Would you feel undergunned in wild with a .357 Magnum?

[DD977GM2]

Title says it all. Im curious what you all have to say on this. Im thinking in the Lower 48 Rocky Mountain regions to the Sierra Nevadas.

I say no as I have never encountered a bear or mountain lion in all my years of backcountry hiking,backpacking and hiking to remote climbing spots.

[cowboykjohnson]

Nope I'd be just fine with a .357, I still carry a 6 shooter .357 when I camp and sometimes hunting. That's all I used to carry before I bought my 10mm. The only time I would feel undergunned would be against a grizz.

[BigBear]

I say no as well... .357 should take down anything I need to... unless I'm hunting that 2000lb white moose! HAHA.

I have encountered cats and bears on hikes/camping, but they've never been a problem. Be respectful towards them, know a little about 'em, and things should turn out ok.

[Tim K]

Are there Grizzlies in the lower 48? That's the only thing that would cause me to feel underarmed. Lions are thin skinned, so a .357 should be strong medicine.

I ran a black bear out of my yard a year or so ago with a lightweight J frame in my hand loaded with .38 +P's. I felt reasonably secure knowing (hoping) he would run, and if he didn't I'd get a chance to see what effect 5 rounds would have at contact distance.

[cowboykjohnson]

I've been within 20yds of mamma bear and 2 cubs, I didn't piss her off so she didn't piss me off, but i felt fine with my ruger vaquero in .357 on my side.

[CrufflerSteve]

I'd tend to agree for most of the US. I've rock collected across Wyoming, Colorado, New Mexico and Arizona with my S&W 586 with me. I haven't been down by the Mexican border in over 5 years and down there its the humans. I had a couple of confrontations and just opening the holster ended the scariest. It has escalated since and I'm not sure what would be effective down there - short of a squad of Marines.

I've run across black bear in the mountains. Their acceleration is unbelievable. Fortunately, it has always been away from me. I'm not so sure of a 357 for them. I've heard something in the bushes towards night that might have been a mountain lion but I think being big helped and the 357 could work there.

I've never been back country up towards Canada in Grizzly country. Up there I think I'd prefer one of those light guide lever action 45/70's.

Steve

[cowboykjohnson]

Are there Grizzlies in the lower 48? Up north there is from wyoming up, but I suspect they are here to.

[Daniel_187]

No but I would want at least 6 shots, I woild love that new S&W that holds 8

[Elhuero]

I wouldn't either.

[68Charger]

Anywhere south of Canadia, .357 would be enough to make me feel comfortable.. except maybe that national forest in AZ.. [Coffee]

Even the grizzlies that are left in the lower 48 aren't very big..
but there are places in Canada & Alaska that no handgun would completely make me feel comfortable.. but now and then it's good to be uncomfortable :D

[iamhunter]

but there are places in Canada & Alaska that no handgun would completely make me feel comfortable.. but now and then it's good to be uncomfortable :D

You've probably never seen the Ruger Alaskan in .454 Casull.

This thing would put away a rhino.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/

[Byte Stryke]

You've probably never seen the Ruger Alaskan in .454 Casull.

This thing would put away a rhino.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/


Paul at the Thornton Gander Mountain has to wipe my drool off of the case every time I go in there.

That is a Motherfucking Cannon.

[cowboykjohnson]

You've probably never seen the Ruger Alaskan in .454 Casull.

This thing would put away a rhino.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/
I still don't think I'd trust anything short of a howitzer against a charging Alaskan Grizz. If it is intent on killing you, you probably aren't going to make it no matter what you have, but it would be enough for some hope.

[Zundfolge]

Honestly if I ever find myself face to face with a bear I'm going to feel undergunned with anything less than a 7mm Mag ... and probably going to wish I had a Ma Duce.


That said, .357mag should be fine for 99.9% of your backwoods needs (frankly the limit of 6 or so shots will be a bit of a determent if you find some "free range weed farmers" which are a greater threat than bears or cougars.)

I have a S&W 29-2 that I keep telling myself I need to prep for backwoods, but honestly unless I'm going way deep into the woods where I feel the chances of meeting a bear are greater I'll probably stick with my .40 in the woods.

