View Full Version : AK build party- June 18
68Charger
05-04-2011, 14:14
I'm planning an AK build party for the 18th of June (day before Father's day)
So far it's myself, dbeal and his son... I'd like to limit the headcount to 6 or so... it's just my garage with a small swamp cooler, it fills up quickly
so as far as tools, we'll have:
Press (I've got one, plus dbeal can bring his), drill press a small mill (X3, 18") + end mills, 115 piece drill bit set, 5mm & 7mm reamers (dbeal)
acetylene torch + oil bucket for heat treat of FCG holes, plus pan & brake fluid for annealing rails
5.45 + 7.62x39 headspace gauges (dbeal) , Flat bending jig (we'll either have an ak-builder jig there, or I'll build one by then, already have the metal set aside)
bolt cutters modified for rivet squeezing on front trunnion, and some handmade rivet tools for long rivets- letter + number stamps for serial#s
mig welder, spot welder modd'ed for rails (I've got the welder, just need to finish modding one of the tongs)
sand blaster, dremel, files, sandpaper, etc
I've got a parkerizing setup, but not fully tested yet, so use at your own peril- but should be better than leaving it in the white...
and 45+ acres in the country, so you can test within minutes of finishing a build!!! [AR15]
All NFA rules will apply, and no alcohol will be present (I'm not opposed to it after the guns & tools are put away, tho)
bring something to BBQ, or other lunch, and your favorite beverage... I'll have water, iced tea & Mtn Dew Retro
Let me know in this thread (or via PM if you're shy) if you're interested- we can make sure we've got what you need for the stage of building that you're at...
I've got a ak74 .223 build I'm still gathering parts for, and I want to start a 2XTM drum-fed AK in a 9mm (maybe 9x23 Win)
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 14:21
so im new to building AK's but would love to build one...i would need an AK parts kit and a receiver right?
Yes you will need a kit, a reciever (or flat) and rivet kit, plus your compliance parts to make it legal.
I'm interested where can we get some parts kit that are complete also new to this
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 14:33
Yes you will need a kit, a reciever (or flat) and rivet kit, plus your compliance parts to make it legal.
where would be the best place to find these magical parts
68Charger
05-04-2011, 14:39
so im new to building AK's but would love to build one...i would need an AK parts kit and a receiver right?
A parts kit, a Barrel (if the kit is barrel-less, as most are now), a receiver or a flat (we can bend it into a receiver), and 922(r) compliance parts (usually a Fire control group, plus either furniture, gas piston, muzzle device, etc)
here's a worksheet to figure out if you have enough compliance parts:
http://jobson.us/922r/ or http://gunwiki.net/Gunwiki/BuildAkVerifyCompliance
You could also do a Saiga conversions there, they're much less involved, but some of the tools are the same... I've done my own Saiga-12
Just to clarify- we're not gunsmiths, so you'll be working on your own gun... but there will be people there that have done the same thing before, and will be able to advise and provide guidance... newbs are welcome, I can tell you from experience you learn A LOT by seeing it done, and even more by doing it with your own hands.
AK-Builder.com is good for flats & compliance parts- I'm sure there are industry partners in the Denver area that can provide some, too...
http://ak-builder.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=30127
Might be dumb but is this complete?
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 14:57
if you get a receiver flat do you have to ship to on an FLL or how does that work?
68Charger
05-04-2011, 14:57
I'm interested where can we get some parts kit that are complete also new to this
apexgunparts.com is a very good source of parts kits, they're in Colorado- but don't have a store front- if you call them, they can bring kits reserved for you to a gun show they have a booth at... https://www.apexgunparts.com/index.php/cPath/51
Arms of America has moved to Colorado, also, and they just got more parts kits in:
http://armsofamerica.com/partskits-2.aspx
There's always gunbroker, CoGunsales.com, Whatacountry.com ,
another list at: http://gun-deals.com/index.php?dealtype=arms&category=1&subcat=6
Well if I can get that day off work and Get a kit I would be in
68Charger
05-04-2011, 15:01
http://ak-builder.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=30127
Might be dumb but is this complete?
That is a very complete kit, just need compliance parts to get you to 10 or less foreign made parts
if you get a receiver flat do you have to ship to on an FLL or how does that work?
a flat is NOT a firearm until it's bent- so no, it can ship to your residence... you must be the one bending it, and then you can't sell it (since you're not a FFL manufacturer)... but you can give it to a family member, will it to them, etc... there are processes that an 07 FFL can do to transfer it, but in general consider the AK yours for life to be on the safe side...
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 15:05
That is a very complete kit, just need compliance parts to get you to 10 or less foreign made parts
a flat is NOT a firearm until it's bent- so no, it can ship to your residence... you must be the one bending it, and then you can't sell it (since you're not a FFL manufacturer)... but you can give it to a family member, will it to them, etc... there are processes that an 07 FFL can do to transfer it, but in general consider the AK yours for life to be on the safe side...
ok...so lets say i bought that kit, what would i still need? sorry for my ignorance, would any of those be good kits bc we are making them ourselfs? And finally I was looking at one with a 14 in barrel do you guys have the stuff to perm mount the break?
68Charger
05-04-2011, 15:06
when looking at kits, it helps to figure out what you want it for- and build a kit that suits that... an underfolder like that AK-Builder kit is a great "shoot-from-the-hip" setup, and quite compact, but they suck for a cheek weld, so don't expect to use it for sniping... [ROFL1]
the 74 kits in the 5.45 round are VERY light recoil, and surplus ammo is very cheap (currently), like around 12 cents per round... very good bang for the buck, plus you'll know your rifle/carbine intimately [Coffee]
What parts are usually us.
