View Full Version : And the hit's just keep coming. 8 dead at FedEx in Indianapolis.
jerrymrc
04-16-2021, 07:02
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/what-we-know-about-the-indianapolis-shooting-8-dead-at-fedex-facility-suspected-gunman-dead/ar-BB1fIC2M?li=BBnb7Kz
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/what-we-know-about-the-indianapolis-shooting-8-dead-at-fedex-facility-suspected-gunman-dead/ar-BB1fIC2M?li=BBnb7Kz
It's almost as if the media put a call out to crazy people.... oh wait, they did....
KevDen2005
04-16-2021, 07:08
I feel bad for the people there. And no doubt this will be politicised with in seconds
jerrymrc
04-16-2021, 07:16
The disturbing part. “I saw a man with a submachine gun of some sort, an automatic rifle, and he was firing in the open,” Jeremiah Miller said.
KevDen2005
04-16-2021, 07:42
The disturbing part. “I saw a man with a submachine gun of some sort, an automatic rifle, and he was firing in the open,” Jeremiah Miller said.
I read that too. The the likelihood is that it was not a machine gun but the way it looked it and is described will certainly be a talking point
BPTactical
04-16-2021, 07:47
You can almost set your fucking clock by them.....
I feel bad for the people there. And no doubt this will be politicised with in seconds
We've had the problem of mentality challenged, criminal, suicidal people wanting to hurt as many as possible on their "way out" for decades and all the politicians and media do is talk bans and control for law abiding citizens. Write them, tell them this is on their hands. They'll keep blaming us, we blame them. Where is the mental health help? Where is Obamacare, where is the creativity to problem solve? Gone with social media, integrity in journalism, and politics permeate everything...
I've only had a couple responses to my letters to the Colorado Legislature that were Democrats, Long ago. Now I only hear back from Conservatives. The Left has stopped listening... What does that leave us?
One witness reported the shooter was yelling things that he could not understand?
“I see a man come out with a rifle in his hand and he starts firing and he starts yelling stuff that I could not understand,” Levi Miller told WTHR-TV.
KevDen2005
04-16-2021, 08:17
I've only had a couple responses to my letters to the Colorado Legislature that were Democrats, Long ago. Now I only hear back from Conservatives. The Left has stopped listening... What does that leave us?
The only responses I ever get are the canned responses of "We believe common sense control measures will help keep people safer." Even after I give them my entire law enforcement/instruction resume and quote statistics they don't care. I did write Congresswoman Boebert, even though she isn't my rep. Just to tell her people support her.
Great reminder, thank you. I'll have to write her and thank her for her courage and conviction.
I want to know more about this part and if they're related:
Miller said he thought the gunman saw him so he ducked for cover. He added that his friends at work told him another man not initially involved pulled out a gun from his truck to "try and engage the shooter."
Timothy Bouillat, who also works at the facility, told the Washington Post a similar account of how the shooting unfolded and seeing someone who confronted the gunman being shot.
Was guy that grabbed his gun the one that confronted the gunman and was shot? Did gunman take the suicide route when confronted with an armed individual?
.455_Hunter
04-16-2021, 09:50
If an employee actually retrieved a weapon from his vehicle, it will be interesting to learn if his actions impacted the gunman. Did the employee fire his weapon? Did the employee get shots on target before being killed? Did the gunman kill/wound others after being engaged by the employee? Expect any media coverage of the above to be very limited if the employee had any negative effect on the shooter.
I’m sure an AWB is coming with all of these shootings.
The only responses I ever get are the canned responses of "We believe common sense control measures will help keep people safer." Even after I give them my entire law enforcement/instruction resume and quote statistics they don't care. I did write Congresswoman Boebert, even though she isn't my rep. Just to tell her people support her.
For what it is worth, thank you Ken.
If an employee actually retrieved a weapon from his vehicle, it will be interesting to learn if his actions impacted the gunman.
Regardless of whatever happened I suppose there?s a chance the guy could lose his job for having a firearm on company property. Depending on whether or not the company had a policy in place.
Martinjmpr
04-16-2021, 11:24
What's weird is that Yahoo is usually the first to post this sort of thing and I haven't seen anything about it on my Yahoo feed.
https://www.kxan.com/news/texas/san-antonio-airport-locked-down-after-nearby-police-shooting/
Bans are definitely coming.
