View Full Version : Some good stuff From Rick Perry
Sharpienads
08-30-2011, 09:41
Not sure how I feel about this guy yet, but definitely some good stuff in this article.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/08/rick-perry-wades-into-foreign-policy-with-speech-to-veterans/
"American soldiers should be led by American commanders." Amen to that.
UberTong
08-30-2011, 09:44
Good stuff, I'm not a 100% on him, but I like what I keep hearing.
Sharpienads
08-30-2011, 10:09
Good stuff, I'm not a 100% on him, but I like what I keep hearing.
Same here. I actually voted against him in the last TX gubernatorial race. I voted for Kathy Glass on the Libertarian ticket. She wanted to get rid of TX's concealed handgun licenses saying that the 2nd Amendment is your right to carry, concealed or otherwise. And she had an awesome view on illegal immigration. Of course Perry kicked her butt, but I went with who I thought was best.
It will be interesting to continue to watch the GOP race.
As a veteran, and it makes me sad, I joined during the Bush administration. I followed everything from the lead up to the election right down to the inauguration (the whole time wishing McCain was CiC). I have to say, while I wore the uniform I had ZERO respect for the man who was our Commander in Chief from 2008-now, but I did respect the position and had to follow orders, even if I did constantly question the legitimacy of how the man attained said position. Perry on the other hand, well I have a lot of respect for him. He openly admits he never saw combat, and never claims he wanted to (because every true warrior wishes for peace, but is prepared to fight), but shows unrelenting support for anyone who wore the uniform. Great man, and I sure hope someone like him can give this current dickhead in office the boot.
ghettodub
08-30-2011, 10:10
Can't stand Rick Perry, but good stuff in that article...
Bailey Guns
08-30-2011, 10:19
I'm gonna go out on a limb now and predict Rick Perry will be the republican nominee.
He's not my first choice but he's definitely on the short list. I wouldn't have any problem voting for him.
Sharpienads
08-30-2011, 10:32
I'm gonna go out on a limb now and predict Rick Perry will be the republican nominee.
He's not my first choice but he's definitely on the short list. I wouldn't have any problem voting for him.
How about a Perry/Bachmann ticket? Or even Bachmann/Perry? That might be a good match.
How about a Perry/Bachmann ticket? Or even Bachmann/Perry? That might be a good match.
I'd throw in my vote! Bachmann has said some very good things lately about how she really truly wants to turn this failboat around... Perry just would do much better for our armed forces- which I believe Obama is failing right now.
Bailey Guns
08-30-2011, 10:52
MB is still my favorite. An MB/RP or RP/MB ticket would be awesome.
UberTong
08-30-2011, 10:55
Agreed.
ghettodub
08-30-2011, 10:57
How about a Perry/Bachmann ticket? Or even Bachmann/Perry? That might be a good match.
That ticket would scare a lot of the more libertarian or non-social conservatives pretty far away. Including myself...
Bailey Guns
08-30-2011, 11:00
2012 = Perry/Bachman
2016 = Perry/Bachman
2020 = Bachman/West
2024 = Bachman/West
2028 and 2032 = West/?
There. Pretty well maps out the next 25 years.
Sharpienads
08-30-2011, 11:26
2012 = Perry/Bachman
2016 = Perry/Bachman
2020 = Bachman/West
2024 = Bachman/West
2028 and 2032 = West/?
There. Pretty well maps out the next 25 years.
AHHHHHH, SHIT! That would be sweet. [Ban3]
Of course I still believe that change needs to come from individuals and work it's way up to the federal government. If we wait for top down change, it's never gonna happen. Until we place the emphasis on state and local elections and elect only those that, for better or worse, will tell the federal government to stay in their lane and/or go f*ck themselves, things will never be as they should.
DeusExMachina
08-30-2011, 11:28
Bachmann is fucking nuts, and Perry isn't far behind from what he keeps saying.
Bachmann is fucking nuts, and Perry isn't far behind from what he keeps saying.
The liberal media has claimed another one!
ghettodub
08-30-2011, 11:37
The liberal media has claimed another one!
I'm with Deus here, and I don't think it's at fault of the media. She says enough crazy shit to make me believe that all on her own...
n8tive97
08-30-2011, 11:42
The liberal media has claimed another one!
Yup, must have read Newsweek last week..... what a shame!
Sharpienads
08-30-2011, 11:42
Bachmann is fucking nuts, and Perry isn't far behind from what he keeps saying.
I'm with Deus here, and I don't think it's at fault of the media. She says enough crazy shit to make me believe that all on her own...
Would you guys mind giving examples? I've heard her speak a few times, and every time I have I can't remember hearing anything that sounded crazy.
DeusExMachina
08-30-2011, 11:48
Would you guys mind giving examples? I've heard her speak a few times, and every time I have I can't remember hearing anything that sounded crazy.
Uh, she's saying the earthquake and Irene are messages from god to Washington about spending.
I don't like Perry's ties to Merck and his executive order requiring all teen girls in Texas be required to get the HPV vaccine...a vaccine that at the time only Merck sold.
He's not terrible otherwise. He's too religious for me. His spending record in Texas doesn't give me any hope he'd do anything to help while President.
Currently, he might be the best the GOP can put out. And it wouldn't be terrible. But Bachmann..no fucking way.
Zundfolge
08-30-2011, 12:03
I would rather that folk like Bachman, West, Paul, Rubio, McCotter and other congresspersons/senators that folk keep talking about for pres or vp stay in the legislature where they actually do some good.
Becoming president or VP means you'll have a few more years of relivance and then you retire ... other than a VP becoming president immediately after 8 years as VP you never see presidents or vice presidents go on to do anything but write a book and collect speaking fees.
We have a lot of ass kickers in the legislature now (and I believe we'll get an additional crop in the 2012 election). At this point, The guy in the whitehouse just has to be a rubberstamp machine.
We have a tendency to look at who is in the whitehouse and judge the "era" by that man (or woman maybe someday). But the real power is in the house and senate.
Look at Bush. He was mediocre but things didn't really go to shit until the dems took over the house and senate in 2006.
I will gladly pull the lever for Perry (much better than McLame or Romney).
