View Full Version : Traveling to Massachusetts. Legal Question inside!
Geology Rocks
03-22-2011, 08:35
I grew up in Boston and have zero desire to move back there with their whacked out gun laws. However being that my family still lives there I get to go back and visit. In June my wife and I will be traveling to Mass to be with my family. Now the legal question............
My family has a vacation house in NH of which we will be spending 1 weeks time there. NH accepts Colorado carry permit and the firearm I would be carrying. Mass does not accept either.
Is it against the law to fly there lawfully, possess the firearm in mass and only begin to carry it once we cross state lines into NH? Or is it illegal once I cross into Massachusetts and have the firearm in my check baggage?
I have flown with firearms before but only to states that allow it.
Thoughts? Couldnt find anything on it.
joe
are you that worried about your safty that you need to bring a gun for a visit ??? if your planing on doing any shooting dont you know anybody that can lend you a firearm when you get there ??
The key here is "possession". If you take possession of your firearm while in Mass., you are most likely in violation of the law and subject to arrest. Logan airport has tried to arrest soldiers returning from overseas for taking possession of their sidearms in checked baggage before. A better option would be to ship your firearm to yourself in NH. This is perfectly legal, and does not require the services of an FFL, as long as you are shipping from yourself to yourself, as long as nobody else opens the package at the other end.
hurley842002
03-22-2011, 08:58
are you that worried about your safty that you need to bring a gun for a visit ???
Hate to get off track, but I had to address my girlfriends flawed statement last night, which was very similar to yours. Why carry at all? Are you that worried about your safety, going to the grocery store, or the Village inn? I don't visit states that don't allow me to carry, period. Unfortunately for some, they don't have a choice rather they visit or not. Kind of the same mindset that many Liberals have, needless to say, my GF didn't like me saying that to her.
To the OP, sorry to derail, and not answer your question, just had to address the above statement.
have you thought about flying into Manchester? It's a great airport, and if you're ending up in New Hampshire anyways.
IANAL, but I think what you're planning is a "no no". In Mass you need to have a FID or LTC just to own a firearm, and with the rare chance that you get pulled over driving up 93, it's a mandatory 1 year in state prison for possession of a firearm without a license. (although I don't believe anyone has actually been convicted of this crime- it seems to be plea-bargened to lesser charges. . . .but the law is there)
Another option is to mail your gun to yourself at the address you'll be at in NH. Perfectly legal. It'll cost you a couple dollars to overnight, but it would be worth the couple buck not to go to jail
Bailey Guns
03-22-2011, 09:40
I'm not sure I care for my family enough to go to...or even through...Massachusetts to see them.
I'll have to think on that.
Hate to get off track, but I had to address my girlfriends flawed statement last night, which was very similar to yours. Why carry at all? Are you that worried about your safety, going to the grocery store, or the Village inn? I don't visit states that don't allow me to carry, period. Unfortunately for some, they don't have a choice rather they visit or not. Kind of the same mindset that many Liberals have, needless to say, my GF didn't like me saying that to her.
To the OP, sorry to derail, and not answer your question, just had to address the above statement.
ok ill bite
after spending my life split between 5 points Denver Colorado and the Penn station area of Baltimore Maryland i still dont carry . Yes i have been shot at more than a few times , held up a gun point , had people break into my place (when im not there ) , stabbed in the gut (that one sucked , 29 staples, ouch ) ect. and i still dont carry . But i do keep a firearm handy at all times , in the truck (never leaving it over night ) , in a safe place in the home , a shotgun in the shed , that kind of thing . even in my mid 30's im not afraid to take a punch or punch someone .
Im not saying this about you or any other member of CoAr15 , but i find that most folks that carry are just plane scared or in some cases to lazy damn lazy to physically defend them selves .
when i travel across country i drive , this way i can have a gun handy. But when ever i go visit north east states (over the mason dixion line) , i just hit up a buddy if i want to do any shooting .
I really was not trying to be a dick , i was just asking because , traveling with a firearm can be a pain so unless there is a good reason ,why do it .
the only real reason i personally think of to carry (aside from work) is if you have small children to look after .
oh and liberal i am not !
liberal [ROFL2][ROFL1][ROFL3]
hurley842002
03-22-2011, 09:51
ok ill bite
after spending my life split between 5 points Denver Colorado and the Penn station area of Baltimore Maryland i still dont carry . Yes i have been shot at more than a few times , held up a gun point , had people break into my place (when im not there ) , stabbed in the gut (that one sucked , 29 staples, ouch ) ect. and i still dont carry . But i do keep a firearm handy at all times , in the truck (never leaving it over night ) , in a safe place in the home , a shotgun in the shed , that kind of thing . even in my mid 30's im not afraid to take a punch or punch someone .
