View Full Version : One punch and out...
Drilldov2.0
08-13-2011, 02:30
So some long-hair, tweeker truck driver called me an asshole for tying up my dogs out side the truck stop. I laughed at him and patted him on the shoulder, he took a swing at me me, which I dodged, and followed up with a nice right hook which left him laying on the pavement, unconscious.
Did I overreact? It seems he was looking for a fight and got some sleep out of it.
I don't know if you overreacted, but I'd say you're lucky you didn't end up in jail.
or did you?
mcantar18c
08-13-2011, 03:11
I'll be the odd one out here and say good job.
While it could possibly be argued in court that you putting your hand on his shoulder initiated it and therefore your punch wasn't self defense... I would have done the same damn thing. Almost. I wouldn't have put my hand on him or touched him at all, but if he swung at me he'd be on the ground regretting it.
If you were carrying at the time (and probably even if you weren't) you ought to give deep and serious thought to how you might not put yourself in a situation like that, and ways to de-escalate if you end up in such a situation. Throwing a punch at anyone anytime in our world is never, ever going to be a good idea. And if you are carrying a firearm at the time, there are so many things that can go so incredibly bad in that scenario that it is hard to imagine anyone who has any common sense doing so. And it would be far, far worse if he was carrying, legally or not! The reason an armed society is a polite society (it isn't--but let's pretend the old saying is true) is because we are polite, not because others are. A guy willing to mix it up at the first provocation ought not to carry a gun for sure. Not saying you are such a guy, just saying....
Seems to be a bit of an overreaction on both accounts. I have a buddy who was in a very similar circumstance - and on a Friday, and he ended up in jail for the entire weekend until a judge would see him Monday morning. If someone took a swing at me I might have the same reaction but I wouldn't have patted him on the shoulder in the first place. There are so many "what-if" here that it hopefully would make you reconsider your actions if you could do them over again - like if when he dropped he hit his head and cracked it open or he fell on to a bottle - things that could get you serious prison time for something as seemingly innocent as punch.
Chances are that if you got arrested for it that not much would come of it but it all would depend on the judge.
Chad4000
08-13-2011, 08:06
good job... If dude didn't want to go to sleep or "maybe fall on a bottle" or maybe crack his head open as he fell "lights out" to the floor,, then he shouldn't have called a stranger an asshole, and taken a swing...
I actually think interactions like this is how we will win back society..the people policing themselves
Chad4000
08-13-2011, 08:11
Haha, one more thing, if youre one of those guys that can take somebody out with one punch (like I wish I was lol ) ... I'm gonna go spider man on ya, "with great power comes great responsibility"
Go ahead, Swing away.... Fight for good.. Take out dicks.. Eventually there will be fewer of them lol
It sounds like instinctive reaction to me. I probably would have done the same thing.[Beer]
BPTactical
08-13-2011, 09:56
People call me an Asshole all the time. Especially my wife.
Sometimes I am.
Doesn't bother me a bit usually.
I won't touch somebody in a situation like that, you are just asking to escalate the situation.
But its over and done now.
Did what you felt you had to do.
OnePunchDrillDov2.0...................is his name.
Cool story bro...
Did you stand over him when he woke up, laugh and yell, "Dude, you got the F@CK KNOCKED OUT B!@TCH!!! HAHA!"
Delfuego
08-13-2011, 10:19
[Worth]
Had to do it, video would be accepted too...
And why was the guy bitching about your dog? Was is making a nuisance of itself?
Technically, you touched him first. Just sayin'.
tmleadr03
08-13-2011, 10:48
What a thin veneer of civilization.
sneakerd
08-13-2011, 10:56
I'm not into the bravado of doing it and then posting it here. Seems to me that if something like that happens, then you put it in a file somewhere for further review. You could easily have a situation where his head bounces off the concrete like that Giants fan in LA at the Dodgers game. Guy gets brain damage and then you sir, are DONE.
Bad move. Posting about it here isn't smart either, maybe this guy is legally upset by it and got your plate.
Were you carrying at the time? Even in a state like Florida with a "Make My Day" law, you are going to make your life in court a lot easier by having taken every opportunity to de-escalate or remove yourself from the situation. Touching strangers especially after they've insulted you could been seen as provocation by then, especially if they're jumpy and dumb.
It's easy for me to armchair quarter back the situation sitting here with no adrenaline, but my mental game is to back away with one hand up palm out saying "I don't want any trouble" while my strong hand moves to cover my carry gun.
Not to mention the reactions of other people who witnessed it... how would you react if you saw someone knock out a random stranger? Or a LEO that was there, maybe just on vacation with his kids. You never know.
My two cents.
H.
SideShow Bob
08-13-2011, 13:19
Your putting your hand on the trucker is provocation, there ARE people that have severe adversion to being touched, and being a stranger, his reaction to you "patting him on the back" is typical. Unless you really know someone, keep your hands to yourself. Hopefully you won't get charged with assault since you were the first to make physical contact.
Chad4000
08-13-2011, 14:03
Maybe he shouldn't have called the guy an asshole... Just putting the hand on his shoulder seems like restraint to me...... I know guys who would swing when the guy got tough and tried to bow up. LET alone when he swings first...
Again,,, it's hard to call it one way or another.. What I do know is that most folks dont think youll swing.. They think you will back down cause youre scared of the law..thats why these guys continue to be dicks..
Maybe this particular dick, will think twice about commenting on something that wasn't his business next time...
If you and I had a verbal altercation followed by you "patting me on the shoulder" I probably would have taken a swing at you too. Just saying. I am not the type of guy that likes people I don't know to lay a hand on me.
Of course, since I wasn't there and don't have all the details, I would never pass judgement on you for how you handled the situation. Perhaps the gentleman in question truly was being a dick and looking for trouble and got exactly what he deserved no matter how it all went down.
Guess there is another version to this story and somewhere in the middle...
And my topic got locked and there was NO violence.
And my topic got locked and there was NO violence.
What? Did you call someone an a$$hole at a truck stop? :D
Gas station same thing , only he was to fraid to take on the Mtn.
Gas station same thing , only he was to fraid to take on the Mtn.
[ROFL2][ROFL1] I missed that one.
I wouldn't have touched him, but I say good punch. A drunk needlessly touched me a few months ago. I didn't punch him though. He probably would have knocked me out.
DD977GM2
08-13-2011, 17:31
So some long-hair, tweeker truck driver called me an asshole for tying up my dogs out side the truck stop. I laughed at him and patted him on the shoulder, he took a swing at me me, which I dodged, and followed up with a nice right hook which left him laying on the pavement, unconscious.
Did I overreact? It seems he was looking for a fight and got some sleep out of it.
Sounds like self defense to me and you just happened to land your punch in a perfect spot on the tweeker dude.
Id say good swing!!!!![Beer]
DD977GM2
08-13-2011, 17:39
For all those saying Drilldo escalated by patting him on the back, I think since I know Drilldo, he was patting him on the back as a way to let the douche know there was no hardfeeling for him butting into his business and said douchebag obviously took it the wrong way.
He travels as much as I do and some folks are just looking for trouble no matter where they are.
I personally avoid any and all contact with folks when I am traveling as I dont knwo the area and the people in these small towns and folks tend to be up to no good at a as station at times.
As far as the punch, Id say Drilldo did exactly what he should of to handle the situation and if he knocked him out in one punch, then he just landed the right punch.
I DOUBT THE DOUCHE GOT HIS LICENSE PLATE SINCE HE WAS KNOCKED OUT. COMMON SENSE ON THAT ONE.
DD977GM2
08-13-2011, 17:42
Also, are you folks on here so afraid of confrontation due to the possibility of legal action after the fact?
I dont look for shit to happen, but seems to find me all the damn time. I have fought guys on the rigs and a few times while filling up on my way to a rig or home and never once did I worry about legal action after. I was more worried about dealing with the situation at the moment and in the times I couldnt get out of the physical altercation, I worried more about how to deal with the guy at that moment instead of anything else. Probably why I havnt been too hurt in these altrecations and was able to walk away, rather speed off to put distance between me and said douchebags.
As for CCW, yes I had it on me and never once felt it was necessary to unholster.
Drilldov2.0
08-13-2011, 18:15
I didn't end up in jail, Elhuero.
My weapon was in the hotel room, I was not carrying. If a friendly laugh and quick pat on the shoulder warrants someone taking a swing at me, then I guess I deserve to be in jail. God forbid anyone being able to defend themselves.
Interesting to hear people's responses though. It could happen to any of you, any day. How will you respond?
tmleadr03
08-13-2011, 18:25
I didn't end up in jail, Elhuero.
My weapon was in the hotel room, I was not carrying. If a friendly laugh and quick pat on the shoulder warrants someone taking a swing at me, then I guess I deserve to be in jail. God forbid anyone being able to defend themselves.
Interesting to hear people's responses though. It could happen to any of you, any day. How will you respond?
I would not put my hands on someone else. I do not want them to put their hands on me, why would I put my hands on them.
I didn't end up in jail, Elhuero.
My weapon was in the hotel room, I was not carrying. If a friendly laugh and quick pat on the shoulder warrants someone taking a swing at me, then I guess I deserve to be in jail. God forbid anyone being able to defend themselves.
Interesting to hear people's responses though. It could happen to any of you, any day. How will you respond?
that's good
Not trying to criticize you, but personally I never would have patted him him on the back to start with.
I can't fault you for anything you did.