They did the same thing with Palin... made her out to seem like a complete idiot, when in later interviews after the election she complained that they twisted and edited her to come off looking like a fool... Hence why I think Katie Couric is a dirty c*nt! Now they're twisting Bachmann's words. I guess the lib media is frightened of female politicians that aren't with the democrack party.
n8tive97
08-30-2011, 12:58
They did the same thing with Palin... made her out to seem like a complete idiot, when in later interviews after the election she complained that they twisted and edited her to come off looking like a fool... Hence why I think Katie Couric is a dirty c*nt! Now they're twisting Bachmann's words. I guess the lib media is frightened of female politicians that aren't with the democrack party.
It's OK to have minority candidates, judges etc., ONLY if you are a democrack! If not, then all the BS they preach about being the minority party doesn't count. What hypocrites’!
+1 for Palin
Bailey Guns
08-30-2011, 13:06
Oh, you guys have done it now. All the Palin haters are going to come out of the woodwork and thrash you good. They don't have a f**kin clue why but they'll sure tell you Palin is an idiot.
I like Sarah. I wish she had a real shot at the title.
n8tive97
08-30-2011, 13:17
Oh, you guys have done it now. All the Palin haters are going to come out of the woodwork and thrash you good. They don't have a f**kin clue why but they'll sure tell you Palin is an idiot.
I like Sarah. I wish she had a real shot at the title.
+100
n8tive97
08-30-2011, 13:23
Bailey Guns, this will get their panties in a wad then......
Very interesting facts on two very different women.
Sarah Palin
Whether you're a Democrat, Independent or Republican the second half of this email should make all of us very sick, send this on especially the second half.
READ TO THE VERY END, VERY ENLIGHTENING AND VERY DISTURBING!
By Dewie Whetsell, Alaskan Fisherman.As posted in comments on Greta's article referencing the MOVEON ad about Sarah Palin.
The last 45 of my 66 years I've spent in a commercial fishing town in Alaska . I understand Alaska politics but never understood national politics well until this last year. Here's the breaking point: Neither side of the Palin controversy gets it. It's not about persona, style, rhetoric, it's about doing things. Even Palin supporters never mention the things I'm about to mention here.
1.Democrats forget when Palin was the Darling of the Democrats, because as soon as Palin took the Governor's office away from a fellow Republican and tough SOB, Frank Murkowski, she tore into the Republican's "Corrupt Bastards Club" (CBC), sent them packing. Many of them are now residing in State housing, wearing orange jump suits The Democrats reacted by skipping around the yard, throwing confetti and singing, "la la la la." Name another governor in this country that has ever done anything similar.
2.Now with the CBC gone, there were fewer Alaskan politicians to protect the huge, giant oil companies here. So she constructed and enacted a new system of splitting the oil profits called "ACES." Exxon (the biggest corporation in the world) protested; Sarah told them, "don't let the door hit you in the stern on your way out." They stayed and Alaska residents went from being merely wealthy to being filthy rich. Of course, the other huge international oil companies meekly fell in line. Again, give me the name of any other governor in the country that has done anything similar.
3.The other thing she did when she walked into the governor's office is she got the list of State requests for federal funding for projects, known as "pork." She went through the list, took 85% of them and placed them in the "when-hell-freezes-over" stack. She let locals know if we need something built, we'll pay for it ourselves. Maybe she figured she could use the money she got from selling the previous governor's jet because it was extravagant. Maybe she could use the money she saved by dismissing the governor's cook (remarking she could cook for her own family), giving back the State vehicle issued to her, maintaining she already had a car and dismissing her State-provided security force (never mentioning - she's packing heat herself). I'm still waiting to hear the names of those other governors.
4.Now, even with her much-ridiculed "gosh and golly" mannerism, she also managed to put together a totally new approach to getting a natural gas pipeline built which will be the biggest private construction project in the history of North America. No one else could do it although they tried. If that doesn't impress you, then you're trying too hard to be unimpressed while watching her do things like this while baking up a batch of brownies with her other hand.
5.For 30 years, Exxon held a lease to do exploratory drilling at a place called Point Thompson. They made excuses the entire time why they couldn't start drilling. In truth they were holding it like an investment. No governor for 30 years could make them get started. Then, she told them she was revoking their lease and kicking them out. They protested and threatened court action. She shrugged and reminded them she knew the way to the court house. Alaska won again.
6.President Obama wants the nation to be on 25% renewable resources for electricity by 2025. Sarah went to the legislature and submitted her plan for Alaska to be at 50% renewable by 2025. We are already at 25%. I can give you more specifics about things done, as opposed to style and persona. Everybody wants to be cool, sound cool, look cool. But that's just a cover-up. I'm still waiting to hear from liberals the names of other governors who can match what mine has done in two and a half years. I won't be holding my breath.
By the way, she was content to return to Alaska after the national election and go to work, but the haters wouldn't let her. Now these adolescent screechers are obviously not scuba divers. And no one ever told them what happens when you continually jab and pester a barracuda. Without warning, it will spin around and tear your face off. Shoulda known better..
You have just read the truth about Sarah Palin that sends the media, along with the Democrat party, into a wild uncontrolled frenzy to discredit her.I guess they are only interested in skirt chasers, dishonesty, immoral people, liars, womanizers, murderers, and bitter ex-presidents' wives.
So "You go, Girl.." I only wish the men in Washington had your guts, determination, honesty and morals. Only FOOLS listen to the biased media
The establishment politicians both DemocRAT and RepubliCON-MEN are scared she'll get elected, some of them could end up in jail to...
NOWIf you've read this far open your eyes..........