Im not saying this about you or any other member of CoAr15 , but i find that most folks that carry are just plane scared or in some cases to lazy damn lazy to physically defend them selves .
when i travel across country i drive , this way i can have a gun handy. But when ever i go visit north east states (over the mason dixion line) , i just hit up a buddy if i want to do any shooting .
I really was not trying to be a dick , i was just asking because , traveling with a firearm can be a pain so unless there is a good reason ,why do it .
the only real reason i personally think of to carry (aside from work) is if you have small children to look after .
oh and liberal i am not !
liberal [ROFL2][ROFL1][ROFL3]
Sounds like you are quite the bad a$$, i'm likely not as tough as you, so i'll continue to carry everywhere, and continue to not travel where I can't carry. Call me scared, paranoid, crazy, whatever, I will continue to practice my 2nd.
KevDen2005
03-22-2011, 09:52
I'm not sure I care for my family enough to go to...or even through...Massachusetts to see them.
I'll have to think on that.
Amen to that...
and Carry all the time if you can...isn't that the point?
hurley842002
03-22-2011, 09:54
Amen to that...
and Carry all the time if you can...isn't that the point?
You must be scared.
DeusExMachina
03-22-2011, 09:55
Holy crap. If all those things happened to me, I'd carry TWO guns everywhere I went.
Sounds like you are quite the bad a$$, i'm likely not as tough as you, so i'll continue to carry everywhere, and continue to not travel where I can't carry. Call me scared, paranoid, crazy, whatever, I will continue to practice my 2nd.
no not a bad ass . just remember" if your gonna be dumb you gotta be tough "
I think that everyone should be allowed to carry and im right there with everybody else on this forum when it comes to the 2nd . Just because i dont feel the need to carry dose not mean i want that right taken away for any reason .
Bailey Guns
03-22-2011, 10:00
I'd just stay home. I'd be too scared...and paranoid...and lazy to defend myself if I left home and got in trouble.
(How are you going to care for your children..or other family...if you get whacked by some criminal and you could've used a gun to defend yourself?)
hurley842002
03-22-2011, 10:01
no not a bad ass . just remember" if your gonna be dumb you gotta be tough "
I think that everyone should be allowed to carry and im right there with everybody else on this forum when it comes to the 2nd . Just because i dont feel the need to carry dose not mean i want that right taken away for any reason .
[Beer]
DeusExMachina
03-22-2011, 10:02
no not a bad ass . just remember" if your gonna be dumb you gotta be tough "
I think that everyone should be allowed to carry and im right there with everybody else on this forum when it comes to the 2nd . Just because i dont feel the need to carry dose not mean i want that right taken away for any reason .
This, and this are two hypocritical statements.
are you that worried about your safty that you need to bring a gun for a visit ??? if your planing on doing any shooting dont you know anybody that can lend you a firearm when you get there ??
Geology Rocks
03-22-2011, 10:09
The reason I ask is because of the Federal Law that allows state to state transportation of a firearm. I am in transit. Does that mean if you live in Maine and are driving to Florida you have to skip Massachusetts, or are you protected by Federal Law? Are all laws thrown out because I am flying?
Reason? I would like to shoot while I am there and most importantly I would like to protect my wife. Our house is in the middle of the woods, surrounded by nothing but trees. Safe yes...however, if something were to go wrong you have no chance unless you are armed. Fire is all volunteer and there are 2 cops in town. Plus I can.....
Joe
I'd just stay home. I'd be too scared...and paranoid...and lazy to defend myself if I left home and got in trouble.
(How are you going to care for your children..or other family...if you get whacked by some criminal and you could've used a gun to defend yourself?)
99% of the time getting shot should not be a concern . do you find yourself associating with criminals or putting yourself at risk of being shot ? Most of the time a firm look or a few choice words get the job done and when thats not enough you should not hesitate grab them by the collar and put your fist down there throat . Hell if im that mad that i feel the need to kill them id rather beat them to death , much more satisfying.
I love firearms , there machines and are fun to take apart and shoot , all that stuff , but until the man comes to take them away or we have gangs of armed looters ect. , ill just shoot for fun thanks .
I dont know how many of you have seen what actually happens when someone gets shot , but its not pretty and a real pain to deal with . I grantee if you go out of state and get involved in a shooting ,right or wrong, you will spend at least one night in jail .
This, and this are two hypocritical statements.
how is that hypocritical , one is a statement and one is a question ?
