View Full Version : Expensive Dog Walk
So as it’s a nice afternoon I decide to take the dogs for a walk. I went to the site of the new rec center off Grand View Meadows.
To cut a long story as there’s no else around so I decided to let the dogs off the leash. Middle of the entire open space quiet as can be, yes I know there’s a Longmont City off-leash law but it’s a nice day and no-one is around.
No one but the K-9 Cop who walks on over with her board in hand and no mess no fuss slaps a 2 dog off leash ticket on me! Dang whatever happened to warnings or cops using judgment! Guess it’s the end of the month and they need to top up the donut fund?
Ok so I know I was in the wrong but there was no one else around and the dogs weren’t being a menace. Hell my GSD is probably better trained than any of the Longmont PD dogs! Shutzhund and protection dog certified!
Anyone any idea what the fine will be? Don’t have the time to go to court and will just have to pay, I’m just curious as to how expensive the walk is going to be.
And yes I know there’s off leash parks! Ever been to them, full of badly trained dogs and dog crap!
Byte Stryke
10-30-2011, 18:31
so I was doing 80MPH down this side street.. yeah it was a 35mph zone, but there was no one around but this cop....
[ROFL1]
jerrymrc
10-30-2011, 19:53
so I was doing 80MPH down this side street.. yeah it was a 35mph zone, but there was no one around but this cop....
[ROFL1]
I have to say you do have a point. ;)
mcantar18c
10-30-2011, 20:14
I have to say you do have a point. ;)
Maybe at first glance... both situations are neglecting a law because nobody else is around.
Bytes example could result in serious bodily harm/death for the person breaking the law and possible unseen bystanders. I don't see how the OP was endangering anybody.
Slowing to a slow roll instead of a complete stop at a stop sign on a quiet rural road with nobody around is a better comparison.
jerrymrc
10-30-2011, 20:42
Maybe at first glance... both situations are neglecting a law because nobody else is around.
Bytes example could result in serious bodily harm/death for the person breaking the law and possible unseen bystanders. I don't see how the OP was endangering anybody.
Slowing to a slow roll instead of a complete stop at a stop sign on a quiet rural road with nobody around is a better comparison.
Just a thought. I have no ill will to the OP and do think it is stupid but your post brings up a very real issue. What you are saying is that some laws are better than others. kind of like we have immigration laws but some want to enforce them and some do not. That laws should not be enforced the same?
In my mind all laws are the same. Break one and you MAY suffer the penalty.
It all breaks down to the law, the act, the punishment. If one believes that they will not get caught then one might break the law. Does not matter where, when or how. The OP got caught plain and simple. Now he gets to pay the fine. This was not a grey area by his own admission.
I bet he never does it again.[Coffee]
mcantar18c
10-30-2011, 20:59
The way I see it there are two types of laws.
Type 1: Honestly there for the benefit of society. Drinking + driving laws come to mind... when you get drunk and get behind the wheel, you put not only yourself but anybody along your path of travel in unnecessary serious danger.
I believe one should follow these laws, period.
Type 2: There for the benefit of the individual. Stuff like getting a ticket because the tags on your car expired a week ago and you haven't had a chance to go to the DMV yet. Most laws that you only get slapped with a fine for breaking fall under this category.
I won't comment on whether one should or shouldn't follow these laws, but I don't believe it as bad if you break one of them
Great-Kazoo
10-30-2011, 21:27
So your dogs are off leash, a rabbit makes a break from cover dogs begin pursuit. Rabbit runs across street dogs follow, 1 gets hit by car and is a goner, number 2 is seriously injured. Do you draw your CCW and do what is right? Or do you hope help arrives before your dog that no one was around the park area does not endure any more pain & suffering than necessary?
Sorry i have issues with off leash dogs, no matter how cute, well behaved or obedient they are. Just as in a CCW situation things go wrong that quick.
To many rules and to many people ready to enforce them no matter the situation.
Byte Stryke
10-30-2011, 22:19
great thing about laws... they apply to everyone, no matter how cool you think you are or how well behaved your dog might be.
I do not know you, I do not know your dog.
Any dog is a threat unless PHYSICALLY Controlled.
Drilldov2.0
10-30-2011, 22:26
I bet my dog walk into the Specialist tomorrow is more expensive than your lawlessness![Neene1]
Byte Stryke
10-30-2011, 22:28
Maybe at first glance... both situations are neglecting a law because nobody else is around.