Barrel
mag?
?
jreifsch80
05-04-2011, 15:06
I plan to come if there's room and I have my pneumatic rivet squasher and my varios other rivets tools if needed also my flat bending jig (new style ak-builder copy) also I have 5mm and 7mm reamers for the flat and barrel pin holes also the reamers for rsb, gb and fsb pin holes. If I can't make it I can lend you any of my tooling you might need.
For those looking for kits or other parts
Kits
apexgunparts.com has decent selection of barrel-less kits
Whatacountry.com good selection as well
Armsofamerica.com has a good price on some decent us made barrels both chromed or not, I personally have build a couple with these barrels and I am quite pleased with the quality and accuracy for the money.
Ak-builder.com has everything needed for the home builder very nice flats, rivet sets and all the required stuff, they also sell kits with built barrel assemblies
there are other places as well of course but these some with the most selection at the moment. Also check copesdistributing.net, militarygunsupply.com, and centerfire for other places that have decent priced kits (when they have them in stock)
guess I should look for a 74 since I already have one
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 15:13
guess I should look for a 74 since I already have one
find a 74 underfolder kit and let me know i might get one too
68Charger
05-04-2011, 15:15
ok...so lets say i bought that kit, what would i still need? sorry for my ignorance, would any of those be good kits bc we are making them ourselfs? And finally I was looking at one with a 14 in barrel do you guys have the stuff to perm mount the break?
There are many flavors of AKs, just figure out what you'd like it for... there are a few options for permanent attachment of a brake/flash hider:
1) weld it- I've got a flux core/ Mig welder that can do this
2) Sliver solder (I have some, and my torch gets plenty hot enough)
3) blind pin (this means drilling through the brake, into the barrel (but not through to the inside), then pressing a pin into the hole, and grinding it flush so it can't easily be removed... this is not difficult, and we'll have the tools to do it...
I don't think they made underdolder 74 only side folders
Could be wrong
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 15:19
im guessing this is an all day event
Umm yes were shooting guns!
68Charger
05-04-2011, 15:33
Don't know that I've seen a '74 underfolder...
https://www.apexgunparts.com/product_info.php/cPath/51/products_id/1875
is a nice kit that's a sidefolder...
most kits now are barrel-less, so you can get a US barrel (but be cautious of cheap '74 barrels, there are some that are .223 diameter, not the .220 they should be... and they "keyhole", just don't stabilize bullets.
There are a few different ways to go with 922(r) compliance-
if you want an authentic look, you can keep the foreign furniture, but change the internals- I'd be cautious of using mags for compliance- in 5.45 or 7.62, the cheapest mags are foreign surplus... I didn't rely upon it for my Saiga or my 7.62 build, but I plan to for my .223 build (I'm going to use a magwell for AR15 mags)... and I won't own any .223 foreign mags.
and yes- it's an all day event- if you're new to it, getting a rifle done in a day is not likely, depending on how much you've done ahead of time (demil, rivet drilling, preparing kit for assembly, etc)
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 15:40
Don't know that I've seen a '74 underfolder...
https://www.apexgunparts.com/product_info.php/cPath/51/products_id/1875
is a nice kit that's a sidefolder...
most kits now are barrel-less, so you can get a US barrel (but be cautious of cheap '74 barrels, there are some that are .223 diameter, not the .220 they should be... and they "keyhole", just don't stabilize bullets.
There are a few different ways to go with 922(r) compliance-
if you want an authentic look, you can keep the foreign furniture, but change the internals- I'd be cautious of using mags for compliance- in 5.45 or 7.62, the cheapest mags are foreign surplus... I didn't rely upon it for my Saiga or my 7.62 build, but I plan to for my .223 build (I'm going to use a magwell for AR15 mags)... and I won't own any .223 foreign mags.
and yes- it's an all day event- if you're new to it, getting a rifle done in a day is not likely, depending on how much you've done ahead of time (demil, rivet drilling, preparing kit for assembly, etc)
i was getting ready to ask about this kit...so i would need 6 US made parts...if i didnt finish it in a day would it be possible to finish on my own? Is there a different flat receiver for the 5.45?
68Charger
05-04-2011, 15:59
if i didnt finish it in a day would it be possible to finish on my own?
It's possible, depends on how far you get, and what tools you have... depending on how hard the bug bites you, you may get more tools, and worst case, you can follow up at another party, or bribe someone with tools another time... I don't plan on disappearing [Beer]
Is there a different flat receiver for the 5.45?
yes, there are different flats for different flavors- magwell is narrower on 5.45- Underfolders are different in the rear (for the UF components to fit through the receiver), and you can get them with or without trunnion holes drilled (either works fine, you may have to "egg" holes if they're already there, and they don't line up)
For a 1st build, I highly recommend the AK-Builder flats, they're very high quality, and have less work required than Tapco flats, for example..
I'm not sure right now if we'll have the die for pressing 1.5mm flats (like Yugos), and make sure you don't get a milled kit- unless you want a lot of work (long story, but there is just more to them)
I looked at that kit but dont know where to find a reciver?
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 16:06
I looked at that kit but dont know where to find a reciver?
+1, does the 74 require a different trigger group than the 47?
blackford76
05-04-2011, 16:22
If I have one I built several years ago using the bolt together method, how hard would it be to re-do it with rivets?
68Charger
05-04-2011, 16:46
+1, does the 74 require a different trigger group than the 47?
Negative, they take the same one...
