View Full Version : Firing Squad gets the green light in Utah
Looks like the firing squad will be executing convicted killer Ronnie Lee Gardner tonight at midnight.
One less Convicted killer the people of Utah have to feed. To bad this execution is the exception and not the rule.
cowboykjohnson
06-17-2010, 15:47
Good for them. [Beer]
clublights
06-17-2010, 15:50
+1 [m2]
Dalendenver
06-17-2010, 20:03
Watching the news last night the "reporter" was making a big deal out of this being a firing squad execution and the person being killed by a "hail of bullets". In Utah the condemned person has the choice of firing squad or lethal injection so he had to have chosen that. Also five shooters have one live bullet and no one knows which one it is. No "hail of bullets".
Yeah, but it's the first one in however many years (I actually remember seeing a waxwork mockup of Gary Gilmore's execution at Madame Tussauds in London when I was younger) and it's a pretty violent method compared to the supposedly peaceful lethal injection.
When he first requested the firing squad I thought it was a case of him being all "bring it on!" but I read he had requested clemency so he could work with disadvantaged children and try and make a difference as he's now a reformed character, so perhaps he requested it as he thought it might shock public opinion into calling for a stay. That backfired pretty badly :D
I was looking for articles about this.
DD977GM2
06-18-2010, 01:55
Good one less piece of shit that tax payers have to foot the bill for. [Beer]
DD977GM2
06-18-2010, 01:59
Here is the link from AP[Beer]
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100618/ap_on_re_us/us_utah_firing_squad
denvernative321
06-18-2010, 03:48
Also five shooters have one live bullet and no one knows which one it is. No "hail of bullets".
Thats BS, if you have ever fired a blank you can most certinly tell the difference between the two. who ever took the shoot knows it was them. There is significantly less recoil in a blank kinda like shooting a .22.
Also on another note that is the first death by firing squad in 14 years in the U.S. I think this should be the new standard. lethal injection is far more expensive and time consuming. Buy a box of .30 and get to work you over crowded prisons. [M2]
Thats BS, if you have ever fired a blank you can most certinly tell the difference between the two. who ever took the shoot knows it was them. There is significantly less recoil in a blank kinda like shooting a .22.
Also on another note that is the first death by firing squad in 14 years in the U.S. I think this should be the new standard. lethal injection is far more expensive and time consuming. Buy a box of .30 and get to work you over crowded prisons. [M2]
the one round is not a blank. it is a "non effective" round that has the same recoil but is not lethal. the media is just reporting gun facts wrong, like always.
ColoEnthusiast
06-18-2010, 11:29
Interesting to note in the following article... The shooting started when the countdown got down to TWO. Had some anxious fellers there!
Yahoo article on execution (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100618/ap_on_re_us/us_utah_firing_squad)
They live by the Get-R-Done rule.
Interesting to note in the following article... The shooting started when the countdown got down to TWO. Had some anxious fellers there!
Yahoo article on execution (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100618/ap_on_re_us/us_utah_firing_squad)
Flame me later... This is totally ridiculous, but entertaining in my head....
But for the really bad dudes:
1. Put the guy out at 200-300 yards or so in a dog run type enclosure.
2. Give the guards iron sights only and 5 shots max.
3. Use point system, one guard firing at a single time.
- 2 point for knees, elbows
- 3 for pelvic/collar bone
- 5 for gential
- 10 for head
- 1 for everything else
4. First guard to reach 10 get's a raise.
5. If no one succeeds in killing the guy, he goes back into isolation for the night until tomorrow's execution, no medical.
Sometimes I think other countries have it right. Steal something, cut off your hand, etc. Yes, yes, I know "What if your a starving family and you stole a crumb of bread off the floor to feed your kid who has x disease and must eat or die?!" It's a broad comment, obviously not everyone who steals should be hacked. I believe in absolute truth, but the law should never be black and white. There has to be shades of grey.
What's the point of all that crap? The guy is going to die anyway. Doesn't matter if he is tortured or not. The point is to permanently remove the offender from society. Anything else is just a needless waste of time and resources.
I know Stu, I know. Just a thought that popped up. Instead of a nice clean kill, torture them a bit and hopefully send a message to others, etc...
I know it doesn't work that way. People will do what people will do.
SA Friday
06-18-2010, 13:04
Actually, I think there are 5 shooters and only one of them has a blank. The other four have live rounds. Pretty sure I read this in a different article about a month ago.
5 rounds all going off at the same timeand a full powder charge blank... could be pretty hard to tell if you are live or just a noise maker.
SA Friday
06-18-2010, 13:10
What's the point of all that crap? The guy is going to die anyway. Doesn't matter if he is tortured or not. The point is to permanently remove the offender from society. Anything else is just a needless waste of time and resources.
