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Glock Shooter
03-21-2010, 08:44
I am forwarding this because it is a bit of education we should all know.
The author of this article lives in South Dakota and appears to be very active in attempting to maintain our freedom. I encourage everybody to read this article and pass it along. I see so many parallels in this country–are we going to sit by and watch it happen? Spread the word; also contact your congressional reps; vote them out if they don’t do what they should. If you don’t want to be bothered, then you’re part of the problem! Google Kitty Werthmann and you will see articles and videos.
http://sn109w.snt109.mail.live.com/mail/SafeRedirect.aspx?hm__tg=http://65.55.85.135/att/GetAttachment.aspx&hm__qs=file%3dfd8162d4-4654-4f0f-b46c-5fa749e633ab.jpg%26ct%3daW1hZ2UvanBlZw_3d_3d%26nam e%3daW1hZ2UwMDEuanBn%26inline%3d1%26rfc%3d0%26empt y%3dFalse%26imgsrc%3dcid%253a1.3525407347%2540web1 11703.mail.gq1.yahoo.com&oneredir=1&ip=10.13.16.8&d=d2201&mf=34&a=01_4489183bca2be3167976de152a648dc65e5d620943078 5458d1247df9cf33ed6 (http://lornakismet.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/werthmann1.jpg)


Truly is the Greatest Country in the World. Don't Let Freedom Slip Away



By: Kitty Werthmann

What I am about to tell you is something you've probably never heard or will ever read in history books.

I believe that I am an eyewitness to history. I cannot tell you that Hitler took Austria by tanks and guns; it would distort history. We elected him by a landslide - 98% of the vote.. I've never read that in any American publications. Everyone thinks that Hitler just rolled in with his tanks and took Austria by force.
In 1938, Austria was in deep Depression. Nearly one-third of our workforce was unemployed. We had 25% inflation and 25% bank loan interest rates.
Farmers and business people were declaring bankruptcy daily. Young people were going from house to house begging for food. Not that they didn't want to work; there simply weren't any jobs. My mother was a Christian woman and believed in helping people in need. Every day we cooked a big kettle of soup and baked bread to feed those poor, hungry people - about 30 daily.
The Communist Party and the National Socialist Party were fighting each other. Blocks and blocks of cities like Vienna , Linz , and Graz were destroyed. The people became desperate and petitioned the government to let them decide what kind of government they wanted.
We looked to our neighbor on the north, Germany , where Hitler had been in power since 1933. We had been told that they didn't have unemployment or crime, and they had a high standard of living. Nothing was ever said about persecution of any group -- Jewish or otherwise. We were led to believe that everyone was happy. We wanted the same way of life in Austria . We were promised that a vote for Hitler would mean the end of unemployment and help for the family. Hitler also said that businesses would be assisted, and farmers would get their farms back. Ninety-eight percent of the population voted to annex Austria to Germany and have Hitler for our ruler.
We were overjoyed, and for three days we danced in the streets and had candlelight parades. The new government opened up big field kitchens and everyone was fed.
After the election, German officials were appointed, and like a miracle, we suddenly had law and order. Three or four weeks later, everyone was employed. The government made sure that a lot of work was created through the Public Work Service.

Hitler decided we should have equal rights for women. Before this, it was a custom that married Austrian women did not work outside the home. An able-bodied husband would be looked down on if he couldn't support his family. Many women in the teaching profession were elated that they could retain the jobs they previously had been required to give up for marriage.
Hitler Targets Education - Eliminates Religious Instruction for Children:

Our education was nationalized. I attended a very good public school. The population was predominantly Catholic, so we had religion in our schools. The day we elected Hitler (March 13, 1938), I walked into my schoolroom to find the crucifix replaced by Hitler's picture hanging next to a Nazi flag. Our teacher, a very devout woman, stood up and told the class we wouldn't pray or have religion anymore. Instead, we sang "Deutschland, Deutschland, Uber Alles," and had physical education.
Sunday became National Youth Day with compulsory attendance. Parents were not pleased about the sudden change in curriculum. They were told that if they did not send us, they would receive a stiff letter of warning the first time. The second time they would be fined the equivalent of $300, and the third time they would be subject to jail. The first two hours consisted of political indoctrination. The rest of the day we had sports. As time went along, we loved it. Oh, we had so much fun and got our sports equipment free. We would go home and gleefully tell our parents about the wonderful time we had.
My mother was very unhappy. When the next term started, she took me out of public school and put me in a convent. I told her she couldn't do that and she told me that someday when I grew up, I would be grateful. There was a very good curriculum, but hardly any fun - no sports, and no political indoctrination. I hated it at first but felt I could tolerate it. Every once in a while, on holidays, I went home. I would go back to my old friends and ask what was going on and what they were doing. Their loose lifestyle was very alarming to me. They lived without religion. By that time unwed mothers were glorified for having a baby for Hitler. It seemed strange to me that our society changed so suddenly. As time went along, I realized what a great deed my mother did so that I wasn't exposed to that kind of humanistic philosophy.
Equal Rights Hits Home:

In 1939, the war started and a food bank was established. All food was rationed and could only be purchased using food stamps. At the same time, a full-employment law was passed which meant if you didn't work, you didn't get a ration card, and if you didn't have a card, you starved to death. Women who stayed home to raise their families didn't have any marketable skills and often had to take jobs more suited for men.
Soon after this, the draft was implemented. It was compulsory for young people, male and female, to give one year to the labor corps. During the day, the girls worked on the farms, and at night they returned to their barracks for military training just like the boys. They were trained to be anti-aircraft gunners and participated in the signal corps. After the labor corps, they were not discharged but were used in the front lines. When I go back to Austria to visit my family and friends, most of these women are emotional cripples because they just were not equipped to handle the horrors of combat. Three months before I turned 18, I was severely injured in an air raid attack. I nearly had a leg amputated, so I was spared having to go into the labor corps and into military service.
Hitler Restructured the Family Through Daycare:

When the mothers had to go out into the work force, the government immediately established child care centers. You could take your children ages 4 weeks to school age and leave them there around-the-clock, 7 days a week, under the total care of the government. The state raised a whole generation of children.. There were no motherly women to take care of the children, just people highly trained in child psychology. By this time, no one talked about equal rights. We knew we had been had.
Health Care and Small Business Suffer Under Government Controls:

Before Hitler, we had very good medical care. Many American doctors trained at theUniversity of Vienna . After Hitler, health care was socialized, free for everyone. Doctors were salaried by the government. The problem was, since it was free, the people were going to the doctors for everything. When the good doctor arrived at his office at 8 a.m., 40 people were already waiting and, at the same time, the hospitals were full. If you needed elective surgery, you had to wait a year or two for your turn. There was no money for research as it was poured into socialized medicine. Research at the medical schools literally stopped, so the best doctors left Austria and emigrated to other countries.

As for healthcare, our tax rates went up to 80% of our income. Newlyweds immediately received a $1,000 loan from the government to establish a household. We had big programs for families. All day care and education were free. High schools were taken over by the government and college tuition was subsidized. Everyone was entitled to free handouts, such as food stamps, clothing, and housing.
We had another agency designed to monitor business. My brother-in-law owned a restaurant that had square tables. Government officials told him he had to replace them with round tables because people might bump themselves on the corners. Then they said he had to have additional bathroom facilities. It was just a small dairy business with a snack bar. He couldn't meet all the demands. Soon, he went out of business. If the government owned the large businesses and not many small ones existed, it could be in control.
We had consumer protection. We were told how to shop and what to buy. Free enterprise was essentially abolished. We had a planning agency specially designed for farmers. The agents would go to the farms, count the live-stock, then tell the farmers what to produce, and how to produce it.
"Mercy Killing" Redefined:

In 1944, I was a student teacher in a small village in the Alps . The villagers were surrounded by mountain passes which, in the winter, were closed off with snow, causing people to be isolated. So people intermarried and offspring were sometimes retarded. When I arrived, I was told there were 15 mentally retarded adults, but they were all useful and did good manual work. I knew one, named Vincent, very well. He was a janitor of the school. One day I looked out the window and saw Vincent and others getting into a van. I asked my superior where they were going. She said to an institution where the State Health Department would teach them a trade, and to read and write. The families were required to sign papers with a little clause that they could not visit for 6 months. They were told visits would interfere with the program and might cause homesickness.
As time passed, letters started to dribble back saying these people died a natural, merciful death. The villagers were not fooled. We suspected what was happening. Those people left in excellent physical health and all died within 6 months. We called this euthanasia.
The Final Steps - Gun Laws:
Next came gun registration.. People were getting injured by guns. Hitler said that the real way to catch criminals (we still had a few) was by matching serial numbers on guns. Most citizens were law abiding and dutifully marched to the police station to register their firearms. Not long after-wards, the police said that it was best for everyone to turn in their guns. The authorities already knew who had them, so it was futile not to comply voluntarily.
No more freedom of speech. Anyone who said something against the government was taken away. We knew many people who were arrested, not only Jews, but also priests and ministers who spoke up.
Totalitarianism didn't come quickly, it took 5 years from 1938 until 1943, to realize full dictatorship in Austria . Had it happened overnight, my countrymen would have fought to the last breath. Instead, we had creeping gradualism. Now, our only weapons were broom handles. The whole idea sounds almost unbelievable that the state, little by little eroded our freedom.
After World War II, Russian troops occupied Austria . Women were raped, preteen to elderly. The press never wrote about this either. When the Soviets left in 1955, they took everything that they could, dismantling whole factories in the process. They sawed down whole orchards of fruit, and what they couldn't destroy, they burned. We called it The Burned Earth. Most of the population barricaded themselves in their houses. Women hid in their cellars for 6 weeks as the troops mobilized. Those who couldn't, paid the price. There is a monument in Vienna today, dedicated to those women who were massacred by the Russians. This is an eye witness account.


"It's true..those of us who sailed past the Statue of Liberty came to a country of unbelievable freedom and opportunity.



America Truly is the Greatest Country in the World. Don't Let Freedom Slip Away



"After America , There is No Place to Go"

sniper7
03-21-2010, 10:48
i have seen this email before. i hope things turn around before another civil war or revolution is necessary. seems the libs are hell bent on doing what they can though

jake
03-21-2010, 11:50
Well, it starts off with a historical error. German tanks rolled into Austria BEFORE the plebiscite was held.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anschluss

hobowh
03-21-2010, 15:45
good read though

jake
03-21-2010, 16:45
Yep. Of course I wouldn't have voted for a Nazi anyway, but I definitely won't now.

sniper7
03-21-2010, 16:55
Yep. Of course I wouldn't have voted for a Nazi anyway, but I definitely won't now.

what are you talking about you and your lib friends voted for obama...he is essentially a present day socialist nazi

hobowh
03-21-2010, 17:01
[ROFL1][ROFL2][ROFL3]
what are you talking about you and your lib friends voted for obama...he is essentially a present day socialist nazi

jake
03-21-2010, 17:47
what are you talking about you and your lib friends voted for obama...he is essentially a present day socialist nazi
Well, I didn't vote for Obama because I wasn't a US citizen in 2008, but that's just needless pedantry.

However, if you had any knowledge of political science or history and weren't just mindlessly regurgitating someone else's talking points, you would know that 1) the Nazi party were not socialists and 2) Barack Obama cannot be seriously described as a Nazi or a socialist.

Marlin
03-21-2010, 18:09
Sorry,, Read your history.. Nazi short for National SOCIALIST party.. They were not the Right wing of the political spectrum..

ETA: Yep, Barrack is about as socialist as one gets in this country...

ronaldrwl
03-21-2010, 18:18
2) Barack Obama cannot be seriously described as a Nazi or a socialist.

I'm being serious "Barack Obama has a socialist agenda."

sniper7
03-21-2010, 19:45
Well, I didn't vote for Obama because I wasn't a US citizen in 2008, but that's just needless pedantry.

However, if you had any knowledge of political science or history and weren't just mindlessly regurgitating someone else's talking points, you would know that 1) the Nazi party were not socialists and 2) Barack Obama cannot be seriously described as a Nazi or a socialist.


but you WOULD have....don't you have some place else to go be a liberal...we have enough.