BushMasterBoy
08-13-2011, 18:59
When confronted out in public, I tend to ignore any comments by not responding in any way. De-escalate the situation by looking for a safe way to escape. If the comments are threatening or they make gestures to harm me I prepare mentally to use deadly force if necessary. Lots of assholes out there looking for trouble, and while the police may seem sympathetic, they may still arrest you even though you were only defending yourself by punching the asshole out. Glad you got away unharmed.
sneakerd
08-13-2011, 19:06
I don't have a problem with the action. I have a problem with the way it was presented. The title says it all. Not saying the op is a braggart or anything close, because I don't know him at all. But the action was presented that way. "One punch and out". You're obviously proud of the power of your punch. Good for you. I would still never have posted like that on a forum. No offense intended. Just not my style. It could easily have gone the other way. You just don't know. If Bruce Lee is not paying attention, and someone hits him up side of the head with a beermug in a barroom, he's going down. There are way too many unknowns in a fight for me to get into one.
Also, are you folks on here so afraid of confrontation due to the possibility of legal action after the fact?
In short, hell yes! It's the only rationale view, IMHO. If they want to press it in court, even if you're ultimately victorious, can still cost you tens of thousands. For what positive outcome? Some asshole gets himself beat down. That doesn't really help you any.
It's also the first of the steps to deadly force, de-escalate and escape.
I DOUBT THE DOUCHE GOT HIS LICENSE PLATE SINCE HE WAS KNOCKED OUT. COMMON SENSE ON THAT ONE.
I can totally see some other peckerheads in the rest stop coming up to him with, "Are you OK! I saw the whole thing and got the plate number, I'll testify in court!" I don't care if anyone thinks I'm weak and they're tough as long as everybody leaves alive.
H.
DSB OUTDOORS
08-13-2011, 19:32
I think the pat on the shoulder was not nessary. But I do applaud his quick reaction to the situation. I would have done the same thing. If a guy started bitching about what ever, dogs or other. He is looking to start something. Hence One punch and out. Glass jaw??[Tooth]
sneakerd
08-13-2011, 19:38
I'm also glad that it turned out ok for the op. The dick appeared to have earned it.
DSB OUTDOORS
08-13-2011, 19:39
I'm also glad that it turned out ok for the op. The dick appeared to have earned it.
My point exactly! [Beer]
Maybe would should try the same approuch with terrorists, de-escalate and maybe they will leave us alone.....
If someone breaks into your house at night maybe you should just ask them to leave.... i mean what if they got hurt?! you could get sued!!!!!!
Fuck that, someone takes a swing at me its lights out. I think the problem is there are to many people that havent been punched in the face. Our parents and schools are teaching our kids(for years now) that if someone is trying to hurt you, run away or do whatever you can to get away except for react with force. Do I think violence is alway the right answer? no. but sometimes it needed.
What if this guy hit the op? should he have run away then? I think he used the amount of force needed to end the threat.
I had a situation downtown a few years ago, a bum asked me for some change and I declined(respectfully). then he became more agressive and I declined at a louder tone. then the guy grabed my shirt and took a swing at me. When he woke up the police had shown up and he had a broken jaw. The police officer said I was within my rights to defend myself.
Rant over, carry on
Drilldov2.0
08-13-2011, 19:46
I don't have a problem with the action. I have a problem with the way it was presented. The title says it all. Not saying the op is a braggart or anything close, because I don't know him at all. But the action was presented that way. "One punch and out". You're obviously proud of the power of your punch. Good for you. I would still never have posted like that on a forum. No offense intended. Just not my style. It could easily have gone the other way. You just don't know. If Bruce Lee is not paying attention, and someone hits him up side of the head with a beermug in a barroom, he's going down. There are way too many unknowns in a fight for me to get into one.
I can understand that. I posted when I was still all wound up on adrenaline. I am not trying to brag, I just landed the punch in just the right spot. I was still a bit bewildered by what happened. The pat on the shoulder and laugh was not the best idea, but it didn't warrant a swing at me IMO. I reacted to a violent situation quickly. I could have just walked away, but then again that could have given him the time to pull out a gun while my back was to him. Not a good situation at all and it never should have happened. I walked away from it fine and that is always the outcome you want.
I posted this as mostly a cautionary tale. Things can go south in the blink of an eye. It is worth it to imagine a worst case scenario and have a plan of action to deal with it.
sneakerd
08-13-2011, 20:05
I totally agree.[Beer]
Bailey Guns
08-13-2011, 20:11
For all the times I've wanted to and didn't/couldn't...you did.
[Beer]
DSB OUTDOORS
08-13-2011, 20:26
I can understand that. I posted when I was still all wound up on adrenaline. I am not trying to brag, I just landed the punch in just the right spot. I was still a bit bewildered by what happened. The pat on the shoulder and laugh was not the best idea, but it didn't warrant a swing at me IMO. I reacted to a violent situation quickly. I could have just walked away, but then again that could have given him the time to pull out a gun while my back was to him. Not a good situation at all and it never should have happened. I walked away from it fine and that is always the outcome you want.
I posted this as mostly a cautionary tale. Things can go south in the blink of an eye. It is worth it to imagine a worst case scenario and have a plan of action to deal with it.
You did just fine!! [Beer]"That will do pig, that will do!!" [Coffee]Like I said I would have done the same thing!! Fight or Flight!!
Colorado Luckydog
08-13-2011, 21:57
I might have hit him before he took a swing. I know for a fact that I would have kicked him in the nuts while he was knocked out. Talking is one thing, if you try and hurt me, you're going to get all I got and then some.
I think you did good and I don't think you're bragging.[Beer]
I had to share this post with my old boss/friend. We went floatin the river today and a little group got upset at us because we lifted and carried our raft over their stuff that was directly in the middle of the path to get back to the cars. Anyway, long story short, they were mad because of that. The fact that we said nothing and just kept walking away pissed them off even more. One of the guys pulled our little raft off our heads (we were carying it above our heads, easier) while the shit talker of the group positioned himself behind me. Raft came down, we turned around and the leader of this little gang of tards hits me in the jaw before I got fully around. I didn't throw a punch back... I thought it was a joke because it barely moved my head, and he held his hand in pain. [LOL]His look of "oh my god, what did I just do" was great. We couldn't help but laugh when we figured out he was trying to do a "one punch wonder" also. We couldn't help it, you guys would have laughed too. Anyway we just picked up the raft again and walked away. Never did hear another word out of those guys (however we did learn that we lost our oar from our little raft falling).
As for the original post, I think the guy went a little too far. I also think you shouldn't have touched him, that could have got you into trouble later on. All in all, you meant no harm in the touch and he took a swing at the wrong person, good job layin him out. [Beer]
I find this post rather troubling. Why was it necessary to tie your dogs up outside the truck stop? Did they have shade and water? Were they safely out of the way of traffic both foot and motorized? Obviously, no one was watching them or there would be no need to tie them up. Who would stop them from being poisoned, or let off their leashes and get hit? What if a young child walked up to them and for some unknown reason, they maul the child?
As a dog lover, I don't like it when people tie their dogs up outside a public building not designed for it. If this place had stalls to tie your dog up in, I apologize. Do me and everyone else a favor by having more respect for the friends you haven't met and YOUR DOGS!
Too, I think by your description of the trucker, there may have been more than one person with a short fuse. Bottom line is: If you had taken proper care of your pets, we wouldn't be discussing this in front of the viewing public.
Take care,
Dave
If someone swang at me, I'd let them have it.. Awesome job on the TKO
trout_champ
08-14-2011, 01:02
I say you shouldn’t have patted the tweeker on the back. But then again he shouldn’t have freaked out and tried to hit you. If this happened to me I probably would have just walked off and not said/did anything. I would have done the same thing if he tried to hit me though. And then I would have stood over him Ali style and took pics for the forum.[Tooth]
Randy
This is why I don't hang out at truck stops.
Is no where safe anymore?
:p
mcantar18c
08-14-2011, 03:07
I really shouldn't respond to this, but you annoy me.
I find this post rather troubling.
Just out of curiosity... are you a liberal?
Why was it necessary to tie your dogs up outside the truck stop?
I'm gonna take a wild guess here, I think its probably cause he couldn't bring them inside the truck stop.
Did they have shade and water?
Tying them up at night with no shade around, away from that big bowl of water in the cup holder in the truck? OH THE HUGE MANATEE!!!! (I can't get that phrase out of my head since that damn rant that was posted).
This might hurt a bit, but use your thinker for a second... tweaker trucker + throwing fists and not having cops called + posting thread at 2:30am = night time = plenty of shade, and if they don't have water while driving I'm sure they'll survive a few minutes outside of a truck stop without drying up.
Were they safely out of the way of traffic both foot and motorized?
If he cared enough to let them out to stretch out and get some fresh air while he ran inside, do you really think he'd leave them where they'll get run over?
Obviously, no one was watching them or there would be no need to tie them up. Who would stop them from being poisoned, or let off their leashes and get hit?
If nobody was around to call the cops about a guy dropping another guy with a punch, there probably wasn't anyone around to poison his dogs.
What if a young child walked up to them and for some unknown reason, they maul the child?
I don't think I've EVER seen a child at a truck stop. Not to mention, its pretty much common sense not to go up to a random dog you don't know and start petting it. I know I know, common sense ain't that common anymore, but that's only because people like you make it possible for stupid people to survive long enough to breed.
As a dog lover, I don't like it when people tie their dogs up outside a public building not designed for it.
