View Full Version : Exterior security camera systems
BPTactical
04-12-2020, 16:15
Anybody have any experience with exterior camera systems? Looking for an affordable system.
I think I would prefer a DVR type system as opposed to a cloud based, would prefer not to be bound with a monthly payment.
Ideas?
Thanks
bobbyfairbanks
04-12-2020, 16:40
I just did a simply safe system for everything. Super easy. But you got the monthly payment
OtterbatHellcat
04-12-2020, 16:42
We're happy with the Ring system we installed. $10/mth. though, unlimited cams I believe. We have 6 going.
The good thing about the cloud storage is nobody is going to steal it.
If I broke in and murdered you and your family and managed to steal your dvr and destroy it then nobody would have video of me committing the crime. Not so much with the cloud.
The good thing about the cloud storage is nobody is going to steal it.
If I broke in and murdered you and your family and managed to steal your dvr and destroy it then nobody would have video of me committing the crime. Not so much with the cloud.
Cut the cable feed going in to the house?
We're happy with the Ring system we installed. $10/mth. though, unlimited cams I believe. We have 6 going.
$100/yr for 24x7 alarm monitoring, unlimited cams/recording, and extended warranties on devices. https://shop.ring.com/pages/protect-plans
BPTactical
04-12-2020, 17:07
The good thing about the cloud storage is nobody is going to steal it.
If I broke in and murdered you and your family and managed to steal your dvr and destroy it then nobody would have video of me committing the crime. Not so much with the cloud.
You wouldn't find the DVR Ray.
But I would find you.........
Cut the cable feed going in to the house?
This would generate a Ring alarm notification to our phones/watches via cellular network.
If it's convenient to hardwire everything via twisted pair and PoE, that would probably be optimal. Have recordings go to on-prem NAS with replication to the cloud.
This would generate a Ring alarm notification to our phones/watches via cellular network.
Sure but there wouldn’t be any video of ray murdering anyone either.
BPTactical
04-12-2020, 17:18
Reluctant to do a Cloud based system for a couple reasons:
A- Monthly fee
B- Ability of somebody breaching the info.
C- Dont know who will have access.
How secure are wireless systems?
You wouldn't find the DVR Ray.
But I would find you.........
Yes, it’s pretty easy to hide an NVR.
Sure but there wouldn?t be any video of ray murdering anyone either.
But he'd let you know he was coming.
bobbyfairbanks
04-12-2020, 17:30
Bert when it’s really cold a lot of those cameras stop working. Most criminals aren’t out then either but something to think about.
Responses for Ring:
Reluctant to do a Cloud based system for a couple reasons:
A- Monthly fee - discounted for yearly payment
B- Ability of somebody breaching the info. - the cameras are as secure as your home network
C- Dont know who will have access. - only users that you designate have access (which is granular) and 2FA is now required - reports for police having access is only through video shared by anonymised users in the Neighbors app
How secure are wireless systems?
For the record, if I went to BP?s house it would likely be to return something I borrowed. I would also notify him I was coming.
I will be following this thread since I have seriously been considering some sort of camera system. Not really looking for any sort of alarm type thing that notifies anybody other than me so hoping maybe I can also avoid pesky monthly fees.
Bert when it’s really cold a lot of those cameras stop working. Most criminals aren’t out then either but something to think about.
I checked the tech specs on mine and they're good down to -5 F.
A wired system running to a computer using something like Blue Iris which can also send notifications would be pretty slick, but it may be pricey. The software is often licensed, so figure that in.
I checked the tech specs on mine and they're good down to -5 F.
A wired system running to a computer using something like Blue Iris which can also send notifications would be pretty slick, but it may be pricey. The software is often licensed, so figure that in.
Ispy is free software
https://www.ispyconnect.com/
xiondavis
04-12-2020, 18:53
Here are two local NVR systems that I have had very good luck with and are easy to setup and maintain.
Synology Surveillance Station - can use just about any cameras, they have a list online. There is a fee per camera. We are using hardwired PoE 4k hikvision cameras and it has been rock solid with no maintenance required for 2 years.
Ubiquiti UniFi Protect - must use their hardwired cameras (they do have one wireless model). I use this at home with their flex g3 cams. It’s dead simple plug and play setup.
Both Systems have phone apps for remote live viewing, historical viewing, and email notifications.