I can call him whatever I feel like...that is MY right since I am an AMERICAN.
He is forcing bullshit down our throats, and is hellbent on stealing our rights. His background is shady at best, he was an unknown just as Hitler was. He feeds on power, he feeds on success and feels he is more and more invincible with each of his victories.

jake
03-21-2010, 19:57
Sorry,, Read your history.. Nazi short for National SOCIALIST party.. They were not the Right wing of the political spectrum..

ETA: Yep, Barrack is about as socialist as one gets in this country...
I think you need to read your history, and not just the name of the party. Or do you think that North Korea is a democracy too? And you're seriously suggesting that the Nazis were not right wing? Yeah, you need to read your history. Urgently.

Marlin
03-21-2010, 19:58
Oh please,,, Give it up.... You been reading socialist history or what...

jake
03-21-2010, 19:59
but you WOULD have....don't you have some place else to go be a liberal...we have enough.

I can call him whatever I feel like...that is MY right since I am an AMERICAN.
He is forcing bullshit down our throats, and is hellbent on stealing our rights. His background is shady at best, he was an unknown just as Hitler was. He feeds on power, he feeds on success and feels he is more and more invincible with each of his victories.
Yes, I would have. I'm not going to deny that.

And yes, you can call him whatever you like. I wasn't telling you that you aren't allowed to call him a Nazi or a socialist. I was just pointing out that you're wrong on both counts. Not a matter of opinion, a matter of fact :)

jake
03-21-2010, 20:00
Oh please,,, Give it up.... You been reading socialist history or what...
Ok, enlighten me. The Nazis were a left wing socialist party. Go for it. I'm open minded, so if you can actually back up what you're saying, I might be convinced.

Marlin
03-21-2010, 20:02
What makes you think they weren't? just wondering...

Marlin
03-21-2010, 20:04
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialism


It's wiki, but it is fairly accurate...

jake
03-21-2010, 20:12
Their ideology, their history, their enemies national and internal, just about every historian who ever wrote or read anything about them - edited to add - and the wikipedia article you linked to.

Yes, ideologically they were capable of being pretty amorphous, especially in the early 30s when they were struggling for mass appeal in the chaos of the Wiemar Republic, but they were a far right, fascist party, undoubtedly.

Marlin
03-21-2010, 20:19
Fascist tend to be a little left of center also..

They indoctrinated you good didn't they...

sniper7
03-21-2010, 20:29
Fascist tend to be a little left of center also..

They indoctrinated you good didn't they...


bingo, hits it on the head.



jake, run along back to whatever liberal country you came from...

Drilldo
03-21-2010, 20:33
National Socialist party.

Argue what you will, you are wrong.

jake
03-21-2010, 20:36
Fascist tend to be a little left of center also..

They indoctrinated you good didn't they...
Hey, you gave it a good try. You linked to an article that contradicted your point, and then you fell back on the kool-aid defense.

I would ask if they taught you that tactic in school, but I'm not sure if anyone tried teaching you anything :)

jake
03-21-2010, 20:37
bingo, hits it on the head.



jake, run along back to whatever liberal country you came from...
Go back where I came from? That's a little fascistic of you, you liberal!

roberth
03-21-2010, 20:38
Fascist tend to be a little left of center also..

They indoctrinated you good didn't they...

LOL, spot on!

sniper7
03-21-2010, 20:38
Go back where I came from? That's a little fascistic of you, you liberal!


call it what you will, you represent what I don't want in my state, in my country and especially anywhere around me on the range. I have no use for you.

jake
03-21-2010, 20:40
National Socialist party.

Argue what you will, you are wrong.
No, I'm not wrong. You've made the same mistake that sniper and marlin made. You think that the name is a concrete indicator of the ideology. Did you know that Hitler regretted using the word 'socialist' in the name of his party? That he rejected socialism? That he exterminated socialists along with the Jews, gypsies, communists and homosexuals?

But to extend your argument to its absurd conclusion, National Socialist German Workers Party. Barack Obama is not a German worker, therefore he can't be a Nazi.

Marlin
03-21-2010, 20:41
Hey, you gave it a good try. You linked to an article that contradicted your point, and then you fell back on the kool-aid defense.