Rooskibar03
04-16-2021, 11:58
News reporting "man in his 20's". Guessing he isn't fitting the narrative.
BPTactical
04-16-2021, 12:52
Brandon Scott Hole, 19 or 20yo white kid according to what I'm seeing, allegedly known to LE and Feds.
Ooops, not again????
https://nypost.com/2021/04/16/fedex-mass-shooter-was-reportedly-known-to-authorities/
hollohas
04-16-2021, 13:03
I saw that too. Another mass shooter "known to federal authorities"???
I'd love to know how many of these guys were in contact with federal informants...
All AW to NFA is my guess. If not now, after the next one or two. Things getting better and the country starting to re-open seems to set these losers off. They took a bit of a break while everyone felt like shit about the world.
Found out around 11am while checking fedex tracking #.
On top of their website had statement and info.
eddiememphis
04-16-2021, 19:42
From AP
"The former employee who shot and killed eight people at a FedEx facility in Indianapolis was interviewed by FBI agents last year, after his mother called police to say that her son might commit ?suicide by cop,? the bureau said Friday, as investigators searched for a motive in the latest mass shooting to rock the U.S."
"A police report obtained by The Associated Press shows that officers seized a pump-action shotgun from Hole?s home after responding to the mother?s call. Keenan said the gun was never returned."
Not a chance it happens here. The odds it happened there are astronomical.
BPTactical
04-16-2021, 20:47
Well at least he took the self abortion option, sadly too late though.
BREATHER
04-17-2021, 06:18
The Mental Health "system" is seriously flawed. After twenty years in the field I can give my most humble opinion. One very interesting instance was about two years before I retired was when Mr. Trump won the election. The VP of Vocational Rehabilitation came to the site that I ran and had a 30 minute tear jerk session about how terrible it was and that the "corporation" would lose funding. He actually teared up, it was pathetic. Both times Obama took office, guess what I did, I went to work and did my job. On top of that they were more concerned about "trans" this and "trans" that both with the people receiving services and the employees that "came out". The CEO was a gay shrink. The DSM continues to list homosexuality as a MENTAL ILNESS, which impairs the thought process and judgment. It was tough working there as an old Caucasian male that hunted and fished. The whole system is run by liberals which is most of the problem.
jerrymrc
04-17-2021, 07:04
The Mental Health "system" is seriously flawed. After twenty years in the field I can give my most humble opinion. One very interesting instance was about two years before I retired was when Mr. Trump won the election. The VP of Vocational Rehabilitation came to the site that I ran and had a 30 minute tear jerk session about how terrible it was and that the "corporation" would lose funding. He actually teared up, it was pathetic. Both times Obama took office, guess what I did, I went to work and did my job. On top of that they were more concerned about "trans" this and "trans" that both with the people receiving services and the employees that "came out". The CEO was a gay shrink. The DSM continues to list homosexuality as a MENTAL ILNESS, which impairs the thought process and judgment. It was tough working there as an old Caucasian male that hunted and fished. The whole system is run by liberals which is most of the problem.
And I believe we have the ACLU and Reagan to thank. Although not perfect by any means the shuttering of the mental hospitals in the 80's did far more harm than good. I remember many friends that would have issues and check themselves in to Dammasch Hospital in Oregon back in the 70's. Yes there were some there by court order but if self referred one could leave in a 24 hour window. Now except for a "hotline" people have damn near nowhere to go unless you have good insurance or are a service connected vet. Even that is iffy as one of my co-workers for 20 years just OD'd himself last weekend.
IMO, I don't think it is mental health in medical perspective, but how people and government sees them are flawed.
When someone is on simple ssri, the government and people think they are depressed and cannot do their occupation/job.
If people and government treat them as people with leprosy (years back), they are not going to seek help.
eddiememphis
04-18-2021, 11:46
Saw this today...
However, Chief Taylor said the fact that the shooter was able to “legally purchase a much more powerful weapon than a shotgun”
Media needs to know that, Even Sci fi precogs from Minority Report cannot prevent a crime 100%.
Well at least he took the self abortion option, sadly too late though.
Should have put himself first on his hit list.
Aloha_Shooter
04-19-2021, 08:07
My sister has a doctorate in psychology but she specialized in neuropsychology so heavy on scientific method and a lot of biology. I attended her graduation so met a lot of her classmates. IMO, the clinical psychologists in her graduating class had many more "issues" per capita than the general population. Many many more.