Bytes example could result in serious bodily harm/death for the person breaking the law and possible unseen bystanders. I don't see how the OP was endangering anybody.
Slowing to a slow roll instead of a complete stop at a stop sign on a quiet rural road with nobody around is a better comparison.
except for the unseen family on the other side of the hill having a pork rib picnic and everyone smells like BBQ Sauce.
Fluffy runs over to the toddler and daddy drops him with 3 rounds from his CCW.
Fido, seeing his buddy attacked is now enraged, Chews Baby-Junior's arm off and disfigures his face, Daddy pries fido loose and puts 3 rounds in him.
Doggy-walker is now out 2 dogs 10 years for criminal negligence as well as hundreds of thousand dollars from the civil and criminal suits to ensue.
City council, fearing recurrences, now passes more legislation and closes parks and open spaces for any and all domestic animals.
OR
you could just follow the law... you are only special in your mommies eyes there snowflake.
palepainter
10-30-2011, 22:57
In 1988, I was doing about 65 MPH on my motorcycle, a guy was running his dog off the leash along side of the road. The dog turned and came right out in front of me. I locked the bike up. Could not avoid other than running into head on traffic on a two way road.
I hit the dog square on, it was a large doberman. I flipped after impact, busting 8 major bones in my body, dislocating my hip, a concussion and 4 missing teeth. After the tumble with the dog and my bike, I landed in the oncoming traffic lane and was almost ran over by traffic. I was knocked unconscious as soon as I hit pavement.
My insurance company went after the dog owner for full medical costs. Approx 30k. The dog survived oddly enough. They did find on of my teeth embedded in the dog. :) If the guy would have had the dog on a leash, all would be fine. That was an expensive dog walk for him. Painful for me, but costly for him.
Byte Stryke
10-30-2011, 23:00
In 1988, I was doing about 65 MPH on my motorcycle, a guy was running his dog off the leash along side of the road. The dog turned and came right out in front of me. I locked the bike up. Could not avoid other than running into head on traffic on a two way road.
I hit the dog square on, it was a large doberman. I flipped after impact, busting 8 major bones in my body, dislocating my hip, a concussion and 4 missing teeth. After the tumble with the dog and my bike, I landed in the oncoming traffic lane and was almost ran over by traffic. I was knocked unconscious as soon as I hit pavement.
My insurance company went after the dog owner for full medical costs. Approx 30k. The dog survived oddly enough. They did find on of my teeth embedded in the dog. :) If the guy would have had the dog on a leash, all would be fine. That was an expensive dog walk for him. Painful for me, but costly for him.
"but he is really well behaved and never runs off...."
Sounds like when Marley pooped in the Ocean on the movie.
Law is law, don't like it, move or buy private property. I understand there are stupid laws, but dogs are never 100%, no matter how well trained. leash laws exist for several reasons.
Hopefully the fine isn't too much, but I would assume at least $25 a dog if not more.
ChunkyMonkey
10-30-2011, 23:05
I wish my dog would even step out.
Leash laws should only apply in areas that meet a certain threshold for population density.
Byte Stryke
10-30-2011, 23:22
Leash laws should only apply in areas that meet a certain threshold for population density.
Yes... because Dog Owners rights to let their dogs run outweigh my rights to walk in the park without being molested by a "nice dog" that just wants to say hi.
So as it’s a nice afternoon I decide to take the dogs for a walk. I went to the site of the new rec center off Grand View Meadows.
To cut a long story as there’s no else around so I decided to let the dogs off the leash. Middle of the entire open space quiet as can be, yes I know there’s a Longmont City off-leash law but it’s a nice day and no-one is around.
No one but the K-9 Cop who walks on over with her board in hand and no mess no fuss slaps a 2 dog off leash ticket on me! Dang whatever happened to warnings or cops using judgment! Guess it’s the end of the month and they need to top up the donut fund?
Ok so I know I was in the wrong but there was no one else around and the dogs weren’t being a menace. Hell my GSD is probably better trained than any of the Longmont PD dogs! Shutzhund and protection dog certified!
Anyone any idea what the fine will be? Don’t have the time to go to court and will just have to pay, I’m just curious as to how expensive the walk is going to be.