First Lady Michelle Obama's Servant List and Pay Scale
TheFirst Lady Requires More Than Twenty Attendants (22 Attendants to be exact)
1. $172,200- Sher, Susan (Chief Of Staff)
2. $140,000- Frye, Jocelyn C. (Deputy Assistant to the President and Director of Policy And Projects For The First Lady)
3. $113,000- Rogers, Desiree G. (Special Assistant to the President and White House Social Secretary)
4. $102,000- Johnston, Camille Y. (Special Assistant to the President and Director of Communications for the First Lady)
5. $100,000- Winter, Melissa E. (Special Assistant to the President and Deputy Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)
6. $90,000- Medina , David S. (Deputy Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)
7. $84,000- Lelyveld, Catherine M. (Director and Press Secretary to the First Lady)
8. $75,000- Starkey, Frances M. (Director of Scheduling and Advance for the First Lady)
9. $70,000- Sanders, Trooper (Deputy Director of Policy and Projects for the First Lady)
10. $65,000- Burnough, Erinn J. (Deputy Director and Deputy Social Secretary)
11. $64,000- Reinstein, Joseph B. (Deputy Director and Deputy Social Secretary)
12. $62,000- Goodman, Jennifer R. (Deputy Director of Scheduling and Events Coordinator For The First Lady)
13. $60,000- Fitts, Alan O... (Deputy Director of Advance and Trip Director for the First Lady)
14. $57,500- Lewis, Dana M.. (Special Assistant and Personal Aide to the First Lady)
15. $52,500- Mustaphi, Semonti M.. (Associate Director and Deputy Press Secretary to The First Lady)
16. $50,000- Jarvis, Kristen E. (Special-2Assistant for Scheduling and Traveling Aide to The First Lady)
17. $45,000- Lechtenberg, Tyler A. (Associate Director of Correspondence For The First Lady)
18. $43,000- Tubman, Samantha (Deputy Associate Director, Social Office)
19.. $40,000- Boswell, Joseph J. (Executive Assistant to the Chief Of Staff to the First Lady)
20.. $36,000- Armbruster, Sally M. (Staff Assistant to the Social Secretary)
21. $35,000- Bookey, Natalie (Staff Assistant)
22. $35,000- Jackson, Deilia A. (Deputy Associate Director of Correspondence for the First Lady)(This is community organizing at it's finest.)
Bless her heart, I guess it takes $1.5 million to try to make her look good it (but it didn't work).
There has NEVER been anyone in the White House at any time who has created such an army of staffers whose sole duties are the facilitation of the First Lady's social life. One wonders why she needs so much help, at taxpayer expense, when even Hillary, only had three; Jackie Kennedy one; Laura Bush one and prior to Mamie Eisenhower social help came from the President's own pocket.
Note: This does not include makeup artist Ingrid Grimes-Miles, 49 & "First Hairstylist" Johnny Wright, 31, both of whom traveled aboard Air Force One to Europe..
FRIENDS, THESE SALARIES ADD UP TO SIX MILLION, THREE HUNDRED SIXTY FOUR THOUSAND DOLLARS ($6,364,000) FOR THE 4 YEARS OF OFFICE? AND WE ARE IN A RECESSION? WELL, MOST OF US ARE. I GUESS IT'S OK TO SPEND WILDLY WHEN IT'S NOT YOUR OWN MONEY….
Copyright 2009 CanadaFreePress.Com http://canadafreepress..com/
Yes, Yes, The Canadian Free Press has to publish this because the USA media is too scared they might be considered racist.
Holy shit N8tive! I knew a lot about Palin and the good she did for AK and the good she'd do if in an even higher office, but that really digs in and tells you what she's really about. And then Michelle O, what a joke. I think after they exile her husband for treason and defiling the constitution, they should strap her to a Saturn V rocket and "to the moon, Alice!" Like you always say with one addition "Worst President ever... with an even worse First Lady."
n8tive97
08-30-2011, 13:55
Holy shit N8tive! I knew a lot about Palin and the good she did for AK and the good she'd do if in an even higher office, but that really digs in and tells you what she's really about. And then Michelle O, what a joke. I think after they exile her husband for treason and defiling the constitution, they should strap her to a Saturn V rocket and "to the moon, Alice!" Like you always say with one addition "Worst President ever... with an even worse First Lady."
It's eye opening isn't it. It drives me nuts when people start bashing her based on what they see in the media (Katie Couric). They have no idea how good she would be for this country! Instead, they let blind hatred and ignorance make the decisions for Americans. After all we elected the "worst president ever....with even a worse first lady"!!!
Since we hit rock bottom, there is nowhere to go but up.
I want the stupid O out of office, so I will support whoever the independent moderates will support. Unless they are on board with the GOP candidate, then we have four more years of O S!!!!
It matters very little if a candidate wins the primary but losses the general election.
n8tive97
08-30-2011, 14:03
Since we hit rock bottom, there is nowhere to go but up.
I want the stupid O out of office, so I will support whoever the independent moderates will support. Unless they are on board with the GOP candidate, then we have four more years of O S!!!!
It matters very little if a candidate wins the primary but losses the general election.
It's too late for her this election. I hope whoever gets into office utilizes her experience and talents.
The media and left will just move on to the next one, probably Perry, way to religious and conservative.
I'm afraid the republican and the tea party are going to split the conservitive vote, and we'll have Obeyme for another four years.
Drilldov2.0
08-30-2011, 14:58
I'm afraid the republican and the tea party are going to split the conservitive vote, and we'll have Obeyme for another four years.
Not with his party abandoning him. They have no one.
By this time in 2013, he'll be giving useless speeches to heartbroken dims. Which is the only thing he is good at doing. I'll bet he will have a new book out to tout as well. (which was written on his watch when he should have been leading the country. Will it be called "Bush's fault?)
UberTong
08-30-2011, 14:59
Uh, she's saying the earthquake and Irene are messages from god to Washington about spending.
I don't like Perry's ties to Merck and his executive order requiring all teen girls in Texas be required to get the HPV vaccine...a vaccine that at the time only Merck sold.
He's not terrible otherwise. He's too religious for me. His spending record in Texas doesn't give me any hope he'd do anything to help while President.
.
A) It shouldn't be nuts for an elected official to mention GOD. This country was founded on Christian principles, whether you believe in a deity or not. The values that accompany this is what made America once great. You guys (atheists, religion haters, whatever) are way too fucking sensitive on this one.
B) Reference Marlin's signature...SARCASM. Maybe she believes in Zeus too right?
Zundfolge
08-30-2011, 15:02
I want the stupid O out of office, so I will support whoever the independent moderates will support.
I'm afraid we're going to get another mealy mouthed, middle of the road, moderate, "Democrat lite" Republican candidate (like McLame ... who only started to do well when the conservative firebrand Palin came aboard) and people will choose "the real thing" over the fake any day and we'll end up with O again.
Authentic, genuine conservatism wins every time.
"Independents" don't care about ideology (if they did they wouldn't be independents), they care about sincerity (or at least the appearance of it).