Tapco G2 is cheap, effective- single hook is easier, but a double hook can be tuned a bit by trimming the receiver (yes, I've done it)
If I have one I built several years ago using the bolt together method, how hard would it be to re-do it with rivets?
re-doing a screw build as a rivet build should just require getting the correct rivet set, pressing the barrel out of the trunnion, and re-assembly with rivets. Check headspace, but headspace should not be affected (it's set by barrel pin, bolt and trunnion)
not too difficult, but can't say 100% without getting into it.
Someday I need to re-do the trigger guard on my Saiga- it's screw-built. (but mag catch is separate, and riveted)
blackford76
05-04-2011, 16:53
It shoots ok the way it is, but I worry about the screws working loose. I may have to look into joining up with you guys and try to get rivets put in it.
Also, I have a few parts kits that have had parts cannibalized, but still have some good parts left, maybe I could do a little trading for the rivet set.
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 17:04
with this flat receiver work with that side folder 74?
http://ak-builder.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=29880
68Charger
05-04-2011, 17:29
with this flat receiver work with that side folder 74?
http://ak-builder.com/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=29880
yes, that's the correct one- it's not drilled for trunnions, so it works with either folders or fixed stock tantals
AK-Builder has Polish Tantal rivet sets, and AK74 sidefolder rivet sets- I'd drop him an email to see which one is correct, and you'll need a Center support rivet as well (AK-Builder sells them separately)... and if you use a gas piston as one of your compliance parts, you should get a piston rivet (but I've made my own from a nail, it gets ground flush anyway)
Another part y'all may want to consider is a FCG pin retaining plate- if your parts kit has a full-auto FCG included, you can make a shepard's crook that will do the same job from the auto sear spring (you won't be able to use it, anyway)... but the plate is easy & works better
jreifsch80,
If you come down, bring my Ar15 jig if your not using it, and any bits, etc that went with it..I'm gonna mill another AR this summer.
jreifsch80
05-04-2011, 19:31
Ok dbeal I'll bring it I still want to mill out an ar15 80% someday but I might wait to do it with the help of someone who already has.
Those tantals from apex are very nice, I bought one the first day they listed and it happens to be numbers matching and unfired. As for a barrel for these a standard 74 barrel should work fine though 74 barrels do not have threaded muzzles as 74's have threads on their front sight block but the polish tantal has a threaded muzzle to attatch the long muzzle break they have. The polish tantal flat at apex is correct sice the tantal has a lower placement of the saftey dust cover lever and also has a left side fire selector (which could probably be modified into a safety as well) also the tantal has basicly an akm pattern rear trunnion so if you don't like the side folder they come with a standard akm or ak74 fixed stock could be used. there were never under folding ak74 models but it would be coold if someone built one. Also blackford76, it would be very easy to turn your screw build into a rivet build, it would basicly no different than building any other original barreled kit. Also blackford, if you don't mind the rivets having a tiny bit bigger heads than the original sized ak builder rivets then you can have some of my bulk rivets that I use for rebuilding yours.
jreifsch80
05-04-2011, 19:42
Charger, I forgot to ask, Is your park solution zinc or manganese? If you want I could help season your solution with 3 or 4 ak's ;)
68Charger
05-04-2011, 22:04
Charger, I forgot to ask, Is your park solution zinc or manganese? If you want I could help season your solution with 3 or 4 ak's ;)
I've only got Manganese, but zinc is pretty easy to come by, especially if you don't mind destroying a little worthless currency... [Tooth]
prolly don't want to use the same vessels, tho...
patrick0685
05-04-2011, 22:08
im gunna try to make it, but if someone can def make it let them have my spot
OneGuy67
05-04-2011, 22:46
I would be interested in coming as well! I have a couple of kits still needing to be finished. I've been putzing around with them for months now and need to get serious about finishing them.
As with what someone else stated, please put me on the interested in coming list, but can be bumped if there is someone else who really needs to go to get help.
With the guys up in Windsor (Bryan, Jim), I got enough schooling and knowledge to be able to successfully complete two Romy kits so far and have an Egyptian and a Bulgarian that need to be finished.
I'll be out of the country for about a month and will return on June 12th. So, if I make the list, please send me a PM!
Thanks!
jreifsch80
05-05-2011, 00:57
I would be interested in coming as well! I have a couple of kits still needing to be finished. I've been putzing around with them for months now and need to get serious about finishing them.
As with what someone else stated, please put me on the interested in coming list, but can be bumped if there is someone else who really needs to go to get help.
With the guys up in Windsor (Bryan, Jim), I got enough schooling and knowledge to be able to successfully complete two Romy kits so far and have an Egyptian and a Bulgarian that need to be finished.
I'll be out of the country for about a month and will return on June 12th. So, if I make the list, please send me a PM!
Thanks!
how much do you have done or how much do you have to do?
charger i will probably come just to fart around with your blaster and park tank (and bring tooling that's needed) so just count me as a half person ;)
OneGuy67
05-05-2011, 09:44
how much do you have done or how much do you have to do?
charger i will probably come just to fart around with your blaster and park tank (and bring tooling that's needed) so just count me as a half person ;)
I need to finish a folded receiver. I got one spot welded the last time at Jim's, but it isn't quite right in the angles and need to work on that. Then, the various riveting and barrel instal. The receivers and getting them correct are the biggest pain; they are Tapco's.
jreifsch80
05-05-2011, 13:19
I need to finish a folded receiver. I got one spot welded the last time at Jim's, but it isn't quite right in the angles and need to work on that. Then, the various riveting and barrel instal. The receivers and getting them correct are the biggest pain; they are Tapco's.
Ah I think I remember, you had the handfull of bent flats you wanted to run through a new style bender to sharpen up the corners right? I think I have an idea about how we might be able to do that pretty easily.
