View Full Version : Question about Open-Carry
Half Live
03-05-2010, 18:48
Ok, I work at King Soopers. So after I clocked out, I went home. Maybe like 1 hour later I went back, not to work but to grab some food so I was off the clock and was there as a customer. I had my handgun in my holster on my side in open view as my shirt was tucked in and I had no coat on. As I was getting ready to leave I stopped to talk to a co-worker real quick.
Then the store manager (my boss) came up to me and asked why I had a gun and it was not concealed as another customer told them she saw my gun. I told her I carry it for self defense and I can't conceal it since I don't have my CCW permit yet. I also told her I was off the clock and did not have it on me when I was working earlier. She then told me she wants to talk to me tomorrow when I come in to work.
I am afraid that she might fire me. Can she fire me for open-carrying legally while off the clock and on my own time?
Edit: I have been in a few King Soopers with no problems before and in 3 years of working there I have never seen a No Firearms Allowed sign.
There really are very few laws protecting you as an employee. If your boss asked you to sleep with her and you refused, she could legally fire you.
That doesn't mean that you wouldn't be able to sue them and settle out of court. There is a pro-gun attorney thread stickied in here some where if you think you need help. Doesn't the union offer you any protection from stuff like this? Good luck tomorrow.
Seems to me it will be based on your employee contract or in the absence of that it will be the employee handbook (got to think KS has a long list of do's and don'ts)
My employer specifically prohibits any carry while on company business or at a company site unless given specific OK based on conditions (out in remote locations a truck gun is sometimes allowed).
This being a right to work state unless you are union you have a right to carry and they have a right not to employ you. Got to make your choices.
I am not saying I support that position but I reserve the right to employ who I want when I hire as long as I do not discriminate based on a protected class. I have had several small companies and while I would respect your right to carry I might ask you not to do so in certain situations. Even when off the clock you are still representing in some respect the employer if at the location.
Half Live
03-05-2010, 19:15
Ok, if I was told I can't carry while in there while working or not working I wouldn't. But in 3 years I was never told I can't and I talk about guns a lot.
Ok, if I was told I can't carry while in there while working or not working I wouldn't. But in 3 years I was never told I can't and I talk about guns a lot.
I suspect she will ask you not to open carry and is more worried about upset customers then taking your job or getting in the middle of a gun rights issue.
Give her the benifit of the doubt, see if she is reasonable.
Daniel_187
03-05-2010, 22:49
I got fired for taken the CC class(at gander Mtn) then running into the HR bitch for crocs when i was leaving the class.
Bitch: Hi what are you doing here
Me: taking a class
Bitch: Oh
she saw the sign about the ccw in front of the classroom and knew what class i was taking and was fired a month later, just enough time for her to make up some shit about me
Crocs the bar or the shoe place? I used to work the door at the bar.
I am thinking she is just going to ask you not to open carry while on company property. she can't say a whole lot about CCW as long as she never sees it. customers probably know you and want to know why you open carry, which could cause problems for the company...and for me too since I own stock![Coffee]
I would imagine she will just talk with you about it. She wouldn't want to get in a big legal dispute over your right to carry etc. etc. but it also depends on what your company handbook says and the rules of working there. if anything is in there (and probably is) that says you can't have a firearm on company property or whatever BS they feed you, that might be grounds for termination.
Half Live
03-06-2010, 11:21
Well apparently it is against company policy to even have a gun on company property. So now I am getting terminated for it but me and the union are fighting it. Luckily I know the Union President personally since she was my old union rep before she became the President.
So since this might take a few months to resolve, does anyone know where I can get a job that pays at least $14 per hour and offers health benefits?
Daniel_187
03-06-2010, 12:12
Crocs the bar or the shoe place? I used to work the door at the bar.
The ugly shoe place
I would sue the bajeesus out of them.
RCCrawler
03-06-2010, 12:20
I would sue the bajeesus out of them.
On what grounds?
If his handbook/contract/whatever says he cannot bring a firearm onto company property and he does, they have every right to enforce their rules.
It doesn't mean I agree with it.
Safeway was about to go on a labor dispute awhile ago so they were hiring. Good luck. Sorry to hear this.
I'd look into suing as well. Company policies that violate your rights (especially while you're not on the clock) shouldn't exist. We all know that you don't have to have a case to sue someone.
Half Live
03-06-2010, 12:21
I would sue the bajeesus out of them.
Me and the Union are going to fight this with a basis on the right to bare arms.
The ugly shoe place
huh I'm sorry to hear this my sister still works for this company as a designer!!!
half life: best of luck with this issue, maybe you will get a huge lawsuit and get a bunch of new toys!![Beer]
So since this might take a few months to resolve, does anyone know where I can get a job that pays at least $14 per hour and offers health benefits?