BlasterBob
03-22-2011, 10:27
You must be scared.
I really prefer to consider it as being very CAUTIOUS.....
The reason I ask is because of the Federal Law that allows state to state transportation of a firearm. I am in transit. Does that mean if you live in Maine and are driving to Florida you have to skip Massachusetts, or are you protected by Federal Law? Are all laws thrown out because I am flying?
Reason? I would like to shoot while I am there and most importantly I would like to protect my wife. Our house is in the middle of the woods, surrounded by nothing but trees. Safe yes...however, if something were to go wrong you have no chance unless you are armed. Fire is all volunteer and there are 2 cops in town. Plus I can.....
Joe
right on that makes sense , i really was not trying to be a dick . if its a vacation house that you own why not leave a few tucked away , so in the future you wont have the concern of hassle .
aside from the mail or driving it yourself across , i be real careful about the airlines , they might try to bait and switch ya , sure mr you can bring you gun just put it in you luggage , then you go to clame your luggage and bam your hit with some over blown arms case that will cost way too much in law fees . Personal id stop by a walmart or something and pick up a shotgun for cheap .
hurley842002
03-22-2011, 10:28
I really prefer to consider it as being very CAUTIOUS.....
Yeah, that was a sarcastic statement.
I really prefer to consider it as being very CAUTIOUS.....
[LOL]
[Beer]
ChadAmberg
03-22-2011, 10:34
There's the law that says as long as you're traveling through the state and don't stop except for gas, you're good to go. Lets see from the NRAILA site:
A provision of federal law serves as a defense to state or local laws which would prohibit the passage of persons with firearms in interstate travel.
Notwithstanding any state or local law, a person shall be entitled to transport a firearm from any place where he may lawfully possess and transport such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and transport such firearm if the firearm is unloaded and in the trunk. In vehicles without a trunk, the unloaded firearm shall be in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
Now, this is a "defense" to state or local laws. Which probably means they'd arrest you, seize the weapons, you'd go to court for arraignment and if you're lucky they'll let you go there and you'll get your guns back in a couple months. Worse is if you'd have to go to full court to present your affirmative defense.
In fact, here's a special warning for Mass:
MASSACHUSETTS—Caution: Massachusetts imposes harsh penalties on the mere possession and transport of firearms unrelated to criminal or violent conduct. Possession of any firearm or ammunition within the state generally requires a state-issued firearm identification card (FID) or license. Licensing and possession regulations vary according to the type of firearm at issue.
Nonresidents may possess rifles, shotguns and “ammunition therefor” without a license or FID while traveling in or through the Commonwealth, provided that the rifle or shotgun is unloaded and enclosed in a case. A nonresident without a license or FID may also carry or possess “conventional rifles, shotguns, and ammunition therefor” if the person meets the requirements for such carrying or possession in the state in which he or she resides. Persons in possession of firearms or ammunition who are moving into Massachusetts or returning to the Commonwealth after an absence of at least 180 consecutive days must obtain the proper credentials within 60 days of entry in order to continue to possess the firearms or ammunition legally.
A nonresident “may carry a pistol or revolver in and through the commonwealth” for purposes of attending a competition or a meeting or exhibition of collectors, or for hunting, provided the person has a valid carry permit from another state whose issuing requirements meet certain guidelines specified under Massachusetts law. If the person is traveling for hunting, he or she must also possess a hunting license issued by Massachusetts or the state of destination. Massachusetts will also issue qualified nonresidents a one-year license to carry a firearm in the Commonwealth.
Man, they suck...
Byte Stryke
03-22-2011, 10:34
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed, Except as crossing state boundaries?
Geology Rocks
03-22-2011, 10:34
99% of the time getting shot should not be a concern . do you find yourself associating with criminals or putting yourself at risk of being shot ? Most of the time a firm look or a few choice words get the job done and when thats not enough you should not hesitate grab them by the collar and put your fist down there throat . Hell if im that mad that i feel the need to kill them id rather beat them to death , much more satisfying.
I love firearms , there machines and are fun to take apart and shoot , all that stuff , but until the man comes to take them away or we have gangs of armed looters ect. , ill just shoot for fun thanks .
I dont know how many of you have seen what actually happens when someone gets shot , but its not pretty and a real pain to deal with . I grantee if you go out of state and get involved in a shooting ,right or wrong, you will spend at least one night in jail .