Also guys if I still have zteknik's ak-builder trunnion rivet hole drilling jig I'll bring that too. Makes drilling the non drilled ak builder flats and nodaks a snap.
Anyone who wants to use my bulk rivets that's fine I just ask you give me 2 or 3 bucks so I can put that toward replentishing them otherwise on a random rivvet or two don't worry about it by the way all my bulk rivets are non swell necks in case anyone is anal about that
OneGuy67
05-05-2011, 13:59
Ah I think I remember, you had the handfull of bent flats you wanted to run through a new style bender to sharpen up the corners right? I think I have an idea about how we might be able to do that pretty easily.
Also guys if I still have zteknik's ak-builder trunnion rivet hole drilling jig I'll bring that too. Makes drilling the non drilled ak builder flats and nodaks a snap.
Anyone who wants to use my bulk rivets that's fine I just ask you give me 2 or 3 bucks so I can put that toward replentishing them otherwise on a random rivvet or two don't worry about it by the way all my bulk rivets are non swell necks in case anyone is anal about that
Yep! I re-bent a bunch and it really tightened the edges, but bent them wwaaay over 90 degrees. I got to get that taken care of.
does anyone have any 5.56 X 45 go no/go headspace guages? I'm gonna try to build a 47 and a 5.56 74. gotta teach Junior how his rifle works..heh heh
Ah -looks like you guys are going to have fun![Tooth]
too bad i wont be able to take my vacation early!! :(
Have fun and dont let the rommy vampires bite ya!;)
jreifsch80
05-05-2011, 21:27
For being bent over 90 we can bolt them onto the inner die and bend each side out by hand, hopefully it won't be too hard.
Dbeal, I'll check if maybe jim has a set of 5.56 gauges we could use otherwise they don't cost all that much I guess.
Wish you could make it too bob then we could have you run the park tank ;)
im gunna try to make it, but if someone can def make it let them have my spot
I'm kinda feeling the same. I would like to make it but if another person is a defenitive yes let them have it
jreifsch80,
Set me out a set of bulk rivets for my romy G build..
68Charger
05-06-2011, 13:23
Since I'm doing at least one .223/5.56 build, I may want to pick up the go/no-go gauges... but do we want 5.56x45 or .223?
Looking into it, the difference is .0006 to .0008 (less than one thou) between the 2 sets of GO gauges.. the main difference is in the throat.
NO-GO gages are another matter- 5.56 is almost .004 longer than .223, 5.56 no-go is almost the same as the Civilian Field gage
http://www.ar15barrels.com/data/headspace.pdf
I know I can get a pair at Brownells for $40 + shipping
ETA: the $40 ones are Forster, and .223... it's about $50 for Clymer 5.56 gauges.
jreifsch80
05-06-2011, 18:39
jreifsch80,
Set me out a set of bulk rivets for my romy G build..
ok i'll bring my boxes of various sized rivets, for center support tubes i like using roll pins i think the size is 5/16x1.25" then i trim u each side till it's the right length and they have been working well. i'll bring a handfull of them for center supprt rivets i have long button head rivets for that and i have the factory head on the left side and form the right side. lately i have been hand forming them to great effect, the last one i did looked very close to the russian/romy right sie rivet head. if you don't care you can form it in a long rivet jig then flatten it with a ball peen hammer so it clears the safety selector lever.
yep..I have a long rivet jig just for that..
blacklabel
05-06-2011, 21:48
I'd be interested in coming down. I have a Romy G screw build that I've just about finished demilling. I had a couple of screws that had no purchase and one that had it's head come off. At least one screw will need to be drilled out of the front trunnion and possibly one out of the rear. Lesson learned.
If spots are filled, no worries, but if there's room, I'd like to meet everyone and build some AKs.
jreifsch80
05-08-2011, 02:12
I'd be interested in coming down. I have a Romy G screw build that I've just about finished demilling. I had a couple of screws that had no purchase and one that had it's head come off. At least one screw will need to be drilled out of the front trunnion and possibly one out of the rear. Lesson learned.
If spots are filled, no worries, but if there's room, I'd like to meet everyone and build some AKs.
I didn't realize you lived in greeley, if you want we could get together either next weekend or the one after and set your romy g fully demilled also if your building on a flat we could start on your receiver if you'd like. Let me know.
Great-Kazoo
05-08-2011, 06:19
Since I'm doing at least one .223/5.56 build, I may want to pick up the go/no-go gauges... but do we want 5.56x45 or .223?
Looking into it, the difference is .0006 to .0008 (less than one thou) between the 2 sets of GO gauges.. the main difference is in the throat.
NO-GO gages are another matter- 5.56 is almost .004 longer than .223, 5.56 no-go is almost the same as the Civilian Field gage
http://www.ar15barrels.com/data/headspace.pdf
I know I can get a pair at Brownells for $40 + shipping
ETA: the $40 ones are Forster, and .223... it's about $50 for Clymer 5.56 gauges.
I have gauges i can hand off to jreifresh80. I use no go and field gauges. Honestly the GO gauges are not necessary. I have yet to purchase a Factory AR upper that didn't close on everything except a field, be it BM, RRA, Colt etc!!
68Charger
05-08-2011, 10:04
I have gauges i can hand off to jreifresh80. I use no go and field gauges. Honestly the GO gauges are not necessary. I have yet to purchase a Factory AR upper that didn't close on everything except a field, be it BM, RRA, Colt etc!!
Seems odd, I guess they're rather grow brass than cause a kaboom, tho...
Thanks for info, was hoping someone who has used 5.56/.223 gauges would post their experience.
