View Full Version : Illegal Workers Have Rights...Just Like You!
Bailey Guns
08-31-2011, 22:26
Labor secretary Hilda Solis says so.
"No matter how you got here or how long you plan to stay, you have certain rights."
That's right, sports fans. Workers illegally in the US will be afforded the same rights as US citizens. Just another slap in the face from the Obama administration to citizens and those working in the country legally.
Labor Secretary Hilda Solis has overseen a number of signed agreements between U.S. agencies and foreign officials pledging to give migrant workers the full protections of U.S. workplace laws -- regardless of their legal status -- and she says her department will uphold them.
If you have the stomach for it you can read the article from FoxNews HERE (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/08/31/labor-department-agreements-protect-illegal-workers/).
11/2012 cannot get here fast enough.
Scanker19
08-31-2011, 22:27
Well...........I ..........need.......to.............fuck it.
Robby30-06
08-31-2011, 22:40
11/2012 cannot get here fast enough.
Have you ever considered the possibility of him getting a 2nd term? Sounds impossible but i didn't think there were enough idiots to elect him the 1st time.
Scanker19
08-31-2011, 22:45
Have you ever considered the possibility of him getting a 2nd term? Sounds impossible but i didn't think there were enough idiots to elect him the 1st time.
21/12/12 is about a month and a half later. Coincidence?
If we don't hold people who are currently in our country by our own standards, whose standards do we hold them to? The Founders of our country spoke of inalienable, and God given rights. Surely you can't think that they only felt that way towards citizens of their newly built country. Especially since there was no such thing as an illegal back then.
It'd be unconstitutional to not provide the same rights to all people who are here, unless they are in prison.
When I was doing insurance claims, I used to be asked all the time about illegals. "If I hit an illegal, and it's my fault, you don't have to pay out because they are illegal right?"
"Uhhh, no, stupid ass. Of course I still have to pay them. YOU ARE AT FAULT. Legal status doesn't change anything."
I know that is not exactly the same thing, but it came to mind as I was making this post.
And don't any of you whiney bitches go and assume that I'm some illegal cuddler either, because I'm not at all. I don't like it, but that is the way that it is, and the way that it will always be if you want to be able to be proud of this country.
I agree. Makes me so, so sad.
mjbealer
09-01-2011, 00:24
If we would enforce the laws that we already have, then this whole deal would not even be discussed.
Sharpienads
09-01-2011, 02:01
Nobody is arguing that if you are here illegaly that you are fair game to be abused, molested, taken advantage of, whatever. Illegal or not you're still a human being and should be treated as such.
The real problem is that they have jobs in the first place. I personally think maybe the focus should be put on employers. If you are caught knowingly employing illegal immigrents, you get fined x amount of dollars for each illegal. Second time you're caught, say bye bye to your business.
Take away the incentive for illegals to be here, encourage legal immigration, and problem solved.
Bailey Guns
09-01-2011, 08:19
I'm not against this so illegal workers can be exploited. I'm against this because it provides even more incentive for workers to come her illegally. Once again the Obama administration is thumbing their collective nose at our immigration laws. To be fair, this is not the first administration to do it...but they've been the most outspoken and open about it. Basically it's an "in your face" type of disregard for our laws.
How about if they come out and say, "Sure. You'll be protected if you're treated unlawfully by an employer. But then you'll be deported. Then we'll fine the employer for hiring you."
This is nothing more than another back-door attempt by the Obama administration to encourage and promote illegal immigration. They can't get their agenda passed through the lawful legislative process (ie: the Dream Act, amnesty, etc...) so they're just skirting it and giving a big middle finger to congress and American citizens. It's a pattern we've seen from this asshole time and again.
This policy promotes black market labor and sends a really bad message to all those who do it properly at great cost and personal sacrifice.
There's no way this is the right thing to do (they way they're promoting it, I should say).
If we don't hold people who are currently in our country by our own standards, whose standards do we hold them to? The Founders of our country spoke of inalienable, and God given rights. Surely you can't think that they only felt that way towards citizens of their newly built country. Especially since there was no such thing as an illegal back then.