I will be building a system here shortly on my new house. I wouldn't use wireless cameras for sure! Definitely go with a PoE system and a NVR! I used Lorex cameras on my old house and they were pretty decent. Now that I do commercial alarm and video, I will most likely be using Axis cameras. They make some awesome cameras and you can even buy them off Amazon. A little more pricey but well worth it in my opinion!
CobaltSkink
04-12-2020, 19:05
Opie011-
Please describe you system and sources when you are done.
Thanks.
Opie011-
Please describe you system and sources when you are done.
Thanks.
Will do. May be a little while before I have it all picked out and installed though.
Will do. May be a little while before I have it all picked out and installed though.
Don't use the Axis companion stuff. I had major issues with their cameras having dirt behind/inside the lenses that would leave blurry spots in the image that were much more apparent at night where they would show up as bright spots. As for the Companion records I've had to do factory defaults on a couple that just decided not to play nice anymore. Took forever to get Axis to believe me and replace them. Their P series cameras and up are good to go.
2 of our neighbor has those DVR systems. They love it, except it is pain in the ass to install.
Wiring running 35 to 40ft+ making a hole in not the wall.
They both got the one they sell at costco. I forgot which brand. I was about to get that.
Whereas I got arlo. Free 7 day storage (you can immediately download footage into the phone/pc). Can get budget regular arlo to arlo pro2.
Only issue I have is that it is so sensitive at low setting that it will do many false alarm on sun/shade change or tiny bugs.
I had an Arlo setup, but the batteries were a killer.
I would love to have the opportunity to be able to pre-wire a house as it's being built.
Fentonite
04-12-2020, 20:46
There are some aftermarket power cords that you can use with Arlo. They work great on mine, but I still find the Arlo reliability somewhat less than perfect.
I had an Arlo setup, but the batteries were a killer.
I would love to have the opportunity to be able to pre-wire a house as it's being built.
They might be hiring!
https://www.constructiondive.com/news/the-top-10-residential-construction-companies/298164/
They might be hiring!
https://www.constructiondive.com/news/the-top-10-residential-construction-companies/298164/
Touche
Let me rephrase, "I'd like to have the opportunity to be able to pre-wire my house as it's being built."
I've used Blue Iris with six POE cameras for about three years. No issues to report. Find a used decent quality POE switch, run your Cat 6 and hook it to your computer. Use a VPN (most decent routers will have this built-in.) Blue Iris has apps for Android and iPhone. I have a Synology router setup but, prefer Blue Iris.
gnihcraes
04-12-2020, 21:40
I've used Blue Iris with six POE cameras for about three years. No issues to report. Find a used decent quality POE switch, run your Cat 6 and hook it to your computer. Use a VPN (most decent routers will have this built-in.) Blue Iris has apps for Android and iPhone. I have a Synology router setup but, prefer Blue Iris.
It's what I use. POE and Blue iris running on older laptop. So glad to wire up the house/attic with wall boxes and network ports. can move a camera anywhere or add more without much effort.
blue iris ftw. sunba 20x cameras can be had to provide a lot of dynamic ability you wouldn't see in any traditional camera system.
on a side note to prewiring a house:
You can also do it when you reroof a house. run the cables in places where you're not apt to nail (like on top of valleys), to a centralized place on top of the roof where they descend into the attic space. Then shingle over the roof as you normally would. cat5,6,7 etc. doesn't care about the heat, so long as it doesn't have uv exposure it'll last as long as the shingles do or longer.
FromMyColdDeadHand
04-13-2020, 00:29
I had an Arlo setup, but the batteries were a killer.
I would love to have the opportunity to be able to pre-wire a house as it's being built.
There are some aftermarket power cords that you can use with Arlo. They work great on mine, but I still find the Arlo reliability somewhat less than perfect.
I have an Arlo 2 system and it is good for - what happened last night- not what is happening right now. I never can get it to connect fast enough to get the front door. I do have three solar panels and they have kept two cameras maintenance free for two years. One camera got wonky and I had to recharge the battery. A mix of low sunlight this winter (Due to placement) and cold temps, plus it triggering a bunch due to high traffic area got to it.
I have a camera and a solar charger on a pole/shepherd's-crook type thing that I can move around as needed. It's all black and with a bright red bird feeder hanging on it, it all blends in. For another I built a 'bird house' out of the PVC expanded foam 'wood' that I put on an 8 foot 4x4 in a stake mount. One roof is the solar panel. No one ever sees that one.
