Being called a liar

[Prairiedogsfearme]

Two years ago now I was burglarized and my gun vault was stolen out of my basement with all of my long rifles in it. The cops did a very superficial investigation and closed the case. To answer your first question of course I had all the serial numbers and pics of the rifles in question… they were in the vault; I mean seriously who thinks robbers are going to take a 700# gun vault. I know, stupid me.
Well almost a year later I found one of my rifles at an Aurora pawn shop. I did what I was supposed to and called the police and went through the whole B.S. Only to have the officer tell me that without the serial number, a receipt blah, blah, blah. There was no way I was going to get my rifle back. I said well I don’t have that explained the reasons and said I do have brass fired through the rifle and the free bore measurement, and so on. He didn’t even so much as take any of my brass, the rifle was left at the pawn shop for 2 weeks and he called me and told me I was lying to him and there was no way he would give me my gun. He further stated that he was going to contact the detective on my case and have him open an investigation into me as the person who stole my own guns.
My response was to tell him fine have me investigated I have nothing to hide, further anytime he wanted to come to my door and call me a liar he could come over. He lied about doing his job, but I am the liar here. In short don’t trust the police to find your stuff, they don’t want the right and legal owner to have their own stuff.

[BigBear]

LIAR!!!


Kidding. Sorry about your loss. Unfortunately, I've heard this tale several times.... Seems like there isn't much you CAN do in a robbery.

[Irving]

Sounds like he's trying to weasel his way out of doing his job. Talk to his supervisor.

I got jumped on camera and put in the hospital a few years ago. The detective got the address of the car the guys drove away in and "called them and asked them to come in, otherwise there is nothing I can do."

Cool thanks for the help.

[BigBear]

Wait, wait... Stuart?! They had it ON TAPE and they did not do anything? Wow... a new low.

[Irving]

I guess you can only investigate a criminal if they agree to come in, if they feel like it.

My cousin tried to break up a fight last month and got sucker punched from behind and knocked out. He was a regular at the bar and someone who works there gave his info out. They haven't brought him in either. So much for trying to be a good Samaritan.

[trlcavscout]

Anytime you HAVE to rely on LE, you might as well give up. I called 911 1 time in Las Vegas do to a drug deal gone bad and a big ordeal that happened in front of my house involving gang members, it was X-mas day and the whole family was there caught in the middle of it. It took the cops 45 minutes to get there and then they said 1 guy had warrants the rest got set free after I had to stand out there and ID them. The cop then told me if they started trouble with me to go ahead and defend my family and then call them back!

I feel for you man. So moral of the story is you HAVE to keep receipts for all firearm purchases to ever recover after a theft?

[Prairiedogsfearme]

Seems like everyone is thrilled with LE. [Mad]

[jake]

I got jumped on camera and put in the hospital a few years ago. The detective got the address of the car the guys drove away in and "called them and asked them to come in, otherwise there is nothing I can do."
When I was burgled a few years ago (back in England) the guy left a rucksack with a wallet and ID in it in the back garden. I handed it over to the police but they said it wouldn't be his as no one would be that stupid. Guess what...

I essentially gathered the evidence myself by getting security tapes from Blockbuster (he used my card to rent some movies and didn't return them) and pestering the officer assigned to my case every couple of days until they finally arrested him.

[Hoser]

It sucks and I feel for you. Hopefully your insurance took care of you following the theft.

But please tell me you didnt come here to just bitch about Law Enforcement.

[al_g]

If your insurance did cover the theft, turn the info over to them. An insurance company calling a pawn shop and the police will likely get a far better response.

[Zundfolge]

I had a handgun stolen during a real estate inspection.

Got a copy of the police report so I could file with NRA insurance (as an NRA member you have a free $1000 insurance policy) it was clear from reading it that he didn't do his job. The worthless CSPD "detective" did a half ass "investigation" mostly investigating ME for "filing a false report". I even had to take a polygraph over it.