Off the top of my head I know the T-Mobile call center in thornton is hiring. It pays ballpark $14 an hour and has great benefits. I work in their sales department which would start out at $10, but you get paid commission. If you can deal with customer service type issues its at least a job for the time being. Of course you will sign another document saying you will not bring weapons into work. You should make it a habit to open carry at that King Soopers regularly when your case is settled just to stick it to the man!
Half Live
03-06-2010, 16:33
Off the top of my head I know the T-Mobile call center in thornton is hiring. It pays ballpark $14 an hour and has great benefits. I work in their sales department which would start out at $10, but you get paid commission. If you can deal with customer service type issues its at least a job for the time being. Of course you will sign another document saying you will not bring weapons into work. You should make it a habit to open carry at that King Soopers regularly when your case is settled just to stick it to the man!
Thornton is kinda far for me. I live in Littleton. I don't think I will open carry in King Soopers anymore since I called up the corporate office and talked to the Security department and asked them about their position on firearms. They say they allow concealed carry but not open carry. I guess I will be shopping at Wal mart now and get my coffee at Starbucks.
Daniel_187
03-06-2010, 17:16
Co's right to work it really shitty, if you wear purple socks to work and it pisses off HR or your manager they can fire you(or my fav Self termination, um Puke) this is the price we pay for workin for the man
Half Live
03-06-2010, 17:21
Co's right to work it really shitty, if you wear purple socks to work and it pisses off HR or your manager they can fire you(or my fav Self termination, um Puke) this is the price we pay for workin for the man
Wait, I thought that the right to work bill didn't pass? Plus I'm in an Union so that right to work crap doesn't really apply to me.
It still applies, they can fight to bypass it for you.
RCCrawler
03-06-2010, 21:16
Are you a member of RMGO, a call to them may be helpful.
Half Live
03-07-2010, 15:21
No, I'm not a member but I've decided that I'm going to cut my losses and offer to quit without having a termination on my record and ask for my last paycheck. I've never really felt like it was going to be my career working at a grocery store.
KevDen2005
03-07-2010, 15:34
If you get fired and claim a grievance then a lot of times you can still get unemployment benefits...had that happen in my case. Not sure if you still can if quit. You may not want a termination but you may need the unemployment until a new job can be found, and you can explain to future employers that you had a private grievance. And it depends on who you work for, future employers may not even really look into it.
I had a similar situation where I was told I couldn't come back to my job, but was allowed to "resign in lieu of termination" and they said they would just say I was laid off and not contest unemployment. I DID have to sign a bunch of bullshit papers saying I'd forever stay off the property in order to get paid severance. I don't know what they tell potential employers though, I'm going to call the automated employment line and find out.
KevDen2005
03-07-2010, 18:03
I had a similar situation where I was told I couldn't come back to my job, but was allowed to "resign in lieu of termination" and they said they would just say I was laid off and not contest unemployment. I DID have to sign a bunch of bullshit papers saying I'd forever stay off the property in order to get paid severance. I don't know what they tell potential employers though, I'm going to call the automated employment line and find out.
You should just reapply to the job and pretend you have never worked there and have no idea what they are talking about
Half Live
03-07-2010, 18:45
If you get fired and claim a grievance then a lot of times you can still get unemployment benefits...had that happen in my case. Not sure if you still can if quit. You may not want a termination but you may need the unemployment until a new job can be found, and you can explain to future employers that you had a private grievance. And it depends on who you work for, future employers may not even really look into it.
I don't think I will be needing unemployment benefits since I live with my parents and I should be getting my tax returns back soon. Plus I have an interview for a job setup and everyday I'm filling out applications and turning in my resume at other places.
Plus, if anyone knows a of a job that needs someone with 3 years experience in the grocery industry and 1 year as being a certified barista let me know.
RCCrawler
03-07-2010, 21:23
No, I'm not a member but I've decided that I'm going to cut my losses and offer to quit without having a termination on my record and ask for my last paycheck. I've never really felt like it was going to be my career working at a grocery store.
That's bullshit, I wouldn't quit, If you and the union want to fight it, then make them fire you.
You should just reapply to the job and pretend you have never worked there and have no idea what they are talking about
They laid off most of their managers before my episode (including the one I worked for), and a few months after the lay offs, my manager got a call from the company saying that they found her resume on Monster and liked what they saw. She responded with a big fat, "YOU'RE KIDDING RIGHT?!"
Dummies.
KevDen2005
03-07-2010, 23:34
They laid off most of their managers before my episode, and a few months after the lay offs, my manager got a call from the company saying that they found her resume on Monster and liked what they saw. She responded with a big fat, "YOU'RE KIDDING RIGHT?!"
Dummies.
I was joking, I can't believe that something like that actually happened. Hilarious!!! Some people are so stupid!
vegas976
03-08-2010, 10:31
HALF LIVE: I sent you a PM on a job offer. It is in Denver (capitol Hill) but may be worth your time to look into. PM me back for more details.[Beer]
KevDen2005
03-08-2010, 11:21
I don't think I will be needing unemployment benefits since I live with my parents and I should be getting my tax returns back soon. Plus I have an interview for a job setup and everyday I'm filling out applications and turning in my resume at other places.