Independents flocked to Obama last time for two and only two reasons:
1) They wanted to be part of history (electing first black pres)
2) They believed he was sincere and "authentic".
Mobat555
08-30-2011, 15:17
A) It shouldn't be nuts for an elected official to mention GOD. This country was founded on Christian principles, whether you believe in a deity or not. The values that accompany this is what made America once great. You guys (atheists, religion haters, whatever) are way too fucking sensitive on this one.
Tong, just to play devils advocate here. You would be cool with references to Allah then?
Bailey Guns
08-30-2011, 15:17
Independents flocked to Obama last time for three and only three reasons:
1) They wanted to be part of history (electing first black pres)
2) They believed he was sincere and "authentic".
3) They don't really stand for anything.
Sorry, Z...had to fix that for you.
Zundfolge
08-30-2011, 15:28
3) They don't really stand for anything.
While that's certainly a contributing factor (and frankly a big reason why people ARE independents) its still not a reason ... its not part of their decision making process.
Its because they don't really stand for anything they'll go for the candidate they believe is "real", "authentic" and "sincere" ... regardless of said candidate's actual beliefs.
That's why I argue that we need a real, authentic and sincere conservative, not some hand picked drone that will "appeal to the moderates" (like Romney or Huntsman or Christie for that matter).
I'm mostly arguing against the foolish notion that a lot of conservatives have that a real conservative can't get elected so we have to water our shit down to appeal to the masses.
That's just bullshit.
Not with his party abandoning him. They have no one.
By this time in 2013, he'll be giving useless speeches to heartbroken dims. Which is the only thing he is good at doing. I'll bet he will have a new book out to tout as well. (which was written on his watch when he should have been leading the country. Will it be called "Bush's fault?)
Drilldov, I certainly hope your right about the election.
The book should be called" Waaaaa! the LIBS unloved me".
UberTong
08-30-2011, 15:49
Tong, just to play devils advocate here. You would be cool with references to Allah then?
Sure wouldn't. Islam is a pretty drastic example to play devils advocate with. But let me give a better example. An atheist candidate, who didn't believe in God, but believed in the principles, ideals, and values this country was founded on. I wouldn't say whoaaaa this guy is way too Godless for me.
We need some values and some SPINE back in the white house. It's totally different to recommend a religion/social structure that has zero to do with the founding of this country as my post stated. I just don't want to see a guy discredited because he's too religious, when his values and ideals might be what is needed, somebody that stands by his values and ideals.
Just look at the other thread with great quotes from our forefathers that was started today.
I didn't mean to get on whoever posted that one, wasn't my intention.
stevelkinevil
08-30-2011, 15:56
Only ticket I want goes Paul/whocares. The rest of these people are just more of the same, flip floppers with no integrity who want to limit your liberty just as much as the dems, just in a different way.
mcantar18c
08-30-2011, 18:15
A) It shouldn't be nuts for an elected official to mention GOD. This country was founded on Christian principles, whether you believe in a deity or not. The values that accompany this is what made America once great. You guys (atheists, religion haters, whatever) are way too fucking sensitive on this one.
B) Reference Marlin's signature...SARCASM. Maybe she believes in Zeus too right?
Holy shit... someone actually said it!
[Beer]
Tong, just to play devils advocate here. You would be cool with references to Allah then?
That would be like electing a Communist in the middle of the Cold War.
Whether you accept it or not, the west and the major religions are at war with Islam. Yes, the religion itself, not merely the political aspect of it.
Sure wouldn't. Islam is a pretty drastic example to play devils advocate with. But let me give a better example. An atheist candidate, who didn't believe in God, but believed in the principles, ideals, and values this country was founded on. I wouldn't say whoaaaa this guy is way too Godless for me.
We need some values and some SPINE back in the white house. It's totally different to recommend a religion/social structure that has zero to do with the founding of this country as my post stated. I just don't want to see a guy discredited because he's too religious, when his values and ideals might be what is needed, somebody that stands by his values and ideals.
Just look at the other thread with great quotes from our forefathers that was started today.
I didn't mean to get on whoever posted that one, wasn't my intention.
Run for pres. You'd have my vote.
Scanker19
08-30-2011, 18:37
While I have none, I do not care if he is religious or not. When you start to push it on people is when it gets dangerous. We were based on Christian values but at the same time you should not make decisions based on your private religion that will effect millions.
I want to like perry, I want to.......
Mobat555
08-30-2011, 20:01
Sure wouldn't. Islam is a pretty drastic example to play devils advocate with. But let me give a better example. An atheist candidate, who didn't believe in God, but believed in the principles, ideals, and values this country was founded on. I wouldn't say whoaaaa this guy is way too Godless for me.
We need some values and some SPINE back in the white house. It's totally different to recommend a religion/social structure that has zero to do with the founding of this country as my post stated. I just don't want to see a guy discredited because he's too religious, when his values and ideals might be what is needed, somebody that stands by his values and ideals.
Out of 44 presidents we had how many are there that did not practice some sort of Christianity (unless you don't count Catholicism)? None, so I guess my response would be that religious affiliation does not always have a bearing on their character.
While my statement is farfetched about Allah, makes you ponder the idea of church and state separation. If another religion gained the majority it would more then likely attempt to force that religions ideals on the population. Look at Europe where the mass exodus of immigrants is threatening their way of life and attempting to instill sharia law.
That would be like electing a Communist in the middle of the Cold War. Whether you accept it or not, the west and the major religions are at war with Islam. Yes, the religion itself, not merely the political aspect of it.
January 3 2007 and March 11 2008 Muslims were elected to congress. If we truly were at war with the religion then why is it freely practiced here?
DeusExMachina
08-30-2011, 23:42
That would be like electing a Communist in the middle of the Cold War.
Whether you accept it or not, the west and the major religions are at war with Islam. Yes, the religion itself, not merely the political aspect of it.
I haven't seen that kind of bigoted rhetoric around here in a long time.
mcantar18c
08-31-2011, 00:05
Out of 44 presidents we had how many are there that did not practice some sort of Christianity (unless you don't count Catholicism)? None, so I guess my response would be that religious affiliation does not always have a bearing on their character.
The religions practiced by our presidents don't have their followers kill/convert the "infidels."