Thing is this wasn't even a random theft, the only people in the house were the lady under contract to buy our house, her realtor and the home inspector (they also stole some prescription pain killers my wife had ... she'd just had surgery). I could understand if they had to hunt down some shadowy cat burgler but you had 3 freakin' suspects RIGHT THERE and he NEVER EVEN INTERVIEWED the home inspector!


Cops are worthless.

[KevDen2005]

Sorry to hear that the officer didn't do his job, I would contact his supervisor. As a police officer I am very sorry many of you are upset with LE. However, sometimes there is literally nothing we can do for instance if something gets stolen out of your car and you don't have the serial number for it, video, suspect description, a list of enemies that we can start with or something like that.

I have never called anyone a liar unless i got them in a bold face lie that I could prove to make sure I didn't get a reprimand.

As for APD or CSPD (I don't work for either of these agencies), their call load is extremely high and once again I am defending the officer for not doing his job but keep in mind that it is much hard to solve a theft when there are 1st degree assaults, murders, and such pending to be responded to.

A few bad cops give us a really bad name, the majority of cops will do their job. However, if a crime occurs, always ask for the case number right away so you can give it to your insurance company, etc. This also make the officer write a report (even one without suspect information, and there are a lot of those) to document the fact that a crime occurred.

Keep in mind too, that if your car is broken into that an officer is probably not going to get finger prints, not only do agencies wait for much more serious crimes for things like this, but most agencies need the prints to be ran by an outside agency like CBI or FBI. Those agencies tell local LE that unless it is a serious crime (which they will hand out the list of what the deem as a serious crime) they are not going to process it.

I also say this, if you are 100 percent right (and only you can know this) then fight it. If you are in any way wrong, or really a suspect (again, only you can know this) than it may not be worth your trouble. I also tell people you can catch more flies with honey. If after I have worked all night and I have to stay over several hours to take your call I may not be as pleasant as you would like, so if you are polite to me when I get to your home I will be much more inclined to give a 100 percent effort rather than what the law really only requires of me.

Again, I apologize on behalf of LE that your call wasn't handled the way you want it. As long as you don't attack me I would be more than happy to help you look for answers about LE questions.

[ronaldrwl]

It's disappointing to hear this. If it's any consulation, after reading your story, it motivated me to gather all my records and move them to our fire safe. Coincidentally, I just installed my gun safe this weekend. That was a job. Anybody trying to remove it will need a demolition crew.

[Elhuero]

KevDen2005, excellent post. Stay safe and best of luck to you in your travels.

[KevDen2005]

I also wanted to add I always recommend serial number, receipts, pictures, and storage of such in a fire safe or something similar. Things of value like jewelery, antiques, FIREARMS, etc.

If you live in Aurora or Denver you probably already know this, but a lot of neighborhoods I patrol I find a lot of open garages and unlocked cars within them. If you choose to park your car in your garage make sure you lock it and don't leave keys in it. No matter where your cars are parked they should be locked and and never leave IPODs, Computers, GPS units, CD's (Do they still make those?) in your car, and if you do leave them in there at least put them in a hidden place. Professional criminals don't want to waste time on nothing.

I am a huge fan of sensor lights and car alarms, house alarms are good, but I don't care for them too much.

Again, hope this is helpful.

[KevDen2005]

KevDen2005, excellent post. Stay safe and best of luck to you in your travels.


Thank you, I really do appreciate that.

[68Charger]

In an effort to make this thread more about being called a liar, and less about bashing LE (Which I would have no reason to do), I'll share this story:

My brother-in-law has a new girlfriend.. she does cleaning for a living, apparently to include salvaging of metals, etc...