It'd be unconstitutional to not provide the same rights to all people who are here, unless they are in prison.
When I was doing insurance claims, I used to be asked all the time about illegals. "If I hit an illegal, and it's my fault, you don't have to pay out because they are illegal right?"
"Uhhh, no, stupid ass. Of course I still have to pay them. YOU ARE AT FAULT. Legal status doesn't change anything."
I know that is not exactly the same thing, but it came to mind as I was making this post.
And don't any of you whiney bitches go and assume that I'm some illegal cuddler either, because I'm not at all. I don't like it, but that is the way that it is, and the way that it will always be if you want to be able to be proud of this country.
This is another example of us at times having that double edged sword of freedom... much like Muzzies and those really crazy leftists- as much as you hate them they are protected by our unalienable rights and you just have to put up with them... that is until there is another civil war, and we know who won't last very long when that happens!
It's sad, but Iriving is 100% correct. Just because they're here illegally doesn't mean they are exempt from the rights we enjoy. The best thing we can do is make this country most hostile to them (legally of course), but I really don't see that happening during this shoddy joke of an Administration. If I were president, I'd have fines so large that if you hired an illegal you'd be filing for chapter 11 before the paperwork got finished.
Delfuego
09-01-2011, 09:38
Irving is 100% correct.Ditto on this...
Bailey Guns
09-01-2011, 09:56
Do you suppose US citizens illegally working in Guatemala, Mexico or Honduras will receive the same kind of treatment?
That's all fine and good but what happens when an illegal hits you with no ins. or gets caught drinking and driving? I had a friend who was caught driving his pickup way too fast and just about lost his cdl. While he was waiting for the judge to deal with him he watched 3 different cases involving Mexican citizens here illegally get slapped on the hands for DUI's. None of them had US driver licenses. All had public defenders. They paid court costs and the judge had the translator explain to them that NEXT time it would be worse. Just bs the double standard applied to illegals.
If you're illegal and you complain about unfair work practices, the problems should be resolved and then you should be deported.
If we don't hold people who are currently in our country by our own standards, whose standards do we hold them to? The Founders of our country spoke of inalienable, and God given rights. Surely you can't think that they only felt that way towards citizens of their newly built country. Especially since there was no such thing as an illegal back then.
It'd be unconstitutional to not provide the same rights to all people who are here, unless they are in prison.
When I was doing insurance claims, I used to be asked all the time about illegals. "If I hit an illegal, and it's my fault, you don't have to pay out because they are illegal right?"
"Uhhh, no, stupid ass. Of course I still have to pay them. YOU ARE AT FAULT. Legal status doesn't change anything."
I know that is not exactly the same thing, but it came to mind as I was making this post.
And don't any of you whiney bitches go and assume that I'm some illegal cuddler either, because I'm not at all. I don't like it, but that is the way that it is, and the way that it will always be if you want to be able to be proud of this country.
Do you suppose US citizens illegally working in Guatemala, Mexico or Honduras will receive the same kind of treatment?
That's not the point, do you wish to live under the glorious laws of Honduras or Mexico? No? Don't stoop down to their level of picking and choosing which rights are god-given and which we can just say fuck it to.
My solution is very similar to those already given in this thread. Expand migrant worker quotas and fine the ever living shit out of employers who still employ illegals because they can be exploited for lower wages/no taxes. You can also add an incentive like participate in the migrant worker program for X years lawfully i.e. go home when you are supposed to, don't commit felonies, etc. and be fast tracked to citizenship.
Do you suppose US citizens illegally working in Guatemala, Mexico or Honduras will receive the same kind of treatment?
Eff no! Mexico is really harsh on non-citizens. You can't own a business and without citizen ship are relegated to home ownership for 1 year with a re-examination and maybe you can stay. They are doing things the right way down there, but us, well that's why Mex is laughing at us constantly.
The father & son team did a good job of convincing me that they agree with what I said, but are still angry about the situation. I feel the same way.