And yes I know there’s off leash parks! Ever been to them, full of badly trained dogs and dog crap!
Last time the fine was $50
JohnTRourke
10-31-2011, 07:18
longmont PD is corrupt as hell.
Back to OP... Yup, you broke the law and now must pay. As far as how much, I think every municipality gets to set their own price. I'd imagine it's anywhere from $20 to $80 per dog. I also have a dog that I let "off a physical leash" though he is always electronically leashed. However, some municipalities don't let you use the electronic leashes. I always take into consideration what my action may bring if I let my dog off a physical leash.... however, he is ALWAYS ecletronically leashed...
See what I'm doing there? Ha. Pay up and leash 'em up. You never know what may peak their curiosity off leash. As calm/collected/nice/trained/insert adjective here your dog is, other people don't know that. I LOVE dogs, but I know that if I see a dog charging me or mine outside of a dog park or human control, I'm likely to put it down.
sorry you got a ticket but honestly you should keep your dog on a leash at all times . when im in the hills and i see a dog off leash i always have a side arm out and ready . while your dog might be cool until i have met the animal and its owner i will always see the pet in question as a threat .that being said do you really want your dog off leash ?? i love my dog and because i love my dog i do everything i can to keep her safe and this includes using a leash in open space areas .
Hate to say it but you are going to have to take them to a dog park if you want them to run free.
A cop can be a jerk sometimes when they need to generate revenue. Got a ticket for fuzzy dice on my rear view mirror once. They can find a law against everything. That's what they do.
Don't be so high and mighty. Take your dog to dog park let them run around with other dogs. I guarantee they don't think they are better dogs then any of the other ones out there.
There are a few out there that I know of that aren't bad.
Dang whatever happened to warnings or cops using judgment!
Most any Officer I know would have given you a verbal warning on that situation.
The fine is not a steep one but, as long as you have the dog's vaccines up to date, odds are that it will be drastically reduced if you can show up in court. Bringing documentation that shows that your dogs have approved the obedience portion of Schutzhund Training is also a plus. Though I wouldn't bring up the protection phase up in court.
Guess I stirred up a hornets nest with this one.
Bottom line is it's my fault and I'll suck it up and pay. However given the location and circumstances I think a warning would have been more appropriate.
Longmont PD is all about $! Why, well how come they can have a cop sitting by a Stop Sign in our development at 2230 but haven't got the resources during school start and end time to do the same when it really matters when kids are crossing the street!
As for the dog parks, no thanks. Not a high a mighty thing just don't like the idiot owners that frequent them or the fact I have to step around them like I'm in a minefield. One of my kids got bit by a dog there, called Longmont PD and they didn't have an officer available to come out!
On a side note if anyone is interested in a well trained GSD she's from here: https://kraftwerkk9.com/dogs-for-sale/trained-adult/
Being that you are so close to Boulder, you might also want to check out this option: http://www.bouldercolorado.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5562&Itemid=411
Picking up dog crap is part of the job.
I would have given you a warning. Unless you found my secret sleeping spot out in the middle of a field and you woke me up. You could have gotten and obstructing justice ticket too.
Drilldov2.0
10-31-2011, 12:20
Yes... because Dog Owners rights to let their dogs run outweigh my rights to walk in the park without being molested by a "nice dog" that just wants to say hi.
If you cannot handle a friendly dog coming up to you trying to make a new friend, go to a park where no dogs are allowed Nancy.
Reading the many paranoid replies on this subject. Is the fear of loose dogs causing problems with hunters using dogs while bird hunting?
My thought is people are getting conditioned to fear dogs due to the media reporting of bites and lack of long term relationships, transit life styles effecting dog ownership and training.
Fearful people get dogs excited.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 13:52
Is the fear of loose dogs causing problems with hunters using dogs while bird hunting?
Nope and great point. Leash laws do not apply while hunting even if there is a family eating BBQ right over the next hill at risk of being attacked as someone theorized before...
Being that you are so close to Boulder, you might also want to check out this option: http://www.bouldercolorado.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=5562&Itemid=411
She has one of them already:)
Dog cop was out to get me! Guess the Longmont PD donut $ is low.