I have some cleanup that I haven't gotten to, and she volunteered to help, in exchange for being able to sell the metals for salvage value (there was some steel, some old copper wiring & some aluminum from a trailer).. when they were there, my wife mentioned some steel stairs that we had removed (they were on a deck that I dismantled) and that she would "ask me if it was ok".. the girlfriend had brought an "accomplice" (for lack of a better word) that was helping her... he enthusiastically responded "I'll take them, my brother can use them for the loft in his barn" my wife reiterated she had to check with me- then mentioned it to me, and I was agreeable to them having the stairs, if "they knew someone who could use them as stairs, they're worth more the scrap"

my wife did NOT convey this information yet, but 2 days later I come home (after dark) to the stairs partially cut up (they wouldn't fit in his mini-truck, so he was cutting them up into thirds, and was taking them to salvage as scrap, because "his brother hadn't gotten back to him yet"), and some other steel I-Beams were out next to the stairs that were never part of the deal...

I contacted my brother-in-law to find out what was going on, and he said the "accomplice" was on his way back to pick up the I-Beams.. caught him after he loaded them up, and confronted him...

He started to tell me that my wife had said it was ok (she didn't), but seemed to realize from my reaction that the lie was not going to fly... and agreed to put them back... after verifying the conversations (or lack thereof), I informed the girlfriend that her "accomplice" was no longer welcome on my property, as he could not be trusted...

I don't know why he thought I would believe somebody I've NEVER met who shows up unannounced AFTER DARK to load up property that didn't belong to him >instead< of my wife of nearly 20 years, the mother of my children...

at some point, he realized this too, and has not been back since- I would at a minimum press charges for trespassing...

[TFOGGER]

It's disappointing to hear this. If it's any consulation, after reading your story, it motivated me to gather all my records and move them to our fire safe. Coincidentally, I just installed my gun safe this weekend. That was a job. Anybody trying to remove it will need a demolition crew.

Mine is 684 lbs empty, and bolted into the floor joists with 4 inch long lag bolts that are only accessible from the inside. If someone tries to steal it, I hope the die of a ruptured hernia. Of course, if they're in my house, it would be best for them if I were not home, as I would probably see that as a threat to my life and safety. [AR15]

[Irving]

I don't know why he thought I would believe somebody I've NEVER met who shows up unannounced AFTER DARK to load up property that didn't belong to him >instead< of my wife of nearly 20 years, the mother of my children...




Well, just from reading this, you do come off as kind of a liar. Just saying...

[rondog]

OK, I recently ordered some Jeep parts, and had to give my credit card info over the phone. I'm certain that a co-worker in the next cubicle overheard me (only about 3-4 feet away, behind a cubicle wall), wrote the info down, and then went shopping. Several purchases and attempts were made, all stuff that's directly in-line with his interests. There's also reasons why I think he'd do this to me.

My bank detected the abnormal activity, and flat-out blocked several of the purchases, then called me in under 24 hours to discuss what was going on. The two purchases that did go through have been credited back to me.

I've filed a police report, and filled in my manager about my suspicions so he won't be blindsided by what might happen. Still haven't heard from the police yet, but it's only been a couple days.

Now, do I have a chance in hell of ever seeing anything happen with this? Or am I just screwed? Granted, I'm not out any money because all purchase attempts failed, but a crime was still committed against me.

Seems to me it shouldn't be hard for the po-po to get the info from the merchants about what was ordered, who ordered it, and what address it was supposed to go to. If he DID do this, it shouldn't be hard to connect him to it. He was essentially ordering gifts for a girlfriend of his.

[Elhuero]

OK, I recently ordered some Jeep parts, and had to give my credit card info over the phone. I'm certain that a co-worker in the next cubicle overheard me (only about 3-4 feet away, behind a cubicle wall), wrote the info down, and then went shopping. Several purchases and attempts were made, all stuff that's directly in-line with his interests. There's also reasons why I think he'd do this to me.

My bank detected the abnormal activity, and flat-out blocked several of the purchases, then called me in under 24 hours to discuss what was going on. The two purchases that did go through have been credited back to me.

I've filed a police report, and filled in my manager about my suspicions so he won't be blindsided by what might happen. Still haven't heard from the police yet, but it's only been a couple days.

Now, do I have a chance in hell of ever seeing anything happen with this? Or am I just screwed? Granted, I'm not out any money because all purchase attempts failed, but a crime was still committed against me.