For cougars, feral dogs or feral humans it'll do the trick.

[68Charger]

You've probably never seen the Ruger Alaskan in .454 Casull.

This thing would put away a rhino.

http://www.shootingtimes.com/handgun_reviews/rgrRH/

seen it, never shot one.. also have handled a .500 S&W..
Basically any handgun powerful enough, recovery time is too long..

I knew someone that was charged by a Grizzly near Juneau, emptied a .44 Magnum into the bear, he survived- but said he'd never use a handgun as his 1st choice again, he felt very lucky to have survived.

This is an extreme example: http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/g/giantbear.htm

that example has been exaggerated in other stories.. but even the Moose in this territory can be very dangerous.. I've seen bull Moose you could park a VW bug under! Normally docile, under bad circumstances they kick in all directions & their hooves are massive.

you could go for months up there and never be forced to defend yourself- but if you are forced- I'd rather have something better than a handgun.. That Ruger Alaskan is better than pepper spray, tho [Coffee]

Zundfolge has it right- around here, your worst threat you could ever face is one that will shoot back...

[cowboykjohnson]

seen it, never shot one.. also have handled a .500 S&W..
Basically any handgun powerful enough, recovery time is too long..

I knew someone that was charged by a Grizzly near Juneau, emptied a .44 Magnum into the bear, he survived- but said he'd never use a handgun as his 1st choice again, he felt very lucky to have survived.

This is an extreme example: http://www.truthorfiction.com/rumors/g/giantbear.htm

that example has been exaggerated in other stories.. but even the Moose in this territory can be very dangerous.. I've seen bull Moose you could park a VW bug under! Normally docile, under bad circumstances they kick in all directions & their hooves are massive.

you could go for months up there and never be forced to defend yourself- but if you are forced- I'd rather have something better than a handgun.. That Ruger Alaskan is better than pepper spray, tho [Coffee]

Zundfolge has it right- around here, your worst threat you could ever face is one that will shoot back...

My dad shot a massive bull moose in canada with a .300 win mag shooting 220gr handloads. Dropped it at 100yds. Waited 15-20 mins and started walking up to it. Moose got back up from the dead and started charging. Took 6 more shots all in the heart and lungs. Finally dropped again 10 yds away and was still "alive". Pops is very lucky to be alive, still carries a bullet he dug out of his heart on his keychain.

[Elhuero]

I would not feel undergunned with a .357, but my ideal wilderness sidearm is a Glock 20.

If what's after me survives 15 rounds of 10mm, then I'll draw my blade and start humming my death song.

[iamhunter]

seen it, never shot one.. also have handled a .500 S&W..
Basically any handgun powerful enough, recovery time is too long..

I knew someone that was charged by a Grizzly near Juneau, emptied a .44 Magnum into the bear, he survived- but said he'd never use a handgun as his 1st choice again, he felt very lucky to have survived.



No doubt. My fiance grew up in Nome, Alaska and some of the stories are scary to say the least.

I've known some wildlife photographers who shoot up there and they usually travel with a partner, who's sole purpose is to carry around a high power rifle.


BUT for your day-to-day protection against wildlife, including grizzlies, I think the Ruger Alaskan is probably your best bet.

It's not exactly a practical to go on a day hike with a .338 Lapua Remington 700 slung across your back :p

[vim]

Title says it all. Im curious what you all have to say on this. Im thinking in the Lower 48 Rocky Mountain regions to the Sierra Nevadas.

I say no as I have never encountered a bear or mountain lion in all my years of backcountry hiking,backpacking and hiking to remote climbing spots.

They're here. I've run into large black bear on the trail, mama/cubs, and a mature mountain lion looking up a rocky outcrop at me.

I never owned a .357 Magnum and carry a 1911. I've never felt the need to draw it in the backcountry.

[rforsythe]

It's not exactly a practical to go on a day hike with a .338 Lapua Remington 700 slung across your back :p

No, but probably a fair bit of fun. [M2]

[68Charger]

It's not exactly a practical to go on a day hike with a .338 Lapua Remington 700 slung across your back :p

It was standard practice even on a day hike for me to carry a pump-action shotgun, loaded with alternating 00 buck & slugs (I was under 18 at the time, so a handgun was out of the question anyway)

These were not established trails, it was usually going ashore from our sport fishing boat in BFE... only once did I see a Grizzly in close proximity (about 100-150 yards), and he left when I made noise...