I would ask if they taught you that tactic in school, but I'm not sure if anyone tried teaching you anything :)


Hmmm,, Pretty much thought it proved you were the one drinking the kool aid.. Of course you may have only read the points You wanted too..

Troublco
03-21-2010, 20:54
Bottom line here, Obama is interested in taking more control out of the hands of the people and placing it in the Government, which goes against our Constitution and everything it stands for. Last time I checked, socialists like to do things like redistribute wealth, nationalize industry, and encourage welfare. They think capitalism is something to be eliminated.

I'm all for legal immigration (although I heavily favor quotas), but if you're going to come in here and try to change our country to be more like somewhere you came from, such as England, do us a favor and don't.

We don't need people from societies with heavy socialist influences coming here and trying to change this country to be more like that. If you like that type of government, go back there. If you prefer a country based on individual liberties where you take care of yourself more, then you're in the right place.

And do me the favor of not jumping to the conclusion that I'm simply telling you to get out; such is not the case. I'm saying don't come here and start trying to help push things left. We don't need it. I will say this: as far as I'm concerned, if you're not very familiar with the history of this country and the fact that it is and has been chock full of individualists who have a hard time with the government trying to force its hand (We've had a couple of wars on that subject) then you might want to brush up on that.

The mindless mass of sheep who want things handed to them on the backs of hardworking Americans are happy to take what the latter have earned; and the socialistic democrats are only too happy to oblige in order to preserve their voting base. Problem is, at some point the sheep have taken everything the others have; then what? I'm not comfortable sitting around and letting that happen. And I'd hazard a guess that a lot of others on this site feel the same. It's my opinion that the situation in this country is coming to a head, things have been becoming more polarized for some time.

So talking semantics about Maobama (my favorite pet name for him) really doesn't matter. Even if he isn't a socialist, he certainly leans that way. And what he wants is basically to destroy the underlying fabric of this country; the things that made it what it is. And the only reason I can see for doing that is for selfish gain. Socialism puts too much control in the hands of too few; and it has been proven that absolute power corrupts absolutely. Hence, the form of government our founding fathers gave us. More government is NEVER better than less. People shouldn't depend on a government to provide for them; at that point they cease to be citizens and become subjects. Americans were never supposed to be subjects, and I have no respect for people who would sacrifice the gift of liberty to be coddled.

Long winded way of saying Obama's plenty socialistic, as far as I'm concerned.

And reading some of your posts, you certainly seem as though you're more interested in muckraking than actually proving your point. Namecalling and rudeness as you have shown only undermine any argument you might have. When you resort to those tactics trying to force your point, you've lost. To say nothing of pissing off some of these folks for no reason other than your gratification.

Drilldo
03-21-2010, 21:11
No, I'm not wrong. You've made the same mistake that sniper and marlin made. You think that the name is a concrete indicator of the ideology. Did you know that Hitler regretted using the word 'socialist' in the name of his party? That he rejected socialism? That he exterminated socialists along with the Jews, gypsies, communists and homosexuals?

But to extend your argument to its absurd conclusion, National Socialist German Workers Party. Barack Obama is not a German worker, therefore he can't be a Nazi.

Damn, you are off your rocker and just being stupid. And you are wrong.

Please, state your point or just shut the fuck up. You are telling me what I think?

How do you know what Hitler thought or regretted? Put the pipe down fool. You are looking stupid.

theGinsue
03-21-2010, 21:31
i have seen this email before. i hope things turn around before another civil war or revolution is necessary. seems the libs are hell bent on doing what they can though


It's about control. Somehow the libs seem to think that all of them will be sharing the power and control of the rest of us. In the end, either we are all free or we are all slaves.

TEAMRICO
03-21-2010, 21:31
Jake, I've got 39 almost 40 years of being an AMERICAN, your have, maybe a full 2 years???????
Who they hell made you an expert about being an AMERICAN?
I sure as hell dont want to hear you defending that crap!

jason303
03-21-2010, 21:57
... So talking semantics about Maobama (my favorite pet name for him) really doesn't matter. Even if he isn't a socialist, he certainly leans that way. And what he wants is basically to destroy the underlying fabric of this country; the things that made it what it is. And the only reason I can see for doing that is for selfish gain. ...

