Gun Culture 1.0 vs Gun Culture 2.0

[Zundfolge]

An interesting read on the changes in the gun culture and how it effects the management of shooting ranges.

http://www.pagunblog.com/2011/10/19/gun-culture-1-0-v-gun-culture-2-0/

If we're going to have a gun culture in the future, I think we need to reconcile these differences between GC1.0 and GC2.0

[BigBear]

Cliff notes for those of us who can't view certain pages at work?

[Zundfolge]

Its not that long, I'll just quote it:


Gun Culture 1.0 v. Gun Culture 2.0 (http://www.pagunblog.com/2011/10/19/gun-culture-1-0-v-gun-culture-2-0/)

http://www.pagunblog.com/wp-content/uploads/et_temp/ipsc-24929_200x200.jpg (http://www.pagunblog.com/2011/10/19/gun-culture-1-0-v-gun-culture-2-0/)
SayUncle says he doesn’t get ranges that ban carry (http://www.saysuncle.com/2011/10/19/no-carrying/). I think it’s one of the sillier things you’ll find out there in the gun community, but their is an explanation for why it’s more common than it should be. The most frequent retort is that insurance is the reason, but I don’t actually believe that’s the case most of the time. As someone who is currently an officer at a local club, I can probably speak to what’s driving some clubs to adopt this.
Part of it goes back to Michael Bane’s (http://michaelbane.blogspot.com/) assertion of there being a Gun Culture 1.0, and a Gun Culture 2.0. I’m reluctant to use this analogy, because there’s not really as clean a division among the gun culture as it implies, but it is useful for illustrating the mentality difference from those in the culture who are self-defense oriented, and those that are more connected to the traditional hunting and shooting culture. There is significant overlap between the two cultures, but there are even generational differences in how one approaches the subject of concealed carry, for instance.

The vast majority of clubs are run by people from Gun Culture 1.0. This is certainly true of my club. Except my club does allow concealed carry, you just have to keep it concealed, and aren’t permitted to draw or shoot your carry piece except in an emergency. Pennsylvania has had concealed carry longer than most other states (since 1989), so even most people in Gun Culture 1.0 here carry, even if they aren’t shooting IPSC, IDPA or any of the other action or practical shooting disciplines. The reason clubs are run by Gun Culture 1.0 is because those are the people with the time to invest in overseeing a club. It takes a lot of work, and it’s not something most people in their 30s and 40s have time for. I barely have time for it, and I just basically try to do my job and not much else.
The other major factor that plays into rules like this is that most club boards are responsible for dealing with range incidents. If the club is large enough, the board is typically going to see a parade from the small minority of people who’s gun handling and safety mentality is either poor or non-existent. It’s relatively easy to fall into a mindset that your members are not to be trusted, since you’re dealing with grave stupidity on a regular basis. You’ll never see the 99% of people who are safe. You’ll spend a lot of time interacting with the 1% who aren’t.

I’ve always wondered whether it would be better to set high standards for getting into a private club, but once those standards are met, you are essentially bound only by a handful of safety oriented rules. Our club has a qualification, but it’s essentially being able to hit a rather large piece of paper at ten yards with a pistol. You have to be a real wild man with a gun to fail our qualifier. If you were going to allow someone to, say, draw from holster, it wouldn’t be unreasonable to make them qualify to do so, so someone can verify they know how to do the task safely. The unfortunate fact, at least based on my experience at clubs, is that if you allowed it broadly, it’s not going to be too long before someone puts a round in their leg, or even worse, someone else’s leg. There are a few local commercial ranges that allow draw from holster, but both have armor plating between stalls. Most clubs don’t have the money for that kind of setup, and most people don’t want to be next to a Cletus who can’t avoid finger f***ing his trigger guard every time he draws if the only thing separating you is a few feet of air.

My club probably implements a reasonable compromise between Gun Culture 1.0 and 2.0, when it comes to carrying on the premises. Not all do, and that’s unfortunate. But it’s also a product of the fundamental nature of clubs, and the membership. Clubs are civic organizations, and not really structured like businesses. People in the GC 1.0 age group are more familiar with and better at navigating that kind of organization than people in the GC 2.0 age group, who tend to want to think of shooting facilities as a product they buy or don’t buy, rather than a civic, membership driven enterprise. This is understandable, but without GC 2.0 stepping up, eventually we’re going to lose a lot of good places to shoot, and that will really be unfortunate.

[Bailey Guns]

Reader's Digest version for BigBear:

GC v1.0 = FUDD types.
GC v2.0 = More defensive shooting oriented types
Bottom Line = How the two at are odds with each other and how many GC v1.0 clubs are stagnant and/or dying off. No leadership to bring in newer/younger members.

It's unfortunate but I see the same thing, even on forums such as these. Shooters/Gun Enthusiasts are easily drawn into an elitist attitude. I see this often...especially as some people hone their skills.