I found a fleabay auction of a no-go and field gauges... 3 days left- I'll put my sniping software on them- (currently $12.50 for the pair with shipping)
jreifsch80
05-08-2011, 19:04
i would think maybe the reason for that is things being made "mil spec" i wouldn't be suprised if the military wants a slightly looser chamber for increased reliability when they're going through lots of rounds between cleanings in not so clean invoroments.
jreifsch80
05-08-2011, 19:06
Seems odd, I guess they're rather grow brass than cause a kaboom, tho...
Thanks for info, was hoping someone who has used 5.56/.223 gauges would post their experience.
I found a fleabay auction of a no-go and field gauges... 3 days left- I'll put my sniping software on them- (currently $12.50 for the pair with shipping)
the question is, is your wieger barrel a .223 chamber or a 5.56 chamber? on the other hand i doubt an ak platform will care much
CrufflerSteve
05-08-2011, 19:50
I have gauges i can hand off to jreifresh80. I use no go and field gauges. Honestly the GO gauges are not necessary. I have yet to purchase a Factory AR upper that didn't close on everything except a field, be it BM, RRA, Colt etc!!
It can happen. My third build, a '86 Romy G has a defective front trunnion. The right lug wasn't milled back far enough. It could barely close on an empty chamber. It couldn't come close to closing on a GO gauge. Some of these weren't used at all. Nowadays with fitting new barrels, a GO gauge is worth having to avoid an undersize chamber.
I had a spare G barrel and trunnion. I just got the defective barrel/trunnion out and managed to save the receiver. Now I have to get the good trunnion in. So much for a matching kit.
Steve
jreifsch80
05-09-2011, 00:13
It can happen. My third build, a '86 Romy G has a defective front trunnion. The right lug wasn't milled back far enough. It could barely close on an empty chamber. It couldn't come close to closing on a GO gauge. Some of these weren't used at all. Nowadays with fitting new barrels, a GO gauge is worth having to avoid an undersize chamber.
I had a spare G barrel and trunnion. I just got the defective barrel/trunnion out and managed to save the receiver. Now I have to get the good trunnion in. So much for a matching kit.
Steve
glad you were able to get it out without hurting the receiver. if you decided not to try salvaging that trunnion and end up ordering one apex does the best they can on specil requests for instance they might be able to at least send you one that's the same year. otherwise you might think about using that romy g as a base for a clone, maybe get a polish front trunnion, scrub the g on the sigt base and a polish hg set (of course refinish the romy g stock to match) and have a nice polish akm clone to go with your polish underfolder. just an idea
jreifsch80
05-10-2011, 23:55
by the way guys, check out what apex has added to their parts kits section ;)
68Charger
05-11-2011, 09:39
$155 for a Bulgarian AK74 kit with wood furniture (no barrel)
$170 for one with Plum or black synthetic furniture (no color choice)
I may have to get 2 or 3 at that price!
If somebody hasn't gotten a kit, and want a 5.45, you'd best jump on those at that price... they want $90 for a barrel- Arms of America is better at $70, and they'll do chrome lined for another $25
blackford76
05-11-2011, 10:20
does anyone have any 5.56 X 45 go no/go headspace guages? I'm gonna try to build a 47 and a 5.56 74. gotta teach Junior how his rifle works..heh heh
I have a set you could use. pm me.
jreifsch80
05-11-2011, 11:32
also copes distrbuting has new but drilled bulgy barrels for around 125. now that apex has these bulgys i kind of wish i didnt get my tantal kit ;)
Just trying to help. I did not read the whole thread yet. So this may have been mentioned. But Nodak Spud has aK74 receivers for CHEAP right now.
http://www.nodakspud.com/page2.htm
68Charger
05-18-2011, 13:31
Just trying to help. I did not read the whole thread yet. So this may have been mentioned. But Nodak Spud has aK74 receivers for CHEAP right now.
http://www.nodakspud.com/page2.htm
not bad, but these guys are local, in Colorado Springs area:
http://armsofamerica.com/receivers.aspx
$59+ tax is better than $43 + FFL fee + shipping
but then again, these are in the white, and the Nodaks have a black oxide finish
blacklabel
05-18-2011, 23:24
I won't be able to make it. I start a new job the week before and have to work the 18th.
jreifsch80
05-18-2011, 23:31
The nodak is 43 shipped, but you still have to pay an transfer fee and widen the magwell they also have the original sn xed out and are re numbered per atf regs, those 43 dollar nodaks are pretty decent for the money, I am familiar with nodaks and am a big fan of their receivers. I haven't built or even handled an elk river but I have heard many many good thinks about them. From what I understand is people who use elk river receivers use them because they feel they are the best while people who use nodaks use them because they haven't tried an elk river yet ;)
Also arms of america allows local pickup and mike is a good guy to do business with. By the way gary, I think I'm going to get one of those elk rivers before your party instead of an ak builder flat haha dang I change my mind too fast
GunsRBadMMMMKay
05-21-2011, 10:53
I'm a noob here, but do you have any room left? Any objections to someone rebuilding a CAI 10/63 vs building from a kit? It has the trunnion installed crooked, then the infamous monkeys took a dremel to the inside of the trunnion to meet the rails so it would feed. It's been fired like that too lol (not by me...not yet anyways). Also has a canted front sight LOL. I am going to try to salvage it, but to do the repair correctly I think I need to press out the barrel and change the trunnion (then re headspace,re rivet it , what else).