No worries man i know you weren't being a dick. :)
The reason why I quoted this section though is because there are sometimes when people just don't want to mess with you, or steal your TV. There are people out there who want nothing more than to watch the fear in your eyes as they steal your last breath from you. Those people cannot be controlled by a punch or being talked down. Trust me I have seen and worked with those kind of people before. Its those people that concern me and why i carry. A firearm is a last resort but in the event you need it, it will be great to have.
You have the right to not carry just like i have the right to carry. :)
joe
The reason I ask is because of the Federal Law that allows state to state transportation of a firearm. I am in transit. Does that mean if you live in Maine and are driving to Florida you have to skip Massachusetts, or are you protected by Federal Law? Are all laws thrown out because I am flying?
Reason? I would like to shoot while I am there and most importantly I would like to protect my wife. Our house is in the middle of the woods, surrounded by nothing but trees. Safe yes...however, if something were to go wrong you have no chance unless you are armed. Fire is all volunteer and there are 2 cops in town. Plus I can.....
Joe
Federal Safe Transit does not apply when flying, only when driving. The firearm must be unloaded, inaccessible, and stored separately from the ammunition. You would have to be able to prove that you were transiting through MA, that it was not your destination. Hollow point ammo would still be a faux pas under Assachusetts law.
Bailey Guns
03-22-2011, 10:38
99% of the time getting shot should not be a concern . do you find yourself associating with criminals or putting yourself at risk of being shot ? Most of the time a firm look or a few choice words get the job done and when thats not enough you should not hesitate grab them by the collar and put your fist down there throat . Hell if im that mad that i feel the need to kill them id rather beat them to death , much more satisfying.
I love firearms , there machines and are fun to take apart and shoot , all that stuff , but until the man comes to take them away or we have gangs of armed looters ect. , ill just shoot for fun thanks .
I dont know how many of you have seen what actually happens when someone gets shot , but its not pretty and a real pain to deal with . I grantee if you go out of state and get involved in a shooting ,right or wrong, you will spend at least one night in jail .
It ain't the 99% of the time I worry about.
And I'm no Chuck Norris, but I don't worry about most one on one physical confrontations. I can usually take care of myself. But, short of being attacked by gang of girl scouts, X on one confrontations are a possibility and I doubt I could physically handle multiple attackers...even as few as two.
I've seen the results of actual human beings getting in the way of a bullet. You're right. It isn't pretty. But, that's one of the traits of bullets I really admire...the damage they can do from a (relatively safe) distance when required and effectively employed.
And the aftermath of shooting someone is a PITA. But I submit it's better than being dead.
Sorry for the thread-jack.
Have you checked the Mass State Police website or maybe www.handgunlaw.us (http://www.handgunlaw.us) for an answer?
Paranoid, hell....I have the whole set!
I don't usually carry while actually AT work, but there are a number of strategically located options here, and some of my coworkers DO carry consistently. I just feel more comfortable without the "brick in my pocket" feeling that the Baby Ancho... er...Eagle brings... [LOL]
Geology Rocks
03-22-2011, 10:44
There's the law that says as long as you're traveling through the state and don't stop except for gas, you're good to go. Lets see from the NRAILA site:
A provision of federal law serves as a defense to state or local laws which would prohibit the passage of persons with firearms in interstate travel.
Notwithstanding any state or local law, a person shall be entitled to transport a firearm from any place where he may lawfully possess and transport such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and transport such firearm if the firearm is unloaded and in the trunk. In vehicles without a trunk, the unloaded firearm shall be in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
Now, this is a "defense" to state or local laws. Which probably means they'd arrest you, seize the weapons, you'd go to court for arraignment and if you're lucky they'll let you go there and you'll get your guns back in a couple months. Worse is if you'd have to go to full court to present your affirmative defense.
In fact, here's a special warning for Mass:
MASSACHUSETTS—Caution: Massachusetts imposes harsh penalties on the mere possession and transport of firearms unrelated to criminal or violent conduct. Possession of any firearm or ammunition within the state generally requires a state-issued firearm identification card (FID) or license. Licensing and possession regulations vary according to the type of firearm at issue.
Nonresidents may possess rifles, shotguns and “ammunition therefor” without a license or FID while traveling in or through the Commonwealth, provided that the rifle or shotgun is unloaded and enclosed in a case. A nonresident without a license or FID may also carry or possess “conventional rifles, shotguns, and ammunition therefor” if the person meets the requirements for such carrying or possession in the state in which he or she resides. Persons in possession of firearms or ammunition who are moving into Massachusetts or returning to the Commonwealth after an absence of at least 180 consecutive days must obtain the proper credentials within 60 days of entry in order to continue to possess the firearms or ammunition legally.