I accidentally turned on some liberal talk radio show on an AM channel the other day, and some liberal lawyer was calling in saying how we need to have a MORE porous border, and it needs to be EASIER to get into this country. His point was that our border control works too well, and it is such a hassle to get back into the country after workers leave, that they just stay up here. Basically, it sounded like he was suggesting that people used to come here for seasonal labor, go home, then come back again, and now they just stay.
I think it is at least an interesting point. I'm sure there is some benefit to having immigrant labor here, but with the economy the way it is, I'm not really ready to consider the point. However, if I had to commute to a neighboring state for work every two weeks, and it was a pain in the ass to cross states, I'd just move to where I worked. Something to consider.
*Again, I don't necessarily think that having a ton of people come here and ship their money home is good for the country, but that's not the specific point that I'm talking about.*
Also:
http://chasemebaby.com/thethrill/wp-content/uploads/2010/12/joke.jpg
We should listen to Ron White and his idea to sell a chunk of florida to Israel, buy mexico, fix it up...then flip it!
I tried to find the youtube but was unsuccessful and more motivated to making myself another drink[Pepsi]
Bailey Guns
09-01-2011, 21:05
That's not the point, do you wish to live under the glorious laws of Honduras or Mexico? No? Don't stoop down to their level of picking and choosing which rights are god-given and which we can just say fuck it to.
My solution is very similar to those already given in this thread. Expand migrant worker quotas and fine the ever living shit out of employers who still employ illegals because they can be exploited for lower wages/no taxes. You can also add an incentive like participate in the migrant worker program for X years lawfully i.e. go home when you are supposed to, don't commit felonies, etc. and be fast tracked to citizenship.
OK. So it's not the point.
Here's the fucking point. We're a nation of laws. They're breaking our laws and they're getting rewarded for it time and again. Not just with this issue. They get tuition breaks, housing assistance, medical care, you name it. And they're criminals.
And we have a president who presides over a government that encourages these people to break the law. And then they piss and moan about companies that employ them as the real problem? We have a government that picks and chooses the laws they will and won't enforce. Everything is slanted in favor of law-breaking, illegal immigrants.
Like I said... I don't think these people should be fair game for someone to exploit or mistreat them. But why do we tolerate a president and other government officials, who've sworn to uphold the Constitution and the laws of the land, who turn a blind eye to criminals and actually reward them for their criminal behavior?
Robby30-06
09-01-2011, 21:13
We should listen to Ron White and his idea to sell a chunk of florida to Israel, buy mexico, fix it up...then flip it!
I tried to find the youtube but was unsuccessful and more motivated to making myself another drink[Pepsi] A completely understandable distraction[Beer]
I disagree with irv.
illegal immigrants should not receive any rights or protections of the constitution (and neither should terrorists)
but our system is severely broken and needs to be fixed.
people who want to be citizens should not have to wait 15 years and pay thousands of dollars.
make the path to citizenship fair and efficient, then secure the borders and punish the lawbreakers harshly, and the immigration problem will be fixed.
but hey, I think we should invade the 9 northernmost states of mexico and make them our own, bringing the full might of the military down on the drug cartels.
reconquista my ass.
If we don't give them the protections of our constitution, whose constitution will we give them rights under? I agree with the rest of what you said.
mcantar18c
09-02-2011, 03:10
If we don't give them the protections of our constitution, whose constitution will we give them rights under? I agree with the rest of what you said.
Ummm none?
All humans have certain unalienable rights... such as the right to life. That does not include the right to our jobs, our tax dollars, free education, and all the other bullshit they're "entitled" to.
They are NOT Americans. They should NOT get the benefits that tax paying American citizens have access to. The only thing I want my tax dollars being spent on in regards to illegals is A) Jail time or B) Deportation
If we don't give them the protections of our constitution, whose constitution will we give them rights under? I agree with the rest of what you said.
I think give them the same rights as captured war criminals. They are not citizens and did not earn or work for those rights. After all I consider them invading the country.