Plus, if anyone knows a of a job that needs someone with 3 years experience in the grocery industry and 1 year as being a certified barista let me know.
Whatever floats your boat man, I am sure a lot of people here will tell you have a 'just in case' plan never hurts
Half Live
03-09-2010, 17:13
update: I just got back from the meeting and they took my offer of quitting and putting this all to rest.
Now go shopping there every week and open carry~
KevDen2005
03-09-2010, 20:07
Now go shopping there every week and open carry~
+1[Beer]
Now go shopping there every week and open carry~
+ wear all black and always look real happy. Have a huge smile on your face. [Coffee]
Just kidding, let it be and go on with your life.
Next you'll get thrown in jail for harassment. You don't need anymore trouble.
Goodluck
your walmart buddy.
Half Live
03-09-2010, 23:06
+ wear all black and always look real happy. Have a huge smile on your face. [Coffee]
Just kidding, let it be and go on with your life.
Next you'll get thrown in jail for harassment. You don't need anymore trouble.
Goodluck
your walmart buddy.
Ya, I don't think I will be open-carrying in king soopers anymore, ccw is a different story. Plus I don't need anything on my record when I'm trying to get a job in armed transport.
theGinsue
03-10-2010, 00:23
Okay, I know the situation has been put to rest, but I'm seeing this thread a little late and wanted to offer my $0.02.
Company policies that violate your rights (especially while you're not on the clock) shouldn't exist. We all know that you don't have to have a case to sue someone.
I agree, and I disagree. You're right, these policies shouldn't HAVE to exist. Let's see this from the employers position. Sadly, with all of the workcenter violence issues, companies are put into a position of having to protect themselves and the other employees. If they had a policy saying you couldnt possess a firearm while on the clock, good. If the policy extended to not having a firearm on the property (on or off the clock) where you are employed, understandable. If they (as it sounds here) banned you from ever carrying a firearm on ANY company property at any time, THAT is a situation you'd have some grounds to contest the termination where you could expect to have a 50/50 chance of winning.
If you get fired and claim a grievance then a lot of times you can still get unemployment benefits...had that happen in my case. Not sure if you still can if quit. You may not want a termination but you may need the unemployment until a new job can be found, and you can explain to future employers that you had a private grievance. And it depends on who you work for, future employers may not even really look into it.
Quiting: Not eligible for unemployment benefits.
Layoff/Termination w/out cause: Eligible for unemployment benefits.
Terminiation "with cause" (violating company policies, theft, breaking the law, etc): Not eligible for unemployment benefits.
By Colorado law, a potential employer is not allowed to ask a past employer the circumstances behind the employee ceasing their employment with the previous employer - they CAN ask the potential employee. At the same time, a past employer is not allowed (by law) to release any information regarding the reason(s) the employee ceased working for that employer. The most a past employer can release regarding the cessation of employement is that the employee is no longer employed by that organization. Of course, this is what the law says - it doesn't mean that employers (past and potential) don't violate this every single day.
KevDen2005
03-10-2010, 00:30
Okay, I know the situation has been put to rest, but I'm seeing this thread a little late and wanted to offer my $0.02.
I agree, and I disagree. You're right, these policies shouldn't HAVE to exist. Let's see this from the employers position. Sadly, with all of the workcenter violence issues, companies are put into a position of having to protect themselves and the other employees. If they had a policy saying you couldnt possess a firearm while on the clock, good. If the policy extended to not having a firearm on the property (on or off the clock) where you are employed, understandable. If they (as it sounds here) banned you from ever carrying a firearm on ANY company property at any time, THAT is a situation you'd have some grounds to contest the termination where you could expect to have a 50/50 chance of winning.
Quiting: Not eligible for unemployment benefits.
Layoff/Termination w/out cause: Eligible for unemployment benefits.
Terminiation "with cause" (violating company policies, theft, breaking the law, etc): Not eligible for unemployment benefits.
By Colorado law, a potential employer is not allowed to ask a past employer the circumstances behind the employee ceasing their employment with the previous employer - they CAN ask the potential employee. At the same time, a past employer is not allowed (by law) to release any information regarding the reason(s) the employee ceased working for that employer. The most a past employer can release regarding the cessation of employement is that the employee is no longer employed by that organization. Of course, this is what the law says - it doesn't mean that employers (past and potential) don't violate this every single day.
I would not think they would stoop so low as to violate law...
theGinsue
03-10-2010, 01:05
Someone call a cop. This guy ^^ is on drugs!
[ROFL1]
BTW: I did get the sarcasm.
Seamonkey
03-10-2010, 02:04
Now go shopping there every week and open carry~
+1
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