I have been debating cheating and just changing the carrier out (when I used the ground bolt with a normal non-single stack carrier it seemed to feed just fine lol) or just dumping it to try and get my money back (I just got it yesterday and already have the buyers remorse lmao), but I already ordered the carrier and a complete bolt for it and found a trunnion for 25 bucks.... I've never done this big of a repair on an AK (they aren't supposed to break) but it looks like with the right tooling it shouldn't be too hard, right? Or maybe I should use an 80% Tapco flat that I have had sitting around to make a new replacement for the modified single stack receiver that is this CAI WASR then just transfer over the parts? The barrel is good and all the other parts seem to match.......[Stooge]
CrufflerSteve
05-21-2011, 11:29
I'd been holding off on asking but would there be room for one more? I know presses can be in shortage. I could bring my JEGS 12 ton. I have a bunch of tools for it. Pin presser, trunnion support, AK Machinist rivet tool and trigger guard riveting.
The things I'd be interested in would be getting a new barrel pinned to a Bulgie 74. I also have a junky WASR I got cheap years ago. It has major cant, sight and GB. It's enouh to make it fail to function.
Steve
68Charger
05-21-2011, 13:36
Right now I've got:
dbeal + son
patrick0685 ??
Gunner ??
Blackford76 ??
OneGuy67 ??
GunsRBadMMMMKay
CrufflerSteve
Observers/consultants
jreifsch80
rignt now, out of that list, only dbeal & Jreifsch80 know how to get here... [Coffee]
we'd like to keep it limited to 6 builders- so we're full up if all the "??" members are firmed up... but I haven't heard from them that they're firmly committed at this point... I know it can be overwhelming, don't know if they sorted out the kits & parts they want/need
I have no problem with doing re-builds instead of from kits, takes the same tools & serves the same purpose.... re-cants aren't hard to do with the right tools,
Depending on lifes circumstances I may be able to come just helping out the newbies and some B.S-ing . I know it can get kinda hectic when your trying to build your gun and helping 3 others build theirs as well.
GunsRBadMMMMKay
05-21-2011, 14:53
Cool. I should have all the parts by then to do this. What all do I need to bring?
jreifsch80
05-21-2011, 15:17
i'll bring all myreamers for the various barrel compnant pin holes, trunnion pin hole and axis pin holes but i migt run them depending on a person's experience level so i don't get broken and chattered reamers (no offense meant) also charger, do you still have your cutting oil?
jreifsch80
05-21-2011, 15:21
Cool. I should have all the parts by then to do this. What all do I need to bring?
your parts kit, receiver (flat rails and center support of a commercial receiver), rivet set and barrel if your kit doesn't come with one
also something to eat if you want something
GunsRBadMMMMKay
06-09-2011, 19:53
Got all my parts, and now the wait [Coffee]
68Charger
06-09-2011, 21:33
cool- I got some fittings for my Parkerizing rig, and I milled the lower tong for the spot welder- just gotta pick up a #12 tap for the lower tong to accept the MIG tip.
and do some more cleanup in the garage, it's still a mess [Coffee]
GunsRBadMMMMKay
06-09-2011, 23:54
I have a small metric and standard tap and die set if you want I should bring 'em........
68Charger
06-10-2011, 08:20
I have a small metric and standard tap and die set if you want I should bring 'em........
Thanks, but I'd like to make sure the spot welder is, er "spot on" before the party... the one tap is cheap, and I've got a $5 ACE coupon with it's name on it [Beer]
jreifsch80
06-10-2011, 14:52
it will be fun to get together with everyone there.
CrufflerSteve
06-12-2011, 17:05
Can somebody PM me with instructions and time?
I will be bringing some dark Swedish pine tar if anybody wants to try some for finishing. It's used 50/50 with turpentine so it goes a long way. Bring bottles if you want some. I suggest plastic since it is super pungent. You will be smelling it forever if you spill a bunch in the house or car.
I'll also be bringing some shellac from shellac.net. I can give some samples. Zip lock bags would be great. I have Garnet, Thai Seed Lac and Yellow. I also have a collection of little Baltic birch plywoods I've finished with pine tar stains and such and these shellacs.
Do I need to bring any tools? I do have the AK Builder pin pusher with a fitting for a JEGS 12 ton press. It works quite well. I can bring the press.
Here's what I'ed like to do, depending on time and resources. I certainly don't expect to do them all or complete some.
1. I have two of the Apex Bulgie 74 kits with new US barrel. I'd like some help fitting the parts on the barrel properly. (I can do it improperly with no help.) I've removed all the parts from the barrel pieces. One GB was a bear. I shattered a wrench the first try. Heated it with a torch and it worked the second time. These are great looking kits.
2. I have a WASR I got cheap from somebody years ago that has a serious FS and GB cant. It's enough to make it fail to feed sometime.
3. One of my Romy G kits has a short dust cover that pops off. The rear trunnion seems to have too much room. Maybe a line of welding wire along the back would do the trick. Just finish it to match and it might seat tight.
Help with any and all of these would be great.
Steve
GunsRBadMMMMKay
06-12-2011, 22:20
I still need to know where I'm going too lol.
68Charger
06-12-2011, 23:19
I sent directions via PM to GunsRBadMMMMKay, CrufflerSteve & bryjcom (not sure if you're coming or not) I have received a response from the others that they won't be able to make this one...
I'll be up and around by 7am, come anytime after that...
I'll have some soda, iced tea & water- bring anything else you'd like to drink (no alcohol), and something to burn on the grill (or something else for lunch)
feel free to bring any tools, or materials...
we'll see you there!
68Charger
06-13-2011, 13:56
Steve, I'd like to get some of that pine tar & shellac, thanks for bringing it...
I believe we're going to have 2 presses there already, but any fixtures that are easy to bring are helpful... we may be short on compressed air, my compressor barely runs the sandblaster- can't use it for multiple things at once..