I think give them the same rights as captured war criminals. They are not citizens and did not earn or work for those rights. After all I consider them invading the country.
this ^ when my great grand father came here without papers the us gov had a great idea and gave him a choice . 1 ether go to prison (forced labor 15yrs ) 2 go fight for our friend (at the time ) mussolini for 5 years then he could come back as an american . you guessed right if you think he went back to italy and invaded north africa then waited to get captured (keep in mind he was only there to become an american) . so i guess what im saying is maybe all these mexicans who want to be here soooo bad should go to afghaninam and pay there dues before they can be americans . i think the system is bull ka ka and we should stop rewarding illegals with school , jobs and prison (yes prison , 3 hots and a cot on our dime )
Illegals come here for a couple of reasons, one is to work (steal jobs from Americans) and the other is to cash in with our generous welfare state (steal money from Americans). Their anchor babies get free school and medical, they ride their babies for WIC, free or low cost housing, and free medical.
Illegal aliens are no longer simple immigrants looking to improve their lives by assimilating into the American culture, working hard to achieve the American dream. They are an invading army and in 20 years the entire southwest will have spanish as the primary language and YOUR children will be subject to the rules of a 3rd world shithole.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/federal-eye/post/undocumented-workers-got-billions-from-irs-in-tax-credits-audit-finds/2011/03/23/gIQAhtaKvJ_blog.html
What are you going to do about it? I can see that some of you will do absolutely nothing, in fact you'll encourage the invasion.
Illegals come here for a couple of reasons, one is to work (steal jobs from Americans) and the other is to cash in with our generous welfare state (steal money from Americans). Their anchor babies get free school and medical, they ride their babies for WIC, free or low cost housing, and free medical.
Illegal aliens are no longer simple immigrants looking to improve their lives by assimilating into the American culture, working hard to achieve the American dream. They are an invading army and in 20 years the entire southwest will have spanish as the primary language and YOUR children will be subject to the rules of a 3rd world shithole.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/federal-eye/post/undocumented-workers-got-billions-from-irs-in-tax-credits-audit-finds/2011/03/23/gIQAhtaKvJ_blog.html
What are you going to do about it? I can see that some of you will do absolutely nothing, in fact you'll encourage the invasion.
what do you propose we do robert ? we cant very well go down south and start a shooting war . while yes there is a shooting war going on down there but we as citizens cant go about keep our borders safe without getting into trouble. writing congress does nothing and besides it those assholes who got us into this mess in the first place .
what do you propose we do robert ? we cant very well go down south and start a shooting war . while yes there is a shooting war going on down there but we as citizens cant go about keep our borders safe without getting into trouble. writing congress does nothing and besides it those assholes who got us into this mess in the first place .
Hence why I say we petition to enact my awesome idea called "The Civil Border Defense Act" where the Customs and Border Patrol deputizes farmers, ranchers, residents, etc and allows them to defend the nation from foreign invaders- deadly force if necessary. What's going on down there is not immigration, it's invasion. My uncle is forced to carry a gun at all times on his ranch (and has been for at least 13 years) because of the dangers presented by said invasion- and that's not fucking right! You have the right to feel safe on your property and in your home, and for years he has not. But he has invested 100's of 1,000's of dollars into his family's ranch for the last 40 years, so leaving AZ is out of the question. These colors don't fucking run!
Also, I propose we pass a law that gets rid of "Press 2 for Spanish/Por la Espanol marque dos," fines those who put up signs and bilboards not in English, fines companies who get 5 or more complaints that employees dealing direct with customers can't be understood because of their limited knowledge of English, and makes hospitals check legal citizen or visa status to treat any non-life-threatening illness/injury (life/limb/eyesight accepted, anything else turn 'em away if they're not here legally). Harsh I know, but for fuck's sake let's stop making things so damn easy on them and force them to either abide by our rules or GTFO!
what do you propose we do robert ? we cant very well go down south and start a shooting war . while yes there is a shooting war going on down there but we as citizens cant go about keep our borders safe without getting into trouble. writing congress does nothing and besides it those assholes who got us into this mess in the first place .
I have no idea. Our own country will jail us for defending it or participating in the current border conflict.
We can't vote their enablers and handlers out because we're outnumbered by the sheeple and the illegals who vote.
I guess we wait for the tipping point, we hope for the best and prepare for the worst. When it finally tips it will tip in the direction of La Raza and Aztlan, then you'll have a war whether you wanted one or not. One thing you can count on in this war is that you'll be fighting La Raza, their associates and the federal government.