While my statement is farfetched about Allah, makes you ponder the idea of church and state separation. If another religion gained the majority it would more then likely attempt to force that religions ideals on the population. Look at Europe where the mass exodus of [Muslim] immigrants is threatening their way of life and attempting to instill sharia law.
Looks like you've answered your own question here.
January 3 2007 and March 11 2008 Muslims were elected to congress. If we truly were at war with the religion then why is it freely practiced here?Because we have Freedom of Religion, and that's a double-edged sword.... one that we're now falling on. Allowing Muslims to serve as elected officials is absolutely ridiculous. We wouldn't think of electing a Communist into public service during the Cold War.
I haven't seen that kind of bigoted rhetoric around here in a long time.
They commit violent acts, for the purpose of following the Quran and Allah, against innocents because they are non-Muslims. When you take off the PC goggles, reality becomes painfully obvious.
DeusExMachina
08-31-2011, 00:15
They commit violent acts, for the purpose of following the Quran and Allah, against innocents because they are non-Muslims. When you take off the PC goggles, reality becomes painfully obvious.
They commit violent acts, for the purpose of following the Bible and God, against innocents because they are non-Christian. When you take off the PC goggles, reality becomes painfully obvious.
You're right, it does become painfully obvious. The vast majority of peoples, of any race or creed, do not commit such acts. When we generalize this minority as the majority in an attempt to justify further action, the world becomes increasingly a dangerous place.
mcantar18c
08-31-2011, 00:25
You're right, it does become painfully obvious. The vast majority of peoples, of any race or creed, do not commit such acts. When we generalize this minority as the majority in an attempt to justify further action, the world becomes increasingly a dangerous place.
You're right, the vast majority do not commit such acts. The problem is that, as I've stated, those that do are the conservative ones that are just doing what the Quran says they should to to be good Muslims. The ones that don't, they're the crazies, the radicals, the extremists in the eyes of Allah. And if they're not following the word of their religious text... they're not really interested in the religion so much as they are in the idea of following a religion. They're the kind that would take the "convert" option over "kill" if they were forced to choose. I don't consider them Muslims... just idiots looking for something to believe in, regardless of what that is.
So yes, we are fighting Islam and its followers.
Backed Al Gore and was his campaign manager http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/61428.html
Texas Gov. Rick Perry signed an executive order Feb. 2, requiring all girls entering 6th grade in Texas be vaccinated http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=54095
Attended Bilderberg meetings
90jfQrb4wAE
All you guys thinking Perry is the greatest thing since sliced bread need to wake up and stop listening to Hannity and O'reilly.
Did you guys notice how he's trying to morph into Ron Paul by saying the Fed reserve is "treasonous"????
This guy is diabolical. God save the country if he's elected.
Sharpienads
08-31-2011, 02:56
Only ticket I want goes Paul/whocares. The rest of these people are just more of the same, flip floppers with no integrity who want to limit your liberty just as much as the dems, just in a different way.
If by "Paul" you mean Rand Paul, then I'm with you!!!
Sharpienads
08-31-2011, 03:10
Backed Al Gore and was his campaign manager http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0811/61428.html
Texas Gov. Rick Perry signed an executive order Feb. 2, requiring all girls entering 6th grade in Texas be vaccinated http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=54095
Attended Bilderberg meetings
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All you guys thinking Perry is the greatest thing since sliced bread need to wake up and stop listening to Hannity and O'reilly.
Did you guys notice how he's trying to morph into Ron Paul by saying the Fed reserve is "treasonous"????
This guy is diabolical. God save the country if he's elected.
I don't recall anybody saying he's the perfect candidate. Backed Al Gore in '88? Who hasn't made mistakes in the past? Reagan was a democrat before he became a conservative, and he turned out ok and did some good stuff as president.
If you're looking for a perfect candidate, I highly doubt you'll find him/her. Don't get me wrong, I hate having to settle for a less than desireable candidate.
Anyone who has to appeal to religion to get votes was weak to begin with. This country was built by men who wore wigs and rode horses. It was just a part of the culture.
I can't think of a single country whose laws have not been directly derived from religious law. That is just the way that societies have developed throughout history. Religion isn't bad, but I've yet to see a single politician who is sincere with their religion. I haven't seen them all of course. Religion in public office is a very touchy thing in this country. Everyone tries to shoot for the middle of the road on the religion issue, and they all do it poorly.
It is my opinion that dragging religion into topics that don't have anything to do with religion, is just a way to cater to a specific voting block. In my experience with life, the people who are most sincere about their religion, are those that talk about it the least.
I don't recall anybody saying he's the perfect candidate. Backed Al Gore in '88? Who hasn't made mistakes in the past? Reagan was a democrat before he became a conservative, and he turned out ok and did some good stuff as president.
If you're looking for a perfect candidate, I highly doubt you'll find him/her. Don't get me wrong, I hate having to settle for a less than desireable candidate.
We have been "settling" for the "less than desireable" for too long now. I'm voting for Ron Paul and refuse to vote for the media's darling child. The very fact that the media ignores Ron Paul or tries to smear him when they don't ignore him is the EXACT reason why we should vote for him.
Perry entered the race and the media already declared him the front runner but the guy is nothing more than a fucking neo-con.
Did you know Vicente Fox thanked Perry for giving instate tuition to illegals in Texas?
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Do you all still like Perry???
Rick Perry also supported the TARP Bailout
JqzG3AZBhww
This guy is an ideological light weight. We need someone who stands up for their principles every time.
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 07:13
If I had to vote for Ron Paul as the republican candidate, in my opinion I'd be in a position where I was forced to "settle for a less-than-desirable candidate".
He's totally insane on national security issues related to foreign policy. I find that highly undesirable.
That street runs both ways, ya know.
If I had to vote for Ron Paul as the republican candidate, in my opinion I'd be in a position where I was forced to "settle for a less-than-desirable candidate".
He's totally insane on national security issues related to foreign policy. I find that highly undesirable.
That street runs both ways, ya know.
Your right. Keeping the same foreign policy of the last 60 years is totally sane. [ROFL3]
Edited to add: See my sigline
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
Mobat555
08-31-2011, 07:54
Look at Europe where the mass exodus of [Muslim] immigrants is threatening their way of life and attempting to instill sharia law.
Looks like you've answered your own question here.
Which question would that be?