As a bike lover, I don't like it when people chain up their bikes to objects not designed for it. I saw a guy lock his bike up to a tree once... that must have been unbearable for the bike. At least it had shade.
I love my dog too. He's somewhere between brother, child, and best friend to me. But if he's been sitting in the truck for a while or its really hot out, and I run inside somewhere, I'll tie him up to anything strong enough to not be pulled out of the ground if he sees a rabbit. Now I probably would put him somewhere I can see him, but that's just because I'm overprotective of my loved ones... but I don't think it'd be the end of the world if I had to leave him out of sight for a few minutes.
PS I hate bycicles.
If this place had stalls to tie your dog up in, I apologize. Do me and everyone else a favor by having more respect for the friends you haven't met and YOUR DOGS!
Referring to tweaker truck drivers and strangers as "friends you haven't met yet?" Well it looks like we've answered my question.
Too, I think by your description of the trucker, there may have been more than one person with a short fuse.
Does this mean I can take a swing at you without fear of you attempting to fight back?
Bottom line is: If you had taken proper care of your pets, we wouldn't be discussing this in front of the viewing public.
Nowhere in any of his posts did he indicate that he wasn't taking good care of his dogs. Now go back to your import beers and foreign cars.
Take care,
Dave
DD977GM2
08-14-2011, 03:19
I can totally see some other peckerheads in the rest stop coming up to him with, "Are you OK! I saw the whole thing and got the plate number, I'll testify in court!" I don't care if anyone thinks I'm weak and they're tough as long as everybody leaves alive.
H.
People in this ocuntry are to complacent to do that in 99% of the incidents that happen I can assure.
DD977GM2
08-14-2011, 03:21
I find this post rather troubling. Why was it necessary to tie your dogs up outside the truck stop? Did they have shade and water? Were they safely out of the way of traffic both foot and motorized? Obviously, no one was watching them or there would be no need to tie them up. Who would stop them from being poisoned, or let off their leashes and get hit? What if a young child walked up to them and for some unknown reason, they maul the child?
As a dog lover, I don't like it when people tie their dogs up outside a public building not designed for it. If this place had stalls to tie your dog up in, I apologize. Do me and everyone else a favor by having more respect for the friends you haven't met and YOUR DOGS!
Too, I think by your description of the trucker, there may have been more than one person with a short fuse. Bottom line is: If you had taken proper care of your pets, we wouldn't be discussing this in front of the viewing public.
Take care,
Dave
Are you fucking serious? From your liberal whiney post Id say it is time you turned in yoru firearms and started using flowers as a means to protect yourself.
Bailey Guns
08-14-2011, 07:38
Are you fucking serious? From your liberal whiney post Id say it is time you turned in yoru firearms and started using flowers as a means to protect yourself.
OUCH! [Beer]
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 07:51
Ok so how many of you on this site have called someone an asshole? I know I have. If the person you called an asshole then put their hands on you in any way how would you react?
If I do not know you and you put your hands on me, well lets just say you could have chosen a better thing to do for your continued health.
The "tweeker" was wrong for calling the OP an asshole. The OP should have kept his hands to himself and this time got lucky.
Chad4000
08-14-2011, 07:57
As usual, people are putting way to much thought into this lol.... Poisoning the dogs? Lol.. Getting sued? Lol.. Somebody catching a license plate in the middle of the night? Lol
Dick = knocked out (just like it should work)
The end..
As usual, people are putting way to much thought into this lol.... Poisoning the dogs? Lol.. Getting sued? Lol.. Somebody catching a license plate in the middle of the night? Lol
Dick = knocked out (just like it should work)
The end..
Exactly what I was about to say. It's a sad world we live in that this even needs to be discussed more than "I knocked out some idiot."
Maybe would should try the same approuch with terrorists, de-escalate and maybe they will leave us alone..... If someone breaks into your house at night maybe you should just ask them to leave.... i mean what if they got hurt?! you could get sued!!!!!!
These two statements are disingenuous straw man arguments. You cannot conflate every scenario into the same thing, they all required a different response.
Fuck that, someone takes a swing at me its lights out.
Do you have the mentality regardless of if you are CCW or not?
H.
Robby30-06
08-14-2011, 13:45
Anyone who calls another an asshole should expect some reaction. However if you touched him first....just be glad you met someone with inferior skills....might not be the same next time. If i called someone an asshole and then he touched me, i would not expect him to laugh and say oh it's ok man.
I'm wondering why this guy was just so angry about your dog that he started swinging at our guy.
DD977GM2
08-14-2011, 15:35
Im saddened by all the posts refering to the CCW mentality and what not. I carry my CCW and only take it off for work when Im there and have had a few confrontations with CCW and never once in these encounters felt that unholstering was the means to the end of the confrontation. One time was downtown and this fool was beating his hot GF or wife with closed fist full on punches. I had my CCW on and without caring about my CCW being on me, I went up and layed him out with a nice punch to his face. I left the grill and bar asap and never looked back. The idea was I didnt want to deal with the after effect and this guy deserved being tagged the way he did. His GF or wife was bleeding bad and no one was doing anything.
Now all the nay sayers, shoudl I have left well enough alone? Drawn my CCW and told him to suck pavement? Left well enough alone and countinued with my dinner? Layed him out like I did and walk away?
The complacency of this liberal mindset by majority of folks out there is why I acted the way I did and have no regrets what so ever and would do it again regardless of having my CCW on me or not.
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 15:39
I'm wondering why this guy was just so angry about your dog that he started swinging at our guy.
Have you ever met a tweeker? Normally, I have no problem with what others choose to do, but meth absolutely changes a person and makes them irrational to the extreme. I have dealt with and run off a bunch of them on the rigs before they got someone, or themselves hurt or killed.
I thought he was a truck driver?
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 15:41
I thought he was a truck driver?
He was and an obvious tweeker. Meth use is very common among jobs that require long hours.
DD977GM2
08-14-2011, 15:41
The concept of a CCW Mindset seems to be lost with a lot of folks on here.
It isnt necessarly using your CCW in all situations regardless of the need for lethal force or to scare off a person in a potentially bad situation.
The mindset is to know when to use it our not and when to unholster. Doesnt mean we as folks with a CCW should become complacent in everyday life and never react to situations that do not warrent even acknoledgment of a CCW and sit back and watch people continue to harm others in any capacity.
In a lot of ways I think folks with CCW have felt they need ot be more of a pussy and leave well enough alone unless it is threatening your family or anothers. We still need to look out for our fellow person who is unable to defend themselves, such as the situation I mentioned early when a guy was beating his wife or GF and she had no way of defending herself and no one was stopping the nefarious acts of the douchbag BF or husband.
That doesn't seem safe to me. I try to avoid people addicted to drugs at all costs.
The concept of a CCW Mindset seems to be lost with a lot of folks on here.
It isnt necessarly using your CCW in all situations regardless of the need for lethal force or to scare off a person in a potentially bad situation.
The mindset is to know when to use it our not and when to unholster. Doesnt mean we as folks with a CCW should become complacent in everyday life and never react to situations that do not warrent even acknoledgment of a CCW and sit back and watch people continue to harm others in any capacity.
In a lot of ways I think folks with CCW have felt they need ot be more of a pussy and leave well enough alone unless it is threatening your family or anothers. We still need to look out for our fellow person who is unable to defend themselves, such as the situation I mentioned early when a guy was beating his wife or GF and she had no way of defending herself and no one was stopping the nefarious acts of the douchbag BF or husband.
I tend to agree with this. I don't think it matters all that much if you are carrying or not. If you can end the conflict with a punch, that's all the better.
I think people are just trying to point out that if you are carrying, you shouldn't make any moves that could add to a conflict. However, I really can't see how a jolly laugh and a back rub could come across as being aggressive. Even if I called someone an asshole, I feel like I'd be able to tell if they found it genuinely funny or not when they laughed in my face. I don't know though, I don't do meth, so I can't really comment on the guy's mindset.
Was this truck stop in Colorado?
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 15:46
That doesn't seem safe to me. I try to avoid people addicted to drugs at all costs.
As do I Irving. In my business I unfortunately encounter a lot of them. Which is part of the reason I reacted the way I did. I ended the threat as quickly as possible.
Irving, This occurred in Rock Springs, Wyoming. At the Texaco truck stop off Elk Street just next to I-80.
Also, My truck was getting a new vacuum pump installed in Green River. I was hungry, took my dogs out for a walk, encountered a trucker who was broke down and leaking trans fluid. I helped him out, gave him the repair shop number, then went to the truck stop for some food and ran into the tweeker/trucker.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 15:49
The concept of a CCW Mindset seems to be lost with a lot of folks on here.
It isnt necessarly using your CCW in all situations regardless of the need for lethal force or to scare off a person in a potentially bad situation.
The mindset is to know when to use it our not and when to unholster. Doesnt mean we as folks with a CCW should become complacent in everyday life and never react to situations that do not warrent even acknoledgment of a CCW and sit back and watch people continue to harm others in any capacity.
In a lot of ways I think folks with CCW have felt they need ot be more of a pussy and leave well enough alone unless it is threatening your family or anothers. We still need to look out for our fellow person who is unable to defend themselves, such as the situation I mentioned early when a guy was beating his wife or GF and she had no way of defending herself and no one was stopping the nefarious acts of the douchbag BF or husband.
That is a completely different type of situation then the OP. I agree you have a responsibility to try to protect those who can not protect themselves and you know me well enough to know that I would have been right there with you.