Hence why I say we petition to enact my awesome idea called "The Civil Border Defense Act" where the Customs and Border Patrol deputizes farmers, ranchers, residents, etc and allows them to defend the nation from foreign invaders- deadly force if necessary. What's going on down there is not immigration, it's invasion. My uncle is forced to carry a gun at all times on his ranch (and has been for at least 13 years) because of the dangers presented by said invasion- and that's not fucking right! You have the right to feel safe on your property and in your home, and for years he has not. But he has invested 100's of 1,000's of dollars into his family's ranch for the last 40 years, so leaving AZ is out of the question. These colors don't fucking run!
Also, I propose we pass a law that gets rid of "Press 2 for Spanish/Por la Espanol marque dos," fines those who put up signs and bilboards not in English, fines companies who get 5 or more complaints that employees dealing direct with customers can't be understood because of their limited knowledge of English, and makes hospitals check legal citizen or visa status to treat any non-life-threatening illness/injury (life/limb/eyesight accepted, anything else turn 'em away if they're not here legally). Harsh I know, but for fuck's sake let's stop making things so damn easy on them and force them to either abide by our rules or GTFO!
i dont think a petition will do much and thats not harsh imho .
I have no idea. Our own country will jail us for defending it or participating in the current border conflict.
We can't vote their enablers and handlers out because we're outnumbered by the sheeple and the illegals who vote.
I guess we wait for the tipping point, we hope for the best and prepare for the worst. When it finally tips it will tip in the direction of La Raza and Aztlan, then you'll have a war whether you wanted one or not. One thing you can count on in this war is that you'll be fighting La Raza, their associates and the federal government.ammo ammo ammo [Tooth]
This is a pretty depressing topic once a person understands the ramifications of the inaction by the United States government in defending the southern border and the way the United States government rewards illegal aliens.
Bad things are coming, we just don't know when.
This is a pretty depressing topic once a person understands the ramifications of the inaction by the United States government in defending the southern border and the way the United States government rewards illegal aliens.
Bad things are coming, we just don't know when.hell 49 police officers have been killed in juarez this year , ill bet its less than a year before that crap spills over to america (id rather it didnt ) . i honestly do not get the gov right now . they want to give the same people who do not respect there own laws the same right as us here . the brain pain ...oh the brain pain [Bang][Bang][Bang]
Ok...now my head is gonna explode....http://www.cosportbikeclub.org/forums/images/smilies/microwave.gif
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/09/02/undocumented-workers-pocketed-42-billion-in-tax-credits-audit-shows/
mcantar18c
09-02-2011, 14:02
Hence why I say we petition to enact my awesome idea called "The Civil Border Defense Act" where the Customs and Border Patrol deputizes farmers, ranchers, residents, etc and allows them to defend the nation from foreign invaders- deadly force if necessary. What's going on down there is not immigration, it's invasion. My uncle is forced to carry a gun at all times on his ranch (and has been for at least 13 years) because of the dangers presented by said invasion- and that's not fucking right! You have the right to feel safe on your property and in your home, and for years he has not. But he has invested 100's of 1,000's of dollars into his family's ranch for the last 40 years, so leaving AZ is out of the question. These colors don't fucking run!
Also, I propose we pass a law that gets rid of "Press 2 for Spanish/Por la Espanol marque dos," fines those who put up signs and bilboards not in English, fines companies who get 5 or more complaints that employees dealing direct with customers can't be understood because of their limited knowledge of English, and makes hospitals check legal citizen or visa status to treat any non-life-threatening illness/injury (life/limb/eyesight accepted, anything else turn 'em away if they're not here legally). Harsh I know, but for fuck's sake let's stop making things so damn easy on them and force them to either abide by our rules or GTFO!
+1!
Hell yes.
Ummm none?
All humans have certain unalienable rights... such as the right to life. That does not include the right to our jobs, our tax dollars, free education, and all the other bullshit they're "entitled" to.