In my opinion, I agree with the conclusion reached by many before me that the reason he's destroying the country is to rebuild it the way he was taught things should be. He's a product of very extremist thought and he surrounds himself with the same types of individuals. It's been a long time coming and the result of incremental change. I also believe the pace of change is quickening as older generations pass on and successive generations are educated through a public system designed to fail them and a higher education system designed to indoctrinate them.

theGinsue
03-21-2010, 22:36
Well said jason.

Troublco
03-21-2010, 23:14
In my opinion, I agree with the conclusion reached by many before me that the reason he's destroying the country is to rebuild it the way he was taught things should be. He's a product of very extremist thought and he surrounds himself with the same types of individuals. It's been a long time coming and the result of incremental change. I also believe the pace of change is quickening as older generations pass on and successive generations are educated through a public system designed to fail them and a higher education system designed to indoctrinate them.


Well said jason.

Indeed. The Death of a thousand cuts, along with their other insidious plans coming to fruition.

Glock Shooter
03-22-2010, 07:36
The wonderful beauty of this country is, regardless of who is in the Big Chair....WE GET TO VOTE EM OUT EVERY 4 YEARS!!!!

Brassie
03-22-2010, 07:57
The wonderful beauty of this country is, regardless of who is in the Big Chair....WE GET TO VOTE EM OUT EVERY 4 YEARS!!!!

True as of this writing, but I suppose the libs might be working to change this also by 2012

sniper7
03-22-2010, 15:25
The wonderful beauty of this country is, regardless of who is in the Big Chair....WE GET TO VOTE EM OUT EVERY 4 YEARS!!!!

unless obama tries to pull a bloomberg and extend himself

ronaldrwl
03-22-2010, 15:46
The wonderful beauty of this country is, regardless of who is in the Big Chair....WE GET TO VOTE EM OUT EVERY 4 YEARS!!!!

Hmmm, who's in the Big Chair or who is pulling the strings? Not our junior president I think

edjobsman
03-22-2010, 17:07
Sorry,, Read your history.. Nazi short for National SOCIALIST party.. They were not the Right wing of the political spectrum..

ETA: Yep, Barrack is about as socialist as one gets in this country...


I am confused. But some of you already know that.

This is what I believe to be true:

I have never heard that the Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei (National Socialist German Workers' Party) was a the left-leaning organization. I thought the rise of the Third Reich (same thing as the Nazis, right?) was fostered by nationalism (a race-purity concept) and civil unrest attributed to Leftist Marxist groups. If the Leftests were the cause of the unrest in germany, I don't think the Nazis would have aligned with them, therefore I don't think the Nazis supported them. It therefore follows that Nazi were not leftests. I don't know for sure if they were on the right side of the political spectrum, but I know they were not anywhere near the left.

The Nazi's wanted to insinuate all aspects of their military goverment into everyday life. I can see how some people can draw connections between government regulation (usually considered an agenda of the left) with government imposed nationalism. But the Nazis in Germany defined their society as one group of people, the Arians. They wanted to impose control over the Arians; everyone else was meant to be exterminated, and many nearly were. One can hardly say that our society in the USA thinks of itself as one pure race nor is it easy to believe that there is any movement in that direction. I think Obama is more of a socialist than a national socialist (i.e., not a Nazi).

I think my confusion really stems from not ever having a clear definiion of "socialism". The USSR (Union of Soviet Socialist Republics) was socialist, I know that. I know that socialism usually is asociated with the left end of the policitical sprectrum. Maybe I am confused as well because the Red Scares (from 1917–1920 and again from 1947-1957) were directed at left-leaning political parties. The Soviets were the "Reds", right?

What I need to know is who should I point my rifle at when they come marching down my street, each from a different direction - the communists or the socialists (as if any would attempt that)? Socialism (of the Communist ilk) and national socialism don't seem to be the same thing at all. I just don't see how so many different groups can be labelled "socialist".

There is one quote that I really like. It's from Mao Tse Tung, I think. He said "Left is Right and Right is Left". It sort of seems like all this confusion about Nazis suggests that he may have been right (I mean, correct).