Seems to me it shouldn't be hard for the po-po to get the info from the merchants about what was ordered, who ordered it, and what address it was supposed to go to. If he DID do this, it shouldn't be hard to connect him to it. He was essentially ordering gifts for a girlfriend of his.



a brick thru his window should even things out

[Hoosier]

@rondog -- if you got refunded or no money was lost to you, then the victim is the bank that secures your credit card, as they're liable for any charges, AFAIK.

As for backups, I'll add my suggestion, use a digital camera or page scanner to scan receipts, take pictures of serial numbers, store all important data. Use a program called http://www.truecrypt.org to create an encrypted file container into which you put these files. Store a copy on your HDD and on a USB thumb drive or external HDD which you keep off site. Could be a bank deposit box, at your office, etc.

H.

[coop68]

I am sorry to hear your fire arms where stolen for the person who started this thread. i would say keeping a record of all your firearms and even updating them often when you add a part or scope. I use a program that I received from a LE friend and shooter, it stores all my gun info plus I have a written log in my safe and backed up file on my external hard drive Plus pictures. This is just me I am guessing a few of us here do the same or perhaps after this thread will be.
Story:
When I was doing an internship for the local police department at my college we got an email about a gun that was pawned that matched a report of a stolen rifle out of a safe. Pawn shops here in NE are required to turn in tickets of items they buy, it just so happened the models matched and this was an odd rifle you don’t see often. We went to the extent of going to the shop and looking at the rifle unfortunately the numbers didn’t match up. But my questions to are LE members does Colorado have a similar system? I do know here that if your item is stolen and sold to the pawn shop the owner has to pay the pawn shop for whatever they paid for your item in order to get it back which sucks. Being a smaller town things do get looked at more often from my observation. But was wondering if there was something similar? Based on what happened I’m guessing not in Colorado at this time. thought i would ask.

[KevDen2005]

Rondog, glad to hear you got your money back. Basically it comes down to being able to prove it was him. IP addresses can link back to computers/companies, now the hard part is actually proving that the suspect was behind the computer doing that to you. Most of the time I would say without a good investigator pushing for a confession, its not going to happen, especially since mostly everything was blocked and you had your money refunded. If he actually still has those items, without having them in plain view or you seeing them at his house it would be nearly impossible to link him to that, but still possible.

My first suggestion is to make sure you have changed all your account info and your passwords. Keep an eye on that guy and see if you can get any info out of him.

[ronaldrwl]

As a business owner myself I can tell you it's a foolish business that will ship merchandise to an address different from the credit card holders address. If they do, they are talking all the risk. Not only will the money be returned to the card holder, they will pay a "Charge Back" fee.

[Hoosier]

@ronaldrwl You can implement "Verified By Visa" which is basically a PIN number check run by Visa themselves. They guarantee any purchase that they approve via it, I heard.

[68Charger]

Well, just from reading this, you do come off as kind of a liar. Just saying...

Know it all... [Coffee]


I was kinda pissed, guess I'm still not over it, [Rant1]and I over emphasized.. sue me[BooHoo]

[rondog]

Rondog, glad to hear you got your money back. Basically it comes down to being able to prove it was him. IP addresses can link back to computers/companies, now the hard part is actually proving that the suspect was behind the computer doing that to you. Most of the time I would say without a good investigator pushing for a confession, its not going to happen, especially since mostly everything was blocked and you had your money refunded. If he actually still has those items, without having them in plain view or you seeing them at his house it would be nearly impossible to link him to that, but still possible.

My first suggestion is to make sure you have changed all your account info and your passwords. Keep an eye on that guy and see if you can get any info out of him.

Thanks! I don't know if he did this online or via phone. From my experiences, ordering online seems more secure because of the fact it nearly always asks for your Billing Address, which if you don't have that you're not going anywhere. Ordering by phone, you just need the card number, exp. date, and 3-digit code on the back. All of which he could have overheard when I ordered my parts. We sit close enough to hear each other fart.