My problem with the OP is that lets say you called someone an asshole and then that guy put his hand on you like described in the OP. Would you swing? I would. Put your hands on me or mine and good luck to you. Keep your hands to yourself. The OP got lucky that he hit the sweet spot on the guy. If he keeps his hands to himself he may not have to try his luck next time.
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 15:59
That is a completely different type of situation then the OP. I agree you have a responsibility to try to protect those who can not protect themselves and you know me well enough to know that I would have been right there with you.
My problem with the OP is that lets say you called someone an asshole and then that guy put his hand on you like described in the OP. Would you swing? I would. Put your hands on me or mine and good luck to you. Keep your hands to yourself. The OP got lucky that he hit the sweet spot on the guy. If he keeps his hands to himself he may not have to try his luck next time.
I find your response funny. You think taking a swing at someone who laughs and pats you on the shoulder a correct time to swing? Well then I should have had people swinging at me left and right in the crowd at the Tim McGraw concert. I put my hand on people's shoulder's in a crowd who aren't paying attention while I try to navigate my small gf through. NEVER has anyone taken a swing at me. Most apologize. You need to rethink your mindset of put your hand on me or mine and good luck to you. It seems like you would be the aggressor every time someone touched you. I was presented with a violent person looking for trouble. Why do you think I was lucky? Remember, luck favors the most prepared.
I'm just glad to hear that a tweaker got knocked out.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 16:06
I find your response funny. You think taking a swing at someone who laughs and pats you on the shoulder a correct time to swing? Well then I should have had people swinging at me left and right in the crowd at the Tim McGraw concert. I put my hand on people's shoulder's in a crowd who aren't paying attention while I try to navigate my small gf through. NEVER has anyone taken a swing at me. Most apologize. You need to rethink your mindset of put your hand on me or mine and good luck to you. It seems like you would be the aggressor every time someone touched you. I was presented with a violent person looking for trouble. Why do you think I was lucky? Remember, luck favors the most prepared.
And you put your hand on him. Perhaps you did not notice that this was not a Tim McGraw concert? Or are the people at a Tim McGraw concert violent people looking for trouble?
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 16:09
And you put your hand on him. Perhaps you did not notice that this was not a Tim McGraw concert? Or are the people at a Tim McGraw concert violent people looking for trouble?
Now you are just being silly... and missing the point.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 16:10
Now you are just being silly... and missing the point.
Nope, but you sure are.
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 16:19
Nope, but you sure are.
Of course I am dear. BTW missed points are on sale for you at walmart right now.
DD977GM2
08-14-2011, 16:21
That is a completely different type of situation then the OP. I agree you have a responsibility to try to protect those who can not protect themselves and you know me well enough to know that I would have been right there with you.
My problem with the OP is that lets say you called someone an asshole and then that guy put his hand on you like described in the OP. Would you swing? I would. Put your hands on me or mine and good luck to you. Keep your hands to yourself. The OP got lucky that he hit the sweet spot on the guy. If he keeps his hands to himself he may not have to try his luck next time.
TMLeader
The pat on the back was an attempt to squash the conflict. I have done that before with douchbags when I had encounters and have lckily folks took it the right way, but as a person under the influence of drugs, the action obviously was misintrepeted by the douchbag. The tweeker was wrong in the first place IMHO, due to knowing Drilldo and how he is with folks and even how he is wit his dogs. The tweeker was 100% incorrect in his assumption of how Drill takes care of his dogs to boot.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 16:23
Of course I am dear. BTW missed points are on sale for you at walmart right now.
Considering that you are comparing a meeting with an aggressive person in a gas station to a Tim McGraw concert if anyone is missing points it would be you. But then logic is not something that many people seem to be capable of anymore.
Though I am sure you will continue to rationalize your blatant disconnection with reality.
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 16:26
Considering that you are comparing a meeting with an aggressive person in a gas station to a Tim McGraw concert if anyone is missing points it would be you. But then logic is not something that many people seem to be capable of anymore.
Though I am sure you will continue to rationalize your blatant disconnection with reality.
I thought you were heading to Wal Mart for the missed point sale? Why are you still here?
I am certain you would have handled the situation differently. Good for you. (I did enjoy a Marine talking about logic though, thanks)
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 16:30
I thought you were heading to Wal Mart for the missed point sale? Why are you still here?
I am certain you would have handled the situation differently. Good for you. (I did enjoy a Marine talking about logic though, thanks)
Ah yes the bastion of the weak minded individual. Can not argue the point? Just ad hominem. Works every time.
DD977GM2
08-14-2011, 16:35
Now Now kids, we all have diffrent view points and ways we would react to things in diffrent situations, but based on knowing both of you, Drill & TMLeader, Sorry TM Id say you would have reacted the exact same way if you patted the guy on the back and he swung at you.
The pat on the back was key to trying to stop the conflict and a gesture of lets be buddies and stop argueing and no hard feelings.
I think that concept of that in this thread has been lost.
The tweeker was obviously off his rocker and didnt understand that and due to his lifestyle of choice, he felt threatened and reacted and thus DRILL reacted and with knowing his height and weight, obviously had the upper hand fromt he get go.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 16:50
Now Now kids, we all have diffrent view points and ways we would react to things in diffrent situations, but based on knowing both of you, Drill & TMLeader, Sorry TM Id say you would have reacted the exact same way if you patted the guy on the back and he swung at you.
The pat on the back was key to trying to stop the conflict and a gesture of lets be buddies and stop argueing and no hard feelings.
I think that concept of that in this thread has been lost.
The tweeker was obviously off his rocker and didnt understand that and due to his lifestyle of choice, he felt threatened and reacted and thus DRILL reacted and with knowing his height and weight, obviously had the upper hand fromt he get go.
The point I failed to make is that I would not have patted him on the back. I would not have initiated physical contact. He may have swung at me anyways, but he is more likely to have if physical contact is initiated.
How many times have you seen in "fights" where two guys are yelling at each other but neither will swing? The "fight" never actually happens. But as soon as physical contact is made by either side it is on. Even when that contact is inadvertent. Yelling does not make a fight. Name calling does not make a fight. Physical contact does.
SideShow Bob
08-14-2011, 17:19
The Name calling does not make a fight. Physical contact does.
The OP cannot understand this and cannot believe that there are people in this world that have unreasonable aversion to being touched in any manner by another person. Not to mention that the so called Tweeker ( the OPs professional diagnosis of the individual ) could have perceived the so called "pat on the back" as a hostile attack.
The OP got Lucky, he could have ended up with the crap stomped out of him and left laying there crying for the police.
The OP should have just ignored being called an asshole and went about his business. It could be that where he tied his dog caused the " Tweeker" to trip on his way into the truck stop or interfered with sidewalk traffic in the immediate area.
I'm sure he understands that just fine, but it is irrational to assume that a pat on the back is an aggressive move. I might have an aversion to high pitched voices, but it doesn't make it okay for me to go around swinging at women and children. The situation needs to be viewed in light of what a logical person would do. Dealing with a druggy, everything goes out the window.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 17:29
I'm sure he understands that just fine, but it is irrational to assume that a pat on the back is an aggressive move. I might have an aversion to high pitched voices, but it doesn't make it okay for me to go around swinging at women and children. The situation needs to be viewed in light of what a logical person would do. Dealing with a druggy, everything goes out the window.
ANY physical contact in an aggressive situation is the catalyst for a fight.
sneakerd
08-14-2011, 17:31
This is a great thread![Pop][Pepsi]
SideShow Bob
08-14-2011, 17:35
ANY physical contact in an aggressive situation is the catalyst for a fight.
^ This, and most likely the person turned away and started leaving after calling the OP an Asshole. So the pat on the back can be perceived as an attack from behind.
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 17:39
The OP cannot understand this and cannot believe that there are people in this world that have unreasonable aversion to being touched in any manner by another person. Not to mention that the so called Tweeker ( the OPs professional diagnosis of the individual ) could have perceived the so called "pat on the back" as a hostile attack.
The OP got Lucky, he could have ended up with the crap stomped out of him and left laying there crying for the police.
The OP should have just ignored being called an asshole and went about his business. It could be that where he tied his dog caused the " Tweeker" to trip on his way into the truck stop or interfered with sidewalk traffic in the immediate area.
Now you are just assuming nonsense as you assumed I got "lucky". Have you ever been to the truck stop? Do you know where I tied my dogs up? Do you know where I tied them up and how long I was away from them? No. So basically your opinion is just that. An Uniformed opinion without any facts. BTW why do I need a "professional diagnosis" to see a tweeker? I have seen plenty, have you? Probably not. I was not "lucky". I was trained and reacted immediately. You don't like that and want to talk about what ifs? Go do it with TM since you both seem to think that you know better than I do without ever being in the situation.
SideShow Bob
08-14-2011, 17:42
Now you are just assuming nonsense as you assumed I got "lucky". Have you ever been to the truck stop? Do you know where I tied my dogs up? Do you know where I tied them up and how long I was away from them? No. So basically your opinion is just that. An Uniformed opinion without any facts. BTW why do I need a "professional diagnosis" to see a tweeker? I have seen plenty, have you? Probably not. I was not "lucky". I was trained and reacted immediately. You don't like that and want to talk about what ifs? Go do it with TM since you both seem to think that you know better than I do without ever being in the situation.
Looks like we figured out what buttons to push on this guy. [LOL]
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 17:49
Looks like we figured out what buttons to push on this guy. [LOL]
Pat him on the back, it will defuse the situation.