[DocMedic]

Bear Mace.

[Seamonkey]

Nope I'd be just fine with a .357, I still carry a 6 shooter .357 when I camp and sometimes hunting. That's all I used to carry before I bought my 10mm. The only time I would feel undergunned would be against a grizz.


+1

[Troublco]

Nope I'd be just fine with a .357, I still carry a 6 shooter .357 when I camp and sometimes hunting. That's all I used to carry before I bought my 10mm. The only time I would feel undergunned would be against a grizz.

My GP "in the woods" carry gun used to be my 686, until I got my G20.


I would not feel undergunned with a .357, but my ideal wilderness sidearm is a Glock 20.

If what's after me survives 15 rounds of 10mm, then I'll draw my blade and start humming my death song.

That's why I always carry two extra mags. I originally got my G20 for handgun hog hunting, but it's such a good GP gun it's my usual carry gun for out in the sticks now. 6 rounds of .357 is good, but 15+1, with an additional 15, or 30, or more, of 10mm for fast reload is WAYYY better. Especially if whatever you're gunning for thinks it's higher up the food chain than you at that particular time.....

[theGinsue]

Nope I'd be just fine with a .357, I still carry a 6 shooter .357 when I camp and sometimes hunting. That's all I used to carry before I bought my 10mm. The only time I would feel undergunned would be against a grizz.

Everything in the statement above EXCEPT the 10mm part could have been written by me. For the last 18 years all I've carried in CO woods (aside from my 30-06 hunting rifle - while actively hunting for elk, deer and beer) is a Ruger Blackhawk .357 Magnum loaded with Federal Premium 158gr Hydra-Shok hollowpoints. I have never felt under-gunned.


Are there Grizzlies in the lower 48?


Up north there is from wyoming up, but I suspect they are here to.

It depends on who you ask. Officially, per the CO Dept of Wildlife (DOW) there are NO Grizzlies/Brown Bears/Brownies/Kodiaks, etc. (whatever you want to call them) in CO but there ARE brown colored black bears.

Now, that said, MANY people have claimed to have seen grizzlies in the SW corner of CO. They have described what they saw as a bear with the shoulder hump that only grizzlies have.

I am not at all afraid of CO black bears. While I'll never be quite THIS stupid ever again, I had a face-to-face with a black bear on Sep 12, 2001 in Colorado Springs. It was trapped in a courtyard of a hospital and I made sure it didn't leave until the DOW got there... All I had to protect myself was a 3D cell Maglite and my cell phone. I didn't feel under-gunned but I realize what I did was stupid.

While I don't fear CO black bears, Mtn Lions scare the hell out of me. The sneaky buggers will stalk you until they are ready to pounce and you've gotta be ready for them. Of course, a .357mag would drop it without a problem.

I'm not really concerned about having an encounter with a moose so I'll leave that one right there.

Now, if it is found that CO truly does have grizzlies, you're gonna need a bigger gun!

[Colorado Osprey]

It depends on who you ask. Officially, per the CO Dept of Wildlife (DOW) there are NO Grizzlies/Brown Bears/Brownies/Kodiaks, etc. (whatever you want to call them) in CO but there ARE brown colored black bears.

Very true, there are differrent color phases of black bears ranging from blonde, cinnamon, brown and black.

BUT.. a very big BUT! Colorado DOW has re-introduced Brown bears into Colorado just like the re-introduction of Wolves and Lynx. They keep it quiet for a few to many years until a sustainable population is reached.

I used to be in law enforcement and talked to the DOW guys almost daily. There has been many sightings of brown bears in Colorado... not just brown colored Black Bears.

Brown Bears are NOT all Grizzlies. Calling all Brown Bears Grizzlies are like calling all dogs Great Danes. Grizzlies live next to the coast and grow substantially larger than an inland Brown due to their diet including fish that Browns do not get.