This guy seems to think I'm wealthy for some reason, and he loves to play the ladies. Obsessed with big women, sex and money. He's always acting jealous of the money he "thinks" I have, and always bitching about how much of "his money" he has to spend to charm his way into some hogger's pants. If he had the opportunity to use someone else's money to get himself laid, I can see him jumping at the chance. He seems to think I owe him something, and should fork over cash to "hep a brotha out".

The attempted charges were for wine, flowers, a big-ass teddy bear ($160!), a membership for a meetdemfatbitches.com dating service, and several tries to open Skype accounts. He also got an ass-chewing recently for excessive personal text messaging from "the ladies" on his company-issued cellphone. Skype accounts? Hmmmm.

I'm just thinking that any other thief would have tried to buy big-ticket electronics or something worthwhile, not gifts for some ho.

[theGinsue]

A few bad cops give us a really bad name, the majority of cops will do their job.

Agreed. Most LEO's still try to do their jobo the way it's meant to be performed. Unfortunately it only takes a few bad apples to establish a bad stereotype.


.......rather than what the law really only requires of me.

It's it sad the way things have gone? When the law only requires a half-assed job on behalf of it's LE agencies & citizens have to rely on officers who are willing to above and beyond to get the assistance they need?


KevDen2005, excellent post. Stay safe and best of luck to you in your travels.

+1


a brick thru his window should even things out

Yeah, or even better, 1 brick a week for a month!

[rondog]

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack this thread. AFA the original post, yeah, that's messed up! As ordinary citizens, we certainly should be able to expect more help from LE, I would think. Makes me wonder just what can I do to protect my property. Guess I need to get busy photographing and recording every little detail about all my guns. Better do the knives and bayonets too.

Sure is discouraging to hear that a gun can get stolen, you find it in a pawn shop and tell the police "I found it! Here it is!!!", and then be accused of "stealing" and pawning it yourself. Not to mention you have to pay the pawnbroker for it to get it back? Oh, that would REALLY piss me off! [Rant1]

[theGinsue]

.....Not to mention you have to pay the pawnbroker for it to get it back? Oh, that would REALLY piss me off! [Rant1]

That practice should really be stopped. Whether the pawn broker purchased the item in good faith or not, he is still in possession of stolen merchandise (which belongs to YOU) and the item(s) should be returned to their owner without the owner having to pay for it (again).

If you or I had stolen merchandise in our possession, do you think that it would carry any weight that we had a Bill of Sale for the item and claimed that we purchased it in good faith? Heck no. The item would be taken from us with NO compensation and returned to the owner.

How is it that a retailer, especially a pawn broker is exempt from this? Aren't they supposed to know better (My understanding is that pawn brokers are supposed to be tightly regulated)?

[rondog]

That practice should really be stopped. Whether the pawn broker purchased the item in good faith or not, he is still in possession of stolen merchandise (which belongs to YOU) and the item(s) should be returned to their owner without the owner having to pay for it (again).

If you or I had stolen merchandise in our possession, do you think that it would carry any weight that we had a Bill of Sale for the item and claimed that we purchased it in good faith? Heck no. The item would be taken from us with NO compensation and returned to the owner.

How is it that a retailer, especially a pawn broker is exempt from this? Aren't they supposed to know better (My understanding is that pawn brokers are supposed to be tightly regualted)?

PRECISELY correct!!! My stepkids and the slime they hung out with used to be active heroin addicts, and they could steal and pawn anything in Denver with total impunity. Their favorite target was brand-new tools from Home Depot. They'd steal 'em, unwrap them outside the pawn shops and pawn 'em with no problems. Useless turds should be in prison forever for all the things they did. Instead, us taxpayers are supporting them via Section 8, free methadone, and whatever other freebies they can get from the gooberment's "social programs". While my wife and I are raising the daughter's kid because she can't be bothered. Kid would suffer anyway.

[theGinsue]

I never understood why it is that those of us who try to do the right thing and be responsible seem to be held accountable for our actions - often times to a higher standard than one might expect - while the dirt bags aren't held accountable at all.

[Colorado Luckydog]

95% of cops give the rest of them a bad name.