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 17:50
Looks like we figured out what buttons to push on this guy. [LOL]
Ignorantly assuming without knowing facts and foolishly swinging? You are damned right.
BTW, why are you trying to push my buttons? It just make you even more foolish.
bellavite1
08-14-2011, 17:57
WTH!
Let's all beat each other up and then go for beers![Tooth]
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 18:01
Ignorantly assuming without knowing facts and foolishly swinging? You are damned right.
BTW, why are you trying to push my buttons? It just make you even more foolish.
Serious question time. If I laughed at you and patted you on the shoulder right now what would you do? The absolute least you would do is strike my arm away from touching you.
But what would I know, I don't have training.
What I do have is 500 fights. You see when I was growing up I figured that 500 fights is what you needed to be a tough guy.
Given the OP's initial description of the situation, there is a lot left to interpretation. Later posts don't add much more.
Newbs [Roll1]
Does it count? I fought in the Badman Competition before it was called the Tapout...
Drilldov2.0
08-14-2011, 20:30
Serious question time. If I laughed at you and patted you on the shoulder right now what would you do? The absolute least you would do is strike my arm away from touching you.
But what would I know, I don't have training.
What I do have is 500 fights. You see when I was growing up I figured that 500 fights is what you needed to be a tough guy.
That is your serious question? Why again are you still posting?
sneakerd
08-14-2011, 20:35
500 fights? Holy crap you must be ugly.[Worth]
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 20:47
That is your serious question? Why again are you still posting?
Because you have not answered the question. And if you answer honestly you totally invalidate your entire argument against me.
Maybe you should check walmart dear. Perhaps they sell logic and understanding. Though maybe you should hit up sams club, they sell in bulk.
SideShow Bob
08-14-2011, 20:49
Let us all hope that Drilldo is not an LEO. Or sooner or later we will see him on a posted video delivering an unwarranted beat down to a innocent bystander.
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 20:49
500 fights? Holy crap you must be ugly.[Worth]
Knockaround guys bar fight.
0x3-d7_GxNk
SideShow Bob
08-14-2011, 20:51
Knockaround guys bar fight.
0x3-d7_GxNk
Video doesn't work. ( For me at least. )
tmleadr03
08-14-2011, 20:55
Video doesn't work. ( For me at least. )
I just clicked on it and it worked, but it could have to do with my lack of training... with the internet.
Here is the link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0x3-d7_GxNk
I'll say this: I wasn't there, so I don't know how it went down. I do know that meth and drugs like it make people hyper paranoid. Chances are about 50/50 that the guy would have taken a swing anyway. Violence isn't the answer, but sometimes it's an answer.
meh, the guy was probably a douche, but to be honest you should never reach out and touch anyone you don't know, ever, in a situation like that. sure, you let him have it this time. next time you might find a knife in your belly, or worse. never a good idea to make physical contact with a stranger. obviously once the d-bag swings, he should be fair game. i just don't see why it isn't easier and safer for everyone to descalate the situation by talking calmly, politely, and sometimes even backing down. your manhood isn't at stake. speaking in a humble voice and trying to explain the situation doesn't mean you don't have balls. don't get me wrong, im not trying to preach to you, the guy was probably an idiot and probably had it coming, but its just my opinion.
knowing how to fight or carrying or whatever the situation may be, doesn't mean we should puff up our chest when people confront us in and effort to be "the man". in fact, i think those of us with the ability to protect ourselves need to have even more responsibility to avoid confrontation at ALL costs. thats not necessarily directed to you, ive just seen a lot of threads on here about almost drawing on people, getting in fights, what have you. and almost every single one has to do with said person being just a tad too puffy and afraid to look meek and escalating a situation that probably didn't need to be escalated, even if the assailant is a complete idiot d-bag. someday someone could get seriously injured or even killed, and frankly even if its the bad guy its not a result i think anyone really wants.
I'll say this: I wasn't there, so I don't know how it went down. I do know that meth and drugs like it make people hyper paranoid. Chances are about 50/50 that the guy would have taken a swing anyway. Violence isn't the answer, but sometimes it's an answer.
i completely agree. but i am a super easy going, laid back guy who would avoid a fight in any way possible. but if some random guy reached out and touched me, even patted me on the shoulder or back, it would immediately put me into a defensive mind set. i wouldn't swing at someone but it would make me super uncomfortable, and if someone is already on edge or just a plain jerk, touching them isn't going to end well.
ronaldrwl
08-14-2011, 21:18
500 fights? Holy crap you must be ugly.[Worth]
This is getting funny
ronaldrwl
08-14-2011, 21:19
Pat him on the back, it will defuse the situation.
Umm, good advice :)
Chad4000
08-14-2011, 22:30
This is finally the thread where the newbs like me get to see where everybody is at.. There is a differance between people..
Those who think it's ok to go up to somebody and talk shit, assuming nothing will happen. The same people that are banking on somebody elses restraint... The one who wakes up taking about how he almost tripped walking by some dogs [BooHoo]
Then there is the person who gets swung on and knocks out a dick...
I'm going with the later...
hollohas
08-15-2011, 09:39
I am late and haven't read all the responses but I will say I don't think you did anything wrong. I'm not sure what to think about some people here saying "I would have never patted him on the shoulder in the first place". WTF? What have we come to when you people consider a seemingly friendly pat on the shoulder with a stranger an invitation to a dangerous altercation?
The dude was a dick by calling you an asshole. I think you handled it fine by laughing it off and giving him a friendly pat. He had no right to swing at you and you had every right to knock his ass out for that. Then the fight was over, no knives, no guns. OVER. That's the way it should be.
A polite society is one where a man gets a broken nose for taking a unprovoked cheap shot on another man. God I wish we stilled lived in a world where two men could solve their problems this quickly without always escalating to knives, guns and police.
That dick got his ass handed to him. Good job.
hollohas
08-15-2011, 09:53
If you and I had a verbal altercation followed by you "patting me on the shoulder" I probably would have taken a swing at you too. Just saying. I am not the type of guy that likes people I don't know to lay a hand on me.
I didn't include the name here because I don't want to sling insults directly at someone I don't know. This post is not directed solely at the person who wrote the above but I have issue with the above statement.
Seriously?!?!?! You think a man patting you on the back is a reason to swing at him? That's fucked.
What happened to this country when people see a pat on the back as instigation and assault? Anyone that says patting another man on the back or shoulder is a provocation needs to grow a pair. "OMG, officer, he patted me on the back! I had a right to swing at him! He TOUCHED ME first!!" Bunch of whinny girls...
hollohas
08-15-2011, 10:09
I find this post rather troubling. Why was it necessary to tie your dogs up outside the truck stop? Did they have shade and water? Were they safely out of the way of traffic both foot and motorized? Obviously, no one was watching them or there would be no need to tie them up. Who would stop them from being poisoned, or let off their leashes and get hit? What if a young child walked up to them and for some unknown reason, they maul the child?
As a dog lover, I don't like it when people tie their dogs up outside a public building not designed for it. If this place had stalls to tie your dog up in, I apologize. Do me and everyone else a favor by having more respect for the friends you haven't met and YOUR DOGS!
Too, I think by your description of the trucker, there may have been more than one person with a short fuse. Bottom line is: If you had taken proper care of your pets, we wouldn't be discussing this in front of the viewing public.
Take care,
Dave
HAHAHAHAHA. After the OPs story and the comments we get you should take better care of your dogs. HAHAHAHAHA.
Paladin, are you suggesting he leave them in the hot vehicle instead? Maybe the OP should only do business at truck stops that allow pets inside and then bring them in the restroom with him too? Oh, and when it's time to eat, he should bring them into the diner and let the dog sit in the booth too... Ridiculous.
"If the place has STALLS to tie your dog in"...??? What? What kind of store has stalls for dogs?
Sorry if this has been discussed already. I'm just not able to wait to post until I have read everything first. Some posts require immediate responses...
hollohas
08-15-2011, 10:19
My problem with the OP is that lets say you called someone an asshole and then that guy put his hand on you like described in the OP. Would you swing? I would. Put your hands on me or mine and good luck to you. Keep your hands to yourself. The OP got lucky that he hit the sweet spot on the guy. If he keeps his hands to himself he may not have to try his luck next time.
Bunch of whiners. "He TOUCHED me!" If you would hit a guy for touching you with a friendly pat, you're a dick just like the tweaker. Grow some balls. Not everything is worth fighting over and a pat on the shoulder is on the top of the list of "Things Not Worth Fighting Over"
Man, this thread is really making me upset at how many people think a pat on the back is grounds for a fight.
OP, good job. You tried to be a man and be friendly about being called out but obviously the world has changed. For whatever reason, as this thread proves, a pat on the back is no longer allowed in our society. Too bad.
Name calling does not make a fight. Physical contact does.
And another asinine comment. A friendly pat on the shoulder doesn't make a fight either. What a joke.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 10:34
I didn't include the name here because I don't want to sling insults directly at someone I don't know. This post is not directed solely at the person who wrote the above but I have issue with the above statement.
Seriously?!?!?! You think a man patting you on the back is a reason to swing at him? That's fucked.
What happened to this country when people see a pat on the back as instigation and assault? Anyone that says patting another man on the back or shoulder is a provocation needs to grow a pair. "OMG, officer, he patted me on the back! I had a right to swing at him! He TOUCHED ME first!!" Bunch of whinny girls...
Bunch of whiners. "He TOUCHED me!" If you would hit a guy for touching you with a friendly pat, you're a dick just like the tweaker. Grow some balls. Not everything is worth fighting over and a pat on the shoulder is on the top of the list of "Things Not Worth Fighting Over"
Man, this thread is really making me upset at how many people think a pat on the back is grounds for a fight.