Fitting the barrel parts shouldn't be that difficult (unless the barrel profile is wrong- then you'll need a lathe), just have to have some pipe/fixtures around to press them on... I'll have an assortment ready to go...
FSB/ GB cants aren't too hard to fix- I haven't used any fixtures, just "eyeball" the parts on the barrel, then clamp it in the mill & re-drill the pin hole... use an oversize pin if you need to make sure the old hole doesn't interfere. I have a cheap metric drill bit set that we can use to make pins out of.
On a dust cover that's popping off, usually you can tweak the cover enough to make it stay, if not, then I've got at least one spare dust cover you can try (from a Romy M63)
One of the best things about where I live- the range is just down the hill from the shop... so you can try something, test, try again without having to drive to a range... [UZI]
Now be sure to take some good pictures of your builds[Tooth]
I sure wish i could be there for it-I'd love to get my hands dirty on trying out that pine tar!!I think I can work some of my majiic on some stocks
I'll call you guys to see how your making out
And remember to watch out for those cursed Romanian vampire springs!!![LOL]
Stay safe boys!!!And have fun!!![Luck]
CrufflerSteve
06-13-2011, 23:58
I do have a reasonably portable compressor. I'll bring that instead of the press. It'll be easier on my back.
Steve
jreifsch80
06-14-2011, 10:35
i have finally developed a goot easy way to align barrel parts it's nothing special you juts need a good flat piece of steel. on my last couple builds it's helped make my barrel parts very nice and it's faster than eyeballing alone
does anyone have an ak47 rear trunion that has been drilled out they will part with for Saturday? I was drilling out mine and unfortunately snapped the drill bit on the last bit of drilling..GRRR it is at the machine shop trying to get it out, but in case was wondering if anyone had a spare?
jreifsch80
06-14-2011, 18:03
does anyone have an ak47 rear trunion that has been drilled out they will part with for Saturday? I was drilling out mine and unfortunately snapped the drill bit on the last bit of drilling..GRRR it is at the machine shop trying to get it out, but in case was wondering if anyone had a spare?
akm? i'll see what i have, other wise i know i have a spare 74 rear trunnion
akm..I boogered up my romy g rear..
68Charger
06-15-2011, 08:37
akm..I boogered up my romy g rear..
I've got the one that came with my Norinco kit- I'll have to mic it again, but my 1st impression when I mic'd it was that it was too wide for the 1.3 to 1.5mm receiver- I know it's wider than the front trunnion
jreifsch80
06-15-2011, 16:22
I've got the one that came with my Norinco kit- I'll have to mic it again, but my 1st impression when I mic'd it was that it was too wide for the 1.3 to 1.5mm receiver- I know it's wider than the front trunnion
Make sure the stock screw holes in the tang are in the same location as an akm or 74 as I think I remember hearing that chinese stock screw holes are in slightly different locations.
68Charger
06-15-2011, 16:36
Make sure the stock screw holes in the tang are in the same location as an akm or 74 as I think I remember hearing that chinese stock screw holes are in slightly different locations.
from what I've researched today, if it's not close to 1.225" wide, it's not a MAK 90 rear trunnion.
I do know that slant-back MAK 90 rear trunnions are NOT the same as AKMs
CrufflerSteve
06-16-2011, 21:22
Just a remember to bring some, hopefully non-glass, containers if you want some Swedish pine tar. Also, bring something like zip-lock bags if you want some shellac.
Steve
lead_magnet
06-16-2011, 22:03
If I wasn't getting married on June 18th, I'd be all over this. Have fun guys.
CrufflerSteve
06-16-2011, 22:26
If I wasn't getting married on June 18th, I'd be all over this. Have fun guys.
It would take a very special woman to get married at an AK build party. Good luck and have a long & happy life together. This really is the woman's day. A guy's role is to be helpful, smile a lot & enjoy it.
Steve
I was meaning to give a call while you guys were building
but unfortunately there was phone outages here-a tree knocked down a pole and some lines and was a mess to clean up!!
So how did it go??Do we have any new family members?[Coffee]
Any body get bit by the Rommy vampires[LOL]
Garys a great host so im sure you guys did well!!
NOW POST UP THEM PICTURES!!![Tooth]
68Charger
06-19-2011, 08:22
We didn't designate a photographer, so we'll need those that finished something to post up pictures...
I know there were at least 2 test fired, besides an AR and HK that dbeal tested... [AR15]There were about 4 flats bent & heat treated, too...
no injuries that I'm aware of- only a couple busted drill bits... at least they didn't get stuck in the workpiece.
68Charger
06-19-2011, 20:05
Josh called to let me know that he's got an orange-handled screwdriver that his stepson mistakenly picked up, and that he also left a set of needle-nosed pliers & a Dremel tool..
I also have a folding chair that appeared, and some 400 grit sandpaper...
besides the tools borrowed from Justin & Darrell...
Let me know if there's anything else someone is missing, and I'll look for it, or someone can chime in that they wound up with it...
Thanks to all that came, it was a great time...
Gary
GunsRBadMMMMKay
06-19-2011, 20:38
I forgot to weld something....:(
I took a couple pics of the kid shooting the rebuilt WASR and I was going to take a pic of it for the records so maybe I'll share. Funny thing - I had told the kid that if he graduated highschool (without a criminal record lol) that he could have one of my rifles. I guess he told his mother the other day that now he wants to build his own AK instead of getting one of mine [LOL]
I forgot to weld something....:(
I took a couple pics of the kid shooting the rebuilt WASR and I was going to take a pic of it for the records so maybe I'll share. Funny thing - I had told the kid that if he graduated highschool (without a criminal record lol) that he could have one of my rifles. I guess he told his mother the other day that now he wants to build his own AK instead of getting one of mine [LOL]
Ah yes-Fun for the whole family!!!