Troublco
10-31-2011, 14:18
Yeah, I'm taking the buy land away from town route. I'm tired of the neighbor's beagle getting left out all the time and baying at anything that moves (or doesn't) and the neighbors behind us automatically thinking that it's our dogs, and complaining to us. I'm tired of our other neighbors letting their Rottie run around loose out front, as Arapahoe County has no leash law; you only have to have them under verbal control. Who decides if they're really under control?
I also think some of our laws anymore have gotten a bit over the top, but I'm not going to complain. I'm outta here! [Beer]
So as it’s a nice afternoon I decide to take the dogs for a walk. I went to the site of the new rec center off Grand View Meadows.
To cut a long story as there’s no else around so I decided to let the dogs off the leash. Middle of the entire open space quiet as can be, yes I know there’s a Longmont City off-leash law but it’s a nice day and no-one is around.
No one but the K-9 Cop who walks on over with her board in hand and no mess no fuss slaps a 2 dog off leash ticket on me! Dang whatever happened to warnings or cops using judgment! Guess it’s the end of the month and they need to top up the donut fund?
Ok so I know I was in the wrong but there was no one else around and the dogs weren’t being a menace. Hell my GSD is probably better trained than any of the Longmont PD dogs! Shutzhund and protection dog certified!
Anyone any idea what the fine will be? Don’t have the time to go to court and will just have to pay, I’m just curious as to how expensive the walk is going to be.
And yes I know there’s off leash parks! Ever been to them, full of badly trained dogs and dog crap!
So much ignorance in this post that I don't even know where to start so I'll just say: You were wrong. Period.
The laws pertaining to leashes and dogs aren't for YOU the owner but for the safety of others and also your dog since you don't seem to care for your dog enough to keep them leashed or let them in in designated fenced in areas.
Saying your dog is better trained (go to a K9 selection & training course sometime and then come back to this statement) and that it's for the 'donut fund' is doing nothing to help your cause.
Maybe at first glance... both situations are neglecting a law because nobody else is around.
Bytes example could result in serious bodily harm/death for the person breaking the law and possible unseen bystanders. I don't see how the OP was endangering anybody.
Slowing to a slow roll instead of a complete stop at a stop sign on a quiet rural road with nobody around is a better comparison.
You see someone's smaller dog or puppy who IS on a leash get mauled by a dog that was unleashed and you may change your tune. Especially if that someone is a smaller girl walking her precious little puppy.
You see someone's dog get hit by a car when it strays into a roadway because someone or something spooks it. You watch a teenage driver brought to tears because they couldn't avoid hitting the dog when they were doing everything else right.
You see someone swerve to miss a loose dog and do serious harm to themselves or someone else as a result or any of these things mentioned and you too may see more relevance in the laws pertaining to them.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 14:57
...you don't seem to care for your dog enough to keep them leashed...
Hunting dogs, sheepdogs, S&R dogs...none of their owners care for them...
Shooting a man's best friend because you felt threatened? Acceptable I guess...now with the number of other permit holders strolling around, I'd say it wouldn't be very wise to act upon that choice before you've even established the dogs demeanor (not all dogs eat babies) because I for one would be in a dimension beyond pissed off if I saw somebody shoot my dog. I'm not saying you shouldn't defend yourself if need be, I'm just pointing out the fact that the possibility of a nip at the hand from a dog trotting up ass and tail wiggling is better than a bullet in the ass from their owner; just be careful.
ETA: My dog's never off his leash when we're out.
Great-Kazoo
10-31-2011, 15:08
Hunting dogs, sheepdogs, S&R dogs...none of their owners care for them...
we are talking about civvie owner with dog off leash, then bitchin about getting a ticket. Lots of folks are coming to his defense as animal control could have given a verbal warning. That i agree with. the rest of the replies are wandering off topic. Dog off leash, warning or ticket. STOP complaining about **** when you are in the wrong.
Hunting dogs, sheepdogs, S&R dogs...none of their owners care for them...
What are you hunting or herding within city limits of Longmont? Clearly these are exceptions but you likely won't find leash laws in a field you're walking to hunt pheasants in Nebraska either so this wouldn't apply. You're also not going to come across others out for a stroll with their dogs or fast moving traffic either.