OP, good job. You tried to be a man and be friendly about being called out but obviously the world has changed. For whatever reason, as this thread proves, a pat on the back is no longer allowed in our society. Too bad.
And another asinine comment. A friendly pat on the shoulder doesn't make a fight either. What a joke.
I like how you stick with your convictions for all of one post. [ROFL1]
hollohas
08-15-2011, 10:55
I like how you stick with your convictions for all of one post. [ROFL1]
Yup, you pissed me off that much.
I like how you stick with your convictions for all of one post. [ROFL1]
TM, I have to say it, I agree 100% with Hollohas... and it's more than one post. The general consensus I get from some of the responses on this is there are two groups- the group that gives the OP a "pat on the back" (it's ok, you can chuckle a bit) for his actions, and the group that says "OH MY GOD! YOU TOUCHED HIM!? He had every right to hit you, keep your hands to yourself!" What is this? Kindergarten? If a friendly gesture of just touching someone warrants violence then I'd say we are surrounded by psychos! I wouldn't throw a punch if I got a bit peeved at someone and they patted me and laughed. I might ask them not to touch me, but I wouldn't take a swing at them, c'mon, a little ridiculous. If physical contact is enough to warrant a fight then I should have had at least 60 fights in just the last few days, because I've touched, bumped into and put my hands on at least 2x that many. Not one of them tried to fight me, no one got angry, and I certainly didn't "provoke" anything. So let's all fucking stop with this pansy attitude where we should all keep inside our own personal bubbles and never touch anyone at all costs for fear of "instigating" something.... jeez, I thought you all would be a little thicker skinned.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 10:58
Yup, you pissed me off that much.
Pat pat [LOL]
hollohas
08-15-2011, 11:02
Pat pat [LOL]
Yup, even if we had this conversation face-to-face and you gave me a friendly pat while I was pissed at your comments I would not swing at you. You on the other hand would swing at me for patting you. And that Sir is fucked.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 11:06
TM, I have to say it, I agree 100% with Hollohas... and it's more than one post. The general consensus I get from some of the responses on this is there are two groups- the group that gives the OP a "pat on the back" (it's ok, you can chuckle a bit) for his actions, and the group that says "OH MY GOD! YOU TOUCHED HIM!? He had every right to hit you, keep your hands to yourself!" What is this? Kindergarten? If a friendly gesture of just touching someone warrants violence then I'd say we are surrounded by psychos! I wouldn't throw a punch if I got a bit peeved at someone and they patted me and laughed. I might ask them not to touch me, but I wouldn't take a swing at them, c'mon, a little ridiculous. If physical contact is enough to warrant a fight then I should have had at least 60 fights in just the last few days, because I've touched, bumped into and put my hands on at least 2x that many. Not one of them tried to fight me, no one got angry, and I certainly didn't "provoke" anything. So let's all fucking stop with this pansy attitude where we should all keep inside our own personal bubbles and never touch anyone at all costs for fear of "instigating" something.... jeez, I thought you all would be a little thicker skinned.
This was already by the OPs description a confrontational situation. Not a friendly bump into someone in the office. Not a Tim McGraw concert. Those are different situations. Not once have I said that it is ok. I have said it is to be expected. If you are in someones face cussing at them and they laugh at you and reach for you this does not defuse the situation.
Let me clarify. The guy should not have been in the OPs face. But in a confrontational situation with someone who is worked up like that the physical contact is a catalyst for a fight, or swinging on someone since it was obviously not much of a fight. Is patting someone on the back wrong? No. But in a physical confrontation it can spark off EXACTLY what the OP described. And most of the time I have seen it do just that. When someones temper is running not enough for them to be yelling profanities at someone else any touch, inadvertent or purposeful will be the catalyst for someone to start swinging.
Comparing what was described in the OP to your office or to a Tim McGraw concert is... well silly. Completely different situations with completely different dynamics.
ETA: No I do not think the guy had every right to hit him. I think that it was a response that was easily predicted considering the situation.
Ok guys...shake hands and.. nevermind, that's touching too...someone's gonna get decked...[Help]
Lex_Luthor
08-15-2011, 12:15
I don't want to join either group of response givers.
I say unleash your dogs and let them eat the meth addict for dinner.
airborneranger
08-15-2011, 12:36
This was already by the OPs description a confrontational situation. Not a friendly bump into someone in the office. Not a Tim McGraw concert. Those are different situations. Not once have I said that it is ok. I have said it is to be expected. If you are in someones face cussing at them and they laugh at you and reach for you this does not defuse the situation.
Let me clarify. The guy should not have been in the OPs face. But in a confrontational situation with someone who is worked up like that the physical contact is a catalyst for a fight, or swinging on someone since it was obviously not much of a fight. Is patting someone on the back wrong? No. But in a physical confrontation it can spark off EXACTLY what the OP described. And most of the time I have seen it do just that. When someones temper is running not enough for them to be yelling profanities at someone else any touch, inadvertent or purposeful will be the catalyst for someone to start swinging.
Comparing what was described in the OP to your office or to a Tim McGraw concert is... well silly. Completely different situations with completely different dynamics.
ETA: No I do not think the guy had every right to hit him. I think that it was a response that was easily predicted considering the situation.
I have to agree with you on this one. Is a pat on the back enough to warrant fists to fly? No, but in the right situation it could.
hollohas
08-15-2011, 12:53
Ok guys...shake hands and.. nevermind, that's touching too...someone's gonna get decked...[Help]
Exactly.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 12:57
Exactly.
Thus showing how you have no understanding of what I am talking about.
hollohas
08-15-2011, 13:06
Would you swing? I would. Put your hands on me or mine and good luck to you. Keep your hands to yourself.
This is what you're talking about and it's a pussy move. Only pricks start swinging at a guy for a friendly pat on the shoulder. A pat on the shoulder is not aggression and only meat heads would think it was grounds for a fight.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 13:24
This is what you're talking about and it's a pussy move. Only pricks start swinging at a guy for a friendly pat on the shoulder. A pat on the shoulder is not aggression and only meat heads would think it was grounds for a fight.
And how do you know it is a friendly pat on the shoulder? Are you a mind reader? You have a guy you just called an asshole reaching for you. He could be wanting to be condescending and pat you on the shoulder, or he could be reaching to initiate some sort of kung fu grip. How do you know? Why are you letting some guy you just initiated conflict with get inside your defenses?
I am not the type of guy anymore to go around calling someone an asshole. But if that situation happens and the other guy reaches towards me the only assumption I can safely make is that bodily harm is intended. How is that being a pussy?
And is this conversation any reason to be throwing pejorative at each other? If you would like I can start using swear words when addressing you as well.
Like I said in my first post in this thread what a thin veneer of civilization we have in this country. I present a conflicting point of view and how is it treated? Name calling. What a sorry state our world is in.
And how do you know it is a friendly pat on the shoulder? Are you a mind reader? You have a guy you just called an asshole reaching for you. He could be wanting to be condescending and pat you on the shoulder, or he could be reaching to initiate some sort of kung fu grip. How do you know? Why are you letting some guy you just initiated conflict with get inside your defenses?
I am not the type of guy anymore to go around calling someone an asshole. But if that situation happens and the other guy reaches towards me the only assumption I can safely make is that bodily harm is intended. How is that being a pussy?
And is this conversation any reason to be throwing pejorative at each other? If you would like I can start using swear words when addressing you as well.
Like I said in my first post in this thread what a thin veneer of civilization we have in this country. I present a conflicting point of view and how is it treated? Name calling. What a sorry state our world is in.
So if by some chance you called me an asshole (I doubt it would get to that, I'm a nice guy :) ) but for arguments sake it happens, I say something like "whatever" and go to pat you on the shoulder... you attempt to strike me and I take it as a viable threat (let's just say you're bigger than me), I draw down and put two .45 HP in your chest and then one more in between your eyes. Now you are dead because you presented a threat while I was trying to deescalate the situation... Jump the gun, misinterpret something, and bad things happen. I'm not trying to pick a fight, but I've been in situations where the guy didn't leave at just one punch, he fully intended to put me in the hospital (and did). Had I been armed, I would have avoided having to go to the ER and get CAT scans, and then endure being in pain for a week, having headaches for three and a half, and not to mention the bruises and cuts on my head. Notice I didn't call anyone by any names, just presented at similar situation and showed how easily someone getting bent out of shape because their "personal space" was so egregiously invaded.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 13:37
So if by some chance you called me an asshole (I doubt it would get to that, I'm a nice guy :) ) but for arguments sake it happens, I say something like "whatever" and go to pat you on the shoulder... you attempt to strike me and I take it as a viable threat (let's just say you're bigger than me), I draw down and put two .45 HP in your chest and then one more in between your eyes. Now you are dead because you presented a threat while I was trying to deescalate the situation... Jump the gun, misinterpret something, and bad things happen. I'm not trying to pick a fight, but I've been in situations where the guy didn't leave at just one punch, he fully intended to put me in the hospital (and did). Had I been armed, I would have avoided having to go to the ER and get CAT scans, and then endure being in pain for a week, having headaches for three and a half, and not to mention the bruises and cuts on my head. Notice I didn't call anyone by any names, just presented at similar situation and showed how easily someone getting bent out of shape because their "personal space" was so egregiously invaded.