My boy is 6 and he wants to help me every chance he gets!!
I put a kit away for him so when hes ready he can do one on his own
But now my wife complains that she dont have one!![LOL]
CrufflerSteve
06-20-2011, 09:38
Josh called to let me know that he's got an orange-handled screwdriver that his stepson mistakenly picked up, and that he also left a set of needle-nosed pliers & a Dremel tool..
The orange handled screwdriver is mine. It's not urgent since I have a bunch. I generally use a gunsmith screwdriver for the real stuff. That was just to pry open the pine tar.
It was fun. I'm glad I got the WASR uncanted. It was great fun. It's a shame I didn't make more progress on the '74 barrels but they are pretty far out of spec.
Steve
jreifsch80
06-20-2011, 12:12
The orange handled screwdriver is mine. It's not urgent since I have a bunch. I generally use a gunsmith screwdriver for the real stuff. That was just to pry open the pine tar.
It was fun. I'm glad I got the WASR uncanted. It was great fun. It's a shame I didn't make more progress on the '74 barrels but they are pretty far out of spec.
Steve
Sounds like it was a great time, sorry I couldn't make it, it would have been fun to hang out with you guys.
Steve, what's out of spec on those 74 barrels? Are they us made barrels or bulgys? If you need someone to turn them on a lathe then call me and I might be able to find someone to help out
CrufflerSteve
06-20-2011, 12:59
Sounds like it was a great time, sorry I couldn't make it, it would have been fun to hang out with you guys.
Steve, what's out of spec on those 74 barrels? Are they us made barrels or bulgys? If you need someone to turn them on a lathe then call me and I might be able to find someone to help out
I have two of those kits with the the barrels. I put one into the trunnion and it fit fine and headspaced well. The problem was the rear sight. Both barrels are undersize quite a bit. I did get one to fit by gouging up the inside of the rear sight. (Is that called knurling?) I've done something like this with a punch and a dovetailed front sight on an old rifle. It makes it fit. I'll probably remove it and do a better job of fitting.
The GB is at least .004 too big. That isn't as upsetting since too much is always more workable than too little. That might need some lathe work. I never got to the front sight.
What size is the brass pipe used to fit the GB? That works well, at least is this differences were less. I'd like to get of those since it would be a useful tool.
Steve
the chair would be mine as well as the 400 grit sandpaper..I'll get it from you later
when is the next build party i found this thread two days too late
don't know..will have to get with Gary as his time permits..
jreifsch80
06-21-2011, 10:27
I have two of those kits with the the barrels. I put one into the trunnion and it fit fine and headspaced well. The problem was the rear sight. Both barrels are undersize quite a bit. I did get one to fit by gouging up the inside of the rear sight. (Is that called knurling?) I've done something like this with a punch and a dovetailed front sight on an old rifle. It makes it fit. I'll probably remove it and do a better job of fitting.
The GB is at least .004 too big. That isn't as upsetting since too much is always more workable than too little. That might need some lathe work. I never got to the front sight.
What size is the brass pipe used to fit the GB? That works well, at least is this differences were less. I'd like to get of those since it would be a useful tool.
Steve
Steve, that would be a rough form of knurling, you could probably use a pipe cutter to knurl the barrel on the rsb journal. As for a brass pipe to fit a gas block you'd need one with around 5/8" I.D. What I do is I have a plate for my press with a hole in the middle. I install the barrel into the trunnion before installing the trunnion then set headspace and ream and pin the barrel. Then I use my plate with the barrel pointing down and press the barrel into each barrel part. For alignment I use a flat piece of aluminum plate to line up the barrel parts with the trunnion ( they all have flat spots on the top ) also I check for proper location for the rsb by installing the gas tube and hg retainer and make sure the front hg ferrule on the gas tube lines up well with the lower hg retainer. Then when I press the barrel into the gas block I have the gas tube in place to curefully seat the gas vlock up to the gas tube the way I like. Hope that makes sense. If you just have .003 to shave off the barrel you might be able to shoe shine the barrel with emory cloth of you could use a brake cylinder hone to hone out the gas block a little.
68Charger
06-21-2011, 13:16
when is the next build party i found this thread two days too late
at the moment, I'm not sure when I'll do another, I've got some catching up to do on other projects... what are you building, do you have a parts kit already?
Awwwww - CMON ! How come I miss this stuff each time. ARRRGGGHH !
Awwwww - CMON ! How come I miss this stuff each time. ARRRGGGHH !
Dont wory-i know these boys aint done yet!!!There just collecting more parts peices for there next buildoff!!!!
I need to hurry up and move my butt out there!!!-I'm missin out on all the fun!!
jreifsch80
06-21-2011, 21:55
Awwwww - CMON ! How come I miss this stuff each time. ARRRGGGHH !
don't sweat it, i'll let you know when a buddy of mine from gunco is having his, should be soon and he's in wellington
jreifsch80
06-21-2011, 21:59
Dont wory-i know these boys aint done yet!!!There just collecting more parts peices for there next buildoff!!!!
I need to hurry up and move my butt out there!!!-I'm missin out on all the fun!!
exactly, i still have a few kits to build;cetme, g3, ak74, sbr ak74, romy underfolder, amd65, and my 7.62x25 blowback, plus i need to finish collecting parts for my late patter east german akm ;) oh not to mention i might as well get a polish underfolder or two while they are availible. i'm sure some of the others are as bad as me haha i know Bob is [Tooth]
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