I suspect a lot of people go into clinical looking for answers to their own problems and they project their problems a lot. Probably the last group of people I would go to for counseling if I never needed any. I've had a couple friends benefit greatly from psychiatry but that requires an MD as well as psychology.
BTW, I also skimmed through some of their papers while I was up there. Some of the poorest trash I've read in any academic setting. I don't think a single one of them proposed much less demonstrated causal effects. Many (most?) made the classic mistake of relying on statistical correlation to "prove" their hypothesis with no supporting evidence other than correlation.
Make no mistake, the mental health industry is an industry and like any other industry there are some good people in it but there are a lot of other people looking for the quickest easiest buck. Like any other industry, a flood of government or "other peoples" money will cause it to explode.
Amen to that. It's also not just self-psychiatry, but there are also some that get into that right out of school to e.g. "fix my dad", something I've even heard one admit, or in other cases I am sure, "boyfriend", or whatever. I bet it is a tiny minority that go into it for the right reasons, without baggage upon baggage. Luckily, that one switched her major to business after she realized how moronic her young assertions were.
I also think mental health is possibly the most antiquated of all the medical professions. So much of it is based on very old assumptions and the way it categorizes it defies science and logic. Even the DSM itself, broadly categorizes problems in a way that would be akin to calling any kind of a injury to the extremity of your leg "LEG OWIE" and treating them all exactly the same. Amputation? LEG OWIE. Deep vein thrombosis? Nope, LEG OWIE. Toe fungus? Nope, LEG OWIE.
By way of example, schizophrenia has been determined in studies to be no less than six, maybe even nine different "illnesses". But nope, despite the studies, it's all "schizophrenia" and all treated the same, take your fucking pill. It is amazingly stupid to categorize mental illness in the way we do. Rather than DSM categories, it potentially should be broken up into subclasses: E.G.: Structural, genetic, habitual, chemical, neurotransmitter problems or whatever. And treatment customized to the unique landscape. Rather than "Schizophrenic, take your pill" it should be "Prefrontal cortex deficiency, intercranial cyst in visual cortex resulting in hallucinations, genetic predisposition to personality disorders, obsessive habitual coping strategy complicated by a caffeine allergies and a cooccurring dopamine imbalance resulting in xxxx...." [total bullshit here, but just an example of how they SHOULD be digging into it imho]
ETA: If anyone reads too far into this, neither myself nor anyone I've ever known is schizophrenic. I often read studies while taking a crap. It is only an example, not personal experience.
KevDen2005
04-19-2021, 09:10
I also think mental health is possibly the most antiquated of all the medical professions. So much of it is based on very old assumptions and the way it categorizes it defies science and logic. Even the DSM itself, broadly categorizes problems in a way that would be akin to calling any kind of a injury to the extremity of your leg "LEG OWIE" and treating them all exactly the same. Amputation? LEG OWIE. Deep vein thrombosis? Nope, LEG OWIE. Toe fungus? Nope, LEG OWIE.
By way of example, schizophrenia has been determined in studies to be no less than six, maybe even nine different "illnesses". But nope, despite the studies, it's all "schizophrenia" and all treated the same, take your fucking pill. It is amazingly stupid to categorize mental illness in the way we do. Rather than DSM categories, it potentially should be broken up into subclasses: E.G.: Structural, genetic, habitual, chemical, neurotransmitter problems or whatever. And treatment customized to the unique landscape. Rather than "Schizophrenic, take your pill" it should be "Prefrontal cortex deficiency, intercranial cyst in visual cortex resulting in hallucinations, genetic predisposition to personality disorders, obsessive habitual coping strategy complicated by a caffeine allergies and a cooccurring dopamine imbalance resulting in xxxx...." [total bullshit here, but just an example of how they SHOULD be digging into it imho]
ETA: If anyone reads too far into this, neither myself nor anyone I've ever known is schizophrenic. I often read studies while taking a crap. It is only an example, not personal experience.
Dealing with mental illness on a regular basis is nothing like the students in psychiatry understand. I've met many good psychiatrists. I've also met countless bad ones. One major issue is the constant self diagnosis. A person will say they are bipoloar, schizophrenic, or tell me their child has Autism or ADHD but there is no diagnosis from a physician and no prescribed medications and no regular visits to mental healthcare. When people diagnose themselves, they often get categorized into the numbers statistics. In my experience, it is mostly an excuse to get away with doing something wrong.