Shooting a man's best friend because you felt threatened? Acceptable I guess...now with the number of other permit holders strolling around, I'd say it wouldn't be very wise to act upon that choice before you've even established the dogs demeanor (not all dogs eat babies) because I for one would be in a dimension beyond pissed off if I saw somebody shoot my dog. I'm not saying you shouldn't defend yourself if need be, I'm just pointing out the fact that the possibility of a nip at the hand from a dog trotting up ass and tail wiggling is better than a bullet in the ass from their owner; just be careful.
ETA: My dog's never off his leash when we're out.
If you shot someone for shooting your dog who was coming/charging at them then you would be in a WORLD of **** for retaliating. See why leash laws exist? If you're dog is never off of his lease the way you claim then you have nothing to worry about. This is about people who let their dog roam free which is when bad things happen. The sad part is almost always it's the dog that has to pay for the owner being an idiot.
If your dog is on a leash then you won't have to worry about someone who carries a gun being put in the position of having to make that choice in a moment's notice.
we are talking about civvie owner with dog off leash, then bitchin about getting a ticket. Lots of folks are coming to his defense as the animal could have given a verbal warning. That i agree with. the rest of the replies are wandering off topic. Dog off leash, warning or ticket. STOP complaining about **** when you are in the wrong.
/thread
I'm not worried about my dog at all. As per my last post, people have been known to do dumb **** when they're having a fit.
Btw, leash laws don't exist everywhere...So now what? [Dunno] [LOL]
hollohas
10-31-2011, 15:22
we are talking about civvie owner with dog off leash, then bitchin about getting a ticket. Lots of folks are coming to his defense as the animal could have given a verbal warning. That i agree with. the rest of the replies are wandering off topic. Dog off leash, warning or ticket. STOP complaining about **** when you are in the wrong.
The OP agreed to being wrong in his very first post guys.
All I am saying is some of this "keep your dogs on leash or PEOPLE WILL DIE" nonsense seems a little excessive. It's not the end of the world if a dog is let off leash. The working dogs I mentioned are fine examples that dogs off leash don't guarantee a threat...
I'm not worried about my dog at all. As per my last post, people have been known to do dumb **** when they're having a fit.
The way you worded it made it sound like somehow the person being charged by the loose dog would be at fault for the owner's irresponsibility of said dog. I was meerely stating that had the person who shot not been put in that situation to have to make a decision in a split second then there would be no issue. Hence the reason for keeping your dog on a leash regardless of whether it's the law or not.
Btw, leash laws don't exist everywhere...So now what? [Dunno] [LOL]
Then the OP of this thread should move there and let his dog roam free 24/7 since it's not a law. I mean, there's virtually no reason to ever keep your dog on a leash if you car about him or her, right?
The OP agreed to being wrong in his very first post guys.
All I am saying is some of this "keep your dogs on leash or PEOPLE WILL DIE" nonsense seems a little excessive. It's not the end of the world if a dog is let off leash. The working dogs I mentioned are fine examples that dogs off leash don't guarantee a threat...
Just like people drink and drive all the time w/o people dieing and w/o the world ending. Still doesn't make it right.
Dang to wrap this up:
In my very first post I said I was in the wrong.
Am I pissed I got a ticket - yes. But my own fault.
As for 'Saying your dog is better trained (go to a K9 selection & training course sometime and then come back to this statement) and that it's for the 'donut fund' is doing nothing to help your cause.'
Training - she's Schutzhund Level 3! Check it out, she's trained.
Donuts - cops and donuts need I say more. IT WAS A JOKE.
FYI when I drive out of LAX there's always a LAPD car at the local donut store!
hollohas
10-31-2011, 15:54
Just like people drink and drive all the time w/o people dieing and w/o the world ending. Still doesn't make it right.
Dog off leash = same as drunk driving...
A bit extreme. Again making my point for me.
Dang to wrap this up:
In my very first post I said I was in the wrong.
Am I pissed I got a ticket - yes. But my own fault.
As for 'Saying your dog is better trained (go to a K9 selection & training course sometime and then come back to this statement) and that it's for the 'donut fund' is doing nothing to help your cause.'
Training - she's Schutzhund Level 3! Check it out, she's trained.
Donuts - cops and donuts need I say more. IT WAS A JOKE.
FYI when I drive out of LAX there's always a LAPD car at the local donut store!