Oh I don't know. I think how we execute the condemned is a reflection on our societies civility. This litmus test seems to be pretty consistant across the world. Afghanistan used to just grab people, no trial, run them to the soccer stadium and then shoot them in the back of the head while people cheered. etc etc for other countries... I think it matters more than most like to admit.
Oh I don't know. I think how we execute the condemned is a reflection on our societies civility.
I agree and that is the point I'm trying to make. If we turn killing people into sport, then we as a society are no better than any serial killer, serial rapist, etc.
Jumpstart
06-18-2010, 13:22
Did anyone hear what the pay is to be on the firing line?
Volunteer my friend. There is no pay.
Did anyone hear what the pay is to be on the firing line?
I'd pay about tree-fitty.
ColoEnthusiast
06-18-2010, 13:37
I don't understand why anyone would want to be put to death by injection (weak) or electrocution (screw that!). Seems like the best way to go and still have a shred of dignity is firing squad. I doubt there is any pain in 4 shots to the chest..
I hate to see good ammo wasted shooting maggots, there's other ways to off 'em....http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b150/rinselman/smilies/saddamropesm2.gif
I don't understand why anyone would want to be put to death by injection (weak) or electrocution (screw that!). Seems like the best way to go and still have a shred of dignity is firing squad. I doubt there is any pain in 4 shots to the chest..
I can actually explain this sort of... might sound like a bunch of psycobabble, but...
Injection - thought to be the "humane and civilized" way to die since the series of chemicals introduced kill pain, put in coma, and then stop functions. Supposedly no pain for the condemed and no macabre images for the memory of the witnesses.
Electrocution - Was actually considered a NOVELTY way to die for a long time. It was more humane than beheading and a cheaper alternative to a hanging. However, it was often reported to not be carried out correctly. This lead to two things happening:
1. Not enough jiuce - condemded would get a hell of a shock but not die. Since you can't retry the case due to double jeopardy, condemed would walk.
2. Too much jiuce - horrific smell, horrible convulsing of the body, some cases of people exploding, just nasty all around.
Firing squad - Ever been shot? Depending on the caliber and intial adrelina drump, it hurts like hell... miss a clean kill and have to bleed out and it's not a pleasant way to die.
Personally, I still beheading is the way to go... i wouldn't mind drawn/quartering either but that is a little barbarbic.....
I can actually explain this sort of... might sound like a bunch of psycobabble, but...
Injection - thought to be the "humane and civilized" way to die since the series of chemicals introduced kill pain, put in coma, and then stop functions. Supposedly no pain for the condemed and no macabre images for the memory of the witnesses.
Electrocution - Was actually considered a NOVELTY way to die for a long time. It was more humane than beheading and a cheaper alternative to a hanging. However, it was often reported to not be carried out correctly. This lead to two things happening:
1. Not enough jiuce - condemded would get a hell of a shock but not die. Since you can't retry the case due to double jeopardy, condemed would walk.
2. Too much jiuce - horrific smell, horrible convulsing of the body, some cases of people exploding, just nasty all around.
Firing squad - Ever been shot? Depending on the caliber and intial adrelina drump, it hurts like hell... miss a clean kill and have to bleed out and it's not a pleasant way to die.
Personally, I still beheading is the way to go... i wouldn't mind drawn/quartering either but that is a little barbarbic.....
Please explain how hanging costs more than electrocution. That rope can't cost more than a few bucks and the amount of electricity required to adequately juice someone at today's rates HAS to be substantially higher.
Also, I don't get the double jeopardy thing when it comes to execution. I understand you can't be tried for the same crime twice (double jeopardy) but if your sentence is to be executed how can you POSSIBLY get out alive? I mean the end result is that you are to be dead. If you aren't dead then how can it be done? I don't get that at all.
Please explain how hanging costs more than electrocution. That rope can't cost more than a few bucks and the amount of electricity required to adequately juice someone at today's rates HAS to be substantially higher.
Also, I don't get the double jeopardy thing when it comes to execution. I understand you can't be tried for the same crime twice (double jeopardy) but if your sentence is to be executed how can you POSSIBLY get out alive? I mean the end result is that you are to be dead. If you aren't dead then how can it be done? I don't get that at all.
Edited: Typing errors! In a hurry, sorry.
Would love too! Back in the day, contrary to common belief, most towns/etc did not have a permanent scaffolding the in the center of town. To build this structure would cost money, manpower, etc. Hence a lot of the vigilante squads not doing due justice and just taking their quarry out of town and finding a "hanging" tree.
As fas the first electrocutions, there was a standard ampage in towns of the day (if they were lucky enough to have common electricity) and instead of the fancy machines we have now (think of a vaulted transformer you may see in your neighborhoods) that regulated all that, they'd simply "cut and splice" into a main line. Hence if the executioner didn't know what he was doing and where to apply (and water down the condemned) it could get nasty quick.
