View Full Version : Lock "em Up... in Alcatraz?
eddiememphis
05-05-2025, 07:43
https://www.reuters.com/world/us/trump-directs-bureau-prisons-reopen-alcatraz-2025-05-04/
https://www.cnn.com/2025/05/05/us/trump-alcatraz-prison-history-hnk
U.S. President Donald Trump said on Sunday he was directing the Federal Bureau of Prisons to rebuild and reopen the infamous Alcatraz prison in the San Francisco Bay to "house America?s most ruthless and violent Offenders."
"REBUILD, AND OPEN ALCATRAZ!" he posted on the Truth Social platform. "When we were a more serious Nation, in times past, we did not hesitate to lock up the most dangerous criminals, and keep them far away from anyone they could harm."
For a guy that ran and won on cutting federal spending, this seems like an incredibly wasteful idea. Turning the National Park Service attraction back into an actual functioning prison is going to cost a lot more than expanding Supermax in Florence or even building a new prison someplace else.
The entire facility would likely need to be knocked down and rebuilt. That would include all the environmental impact studies in California is famous for. Just planning and permitting would likely take 5 to 10 years. Add to that union labor, material costs in the Bay Area, and legal challenges, and you're talking billions and probably multiple decades to see it through.
One of the reasons it was shut down was because of the expensive logistics of maintaining it. That can only have increased in the time since it closed.
Hopefully, this is just another goofball idea Trump tosses out there to make leftist's heads spin but with this guy, you never know.
He has no problem spending our money.
Oh boy, Sounds more like a Biden idea…. He’s getting tired and his brain must be slipping in his old age.
BushMasterBoy
05-05-2025, 10:40
Tarriffs will mean an excess of shipping containers. So he builds a steel box prison on an island. War with cartels means more prisoners. 87,000 drug overdoses last year? Thats a lot of dead Americans. I'm sure the administration did the math on this issue. I'm going to retire to a sunny beach/swamp soon...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvHsgEZ6lWc
We've been thru this before.................. He just lets ideas flow man.............. just a constant stream of consciousness...........
BPTactical
05-05-2025, 14:57
Cost prohibitive
Here we are trying to cut waste and someone thinks it might be a good idea to open a place that was rotten and at the end of it's lifespan when they closed it due to the fact that it required 3x the funds and resources to operate than any other prison and the buildings were basically junk.
We've been thru this before.................. He just lets ideas flow man.............. just a constant stream of consciousness...........
Oh yeah that’s right! Stream of consciousness, man!
TEAMRICO
05-05-2025, 17:21
Trump says something. PANIC!!!
Train station's a LOT cheaper.....
His point is that prison SHOULD be HELL.
-John {I speak Trump}
His point is that prison SHOULD be HELL.
-John {I speak Trump}
Dont start applying reason to his comments.
People would rather FREAK THE F out everytime he speaks and whine about it.
People still have TDS dont forget.
JohnnyDrama
05-07-2025, 20:22
We've been thru this before.................. He just lets ideas flow man.............. just a constant stream of consciousness...........
Wait until someone gets wind of his idea to raise the Titanic.
Dont start applying reason to his comments.
People would rather FREAK THE F out everytime he speaks and whine about it.
People still have TDS dont forget.
Isn't reason pointing out contradictions such as asserting they are cutting government spending when they are actually grossly expanding it?
Or is facts TDS, and blind faith is, what exactly.
Define grossly?
Do you mean spending us 34 trillion dollars in to debt?
Because resurrecting Alcatraz, is not gross, for the message it sends.
After all, how much can it cost to hold a man in prison?
-John
Define grossly?
Do you mean spending us 34 trillion dollars in to debt?
Because resurrecting Alcatraz, is not gross, for the message it sends.
After all, how much can it cost to hold a man in prison?
-John
About $70K per year, assuming the infrastructure is already paid for, so NOT Alcatraz.
eddiememphis
05-09-2025, 16:01
Wait until someone gets wind of his idea to raise the Titanic.