My guess is this attitude towards cops you present in this thread shows up when you are contacted by one in real life. Believe it or not, you are less likely to get a ticket when you are respectful than when you are a prick... even if you don't think you are outwardly. Personally, if I had a badge, everyone who allowed their dog to roam free would get a ticket from me. Why you ask? Well, I'm glad you asked that. It's because those 'scenarios' I made up earlier weren't made up scenarios... I actually witnessed each of those and I can tell you that each and everyone involved in those situations were devastated and a dog ended up dead in each one through no fault of it's own. It should also be noted that the dog that ran into traffic was also 'very well trained' much as you have mentioned here. Dogs react when they're spooked and no amount of training will take that out of them. The dog that mauled the little girl's dog was also one of the dogs you hear about that 'have never bit before' so either they lied or dogs are capable of resorting to their instincts in time of high stress. In all cases a simple leash could have prevented the situation and it really shouldn't have even required a law for the owner to know better. So, I would write tickets to drive the point home. Sure I could just give warnings but had you not been given a ticket would you have even thought about it again? Probably not. You certainly wouldn't have posted here about it so look how much awareness that one ticket created. I say good job LEO and you need to be a more responsible pet owner who takes responsibility for his actions and safety of an animal that would follow you through hell if you asked it to.
Find another forum to bitch about being cited for a law you admittedly broke.
Dog off leash = same as drunk driving...
A bit extreme. Again making my point for me.
How is this extreme? Either one can and does regularly cause injury and death to innocent people and both are equally easily preventable. The only point I make is my own.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 15:59
I think we found Jer's 'button'...
I think we found Jer's 'button'...
People who knowingly break laws (put into place since people like them can't seem to make wise decisions w/o them unfortunately) which put innocent people around them in danger then bitch about being cited for said law breaking? You got me. It's a bugaboo alright.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 16:05
Dogs react when they're spooked and no amount of training will take that out of them.
Wrong. Most dogs run, hide or go crazy when they hear gun shots. But hunting dogs don't. Why you ask? Glad you asked that...because they have been trained not too.
I think everyone here will agree or has agreed that the law is the law. If the law says you must leash, then you must leash or pay a fine. But your generalizations about dogs off leash are absurd.
Wrong. Most dogs run, hide or go crazy when they hear gun shots. But hunting dogs don't. Why you ask? Glad you asked that...because they have been trained not too.
Yeah, talk to me like I've never been around hunting dogs. Take that same dog that's trained to not flinch around gun fire and walk them off leash next to a busy road (Prospect & Shields in Fort Collins in this case) and then pass someone riding a skate board going the same way in the cross walk. Suddenly, that super smart dog that's fearless of gun fire is now inexplicably afraid of the sound the skate board wheels make on the rough concrete. The dog then panics and goes out into traffic to avoid the sound that neither you nor I would think twice about it being afraid about. I was at that intersection waiting to turn left at the front so I saw the entire event unfold clearly. Had the teenager swerved to miss the dog it would have likely meant the loss of human life so the right decision was made, the dog died a horrific painful and slow death in front of everyone all while the dog's owner had the leash draped around his neck the entire time. Turns out that dog was also a hunting dog (I asked when I saw his RealTree camo collar & leash) and trained to not fear gun fire which is a very focused and specific type of training. To say that that dog now is afraid of nothing and will never react adversely to conditions neither you or I can predict proves your level of intelligence.
I think everyone here will agree or has agreed that the law is the law. If the law says you must leash, then you must leash or pay a fine. But your generalizations about dogs off leash are absurd.
Love the way you call real life experiences generalizations because even if I hadn't witnessed these first-hand they would be any less relevant. The bottom line is I'm a dog lover and have watched too many dogs die a horrible death due to the owner's stupidity and ignorance to what's possible. You seem to fit this nicely since you seem to think nothing I have said is possible and there's no good reason for leash laws within city limits. I suppose you also think it's not possible to be mugged or attacked so why carry a firearm, right? The odds are good you won't get in an accident and your driving record is clean so why wear your seat belt, right? How is this different?
StagLefty
10-31-2011, 16:32
Dang to wrap this up:
In my very first post I said I was in the wrong.
Am I pissed I got a ticket - yes. But my own fault.
As for 'Saying your dog is better trained (go to a K9 selection & training course sometime and then come back to this statement) and that it's for the 'donut fund' is doing nothing to help your cause.'
Training - she's Schutzhund Level 3! Check it out, she's trained.
Donuts - cops and donuts need I say more. IT WAS A JOKE.