ARLO is getting better with AI to tell you what is at the door- person, package, animal. The cloud access is too slow is the issue. I wish there was one that was local stored with cloud back-up.
Also, cloud means that they use that for training the AI. I always make sure I shut off the system before I load the car for outings related to this website.
I'm thinking about adding a ring door bell to get faster access. ARLO is just too slow, and the audio sucks too badly to be used as a communication device.
Martinjmpr
04-13-2020, 08:27
I had an Arlo setup, but the batteries were a killer.
I would love to have the opportunity to be able to pre-wire a house as it's being built.
There are some aftermarket power cords that you can use with Arlo. They work great on mine, but I still find the Arlo reliability somewhat less than perfect.
We have been using an Arlo system since 2017.
Pluses: Easy to install (wireless), no fees (for up to 5 cameras), cloud-based. Reasonably priced (under $500 for a 4 camera system.) Provides OK video.
Minuses: Slow to connect (can't really monitor the door because it takes anywhere from 10 - 30 seconds for the camera to actually pull up an image on the phone), motion-activated video can be unreliable (doesn't always activate) and cameras need to be recharged every 3 months or so (although mine are set up so I get an alert on my phone when they get to 15% so I usually have plenty of time to pull them down to recharge.)
What I like about them is that if we are camping somewhere we can monitor what is happening back at the house (as long as we have cellular data service, that is.) The good news for us is that we don't really live in a neighborhood that has a lot of crime so they're not really "necessary" for us.
I regard them as "better than nothing" but if we lived in a place where we actually NEEDED a video camera system for security, I don't think I'd rely on them, I'd probably bite the bullet and get something more reliable, hard wired and maybe even monitored.
Either that or I'd find somewhere else to live. [Coffee]
My experience with battery powered cams is that their motion triggers miss a lot. The powered cameras are basically always recording, so if there's a trigger it will jump back in the buffer to something like 5 seconds before the trigger.
With the my experience with the Ring cameras, the motion zones for the battery cams are very rudimentary. With the powered cams, you have multiple zones that you can stitch together to get a really refined detection while ignoring a shrub/grill cover/furniture cover that may flap in the breeze. My rear LED flood light cam for example, does not pickup squirrels running across the top of the fence or people in my neighbors' yards. As soon as something enters my yard space, they're being recorded, including several seconds before the activation. If someone climbs over the fence I'll know. If a critter happens to come down the fence, I'll know. If anyone/anything is near my gate, same thing. Motion sensing for triggering the lights (on cameras equipped with them) is an independent activation range, which may be different than the activation settings for camera motion.
If I could afford it and had better access in the attic (we have very high vaulted ceilings), I'd go hardwired with on-prem recording and cloud backup with everything on UPS. It's cost prohibitive for me and I get plenty of coverage to satisfy my curiosity and comfort level. I live in a pretty safe neighborhood with neighbors that look out for each other.
ETA: I also have a spare powered cam that I put inside the house when we're away for peace of mind. The monitored alarm with the ability to detect smoke detectors and glass breakage via Alexa set in "Away Mode" provides extra coverage.
We went with this system:
https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B06XR6XFGR/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Cameras can be POE, but we just positioned them so they could be independently powered. They come already paired to the NVR, so no tech stress for those that don't speak geek. I went ahead and ran CAT5 from the NVR to the router for the online features. Bought it 2 years ago this month, and it's been pretty trouble free. They've put out updated firmware since then, but the update was easy.
FromMyColdDeadHand
04-13-2020, 16:27
We have been using an Arlo system since 2017.
Pluses: Easy to install (wireless), no fees (for up to 5 cameras), cloud-based. Reasonably priced (under $500 for a 4 camera system.) Provides OK video.
Minuses: Slow to connect (can't really monitor the door because it takes anywhere from 10 - 30 seconds for the camera to actually pull up an image on the phone), motion-activated video can be unreliable (doesn't always activate) and cameras need to be recharged every 3 months or so (although mine are set up so I get an alert on my phone when they get to 15% so I usually have plenty of time to pull them down to recharge.)
What I like about them is that if we are camping somewhere we can monitor what is happening back at the house (as long as we have cellular data service, that is.) The good news for us is that we don't really live in a neighborhood that has a lot of crime so they're not really "necessary" for us.
I regard them as "better than nothing" but if we lived in a place where we actually NEEDED a video camera system for security, I don't think I'd rely on them, I'd probably bite the bullet and get something more reliable, hard wired and maybe even monitored.