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 08:03
Your right. Keeping the same foreign policy of the last 60 years is totally sane. [ROFL3]
Edited to add: See my sigline
VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV
You can be a RP fanboi all you like. It doesn't change at least two facts:
He will not be the republican nominee
His tremendously dangerous foreign policy ideas and his lack of insight into national security as it relates to foreign policy will be the primary reasonsOh, yeah...voters don't give a rat's ass about signature lines on internet forums. Neither do I.
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 08:21
It's really funny how the majority of RP fanboys have to accuse those who don't share their views of Ron Paul of following the talking heads on Fox News or O'Reilly. If that's all you got, bryjcom, you're wasting your breath (or bandwidth in this case) trying to convince me to vote for Paul
They view it as undeniable fact that RP is the ONLY desirable candidate and their narrow minds can't comprehend that many people, I'd venture to say MOST people since that's been proven the case in the past, don't find him as desirable a candidate as they do.
Be an RP follower all you like. But don't try to convince me he's the only desirable candidate. I find him highly undesirable overall. An overwhelming majority of voters have obviously felt that way in the past. Will that change this time around? I doubt it but we'll have to wait and see. I suspect when it's all said and done that RP will not be chosen by the voters to be the Republican nominee and RP fans will still cling to their assertion that they're right and everyone else is wrong.
I do agree with some things he says but I disagree with others. And I'm really tired of hearing how everyone snubs RP. For cryin' out loud...he polled in single digits in the last two presidential elections. In terms of presidential candidates he's been a lightweight the last two times he's ran. That's because people don't like him. Hell...even Ross Perot polled at close to 40% when he ran, then withdrew, then ran again and he got almost 20% of the vote in the election. Paul hasn't come close to any of those numbers and there's a good reason for that. It's not because the media ignores him, it's because most people don't agree with him.
Get over it already.
Mobat555
08-31-2011, 08:22
You can be a RP fanboi all you like.
Wait... Ron Paul or Rick Perry fanboy? lol
UberTong
08-31-2011, 08:27
Out of 44 presidents we had how many are there that did not practice some sort of Christianity (unless you don't count Catholicism)? None, so I guess my response would be that religious affiliation does not always have a bearing on their character.
While my statement is farfetched about Allah, makes you ponder the idea of church and state separation. If another religion gained the majority it would more then likely attempt to force that religions ideals on the population. Look at Europe where the mass exodus of immigrants is threatening their way of life and attempting to instill sharia law.
Religious affiliation has zero to do with character unfortunately. But...my point was that someone should not be cast out and thrown aside on their personal beliefs, thats all. Hell I still think Barry is a closet Muzzie.
January 3 2007 and March 11 2008 Muslims were elected to congress. If we truly were at war with the religion then why is it freely practiced here?
Holy shit... someone actually said it!
[Beer]
That would be like electing a Communist in the middle of the Cold War.
Whether you accept it or not, the west and the major religions are at war with Islam. Yes, the religion itself, not merely the political aspect of it.
Run for pres. You'd have my vote.
Thanks mccantar
I haven't seen that kind of bigoted rhetoric around here in a long time.
Not all muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists are muslim.
Zundfolge
08-31-2011, 08:34
I like Ron Paul (as a legislator, where he actually has a snowball's chance of implementing his ideas as policy ... as president he'd be a lame duck for 4 years and then he'd just go away). But the quote in bryjcom's sig is just wrong.
Entitlements, welfare, the nanny state ... these are ALL greater incentives to expand the government than our "interventionist foreign policy" (not that it helps).
Anyway, I encourage all the Ron Paul supporters to vote their consciences and pull the lever for him in their respective primaries or caucuses ... but after he loses, STFU and get behind whatever Republican wins so we can get rid of Obama.
Mobat555
08-31-2011, 08:38
Not all muslims are terrorists, but all terrorists are muslim.
I would beg to differ...
U.S. State Department list of Foreign Terrorist Organizations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._State_Department_list_of_Foreign_Terrorist_Or ganizations)
Aum Shinrikyo (Japan)
Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE) (Sri Lanka)
Communist Party of the Philippines/New People's Army (CPP/NPA) (Philippines)
Continuity Irish Republican Army (CIRA) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Real Irish Republican Army (RIRA) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Ulster Defence Association (UDA) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Revolutionary Organization 17 November (Greece)
Revolutionary Struggle (Greece)
Revolutionary People's Liberation Party/Front (DHKP/C) (Turkey)
Euskadi Ta Askatasuna (Basque Fatherland and Liberty) (ETA) (Spain, France)
National Liberation Army (ELN) (Colombia)
Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) (Colombia)
United Self-Defense Forces of Colombia (AUC) (Colombia)
Shining Path (Sendero Luminoso, SL) (Peru)
Oh, you guys have done it now. All the Palin haters are going to come out of the woodwork and thrash you good. They don't have a f**kin clue why but they'll sure tell you Palin is an idiot.
I like Sarah. I wish she had a real shot at the title.
Yep, she is badass. I would love to see her the first female president.
As for Rick Perry, I really want to see some hard stances taken by him on gun rights. I get the updates from RMGO and NAGR and he never returned the pledge to protect the 2nd.
I haven't really done much research on him but I want to see some hard stances on getting this shit we are in turned around.
Zundfolge
08-31-2011, 08:48
We need someone who stands up for their principles every time.
No, actually we would LIKE someone who stands up for their principals every time but we NEED to get rid of Obama and put someone in the whitehouse that will not veto every good thing that Republicans in the house and senate pass in the 2013 session (like the repeal of Obamacare among other things).
The real power is in the legislature, again I'll say this until I'm blue in the face, Ron Paul needs to stay in the legislature where he can actually have an impact on policy ... not become president where he can beat his head against a brick wall for 4 years, get nothing done and make sure no future libertarian leaning president can be elected in our lifetimes. Same goes for Bachman, Rubio, West, McCotter and a litany of other decent GOP congressmen and senators with pres or vp buzz.
UberTong
08-31-2011, 08:49
I would beg to differ...