So your saying that it is easy to interpret intentions when tempers are running high and we should just assume the best of intentions from someone?
You do notice that in your hypothesis the catalyst was what? Not the name calling, but the physical contact. I am now a dead man not because I called you an asshole, but because physical contact was initiated and I miss-interpreted it. You bet my life on my ability in the heat of the moment to properly read your mind.
hollohas
08-15-2011, 13:39
A pat on the shoulder as described is no different than a handshake. It was clearly meant as a friendly gesture and a refusal of hostilities (hence the laughing). You said that was worthy of hitting the man over and that you would have done the same. If you continue to say that it's ok to hit a man who pats you friendly, then I stand by my statement. If you think that a friendly pat on the shoulder is a threat of bodily injury, then I stand by my previous statement. A man who hits another man for a friendly pat is no man at all.
That is the thin veneer of civilization when you can't even give a friendly gesture to someone who is angry at you without expecting them to hit you.
What a joke.
Hollohas out.
airborneranger
08-15-2011, 13:41
Hollohas out.
Well then, I guess that's that and it is over [ROFL1]
I don't think anyone is going to prevail when you are arguing opinions based on your interpretation of what happened.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 13:41
A pat on the shoulder as described is no different than a handshake. It was clearly meant as a friendly gesture and a refusal of hostilities (hence the laughing). You said that was worthy of hitting the man over and that you would have done the same. If you continue to say that it's ok to hit a man who pats you friendly, then I stand by my statement. If you think that a friendly pat on the shoulder is a threat of bodily injury, then I stand by my previous statement. A man who hits another man for a friendly pat is no man at all.
That is the thin veneer of civilization when you can't even give a friendly gesture to someone who is angry at you without expecting them to hit you.
What a joke.
Hollohas out.
Ah, in that case, you are just a little ignorant bitch.
You're right, it is much more easy to argue this way.
A pat on the shoulder as described is no different than a handshake. It was clearly meant as a friendly gesture and a refusal of hostilities (hence the laughing). You said that was worthy of hitting the man over and that you would have done the same. If you continue to say that it's ok to hit a man who pats you friendly, then I stand by my statement. If you think that a friendly pat on the shoulder is a threat of bodily injury, then I stand by my previous statement. A man who hits another man for a friendly pat is no man at all.
That is the thin veneer of civilization when you can't even give a friendly gesture to someone who is angry at you without expecting them to hit you.
What a joke.
Hollohas out.
Bingo!
So your saying that it is easy to interpret intentions when tempers are running high and we should just assume the best of intentions from someone?
You do notice that in your hypothesis the catalyst was what? Not the name calling, but the physical contact. I am now a dead man not because I called you an asshole, but because physical contact was initiated and I miss-interpreted it. You bet my life on my ability in the heat of the moment to properly read your mind.
No need to read my mind- if my hand is balled up in a fist, and I reach back to punch, it's a threat. If my hand is open, I'm clearly in a jovial mood, and my hand does not come at you in any way menacing, you'd still hit me? There are various kinds of physical contact, and not all can be seen as threatening... unless you are Samuel L. Jackson's Mr. Glass and a harmless pat on the back could cause your rib cage to shatter. People do not need to be so damn sensitive, a pat on the back, a handshake, a friendly shoulder clap, etc. are completely different things from a punch, a kick, a judo chop, etc.
airborneranger
08-15-2011, 13:48
People do not need to be so damn sensitive, a pat on the back, a handshake, a friendly shoulder clap, etc. are completely different things from a punch, a kick, a judo chop, etc.
I don't know about that. My judo chop looks like a friendly tap and then BAM - you are down! [Beer]
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 13:50
I don't know about that. My judo chop looks like a friendly tap and then BAM - you are down! [Beer]
Bull, the only way you could possibly hit someone is with a closed hand. No other way can even be considered.
Everyone was kung fu fighting. Damn song is in my head I figured I would share.
UberTong
08-15-2011, 14:09
I say good work, what happened to people minding their own business. I'm sure you love your dogs, tell that asshat to go call PETA when he wakes up.
i had a friend in a similar situation kill the guy because after he hit him he fell weird and hit his head(killing him) dude is still in jail
always always always try to calm down the situation
UberTong
08-15-2011, 15:11
All of you that think the OP did something wrong are as soft as baby thighs, period.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 15:28
All of you that think the OP did something wrong are as soft as baby thighs, period.
Felt a lot of baby thighs have you?[ROFL1][Beer]
All of you that think the OP did something wrong are as soft as baby thighs, period.
[ROFL2]
I'm willing to bet 80% or more of the people here, if confronted, and a punch was thrown at them, they'd hit back. Once the fists are flying it's hard to make peace. And I'm a somewhat "touchy feely" guy (no homo) that when people get pissy I just put a friendly hand on their shoulder (sometimes give a bit of a half-hug) and say "Hey, calm down cupcake, we're all friends here," and they usually end up laughing it off. Now, none of the people I do this with are meth riddled freaks, and I'm pretty sure they'd be a little crazy or demonic if I tried to half-hug and called them cupcake, but once in that position it's quite easy to subdue someone without too much pain inflicted.
n8tive97
08-15-2011, 15:31
I'm one of those guys that has too much to lose and don't care for the sleeping arrangments at the grey bar in.
However, in my younger years and probably now, I will warn someone who is talking lot's of junk not to touch me. You can call me what you want, but leave the family out of it, you dont know my Mom. I have even offered to by one guy a beer and told him he is making an ass out of himself. As soon as he pointed in my chest, l made sure he knew it was a mistake.
Someone has the signature about violence isn't always the best option, but it is still an option. I think that fits best in this thread for sure.
Full on swing? Oh ya it's on. I wouldn't wait for him to touch me at that point, I would have done the same thing. Tweeker or not....
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 15:37
[ROFL2]
I'm willing to bet 80% or more of the people here, if confronted, and a punch was thrown at them, they'd hit back. Once the fists are flying it's hard to make peace. And I'm a somewhat "touchy feely" guy (no homo) that when people get pissy I just put a friendly hand on their shoulder (sometimes give a bit of a half-hug) and say "Hey, calm down cupcake, we're all friends here," and they usually end up laughing it off. Now, none of the people I do this with are meth riddled freaks, and I'm pretty sure they'd be a little crazy or demonic if I tried to half-hug and called them cupcake, but once in that position it's quite easy to subdue someone without too much pain inflicted.
Completely in contrast to the arguments you have made.
Wow, this thread is STILL going? I have no reason to throw a punch unless I feel threatened. If that makes me "soft as baby thighs" then bite me. I don't know if I'm as Rambo as the OP and would put a guy out with one punch but I do know how to land them and will do whatever I intend to do. That being said, I've cooled down a lot since I was 25 and don't feel like I need to "rumble" these days.
Completely in contrast to the arguments you have made.
How so? I said I am kind of the same way, I'll do that with my friends, or people at gatherings of mutual friends and it contrasts in no way to what I was saying earlier...
UberTong
08-15-2011, 16:07
Wow, this thread is STILL going? I have no reason to throw a punch unless I feel threatened. If that makes me "soft as baby thighs" then bite me. I don't know if I'm as Rambo as the OP and would put a guy out with one punch but I do know how to land them and will do whatever I intend to do. That being said, I've cooled down a lot since I was 25 and don't feel like I need to "rumble" these days.
Ranger, not calling you out. Unless you think you wouldn't feel threatened by A) a guy talking smack to you as you approach an establishment (I'm not feeling threatened yet) or B) THE GUY TAKES A SWING AT YOU (ok, now I feel threatened. Why? He intended physical harm by swinging a fist at my body, end of story). What if he landed that first punch and you never got to swing back, and he got to keep kicking your face into the curb? I honestly can't see how this is up for debate. I'm far from a hothead, I'm 28 years old, don't drink, and avoid bars and confrontations like the plague. BUT, if someone swings at me, game on, green light. I'm tired of the pussification of America. How is there a right and wrong after the guy has both been the first to talk shit and take a swing? I didn't say be Rambo, I didn't see be Johnny Tuffnuts and look for a fight. When did it become wrong to stand up for yourself and defend yourself. Jesus people, fist fights used to be a way to deal with this sort of thing, now we are so soft its a umpteen page debate. Sorry just my .02 and to quote ranger, if you don't like it bite me.
Who said patting someone on the back gives a right to swing? Only an idiot wouldswing and that's what happened. But sometimes you have to e the bigger and smarter man and completely walking away. Putting your hands on a stranger, especially someone confrontational, is just plain stupid, for your safety and his. It escalates things unnecessarily. Once the guy swings sure I don't think there is anything wrong with defending yourself. But if you have the means to defen yourself, especially if carrying, it should alwas e avoided anyway possible. You can say that's soft but the fact is we live in a country where you can end up in jail real easy. If you want to ro the dice so you can call yourself a man have at it. My advice is to avoid it altogether, backdown, and both get to live another day of freedom. It seems like a stupid reason to risk so much. It's not about soft it's about priorities.
TM, I have to say it, I agree 100% with Hollohas... and it's more than one post. The general consensus I get from some of the responses on this is there are two groups- the group that gives the OP a "pat on the back" (it's ok, you can chuckle a bit) for his actions, and the group that says "OH MY GOD! YOU TOUCHED HIM!? He had every right to hit you, keep your hands to yourself!" What is this? Kindergarten? If a friendly gesture of just touching someone warrants violence then I'd say we are surrounded by psychos! I wouldn't throw a punch if I got a bit peeved at someone and they patted me and laughed. I might ask them not to touch me, but I wouldn't take a swing at them, c'mon, a little ridiculous. If physical contact is enough to warrant a fight then I should have had at least 60 fights in just the last few days, because I've touched, bumped into and put my hands on at least 2x that many. Not one of them tried to fight me, no one got angry, and I certainly didn't "provoke" anything. So let's all fucking stop with this pansy attitude where we should all keep inside our own personal bubbles and never touch anyone at all costs for fear of "instigating" something.... jeez, I thought you all would be a little thicker skinned.