Either that or I'd find somewhere else to live. [Coffee]
This is my feelings and experiences with Arlo too.
I do like the solar chargers. I just put that last 'pole' camera out and I didn't realize the spare battery I put in it was at 3% power. With in three days, the solar panel had charged it to 95%+.
The main function I use is "Did I close the garage door.....". Plus I travel a lot (or used to) and it is nice to be able to have some situational awareness of what is going on at home.
Blue Iris + whatever cams are the "best" value at the time. This changes regularly as the cams are always improving, but with a roll-your-own system like BI, you aren't stuck with any one vendor. I've installed and supported several systems, and while there can be an initial learning curve the first time, with a few notes from someone who has done it before, it's pretty easy to set up and forget it. I use the remote access on my phone and/or PC all the time as I have it hooked up to a doorbell cam too. Only takes a sec or two to see who is at the door. Also using another BI system to monitor approx 15 cams or so on a tiny little PC - as long as you get a decent speedy hard drive, I've had zero issues and could probably fit more.
Side note but if you decide to do your own system and don't want to mess with grey-market ebay cams, I've had good service from this place called "Nelly's" - they give pretty decent advice when asked and have had pretty decent prices, though it's been a little while since I've bought anything. Some of their stuff is rebranded equipment with USA-based firmware, which I found is a better option than pure Chinese stuff off ebay.
I too just hate the idea of a monthly fee, or locking myself in. If you do a non-brand specific thing, you could always change the cams to the next recorder/system you like or vice versa.
edit to say I'm definitely a big fan of POE/wired over all other options, and wouldn't do anything else unless I had to.
Delfuego
04-15-2020, 00:41
Cannot believe nobody asked for you budget...
2 Good options here.
Here are two local NVR systems that I have had very good luck with and are easy to setup and maintain.
Synology Surveillance Station - can use just about any cameras, they have a list online. There is a fee per camera. We are using hardwired PoE 4k hikvision cameras and it has been rock solid with no maintenance required for 2 years.
Ubiquiti UniFi Protect - must use their hardwired cameras (they do have one wireless model). I use this at home with their flex g3 cams. It’s dead simple plug and play setup.
Both Systems have phone apps for remote live viewing, historical viewing, and email notifications.
Blue Iris + whatever cams are the "best" value at the time. This changes regularly as the cams are always improving, but with a roll-your-own system like BI, you aren't stuck with any one vendor. I've installed and supported several systems, and while there can be an initial learning curve the first time, with a few notes from someone who has done it before, it's pretty easy to set up and forget it. I use the remote access on my phone and/or PC all the time as I have it hooked up to a doorbell cam too. Only takes a sec or two to see who is at the door. Also using another BI system to monitor approx 15 cams or so on a tiny little PC - as long as you get a decent speedy hard drive, I've had zero issues and could probably fit more.
Side note but if you decide to do your own system and don't want to mess with grey-market ebay cams, I've had good service from this place called "Nelly's" - they give pretty decent advice when asked and have had pretty decent prices, though it's been a little while since I've bought anything. Some of their stuff is rebranded equipment with USA-based firmware, which I found is a better option than pure Chinese stuff off ebay.
I too just hate the idea of a monthly fee, or locking myself in. If you do a non-brand specific thing, you could always change the cams to the next recorder/system you like or vice versa.
edit to say I'm definitely a big fan of POE/wired over all other options, and wouldn't do anything else unless I had to.
Another BI user.
Re: Nelly's. You mention you have a video doorbell. Do you have their branded version of the Uniden doorbell cam? I've been pleased with mine (Uniden) with the exception of not being able to turn off the IR. Instead of hacking the hardware, I just covered the IR ring with a vinyl cutout. However, it still attracts bugs and spiders.
There's also some BI integration with Alexa and some Home automation products. I have the video feeds hooked into Hubitiat Elevation aka Hubitat aka HE dashboards but don't yet have any HE to BI controls (3rd party dev) setup.
Another ARLO user. (posted numerous arlo /camera thread in the past).
Got the arlo even before Arlo Pro was available.
Pro:
1. 7 day cloud storage free. i think it is free upto Arlo Pro 2, I am not sure. Mine has 7 days free.
2. Sensitive*. It will catch a bug moving around at 80-85% sensitivity level
Con:
1. I use rechargeable CR123. and it requires to change once a month during summer, and sometimes 1/week during 10F below winter.