BPTactical
04-19-2021, 09:43
A good friend of mine from high school’s mom is a fairly prominent psychologist. She explained it quite well to me a long time ago:
Everybody is crazy.
It’s just their state of adjustment on any given day that is of question.
Great-Kazoo
04-19-2021, 11:18
A good friend of mine from high school’s mom is a fairly prominent psychologist. She explained it quite well to me a long time ago:
Everybody is crazy.
It’s just their state of adjustment on any given day that is of question.
Everybody is crazy.
Sounds like the standard saying of convicts. I'm only here, because my lawyer fucked me.
More news...
https://www.foxnews.com/us/indianapolis-fedex-shooter-red-flag-hearing
Authorities believed they had done what they needed to by seizing the pump-action shotgun from Brandon Scott Hole in March 2020, Marion County Prosecutor Ryan Mears said.
"Absolutely there needs to be some intervention and absolutely the firearm needs to be taken away. ... But the risk is if we move forward with that (red flag) process and lose, we have to give that firearm back to that person," Mears said. "That’s not something we were willing to do."
So authorities didn't want to have to prove their case, he was out a shotgun, but could buy a new one since they didn't want to have the possibility of losing a case?
I guess we know how the government works.
"We cannot prove you did it, so just accept the initial action and we will be all good"
Think about what they are saying.... really think about it.
"We will seize what we want, but wont go any further so we wont lose"
Everybody is crazy.
Sounds like the standard saying of convicts. I'm only here, because my lawyer fucked me.
Was she hot?
(sorry for being exclusive but I am assuming she)
bellavite1
04-19-2021, 12:05
Was she hot?
(sorry for being exclusive but I am assuming she)
Bert is above suspicion! [ROFL1]
Everybody is crazy.
Sounds like the standard saying of convicts. I'm only here, because my lawyer fucked me.
I might believe him/her if it was public defender in shady county.
Dealing with mental illness on a regular basis is nothing like the students in psychiatry understand. I've met many good psychiatrists. I've also met countless bad ones. One major issue is the constant self diagnosis. A person will say they are bipoloar, schizophrenic, or tell me their child has Autism or ADHD but there is no diagnosis from a physician and no prescribed medications and no regular visits to mental healthcare. When people diagnose themselves, they often get categorized into the numbers statistics. In my experience, it is mostly an excuse to get away with doing something wrong.
Along the same lines as a psychologist can only treat what a client tells them, as in your mental care is only as good as the answers you decide to give your counselor or psychologist. There is a lot of fuckery that goes on on both sides when a person suffering from a mental issue or disorder meets with a person that is there to help them. A person with serious issues that could probably easily be solved is probably fairly unlikely to open up about themselves and what the real issues are simply because they are embarrassed or whatever the issue.
The other issue too (and has been reflected in other studies) is if normal people go to a psych they will almost always get diagnosed with something. Customer satisfaction? After all, you went there for a reason, they don't want to say "Uh, your life sucks, that is all, you will have to deal with it".
People taking their kids to these professionals left and right is a tragedy in of itself for the same reason. They WILL get a diagnosis from certain doctors, period. Even if they are just being a kid.
The other issue too (and has been reflected in other studies) is if normal people go to a psych they will almost always get diagnosed with something. Customer satisfaction? After all, you went there for a reason, they don't want to say "Uh, your life sucks, that is all, you will have to deal with it".
People taking their kids to these professionals left and right is a tragedy in of itself for the same reason. They WILL get a diagnosis from certain doctors, period. Even if they are just being a kid.
^This.
KevDen2005
04-20-2021, 00:46
Along the same lines as a psychologist can only treat what a client tells them, as in your mental care is only as good as the answers you decide to give your counselor or psychologist. There is a lot of fuckery that goes on on both sides when a person suffering from a mental issue or disorder meets with a person that is there to help them. A person with serious issues that could probably easily be solved is probably fairly unlikely to open up about themselves and what the real issues are simply because they are embarrassed or whatever the issue.
Dealing with mental illness or addressing it can be done without them admitting to it. This does not necessarily mean diagnosing or getting permanent solutions. Having knowledge and training with continued education on the matter can help dig up issues without that person intending on you finding them.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.