Ranger, not calling you out. Unless you think you wouldn't feel threatened by A) a guy talking smack to you as you approach an establishment (I'm not feeling threatened yet) or B) THE GUY TAKES A SWING AT YOU (ok, now I feel threatened. Why? He intended physical harm by swinging a fist at my body, end of story). What if he landed that first punch and you never got to swing back, and he got to keep kicking your face into the curb? I honestly can't see how this is up for debate. I'm far from a hothead, I'm 28 years old, don't drink, and avoid bars and confrontations like the plague. BUT, if someone swings at me, game on, green light. I'm tired of the pussification of America. How is there a right and wrong after the guy has both been the first to talk shit and take a swing? I didn't say be Rambo, I didn't see be Johnny Tuffnuts and look for a fight. When did it become wrong to stand up for yourself and defend yourself. Jesus people, fist fights used to be a way to deal with this sort of thing, now we are so soft its a umpteen page debate. Sorry just my .02 and to quote ranger, if you don't like it bite me.
I agree, but for clarification, the debate was more about the OP patting this guy on the shoulder (or similar) while laughing trying to get the dude to calm down- they claim that instigated the guy to throw the punch... everyone saying the OP was wrong is basically saying "keep your hands to yourself and don't touch other people." I just for the life of me can't remember when a harmless touch was enough to get punched over...
airborneranger
08-15-2011, 16:12
I thought the base of division was whether or not the OP demonstrated some sort of aggression by "patting" the guy on the back. I don't think anyone is arguing that once someone throws a punch that it is game on.
Lex_Luthor
08-15-2011, 16:13
Wow, this thread is STILL going? I have no reason to throw a punch unless I feel threatened. If that makes me "soft as baby thighs" then bite me. I don't know if I'm as Rambo as the OP and would put a guy out with one punch but I do know how to land them and will do whatever I intend to do. That being said, I've cooled down a lot since I was 25 and don't feel like I need to "rumble" these days.
I'm 25 and I'm definitely cool. It's great to look forward to being even cooler when I get older!
So, lets just say someone pissed you off by doing something you thought was stupid (everyone has their own things) and you call them an asshole and walk away. As you start to walk away, you feel the other guy touch your shoulder. What do you do? Remember, you have already reached the point of name calling.
Honestly, if my back is turned and you touch me, you are at least getting an arm bar. I will probably not swing but rather put you in a hold that doesn't quite hurt you so I can ask what the hell you think you are doing touching me. In the real world, all around us, people hurt and kill other people for a lot less. Now I would have already had to have been in a bad mood for me to have acted like this (easily reached the point of name calling, bad days happen). Shit happens like misunderstandings every day, just be smart, don't touch someone who is already pissed off.
How do we know the other guy was a druggie again? He could have just been someone in a bad mood, or someone who is a little touchy.
That's allfine and good but I know a handful of people that use that rationale and still wound up in jail for a few months right or wrong. I totally agree this country is weak but it is what it is. If you don't acknowledge it and live accordingly you may just find yourself dead or in jail. Just not worth it in my opinion. I've seen the risks you run when you "defend yourself" an I think I've learned a thing or two. One buddy got stabbed when he could have just walked away and two wound up in jail. All had what you would define as a good reason to fight back but it didnt matter
Ranger, not calling you out. Unless you think you wouldn't feel threatened by A) a guy talking smack to you as you approach an establishment (I'm not feeling threatened yet) or B) THE GUY TAKES A SWING AT YOU (ok, now I feel threatened. Why? He intended physical harm by swinging a fist at my body, end of story). What if he landed that first punch and you never got to swing back, and he got to keep kicking your face into the curb? I honestly can't see how this is up for debate. I'm far from a hothead, I'm 28 years old, don't drink, and avoid bars and confrontations like the plague. BUT, if someone swings at me, game on, green light. I'm tired of the pussification of America. How is there a right and wrong after the guy has both been the first to talk shit and take a swing? I didn't say be Rambo, I didn't see be Johnny Tuffnuts and look for a fight. When did it become wrong to stand up for yourself and defend yourself. Jesus people, fist fights used to be a way to deal with this sort of thing, now we are so soft its a umpteen page debate. Sorry just my .02 and to quote ranger, if you don't like it bite me.
sneakerd
08-15-2011, 16:26
[Pop][Pepsi]
UberTong
08-15-2011, 16:44
That's allfine and good but I know a handful of people that use that rationale and still wound up in jail for a few months right or wrong. I totally agree this country is weak but it is what it is. If you don't acknowledge it and live accordingly you may just find yourself dead or in jail. Just not worth it in my opinion. I've seen the risks you run when you "defend yourself" an I think I've learned a thing or two. One buddy got stabbed when he could have just walked away and two wound up in jail. All had what you would define as a good reason to fight back but it didnt matter
That is a good, sensible point mckay. The world is a fucked up place, and 'defending yourself' is all relative to a jury or the scumbag sueing you etc. But, I don't what it is, how I was raised, what God put in my soul. I'm just not the kind of guy to say "Hey now mister, why did you swing that fist at my face? Let's talk about sir, you look upset!". I know I'm dramatizing it, but it's just not me. If that makes me a hothead, then sign this brotha up as a hothead. I will never look for a fight, but I will finish one. And believe me I know the scenario you're talking about. I was always picked on in grade school when I was younger, and when I retaliated I was always the one being reprimanded because I was bigger/stronger. Still felt right in my heart.
ronaldrwl
08-15-2011, 16:53
That's allfine and good but I know a handful of people that use that rationale and still wound up in jail for a few months right or wrong. I totally agree this country is weak but it is what it is. If you don't acknowledge it and live accordingly you may just find yourself dead or in jail. Just not worth it in my opinion. I've seen the risks you run when you "defend yourself" an I think I've learned a thing or two. One buddy got stabbed when he could have just walked away and two wound up in jail. All had what you would define as a good reason to fight back but it didnt matter
+1
Things seem different when you're in your 20's and got nothin. When you're twice that age with a house and kids.... It's just not smart to let some drunk/druggy draw you into something that puts everything you've built in your life at risk. Dumb...
Bull, the only way you could possibly hit someone is with a closed hand. No other way can even be considered.
Everyone was kung fu fighting. Damn song is in my head I figured I would share.
EmEPXXJ4sKw
SideShow Bob
08-15-2011, 17:00
Tmckay2
Though we are on the same page as far as the laughing at and then patting the so called Tweeker on the back during a hostile situation. I have come to the realization that:
" You Can't Fix Stupid !"
As quoted from one of the Redneck Comedy tour comedians. ( I can't recall which one.)
If everyone else wants to think this is still the 60s and look at the world through their rose colored glasses & have group hugs. And think that it is fine to get in a hostile situation with a possible Meth Head, then laugh at him and pat him on the back, so be it ! Most likely sooner than later they will suffer the consequences.
Let this this thread go, it should have died off a long time ago, as I said earlier," You Can't Fix Stupid."
Maybe instead of patting the guy on the shoulder, he should have done the 3 stooges nose pull...
[Stooge]
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 17:22
How so? I said I am kind of the same way, I'll do that with my friends, or people at gatherings of mutual friends and it contrasts in no way to what I was saying earlier...
You have stated quite a few times there is nothing threatening about putting your arm on someone or patting them on the shoulder then you state "but once in that position it's quite easy to subdue someone without too much pain inflicted."
These two statements are contradictory. It is either a threat or it is not. In the context of what we are talking about it would be considered a threat if you can subdue me from the position of having your hand on my shoulder or back.
You have by your own statement invalidated your argument that there is nothing threatening about patting someone on the shoulder/back.
tmleadr03
08-15-2011, 17:25
So, lets just say someone pissed you off by doing something you thought was stupid (everyone has their own things) and you call them an asshole and walk away. As you start to walk away, you feel the other guy touch your shoulder. What do you do? Remember, you have already reached the point of name calling.
Honestly, if my back is turned and you touch me, you are at least getting an arm bar. I will probably not swing but rather put you in a hold that doesn't quite hurt you so I can ask what the hell you think you are doing touching me. In the real world, all around us, people hurt and kill other people for a lot less. Now I would have already had to have been in a bad mood for me to have acted like this (easily reached the point of name calling, bad days happen). Shit happens like misunderstandings every day, just be smart, don't touch someone who is already pissed off.
How do we know the other guy was a druggie again? He could have just been someone in a bad mood, or someone who is a little touchy.
[Beer]
not sure if anyone posted it yet but:
PICS or it didn't happen.
as far as my input, I think it is a great story. not sure what I would have done since I wasn't there, but if you dropped him cold, good on ya. hopefully you got your dogs and rolled out.
If patting him on the back is considered starting an altercation then the next TSA that touches me will be in a world of hurt![ROFL1]
now him taking a swing at you (with witnesses) will put you in self defense. him also complaining about your dogs started the altercation initially. PETA will back you.
Where was this at?
Boarder fence in New Mexico. Also, the whole conversation happened in Spanish.
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