2. Sensitive*. Sometimes it will alert every 8 minutes if there is a sun and shade combo shifting. It gets really annoying. Yes, I can lower the sensitivity, but I need to raise the sensitivity for night time. (i don't use schedule on/off feature).
3. Arlo device make "click" sounds when it is about go on. If bad guy knows about arlo, they can try to sneak away from camera until it makes "click" sound when on. (Arlo Standard, i am not sure about Pro 2).
Overall, I would rather have arlo over any device due to free 7 day cloud service. However, I BELIEVE (from last time i visited arlo website) does not offer free 7 day services.
Another BI user.
Re: Nelly's. You mention you have a video doorbell. Do you have their branded version of the Uniden doorbell cam? I've been pleased with mine (Uniden) with the exception of not being able to turn off the IR. Instead of hacking the hardware, I just covered the IR ring with a vinyl cutout. However, it still attracts bugs and spiders.
There's also some BI integration with Alexa and some Home automation products. I have the video feeds hooked into Hubitiat Elevation aka Hubitat aka HE dashboards but don't yet have any HE to BI controls (3rd party dev) setup.
Yep, that's the same one I have. I had a couple issues getting it set up the first week or two but I did a cheap upgrade on the doorbell transformer and it's been very solid since then.
Yep, that's the same one I have. I had a couple issues getting it set up the first week or two but I did a cheap upgrade on the doorbell transformer and it's been very solid since then.
I upgraded my transformer but that didn't solve the weirdness.
I ended up putting a resistor across the feed line and that fixed it for good.
Haven't we had this convo before? LOL
For the BI users out there, you can use the push notifications to a cell to get notification when someone is, for instance, pulling into your driveway. Use the motion zones and setup an A-->B (From A, to B) rule to make it one way. Additionally, you can duplicate cameras to setup more complex notification rules - so you can have your normal recording on the first camera, then duplicate it, and set precise motion zones with precise rules on the duplicate camera to send you push notifications, which you keep hidden. So many cases when that kind of precise notification is useful (kid, dog training, etc.) Lots more advance configurations you can do ofc too. You can also setup the rules like above (e.g. when A--->B) to trigger other cameras, like having a PTZ look at your door when another camera detects someone walking towards your door - but not away from it.
ETA: If your computer has the hardware to do it, you can also setup pretty much an unlimited amount of pre-recorded buffer on a camera. If you have headroom, you can easily do a full minute in advance of any trigger. The push notification also can be configured to send a jpeg image or video clip and in my experience, it is very fast (using an image). I don't have much of a need for a doorbell, or doorbell camera, for instance.
For the BI users out there, you can use the push notifications to a cell to get notification when someone is, for instance, pulling into your driveway. Use the motion zones and setup an A-->B (From A, to B) rule to make it one way. Additionally, you can duplicate cameras to setup more complex notification rules - so you can have your normal recording on the first camera, then duplicate it, and set precise motion zones with precise rules on the duplicate camera to send you push notifications, which you keep hidden. So many cases when that kind of precise notification is useful (kid, dog training, etc.) Lots more advance configurations you can do ofc too. You can also setup the rules like above (e.g. when A--->B) to trigger other cameras, like having a PTZ look at your door when another camera detects someone walking towards your door - but not away from it.
ETA: If your computer has the hardware to do it, you can also setup pretty much an unlimited amount of pre-recorded buffer on a camera. If you have headroom, you can easily do a full minute in advance of any trigger. The push notification also can be configured to send a jpeg image or video clip and in my experience, it is very fast (using an image). I don't have much of a need for a doorbell, or doorbell camera, for instance.
I had to do zone crossings in the motion triggers to keep down the false positives.
FWIW, someone might steal my computer, but I save the recordings on a drive location that gets copied to the cloud for safekeeping.
I think there was another security cam thread here where we all discussed BI quite a bit. I'm not using it anywhere near its full potential. Hell, I paid maintenance last year to get it and haven't even upgraded to V5.
I used to install alarms systems. So I have installed a few cameras for myself as well. This is the place I was last researching:
https://www.backstreet-surveillance.com
My big problem is making sure it is -20 capable since I am in the mountains. Its not just us mountain types that need that type of temp capable stuff though. I used to get that type of temp out north and east of Kiowa.
Out in Kiowa I had a really high dollar one that was even blast rated and 20x but didn't want to spend that much lately so was researching else.
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