You posted this on a public internet forum. What did you expect ? [Beer]
Byte Stryke
10-31-2011, 16:39
The OP agreed to being wrong in his very first post guys.
All I am saying is some of this "keep your dogs on leash or PEOPLE WILL DIE" nonsense seems a little excessive. It's not the end of the world if a dog is let off leash. The working dogs I mentioned are fine examples that dogs off leash don't guarantee a threat...
I Disagree (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States)
dogs, like people, are always a variable.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 16:48
Jer, As for what you have seen happen to dogs, I never questioned your real life examples nor did I call them generalizations. Each event sounds horrible. However, your generalized statement was that training can't keep a dog from getting spooked. I gave ONE example that it can. Of course a gun trained dog won't necessarily be steady on a busy street. But if a dog can be trained to be gun steady, why can't he be trained not to get spooked on the street? Or anything else for that matter? It can and that is my point. Service dogs are trained not to spoke on busy streets.
You are flat out wrong when you say no amount of training can get the spook out of a dog.
Final note, I have nothing against leash laws. Never argued that. I do however think some posts here come from leash Nazis (no reference to Hitler...think soup Nazi instead).
so I was doing 80MPH down this side street.. yeah it was a 35mph zone, but there was no one around but this cop....
[ROFL1] You beat me to it Byte I was thinking the same exact thing. It is legal if there is no Police around.
Jer, As for what you have seen happen to dogs, I never questioned your real life examples nor did I call them generalizations. Each event sounds horrible. However, your generalized statement was that training can't keep a dog from getting spooked. I gave ONE example that it can. Of course a gun trained dog won't necessarily be steady on a busy street. But if a dog can be trained to be gun steady, why can't he be trained not to get spooked on the street? Or anything else for that matter? It can and that is my point. Service dogs are trained not to spoke on busy streets.
You are flat out wrong when you say no amount of training can get the spook out of a dog.
Final note, I have nothing against leash laws. Never argued that. I do however think some posts here come from leash Nazis (no reference to Hitler...think soup Nazi instead).
Sure, just like a select few amount of people are trained to handle higher speeds than the average public. Doesn't mean they should be allowed to speed because all the other variables are still out there. Now, by your statements, I should expect LEOs to judge if the dog has special anti-spooking training before issuing citations? This is just stupid. You need to stop. You can NOT expect a dog to react in a predictable manner to unknown situations when you can't even expect a human to react properly in similar circumstances. Maybe you had some crazy dog once that had millions of dollars in training and wouldn't react adversely to ANYTHING EVER but in the real world this just doesn't happen. Why do you think service dogs are also not exempt from leash laws? Herp derp. I'm a leash nazi.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 16:57
I Disagree (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_dog_attacks_in_the_United_States)
dogs, like people, are always a variable.
So we're averaging about 30 deaths per year give or take...the vast majority from family dogs or at least dogs in their own home.
What I learned...? Dogs should be on leash in our own homes too.
You posted this on a public internet forum. What did you expect ? [Beer]
You have a point.
Nearly time to drive home, woo hoo 80mph in the 35mph zone.
hollohas
10-31-2011, 17:04
Now, by your statements, I should expect LEOs to judge if the dog has special anti-spooking training before issuing citations? This is just stupid.
Not what I said. I said the law is the law and I have nothing wrong with it. I'm not questioning the law or how it is enforced. I was questioning your very general statement that dogs can't be trained not to spook. You're obviously very worked up so I think I'll let it rest rather than ruin your evening.
rockhound
10-31-2011, 17:05
Reading the many paranoid replies on this subject. Is the fear of loose dogs causing problems with hunters using dogs while bird hunting?
My thought is people are getting conditioned to fear dogs due to the media reporting of bites and lack of long term relationships, transit life styles effecting dog ownership and training.
Fearful people get dogs excited.
actually my son who is now 12 has been attacked twice in his life by those nice dogs who were just off the leash cause they feel better that way. my sister in law has a torn ACL due to being run over by a friendly dog that was off his leash.
far as I am concerned, you deserve the ticket. and your dog's urge to run free is not worth the kid or adult that they bite. just because he is normally friendly doesn't mean he always will be
Not what I said. I said the law is the law and I have nothing wrong with it. I'm not questioning the law or how it is enforced. I was questioning your very general statement that dogs can't be trained not to spook. You're obviously very worked up so I think I'll let it rest rather than ruin your evening.