We're going to raise the Titanic—bigger, better, and more beautiful than ever before. It’ll float again, folks. Just like our great American spirit. This is going to be the most incredible, most luxurious ship recovery in the history of mankind. Nobody raises ships like I do. It’s going to be a very classy salvage. Very elegant. Gold trim. The best people, Jim Cameron, Elon, Lil Marco, only the best people.
The Titanic went down under weak leadership. We're bringing it back under strong leadership—the strongest. We're going to make the Titanic great again!
We're going to raise the Titanic—bigger, better, and more beautiful than ever before. It’ll float again, folks. Just like our great American spirit. This is going to be the most incredible, most luxurious ship recovery in the history of mankind. Nobody raises ships like I do. It’s going to be a very classy salvage. Very elegant. Gold trim. The best people, Jim Cameron, Elon, Lil Marco, only the best people.
The Titanic went down under weak leadership. We're bringing it back under strong leadership—the strongest. We're going to make the Titanic great again!
Absolutely perfect! Well done. I’m gonna save that snippet for my friend who does trump impressions.
His point is that prison SHOULD be HELL.
-John {I speak Trump}
How is the current "correctional facility" model working out for the USA? What is recidivism rate of people that have been "corrected" in these facilities?
eddiememphis
05-11-2025, 08:17
How is the current "correctional facility" model working out for the USA? What is recidivism rate of people that have been "corrected" in these facilities?
https://www.ussc.gov/research/research-reports/recidivism-among-federal-offenders-comprehensive-overview
A federal offender’s criminal history was closely correlated with recidivism rates. Rearrest rates range from 30.2 percent for offenders with zero total criminal history points to 80.1 percent of offenders in the highest Criminal History Category, VI. Each additional criminal history point was generally associated with a greater likelihood of recidivism.
A federal offender’s age at time of release into the community was also closely associated with differences in recidivism rates. Offenders released prior to age 21 had the highest rearrest rate, 67.6 percent, while offenders over sixty years old at the time of release had a recidivism rate of 16.0 percent
https://www.ussc.gov/research/research-reports/recidivism-among-federal-offenders-comprehensive-overview
A federal offender’s criminal history was closely correlated with recidivism rates. Rearrest rates range from 30.2 percent for offenders with zero total criminal history points to 80.1 percent of offenders in the highest Criminal History Category, VI. Each additional criminal history point was generally associated with a greater likelihood of recidivism.
A federal offender’s age at time of release into the community was also closely associated with differences in recidivism rates. Offenders released prior to age 21 had the highest rearrest rate, 67.6 percent, while offenders over sixty years old at the time of release had a recidivism rate of 16.0 percent
What business would be in business with 16, 30, 67 or 80% failure rate ?
eddiememphis
05-11-2025, 14:25
Prisons are not about fixing people.
They’re about separating dangerous people from society.
Rehabilitation is available — but only works if the inmate wants it.
Most don’t. That’s why they come back.
You can’t force someone to change.
Do the crime, do the time. Do it again, go back.
…
Do the crime, do the time. Do it again, go back.
Depending on what it is, it should be “Do it again, and get “disappeared”… and I don’t think I’m alone in that feeling, the older I get….
What business would be in business with 16, 30, 67 or 80% failure rate ?
The whole country, andd it's leader, I 'spose.
https://time.com/3988970/donald-trump-business/
Lets not talk about our failure rate w/r/t to the military either. There's a saying internationally.... it's very dangerous to reject America's "assistance", but outright deadly to be America's friend.
eddiememphis
05-11-2025, 20:39
What business would be in business with 16, 30, 67 or 80% failure rate ?
Criminal rehabilitation is more like sales than production.
In sales, those are strong numbers. Most salesmen would be very happy with a 20% conversion rate, especially with a hostile customer base.
The main thing I have seen, that I disagree with, is people getting busted for small amounts of drugs.
This just happens over and over and over again, and results in them becoming better at prison life than real life.
If they are driving impaired, bust them.
If they are smelling flowers in the park, leave them alone.
-John
Once locked up, it should be painful, and I think the prison system has a pretty good handle on what is good behavior, and what is bad behavior. Good behavior results in priviliges, bad behavior results in a loss of priviliges, or worse.
Alcatraz, for you.
-John
Prisons are not about fixing people.
They’re about separating dangerous people from society.