They are NOT Americans. They should NOT get the benefits that tax paying American citizens have access to. The only thing I want my tax dollars being spent on in regards to illegals is A) Jail time or B) Deportation
None of those things have anything to do with the article though. You can't consider an illegal a war criminal. Let's at least be realistic.
None of those things have anything to do with the article though. You can't consider an illegal a war criminal. Let's at least be realistic.not here in the u.s. but are there not a few americans who are none combatants that are locked up for less and pretty stiff sentences at that . im not disagreeing with you , im just puttin that out there is all
I know that there are, but as we've all already agreed upon, we don't want to lower ourselves to how someone like China or Iran treat people. If we want to be the best country, we have to accept that it's not always easy or cool. Just like being a good boss, cop, or parent.
rockhound
09-02-2011, 22:15
Carl, Carl , Carl
you still act surprised by these things. you know they dont mean to give you or any other citizen more rights than an illegal, they will step on your rights at every turn if they can somehow get the illegals to get legal status and vote for them.
Bailey Guns
09-03-2011, 07:15
Not surprised...infuriated.
ill bet its less than a year before that crap spills over to america (id rather it didnt ).
It's already here man, I wouldn't know the figures but I'd bet a large part of the murders in places like El Paso, Albuquerque, etc are cartel related. My money is on a full on civil war in the north of Mexico very soon and guess who's gonna be the refugee center...
theGinsue
09-03-2011, 14:56
The Founders of our country spoke of inalienable, and God given rights. Surely you can't think that they only felt that way towards citizens of their newly built country. Especially since there was no such thing as an illegal back then.
Would this be the same set of FOunding Fathers that owned slaves?
You must be right, our Founding Fathers could NEVER look at a group of human beings and say that they have fewer rights than another group of human beings. Preposterous.
Have you ever considered the possibility of him getting a 2nd term? Sounds impossible but i didn't think there were enough idiots to elect him the 1st time.
Clinton got reelected and I didn't think there was any possible way that could happen.
I really do think there is a chance Obama could do it too.
Bailey Guns
09-03-2011, 15:31
If we don't hold people who are currently in our country by our own standards, whose standards do we hold them to? The Founders of our country spoke of inalienable, and God given rights. Surely you can't think that they only felt that way towards citizens of their newly built country. Especially since there was no such thing as an illegal back then.
I've done a bit of research on just how the Founding Fathers felt about immigrants.
Much of what I've found shows they were very much in favor of immigration to this country. As a matter of fact, they knew it was a necessity since the population was very low at the time. (This is a very simplified statement but basically sums up the prevailing feelings on immigration)
However, there was a very strong sentiment among the founders that immigrants must assimilate into society as Americans. They felt it was important to adopt our social values and lust for liberty and to become first and foremost, Americans. They pretty much insisted that immigrants adopt American civic values and American heritage as their own. This is not to say they had to entirely renounce their own heritage, it would just take a back seat to their new American heritage.
There's plenty of good reading out there on the subject. Based on what I've read I'm pretty sure our founders would be pretty astonished that we've allowed the illegal immigration problem to become what it is.
I don't think they'd agree with your assessment of how they'd feel at all.
Of course thy wanted immigration; can't have a country without a population. No one said anything about how people shouldn't assimilate, but grading people's right based on their individual level of cultural assimilation is a job for the thought police. Feels to close to a caste system to me.
Bailey Guns
09-03-2011, 17:39
No, not a caste system at all. The point is, do it correctly and adopt American societal values. That seems to be the norm for people who immigrate legally. Doesn't seem to be the norm for illegals at all.
Frankly, I think being an illegal is more likely to lead to a self-imposed caste system. The illegals basically force themselves into the lowest caste simply by coming here illegally. Makes it very difficult to do a lot of things.
I agree with that.
Same here. Everyone always says the illegals are taking jobs from legal citizens, which i agree with for the most part. But with the way as a society as a whole we look down on labor jobs. as beneath many people. How many people on welfare that have made it a life style for example would really last a week picking lettuce for minimum wage in 100 degree heat or basically doing anything that requires lots of hard labor? Blue collar has become a pseudo caste of sorts nothing nearly as bad as India but it is there.
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