U.S. State Department list of Foreign Terrorist Organizations (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._State_Department_list_of_Foreign_Terrorist_Or ganizations)
Aum Shinrikyo (Japan)
Liberation Tigers of Tamil Eelam (LTTE) (Sri Lanka)
Communist Party of the Philippines/New People's Army (CPP/NPA) (Philippines)
Continuity Irish Republican Army (CIRA) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Real Irish Republican Army (RIRA) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Ulster Volunteer Force (UVF) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Ulster Defence Association (UDA) (United Kingdom, Republic of Ireland)
Revolutionary Organization 17 November (Greece)
Revolutionary Struggle (Greece)
Revolutionary People's Liberation Party/Front (DHKP/C) (Turkey)
Euskadi Ta Askatasuna (Basque Fatherland and Liberty) (ETA) (Spain, France)
National Liberation Army (ELN) (Colombia)
Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia (FARC) (Colombia)
United Self-Defense Forces of Colombia (AUC) (Colombia)
Shining Path (Sendero Luminoso, SL) (Peru)
Yeah and those groups are real active. Guess what group is real active?
Mobat555
08-31-2011, 08:50
Yeah and those groups are real active. Guess what group is real active?
That question would be better posed to Norway.
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 08:51
As for Rick Perry, I really want to see some hard stances taken by him on gun rights. I get the updates from RMGO and NAGR and he never returned the pledge to protect the 2nd.
I haven't really done much research on him but I want to see some hard stances on getting this shit we are in turned around.
That's why I like Michele Bachmann. HERE'S (http://www.ontheissues.org/house/Michele_Bachmann_Gun_Control.htm) her stance on 2A issues.
UberTong
08-31-2011, 08:51
That question would be better posed to Norway.
Really????
Better throw a little explanation behind that one.
Zundfolge
08-31-2011, 08:53
That question would be better posed to Norway.
One nutter doth not a "group" make.
But yes, there are non Muslim terrorists out there ... thing is the VAST majority of terrorists currently active ARE Muslim. So for now UberTong's statement is mildly hyperbolic but not 100% inaccurate.
But give it time ... I expect in the next couple years we'll see a rise in leftist/democrat/union violence (hell, just look at the leftard nuttary going on in Wisconsin).
By 2013 I bet we'll be calling SEIU a terrorist organization.
UberTong
08-31-2011, 08:54
One nutter doth not a "group" make.
But yes, there are non Muslim terrorists out there ... thing is the VAST majority of terrorists currently active ARE Muslim. So for now UberTong's statement is mildly hyperbolic but not 100% inaccurate.
But give it time ... I expect in the next couple years we'll see a rise in leftist/democrat/union violence.
Seriously, when do we get to start calling SEIU a terrorist organization?
Thanks again Zund. +1
That's why I like Michele Bachmann. HERE'S (http://www.ontheissues.org/house/Michele_Bachmann_Gun_Control.htm) her stance on 2A issues.
Yeah I really like her. I have seen a few of her interviews and read some on her. Definitely a strong candidate.
Actually Zund, what's extremely funny is the report I read in 2010, just after our deployment ended and I was just looking over some stuff on SIPR (that's the secret internet .mil uses) and there was an unclassified report on current terrorism figures... guess who was in the lead on # murdered? Well I'll back track- the list showed groups related to Christian Extremism (it was at the bottom), Extreme Judaism, Soviet/Neo-Communist, Extremist Right Wing: Europe, Extremist Right Wing: American, Left Wing, African (non governmental/warlord related), and then waay at the top with more deaths caused than any other by leaps and bounds: Islamic Fundamental/Extremist Groups. The link to each group included the most prominent examples (of course they cited Tim McVey for the American extremists) like Al Qaeda, AQI (Iraq), Hezbi Al Islami, Hamas, Hezbollah, PLO, and the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood- the group behind the Sadat assassination where Dr. Ayman Al Zawahiri first came onto the scene. And who can be attributed to the most deaths in the west you ask? OBL's happy little group. So there you have it, not all terrorists are Muslim, but the worst of the worst sure do keep a copy of the Koran on their nightstand.
http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/299925_589583967610_76900796_32203573_5571469_n.jp g
My friend just posted this on facebook with a big LOL... must be a very libtard infested church! Not cool.
Zundfolge
08-31-2011, 10:23
...must be a very libtard infested church! Not cool.
Episcopal = libtard
Kinda like United Methodists ... only without the cool music.
It's really funny how the majority of RP fanboys have to accuse those who don't share their views of Ron Paul of following the talking heads on Fox News or O'Reilly. If that's all you got, bryjcom, you're wasting your breath (or bandwidth in this case) trying to convince me to vote for Paul
They view it as undeniable fact that RP is the ONLY desirable candidate and their narrow minds can't comprehend that many people, I'd venture to say MOST people since that's been proven the case in the past, don't find him as desirable a candidate as they do.
Be an RP follower all you like. But don't try to convince me he's the only desirable candidate. I find him highly undesirable overall. An overwhelming majority of voters have obviously felt that way in the past. Will that change this time around? I doubt it but we'll have to wait and see. I suspect when it's all said and done that RP will not be chosen by the voters to be the Republican nominee and RP fans will still cling to their assertion that they're right and everyone else is wrong.
I do agree with some things he says but I disagree with others. And I'm really tired of hearing how everyone snubs RP. For cryin' out loud...he polled in single digits in the last two presidential elections. In terms of presidential candidates he's been a lightweight the last two times he's ran. That's because people don't like him. Hell...even Ross Perot polled at close to 40% when he ran, then withdrew, then ran again and he got almost 20% of the vote in the election. Paul hasn't come close to any of those numbers and there's a good reason for that. It's not because the media ignores him, it's because most people don't agree with him.
Get over it already.
Actually his polls aren't that low this time around. He actually polls very good against Obama and better then Bachmann.
Why do I think you guys get your talking points from the pundits?? Because your general theme about Ron Paul is he can't win. And thats exactly what the pundits say.
Keep loving Bachmann. You do know she voted for the patriot act, don't you?
http://www.gallup.com/poll/125843/election-2012.aspx
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 14:06
Actually his polls aren't that low this time around. He actually polls very good against Obama and better then Bachmann.
Why do I think you guys get your talking points from the pundits?? Because your general theme about Ron Paul is he can't win. And thats exactly what the pundits say.
Keep loving Bachmann. You do know she voted for the patriot act, don't you?
http://www.gallup.com/poll/125843/election-2012.aspx
I got news for ya. I don't need to listen to pundits to form my opinions of Ron Paul. All I have to do is listen to Ron Paul.