A nonresident “may carry a pistol or revolver in and through the commonwealth” for purposes of attending a competition or a meeting or exhibition of collectors, or for hunting, provided the person has a valid carry permit from another state whose issuing requirements meet certain guidelines specified under Massachusetts law. If the person is traveling for hunting, he or she must also possess a hunting license issued by Massachusetts or the state of destination. Massachusetts will also issue qualified nonresidents a one-year license to carry a firearm in the Commonwealth.
Man, they suck...
Thanks for the info and yes Mass sucks big time. NY and Mass I was told refuse to recognize the retired peace officer card that allows all retired police officers to carry in any state. They refuse and arrested a retired cop in NY. Apparently they think they are above Federal Law. [Rant2]
I have a call into my cousin who is a retired Mass trooper and a criminal defense attorney in Mass as well as a friend of my fathers who ran the Mass state police to hear what they say.
joe
Hey even Chuck carries...
And our local Rambo ain't met with bubba no doubt.
I was once Bad Ass but now old age and lack of wanting to drag out the process I just shoot ya.
Something else to consider. . . if you decide to fly into Boston
Mass still has an "assault weapon ban". Assuming you'd be taking a pistol, you can not have a hi-cap mag (unless it's pre-ban). Possession of a hi-cap is a felony in the commonwealth.
I don't know when you're planning on going, but yet another option is to apply for a Mass non-resident LTC. They are issued by the state police, are $100 and good for a year. I heard thy are taking about 8 weeks door to door.
Mass still has an "assault weapon ban". Assuming you'd be taking a pistol, you can not have a hi-cap mag (unless it's pre-ban). Possession of a hi-cap is a felony in the commonwealth.
According to the media everything is considered and ASSAULT weapon.
chuck also dose not swim , he lets the water surround him .
I figure when i hit 50 ill carry everywhere , until then i can fight and or run if need be , but i mostly avoid the situation .
yes there is always a tougher dog in the junk yard and some times there is no getting out of it and you have to come face to face with psychos .
I just figure when your number is up and there is nothing i can do about it , gun or no gun .
I have never claimed to be a bad ass and have never thought of myself as one , not for one second (well maybe one or twice when i used to drink a lot ,lol )
i do and have considered myself quite lucky in unlucky situations . Most people born and raised in the city (downtown , lower income neighborhoods) have similar experiences.
i wouldn't risk it. either bite the bullet (no pun intended) and mail it to yourself in NH, or don't take it at all. there are lots of stories out there about people getting the book thrown at them for a slight misunderstanding in gun laws in the northeast and they pay a big price for it. i wouldn't take that risk. you have a very small chance of actually needing the pistol for the short time you are there. sure anything is possible, but when you look at the odds and the risk you take i wouldn't do it. unless, of course, you are willing to pay to have it shipped.
i know someone will jump to the "but what if?!?!?!?!" and yes it could happen that you get jumped or something, but frankly the vast majority of us will never, ever have that happen. i am 100% for carry rights, but i personally don't go and get my permit because i just don't see the practical use. if you are smart about where you go, with whom, and when, its extremely unlikely you would need it. in some cases, it will simply escalate the situation to a more dangerous one. some people think it works as a deterrent but it can also raise the stakes. you have to be incredibly wise about when to pull a gun and when not to. for those reasons, i just don't see why you would want to run the risk of breaking the law or spend the extra money all to have it for a one week period of time.
off soap box.
Great-Kazoo
03-22-2011, 12:41
chuck also dose not swim , he lets the water surround him .
I figure when i hit 50 ill carry everywhere , until then i can fight and or run if need be , but i mostly avoid the situation .
yes there is always a tougher dog in the junk yard and some times there is no getting out of it and you have to come face to face with psychos .
I just figure when your number is up and there is nothing i can do about it , gun or no gun .
I have never claimed to be a bad ass and have never thought of myself as one , not for one second (well maybe one or twice when i used to drink a lot ,lol )
i do and have considered myself quite lucky in unlucky situations . Most people born and raised in the city (downtown , lower income neighborhoods) have similar experiences.
I agree when your number is called it doesn't matter if you are getting car jacked or on top / bottom of the spouse, you are done. However i am over 50 and this last surgery took whats left of the wind out of my sails. I have carried for many a year with out incident. HOWEVER as i tell folks who attend my CCW class. Whether it is the paper, radio or tv news, You always here one of the people interviewed say. "
You know this use to be a nice neighborhood, who would have thought something like this could happen here"
something that goes through my head when friends are bs'ing about the younger years of mixing it up, is the pink floyd verse.
you're to old to use the weight you use to need to throw around.
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