As far as the whole double jeopardy etc. Once your execution was carried out (regardless of if it was succesful), by law your conviction was upheld and done with. Hence, if you were said to be convicted to "death by electrocution" and you were electrocuted and pronounced dead (passed out, stupid doctor calls it, etc) but you wake up, then you're a free man. A few years ago, there was a really interested history book on this... I'll see if I can't track it down.
SA Friday
06-18-2010, 15:06
I can'r remember where I came on the info about this, but I remember there is a lot more to a hanging execution than one would think. Everything has to be right or it doesn't result in a quick broken neck and death. Botched hangings were pretty common and resulted in the condemned being choked to death thrashing around for what seemed forever, or the head was ripped from the body. Both, pretty much in the relm of macabre to witness.
Wild West Tech had a complete show on hanging.
There is alot of information on botched executions, electric chair, lethal injection, gas chamber, etc.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=gmail&rls=gm&q=botched+electric+chair&revid=275483375&sa=X&ei=YeIbTLSTBJvuNNPskP0M&ved=0CEoQ1QIoBA
And no where can I find that anyone went free after a botched execution. Most were left to die in a timely manner.
Or lived out their years in prison.
Wild West Tech had a complete show on hanging.
There is alot of information on botched executions, electric chair, lethal injection, gas chamber, etc.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&client=gmail&rls=gm&q=botched+electric+chair&revid=275483375&sa=X&ei=YeIbTLSTBJvuNNPskP0M&ved=0CEoQ1QIoBA
And no where can I find that anyone went free after a botched execution. Most were left to die in a timely manner.
Or lived out their years in prison.
This was kind of the point I was getting at. I think the part where they go free is a myth and really has nothing to do with double jeopardy.
Double jeopardy explained:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_jeopardy
Double jeopardy explained:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_jeopardy
Exactly, the three protections are:
being tried for the same crime after an acquittal
retrial after a conviction, unless the conviction has been reversed, vacated or otherwise nullified
being punished multiple times for the same offenseNow, show me where it says they can't be 'executed' again. The original punishment is execution and if the execution isn't carried out until the convicted is actually executed then how can it be considered complete? Like when a judge says that someone is 'sentenced to hang from the neck until dead' if every part of that isn't carried out then how was the punishment completed? If the person isn't dead then how can the original order of the judge be considered completed? If the punishment is death then there is no such thing as being punished twice. After all, you can only die once... right?
You all have good points. I'll have to step aside now as I don't remember the book title/author nor do I have firsthand experience in executing people...
Good thoughts and discussion though....
I'll try to do some research on finding bothed executions and people going free after presumed dead.
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/some-examples-post-furman-botched-executions
It does look like y'all are correct... the walking is a myth. Even those these executions were botched, a second attempt was made. I stand correct. My apologies.
EDIT: and what do you know, they do have the book in teh endnotes - John Archibald, On Second Try, Dunkins Executed for Murder, BIRMINGHAM NEWS, July 14, 1989, at 1.
but we've established that you were right... I wonder if there is a revised edition out or if someone has contacted Archibald on the missinformation... I'd rather see the actual documents of electrocution though....
If at first you don't succeed try try again.
There is No free get out of jail if an execution fails, the sentence must be carried out.
And I cannot find where anyone every escaped their sentence.( unless it was halted by authorities)
http://www.mentalfloss.com/blogs/archives/17306
Thought so. I was getting ready to contact all my representatives about changing this if it was somehow changed at some point w/o making the news.
No, no, sorry Jer. I was misinformed apparently. I have found a few cases of people sueing or getting themselves sick, etc in order to stay execution. But that's a different topic.
I stand corrected. And it's 4 p.m. Time to get out of here. See y'all Monday.
I read in the newspaper where the squad used ".30 cal. Winchester rifles". Anybody know what that means? .30-30 leverguns? There was a photo of four bullet holes in the wall behind him, no blood, and the holes looked like they were made by undeformed bullets. Wonder what they used, I would have assumed they'd use some type of expanding bullets for a quick kill.
Full Metal Jacket, cheapest ammo they can get,, why waste expensive ammo on a convicted killer.....DUH....
And PS, Humans are pussy don't matter what you shoot em with if its a heart shot they are DEAD, DEAD, DEAD.....
Full Metal Jacket, cheapest ammo they can get,, why waste expensive ammo on a convicted killer.....DUH....
"30 cal. Winchester rifles". .30-30 leverguns? FMJ's in .30-30? I suppose there's round or flat-nosed FMJ's.....
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.3 Copyright © 2025 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.