So, let me ask you this. Where do you get information from (on any subject, not necessarily this one) and how do you form opinions.
This whole "stop watching FoxNews" is about the most lame argument I can possibly think of. If I watch a news report, regardless of the channel, I'm smart enough to form my own opinions in terms of the slant or bias that is presented by the reporter. I think lots of people are.
Unless you get information from some sort of non-biased, Divine source, gimme a fuckin' break. It's biased, too.
If I watched Fox News and ABC News and CNN and all the pundits and talking heads said, "On a clear, sunny day in Colorado the sky is blue," it wouldn't take a genius to go outside on a clear, sunny day, look into the sky, and independently confirm that, in fact, on a clear, sunny day in Colorado the sky is blue.
Maybe people are capable of listening to Ron Paul and figuring out on their own he's a nutjob on national security/foreign policy without watching the news/pundits. Themes are oftentimes common for a reason. In Paul's case, I think it's self-evident. He's been trounced both times he's previously ran for president. In his case, the reason I say he can't get elected to the presidency is because he's proven twice now he can't get elected to the presidency. Not because the media says so.
I could say the same thing about Ron Paul fans. "Stop listening to all the Ron Paul fanboys out there and form your own opinions."
Geez...come up with something original for chrissakes.
Do you live on your computer!!
We will never agree on this subject. Doesn't mean I hate you though. [Beer]
Zundfolge
08-31-2011, 14:21
One of the things that annoys me most about the Ron Paul fanboys is that they can't figure out who their real enemies are.
The Democrats are your enemy bub, not Republicans that don't happen to slavishly support Ron Paul. Until you get that straight I can't take you seriously.
Now this is the primary season, so I expect dogmatic support for whatever candidate you support, but the problem with the RP guys is that if Ron Paul isn't the GOP candidate, they get all pissy and "take their ball and go home" (voting for the LP candidate or not voting at all).
Remember the words of Ronaldus Maximus; "If I agree with you 80% of the time and disagree 20% you are still my friend."
And frankly a LOT of Republicans should remember his 11th commandment; "Thou Shall Not Speak Ill Of A Fellow Republican."
Keep loving Bachmann. You do know she voted for the patriot act, don't you?
Most will tell you how evil the patriot act is and how un-American it is... but the original intent (the first through third draft) was actually pretty good. So Bachmann voted for it? Okay... There was a lot Bush did in his first term I didn't exactly agree with (like the final draft of the patriot act as we know it today), but that sure as hell didn't sway me to vote for the r-tard Kerry. One black mark doesn't make me want to jump into someone else's boat. I never thought I'd see a day we had a female president, but then again I never thought I'd see a black one either... who better to be the first than Michelle Bachmann?
Most will tell you how evil the patriot act is and how un-American it is... but the original intent (the first through third draft) was actually pretty good. So Bachmann voted for it? Okay... There was a lot Bush did in his first term I didn't exactly agree with (like the final draft of the patriot act as we know it today), but that sure as hell didn't sway me to vote for the r-tard Kerry. One black mark doesn't make me want to jump into someone else's boat. I never thought I'd see a day we had a female president, but then again I never thought I'd see a black one either... who better to be the first than Michelle Bachmann?
we could all vote for my wife and then I will run the show behind the scenes[Coffee]
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 14:35
Do you live on your computer!!
We will never agree on this subject. Doesn't mean I hate you though. [Beer]
Lately I do live on the computer. I've been on restricted duty for 2 weeks which means I can't work. Two weeks to go. I've done what I need to do at home. I'm cranky.
Cheers.
You wouldn't happen to be a member at Buffalo Creek Gun Club up their in Bailey?
Went there last fall for a combat shoot and by far is my favorite place to shoot!!!
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 15:21
No...not a member there. I've thought about joining for years now but never got around to it.
No, actually we would LIKE someone who stands up for their principals every time but we NEED to get rid of Obama and put someone in the whitehouse that will not veto every good thing that Republicans in the house and senate pass in the 2013 session (like the repeal of Obamacare among other things).
The real power is in the legislature, again I'll say this until I'm blue in the face, Ron Paul needs to stay in the legislature where he can actually have an impact on policy ... not become president where he can beat his head against a brick wall for 4 years, get nothing done and make sure no future libertarian leaning president can be elected in our lifetimes. Same goes for Bachman, Rubio, West, McCotter and a litany of other decent GOP congressmen and senators with pres or vp buzz.
I've seen you say this 5 or 6 times now, and just wanted to let you know that I am convinced, and agree with your idea. At least one person heard you.
Sharpienads
09-01-2011, 02:10
No, actually we would LIKE someone who stands up for their principals every time but we NEED to get rid of Obama and put someone in the whitehouse that will not veto every good thing that Republicans in the house and senate pass in the 2013 session (like the repeal of Obamacare among other things).
The real power is in the legislature, again I'll say this until I'm blue in the face, Ron Paul needs to stay in the legislature where he can actually have an impact on policy ... not become president where he can beat his head against a brick wall for 4 years, get nothing done and make sure no future libertarian leaning president can be elected in our lifetimes. Same goes for Bachman, Rubio, West, McCotter and a litany of other decent GOP congressmen and senators with pres or vp buzz.
While I know where you're going with this, I respectfully disagree. The real power is in the individual. The federal government was never meant to weild the power it currently has. If we want to change things, we need to start with ourselves, our neighborhoods, our counties, our states. We need our states to tell the federal government to pound sand. Until that happens, we'll keep having more of the same. I think I said this already earlier in this thread, but don't hold your breath waiting for top-down change (unless it's hope and change). We need to change things from the bottom up.
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
Until we start electing state officials that will force the federal government to abide by this, nothing will change.
While I know where you're going with this, I respectfully disagree. The real power is in the individual. The federal government was never meant to weild the power it currently has. If we want to change things, we need to start with ourselves, our neighborhoods, our counties, our states. We need our states to tell the federal government to pound sand. Until that happens, we'll keep having more of the same. I think I said this already earlier in this thread, but don't hold your breath waiting for top-down change (unless it's hope and change). We need to change things from the bottom up.
"The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
Until we start electing state officials that will force the federal government to abide by this, nothing will change.
This!!! Nuff said!
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