Rehabilitation is available — but only works if the inmate wants it.
Most don’t. That’s why they come back.
You can’t force someone to change.
Do the crime, do the time. Do it again, go back.
Then why lie and say say department of corrections?
Why are they “correctional facilities” if they are not correcting anything?
Let’s be honest what prisons, especially private one. They are an industry that makes money (employment, builidings, administration, etc) off of having forced guests paid for by tax payers.
Think about this. Some municipal judges have family ownership in ignition interlock business. Why would their families own these?
Once locked up, it should be painful, and I think the prison system has a pretty good handle on what is good behavior, and what is bad behavior. Good behavior results in priviliges, bad behavior results in a loss of priviliges, or worse.
Alcatraz, for you.
-John
I hope one day you get falsely accused of something and get in the system.
Can’t happen to you, huh?
Couldn’t happen to an ex-president that was accused (and convicted) of a financial crime of hiding a crime where said crime was never identified and not proven. Guilty of hiding crime that no one knows what the crime is.
Or go through a nasty divorce. Some women claim a lot of crimes so they get a leg up in the civil proceedings or as revenge.
I think the number of not guilty people in prison is a lot higher than anyone really wants to admit.
We don’t have a justice system. We have a legal system where the participants in the system are making a lot of money as part of the system. Why does anyone think Franklin Azar exists and had a $400k Maybach?
I hope one day you get falsely accused of something and get in the system.
Can’t happen to you, huh?
Couldn’t happen to an ex-president that was accused (and convicted) of a financial crime of hiding a crime where said crime was never identified and not proven. Guilty of hiding crime that no one knows what the crime is.
Or go through a nasty divorce. Some women claim a lot of crimes so they get a leg up in the civil proceedings or as revenge.
I think the number of not guilty people in prison is a lot higher than anyone really wants to admit.
We don’t have a justice system. We have a legal system where the participants in the system are making a lot of money as part of the system. Why does anyone think Franklin Azar exists and had a $400k Maybach?
I like your points. Obviously, I don't hope for innocent accusations for anyone here but we all know that's tounge in cheek. "Framed" is a book that should be a required read in the educational system - by John Grisham. People have little idea how easy it is to get sucked into that system ESPECIALLY when you're the "upstanding citizen with nothing to hide". The standard of evidence to potentially end up on death row is effectively, nothing at all.
buffalobo
05-13-2025, 11:44
I think our general population would be amazed by the ownership interest judges hold in rehab facilities, half way houses, honor camps etc.
Not justice system, legal system as has been said. Very sticky, like spider web, once entangled very hard to escape it.
If you're unarmed, you are a victim
hurley842002
05-13-2025, 12:38
Some of you gents are making good points on our criminal justice system. I will say this, I left the ?business? after 20 years in corrections (10 state of Colorado and 10 Fed), because I no longer have faith in ?the system?.
Alcatraz being open for anything other than a tourist attraction is a joke, there are currently functioning federal prisons (one in Littleton) that should be closed because the ?facilities budget? is astronomical and no longer fiscally responsible.
All Federal prison camps need to be closed, ankle monitors and home confinement.
eddiememphis
05-13-2025, 16:22
...there are currently functioning federal prisons (one in Littleton) that should be closed because the ?facilities budget? is astronomical and no longer fiscally responsible...
You mean this one?
https://kdvr.com/news/federal-prison-facility-in-colorado-being-deactivated/
The Federal Bureau of Prisons is deactivating a minimum security prison camp in Littleton and moving the inmates to other facilities, it announced Thursday. The camp is in need of significant repairs, which the bureau says will cost $26 million.
hurley842002
05-13-2025, 16:29
You mean this one?
https://kdvr.com/news/federal-prison-facility-in-colorado-being-deactivated/
The Federal Bureau of Prisons is deactivating a minimum security prison camp in Littleton and moving the inmates to other facilities, it announced Thursday. The camp is in need of significant repairs, which the bureau says will cost $26 million.
Yes, but the camp that was only part of the ?complex?, there is a low security secure facility on the property that was built in the 30?s, originally a boys facility if I remember correctly and later converted to a prison, that is where the money is being wasted.
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