My request: Can someone please provide a definition of "socialism" for me.

Thanks.

ronaldrwl
03-22-2010, 17:22
socialism = big controlling government.
conservative = small government.

funkfool
03-22-2010, 17:23
My request: Can someone please provide a definition of "socialism" for me.
Thanks.
Don't know if I can do that, but this - defining the differences - was in a book that helped me.
I could not find the book, but found a simlar expression of the differences:


People often confuse "socialism" with the concept of "communism."
While the two ideologies share much in common -- in in fact communism encompasses socialism -- the primary difference between the two is that "socialism" applies to economic systems, whereas "communism" applies to both economic and political systems.

Another difference between socialism and communism is that communists directly oppose the concept of capitalism, an economic system in which production is controlled by private interests.
Socialists, on the other hand, believe socialism can exist within a capitalist society.

http://usconservatives.about.com/od/glossaryterms/g/Socialism.htm


I'll dig up my books when I get home.

edjobsman
03-22-2010, 19:05
Jake, I've got 39 almost 40 years of being an AMERICAN, your have, maybe a full 2 years???????
Who they hell made you an expert about being an AMERICAN?
I sure as hell dont want to hear you defending that crap!

Depending on how he got to be citizen, he may know a lot more about this county then you might imagine.

Have you ever seen the questions on one of those citizenship exams?

I am not sure how much you have to learn if you get in by joining the military though.

GunTroll
03-22-2010, 19:31
Oh snap! a Lib in the ranks! Smoke em' out!

theGinsue
03-22-2010, 20:21
Here is a lengthy (10:35 long) but VERY good video explanation of the different forms of government.

Pay close attention to the comments at 1:15 into the video.

This used to be a sticky on this site and is considered an essential education for all members of this site.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DioQooFIcgE

sniper7
03-22-2010, 20:22
Oh snap! a Lib in the ranks! Smoke em' out!


Jake has long been a self proclaimed lib, just remained quiet here...I don't understand why he is even on this site.

Irving
03-22-2010, 20:24
Probably because his political views aren't as black and white as you make then out to be and regardless of his political leanings, he is interested in guns.

theGinsue
03-22-2010, 20:34
Jake has long been a self proclaimed lib, just remained quiet here...I don't understand why he is even on this site.

While Liberalism and firearms are usually like oil & water as they seldom go together, it's possible for a Liberal to be a fan of firearms. of course, it's also possible that Bigfoot exists - just because we havent actually seen it doesn't mean it isn't real!

sniper7
03-22-2010, 20:39
he says he is into guns but I have yet to see (or at least remember it) him posting shooting his guns, buying them, or anything truly useful about guns...the posts of his I remember are all liberal based or worthless. maybe I just skipped over those and threw them in the liberal bullshit basket.

He is the epitome of what is going on within our country and our state...foreigners come in or Californians and more of them are liberal than they are conservative and then all of a sudden they want to turn what you have now into what they left...there must have been a reason for them to leave, but then they want to destroy what we have to make themselves miserable again.

Troublco
03-22-2010, 20:45
Okay, now I'm curious. Jake, what are your firearms interests? Any specific types, calibers, or classification that you are interested in?

And I'll respond to your PM here as soon as I have a couple minutes to go point by point.

Irving
03-22-2010, 20:58
Here you go:

http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19375
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16024
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18693
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18090

Troublco
03-22-2010, 21:10
Okay! Thanks, Stuart.

sniper7
03-22-2010, 21:48
Here you go:

http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19375
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=16024
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18693
http://www.co-ar15.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18090


not a whole lot there.[Roll1]

I can can make up things on the internet too. 4 posts out of 135 when he has been here over a year...maybe there is more, but hardly proof.

Irving
03-23-2010, 10:09
He hasn't even been allowed to own guns for very long, and not everyone is young with no family and gainfully employed like you are. We have tons of members that don't post at all but I don't see you questioning if they like guns or not. I'd rather have a liberal here in the group than one NOT in the group and just making things up about gun owners.

omio
03-23-2010, 10:42
I suggest some of you read Eric Hoffer's The True Believer and Henry David Thoreau's Walden. This country isn't about being liberal or conservative it is about being an individual.