't good with credit in the first place. I eventually got to a place where after requesting a credit limit increase, I'd get a letter back from one card company, referencing another card (and that card's limit) and how I wasn't using that card, or their card, so "no, we aren't going to increase your credit anymore."
Yeah, I am generally watching my credit score from a perspective of fraud or identity theft or other malicious intent.
I have everything locked down, so that credit bureaus, have to ask me, before giving financial data to someone who asks.
-John
We're kind of getting off track of business credit though. I don't think you can lock down business credit anyway, as other businesses will pull your credit to help decide whether they want to do business with you.
I'm telling you there is no such thing as "business credit." Your personal credit is all that matters.
D&B, or DUNS number is just a number.
-John
Business tax return showing a ton of income is quite valuable, as is being in business awhile. Prove you don't need credit, practically don't want credit, and you finally magically get credit!
You can also substitute "credit" for "a beautiful woman". Except the latter, when it leaves, will charge hefty penalties.
Amex and Chase have routinely upp my credit limits on my business cards. Started with AMEX with a 6K limit, I think, Now all 3 cards(2 Chase, 1 Amex) are over 35K limit (no running balances). Took about 10 years. As a bonus, the Amex points have sent me on vacations all over the western hemisphere.
I'm telling you there is no such thing as "business credit." Your personal credit is all that matters.
D&B, or DUNS number is just a number.
-John
So in a small business with 15 total people working in the business and 3 partners, when it's time to get a loan, whose credit is run? All three partners? The employees?
Business tax return showing a ton of income is quite valuable, as is being in business awhile.
Income doesn't mean anything for credit. A business can have $200,000 cash in the bank and not qualify for a $50,000 loan if they have no credit history.
As I suspected, business credit is not well known and tough to find good advice on.
Yes, they will run your personal credit. At the end of the day, you secure the loan.
-John
Sturtle I understand your frustration with this thread
Iego I do not know your business back ground but I know Irving?s and as small independent human with a small business I have personally set up accounts with vendors and got the pricing tiers that I did solely on my D&B score
If I had to do a personal credit inquiry for every vendor account it would be detrimental
Let's keep in mind that loans are unnatural from the beginning. Somebody comes to you for a loan, and you look at them funny.
-John
Sturtle I understand your frustration with this thread
Iego I do not know your business back ground but I know Irving?s and as small independent human with a small business I have personally set up accounts with vendors and got the pricing tiers that I did solely on my D&B score
If I had to do a personal credit inquiry for every vendor account it would be detrimental
Irving isn't just asking for an account, he's asking for a loan.
-John
I'm not looking for a loan, nor do I need one. I like to use loans in examples because it is an easy concept. Again, I'm looking to build credit.
The best way to build credit (and protect yourself from fraud) is to sign up for a credit monitoring service. Transunion, Equifax, Experian, each offer this service.
Then lock down your credit at each of the credit bureaus above.
Then, responsibly use credit for things like houses, cars, etc.
-John
I'm not looking for a loan, nor do I need one. I like to use loans in examples because it is an easy concept. Again, I'm looking to build credit.
I'm a bit confused, because the only reason you need credit, is for loans.
-John
The best way to build credit (and protect yourself from fraud) is to sign up for a credit monitoring service. Transunion, Equifax, Experian, each offer this service.
Then lock down your credit at each of the credit bureaus above.
Then, responsibly use credit for things like houses, cars, etc.
-John
Your advice is for personal credit. Business credit is not the same thing
I'm a bit confused, because the only reason you need credit, is for loans.
-John
Try putting an Xcel bill or phone contract or many other things in your name with no credit history.
Income doesn't mean anything for credit. A business can have $200,000 cash in the bank and not qualify for a $50,000 loan if they have no credit history.
In my experience, while that may be somewhat true on the private side (they do consider income re: account limits, btw), lenders on the commercial side were highly interested in revenues, balance sheets, length in business, tax returns, etc. Way more than a D&B score. YMMV, and structure may impact.
However, I usually preferred cash or COD accounts on a business-to-business basis for a few reasons, one being that it is impossible to get underwater and receivables was easier on those accounts. I really didn't have any valid reason to "need" net-30 terms for most of those accounts, and I had several.
Whether or not they'd have check D&B, I doubt it, they heavily pushed it and IIRC, they relied more on personal credit. D&B has always in my experience been more of a middle - big business concern, and I don't think it hasn't aged very well in modern data. I'm pretty sure after years of operation, my business, like most others, had no D&B rating at all. Lenders can't rely on that. It's a dinosaur.
Yeah in fact, I just searched it. To show you how advanced D& B is, despite all the plethora of public record out there, they list my company currently at an address that existed something like... 9 years ago. That's how out of date they are - they don't even have the tech to harvest annual reports from the state or any public directory. (are you f%$ing kidding me).
This is corporate, btw. AND they want $139 to provide a report. I am 100% positive that in all those years, nobody has provided any information to D&B or you'd think they would have more recent information. Pretty sure in all our history nobody checked it either. Not a hobby business either, btw... had employees.
Creditors would have to be utterly stupid to rely on that shit, it's not 1965 anymore.
Which brings me back to my very first post. Most places aren't reporting to the business creditors.
There is more to credit than just loans. Seems like I've gotten a dead end here. We can probably wrap this up.
DireWolf
02-27-2020, 12:05
Which brings me back to my very first post. Most places aren't reporting to the business creditors.
There is more to credit than just loans. Seems like I've gotten a dead end here. We can probably wrap this up.Figured I'd jump in here, if a bit late. (disclaimers: not an expert/professional in this area, just general info based on personal experience; process may vary based on entity type)
My understanding is that, assuming you already have the business accounts set up and whatnot, when you go to apply for a business line of credit, you'll supply your TIN (EIN), but as you have no credit history with that, they'll also use your SSN to run initial credit.
Once you have the credit account up, it will function similarly to personal credit, but tied to the business TIN; you can start using that to build a credit history (depending on the entity type), your personal SSN/credit will no longer be needed/used for the business (at least in this context).
D&B is also useful, but from an entirely different perspective.
Hope that helps address the main question...
Amex and Chase have routinely upp my credit limits on my business cards. Started with AMEX with a 6K limit, I think, Now all 3 cards(2 Chase, 1 Amex) are over 35K limit (no running balances). Took about 10 years. As a bonus, the Amex points have sent me on vacations all over the western hemisphere.
I don't know how I missed this post, but thanks for the real world example. That's exactly the reason I like Amex. I was able to get a personal card limit up that high in something like 3-5 years of total card ownership, but maybe only like 18 months when I started asking them.
Direwolf: Thanks for chiming in. When I get around to applying for an Amex business credit card, I'll see if they use my TIEN number to pull my business credit, use my SS, or both, and if I remember I'll report back here. I was able to find a business credit rating with D&B and Experian, so at least I have some credit floating around out there.
Irving, make an appt with small biz rep at your bank. Even if they don't have what you looking for it will be worth your time.
I did this today and it was helpful. Nothing formal, just a quick chat to make sure I was pursuing the correct path. I'll be making an appointment later to find out if there is a business line of credit I can set up right now (basically like a HELOC, but for business), or if not, what steps I need to take to get there. Looking forward to it and thanks for the recommendation.
buffalobo
03-04-2020, 18:42
[emoji106]They are the guys with the money and since they want your money they are a resource for you to use/get as much as you can before they get your money.
I always got good info and a different viewpoint.
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