How many people have seen wolves in Colorado??
I spotted a pack back in 1986... reported it to the DOW and then they said that they were Wolf Hybrids and that wolves were not in Colorado. Years later, in 2007 the DOW admitted the wolves were within 5 miles of where I had seen them years before; and indeed they were wolves and not wolf hybrids.... but 20 years later.

[Ranger]

I used to carry my .357 S&W when camping or hiking, now I just carry my Glock .45 with 15 rounds.

[OgenRwot]

There have been several reports of grizzly in the state from enough reliable sources that I would say there are a few. If you do a quick google search a lot comes up.

[marty]

Note that a black bear is not always black. It can also be brown, cinammon, blond, honey colored. All the bears I have seen in Colorado have been black except for one very large honey colored bear.

[DD977GM2]

Appreciate all the replys. I guess I will get a 357 & 44mag S&W revolvers and also G20 (I have wanted one for a while now). You guys make me like the expemsive stuff [Weight][Beer]

[BigMat]

except maybe that national forest in AZ.. [Coffee]


Funny story about that, a friend and I were poking around the desert south of Tucson on foot with 2 ARs and 2 Glock 19s looking around for a place to shoot/hunt. We ran into a deputy of a rural county who let us know we were under armed. No joke at all, and he made no bones about it. He also moved up here, he's Morgan338 on here

[theGinsue]

Now that's a good story. I don't recall the user handle though. Does he post much?

[Irving]

If you are hiking around with a rifle, how much of a chance do you have of being accused of poaching? I'm sure people take their rifles out to the forest to target shoot, but do you usually hike and camp while you do that? Kind of a dumb question, but I thought I'd ask anyway.

[sniper7]

who needs a .357 when you carry the knife of rambo[Coffee]...just sayin[Tooth]

[theGinsue]

Poaching? All I wanted was to go for a hike but that chicken sh!t bear wouldn't quit messing with me.

They drew first blood, not me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ExfGEYLrQQY

[argonstrom]

I'd rather feel the undergarments of Michelle Pfeiffer vs. a wild .357, but that's just me.

[rforsythe]

who needs a .357 when you carry the knife of rambo[Coffee]...just sayin[Tooth]

I'd settle for his exploding-tip arrows personally. Bears, cougars, and the occasional Russian attack helicopter will not bother you any more!

Oh and thanks to this thread I have a sudden urge to find a Ruger Super Redhawk and send some .454 at something.

[cowboykjohnson]

If you are hiking around with a rifle, how much of a chance do you have of being accused of poaching? I'm sure people take their rifles out to the forest to target shoot, but do you usually hike and camp while you do that? Kind of a dumb question, but I thought I'd ask anyway.
I've talked to many DOW officers while hiking with my Guide gun. I have never been accused or even hinted at about poaching. A poacher isn't going to go talk to the DOW people while carrying around a rifle.

[Pistol Packing Preacher]

No but I would want at least 6 shots, I woild love that new S&W that holds 8


NICE!!!!!

Me Want...
Me Need!!!

[Beer]

[marty]

Now what load for that .357 mag?
Assuming this is defensive only, no hunting.
I assume a deep penetrating FMJ is best for large critters such as black bears.
Such as the Fiocchi 142 gr with 618 ft. lbs. of muzzle energy.
http://www.ballistics101.com/357_magnum.php

A jacketed, soft point, or hollow point will expand before adequate penetration.

[68Charger]

found these articles, remembered this thread:

Example where a.454 Ruger Alaskan stopped a Grizzly in poor health:
http://www.peninsulaclarion.com/stories/080709/out_478669517.shtml

what happens when you try to use a .357 Magnum on a Grizzly:
http://www.csmonitor.com/From-the-news-wires/2010/0624/Grizzly-bear-attacks-Alaska-biologist-twice-biologist-not-upset-at-bear

we now return you to your discussion about loads..

Since you don't know what your target will be, it's hard to say whether you want FMJ or JHP.. maybe alternating? Standard Alaskan Bear load in the 12 Gauge was alternating 00 Buck & slugs.

[cowboykjohnson]

those were both really good reads, and why I say I would feel OK with a .357 in the woods except in grizz country.