It manifests itself on this forum when attitudes like this are displayed through various comments and in various threads:
We need stricter government-mandated training standards.
If you don't train to "X" level, you suck.
If you do/don't carry/shoot "X" brand of gun, you suck.
I don't "feel" safe because Joe Citizen can pay a few bucks and get a permit.
I attended brand "X" school therefore I don't suck.I really don't like elitist attitudes. We're either for 2A freedoms or we're not. That's why I really like living where I do and having property where I can shoot how I want.

[Zundfolge]

Bailey's assessment is pretty much spot on.

I can't tell you how amazed I was when I had my first run in with a GC v1.0 type.

I just assumed that most gun owners believed the Second Amendment was about defense of life and liberty first, and sport second, but some of these old farts honestly seem to believe that the 2A is so old white guys can bust clays and shoot animals.


That said there are a few GC v2.0 guys that are annoying ... claiming that unless you're burning through a thousand rounds a week, at least one tactical competition a month and have been trained by some high speed/low drag folk at [fill in the name of some fancy schmancy expensive school or military or police training academy] than you need to sell all your guns because it's just "man jewelry" and you suck.

[Bailey Guns]

I just assumed that most gun owners believed the Second Amendment was about defense of life and liberty first, and sport second, but some of these old farts honestly seem to believe that the 2A is so old white guys can bust clays and shoot animals.

"Why do you need a gun like that for hunting?" I can't tell you how many times I heard that asked when a FUDD would come into my store and see the AR-type rifles in the rack.

My response was generally something along the lines of, "Why do you need to go hunting when Safeway sells all the food you could possibly want?"

It never crosses their mind that hunting has nothing to do with the 2A.

Attitudes are pretty hard to change sometimes.

(DISCLAIMER: I'm not against hunting. Question asked for illustration and smart-ass purposes only.)

[Zundfolge]

"Why do you need a gun like that for hunting?" I can't tell you how many times I heard that asked when a FUDD would come into my store and see the AR-type rifles in the rack.

Tell them its for hunting "Long Pig". [ROFL1]

[DD977GM2]

I carry a G23 ,so Im going to ALWAYS be able to fire a round downrange because my G23 is made by the most reliable company EVER [Beer]



I stay away from gun ranges due to the articles finer points. Knuckleheads who
dont know how to safely handle firearms and also the wierd looks I used to get for an AR15 or AK

[Bailey Guns]

Perfection!

[streetglideok]

Never been to a gun club, just gun ranges and open ranges. The open unbabysitted ranges, you did as you pleased when you were alone. The second someone else arrived, you had to elevate your guard. All the gun ranges Ive been to, either didnt want holster carry and firing from a holster, or required a holstered weapon to be open and empty, on the table during cease-fire. In a perfect world, everybody would have common sense, and wouldnt see the stupidity we do see, at the range. Cases in point: First time my wife and I went to Dragonmans on a sunday, this summer, we saw a steady procession of 'tards come in. One guy came walking in with his pump shotgun, carried naked, uncased, barrel pointing towards the ground in front. Rangemaster saw him and quickly talked to him, about making sure the action is left open if it being carried in or out of the range. The guy slid the pump back, and out came a shell from the chamber. 15 minutes later, another tool came walking in, rifle in his hand, and guess what the rangemaster found when he had that guy open the chamber? Yep, same thing. It went on several times that am after that. Each time, the rangemaster spotted them and got onto them right there. So this isnt an attack against dragonmans, as the RM immediately saw a problem and fixed it. This is some stupidity with no sense, loaded weapon, not being pointed at a safe direction, around alot of people. Weekend before 2nd rifle season, we go out one last time, and the place is packed. Guys that cant figure out what pallet is in front of them shooting across the range. Some nimrods cant figure out to keep the barrel pointed downrange. We go to the other section, the 100-220yd range. Less crowded, and lot smarter group. Seems the 'tards cant hit that far out, so they stay back at sesame street,lol.
Cant blame the 1.0 people for the babysitting rules, but some of their old idealogy is crazy. Anything other then an '06 is overkill, or underkill, as its more perfect then Glock. Why are there semi-autos? etc. Some of the 2.0s forget, not everyone is as safe or has as much common sense as them, or in some cases, some of the 2.0s dont realize, they have no common sense, arent safe, and cant shoot! I fit into the gun culture version NON PC.

[Danimal]

The problem here is not stupidity, just good old ignorance. And the part that gets me is that I see all these people complaining about dangerous situations at ranges or Fudd type good ol boys, but I never see anyone attempt to talk to them to fix the problem. If you are waiting for someone else to come along and fix the problem it will be the government through regulations and registration.

My point is 99 times out of 100 these "range idiots" have never been taught safety or range handling of firearms. Just talking to them for a minute teaches them enough that they will be safe enough to get by without endangering others. For the Fudd types, they might not get it, but I know from experience that they too have a blast shooting semi- auto weapons, so if the ask why and you are not too busy let them run a mag through your gun. Just a thought.