My evening is just fine thanks. Taken out of context I could see how you would think I was oblivious to dog training and didn't know anything about certain dogs who are trained certain ways. It also isn't true that 100% of all dogs can be trained to not spook by gunfire so as long as that statistic isn't 100% then we can't expect EVERY dog to react to ALL unknowns in a predictable manner. I stand by my previous statement which was dogs couldn't be trained to not spook but if you apply context you see that I was saying that dogs can't be trained to not spook to ALL situations which could make lack of leash a non-issue. You chose to see it as I was saying that no dog could be trained to not spook about ANY situations which is a big difference between those two little words. Still has no bearing on this conversation because it's impossible to take a dog and make them spook proof from all situations, known and unknown. After all by definition if a situation is unknown how can you train a dog against it?
I can't believe I've even responding to this actually. It's reading comprehension at it's most basic form.
actually my son who is now 12 has been attacked twice in his life by those nice dogs who were just off the leash cause they feel better that way. my sister in law has a torn ACL due to being run over by a friendly dog that was off his leash.
far as I am concerned, you deserve the ticket. and your dog's urge to run free is not worth the kid or adult that they bite. just because he is normally friendly doesn't mean he always will be
Exactly. Nobody ever says 'Oh, that doesn't surprise me... my dog bites and attacks ALL the time' so that means it can be ANY dog at ANY time and to think you know how your dog will react to all situations proves your intelligence.
DD977GM2
10-31-2011, 17:16
so I was doing 80MPH down this side street.. yeah it was a 35mph zone, but there was no one around but this cop....
Exactly what I was thinking.
Dont get mad at the Cop for your inability to follow the law. Yeah the Cop could have handled it diffrently, but
in the end it is you who broke the law and wanted the cop to give you a break.
So as it’s a nice afternoon I decide to take the dogs for a walk. I went to the site of the new rec center off Grand View Meadows.
To cut a long story as there’s no else around so I decided to let the dogs off the leash. Middle of the entire open space quiet as can be, yes I know there’s a Longmont City off-leash law but it’s a nice day and no-one is around.
No one but the K-9 Cop who walks on over with her board in hand and no mess no fuss slaps a 2 dog off leash ticket on me! Dang whatever happened to warnings or cops using judgment! Guess it’s the end of the month and they need to top up the donut fund?
Ok so I know I was in the wrong but there was no one else around and the dogs weren’t being a menace. Hell my GSD is probably better trained than any of the Longmont PD dogs! Shutzhund and protection dog certified!
Anyone any idea what the fine will be? Don’t have the time to go to court and will just have to pay, I’m just curious as to how expensive the walk is going to be.
And yes I know there’s off leash parks! Ever been to them, full of badly trained dogs and dog crap!Just a thought if you follow the Laws and have a little more RESPECT for Police officers just doing their job you probably wont have any problems. And I highly doubt your dog has been better trained than a Police K-9. I had a friend who used to train Dogs for WSO, he helped train my Rottweiler. She did not even go through a 1/4 of the training and that was enough for me, so I could only amagine how they are when fully trained. Anyway bottom line follow the law and you wont get a ticket.
tl;dr
what are we arguing about?
actually my son who is now 12 has been attacked twice in his life by those nice dogs who were just off the leash cause they feel better that way. my sister in law has a torn ACL due to being run over by a friendly dog that was off his leash.
far as I am concerned, you deserve the ticket. and your dog's urge to run free is not worth the kid or adult that they bite. just because he is normally friendly doesn't mean he always will beI agree as well cause I tell you what just to give you an idea of what could happen if a dog were to run towards my kids I would pump lead in it until it dropped. It might be the nicest dog in the world but I do not know why it is running for my kids and would not hesitate to stop it.
Reading the many paranoid replies on this subject. Is the fear of loose dogs causing problems with hunters using dogs while bird hunting?
My thought is people are getting conditioned to fear dogs due to the media reporting of bites and lack of long term relationships, transit life styles effecting dog ownership and training.
Fearful people get dogs excited.
have you ever been attacked by a dog ?? i have and i have know a few others like my friend tony in the 80's . we were kids walking home from school and out of nowhere a pit that attacked us , i got away and tony got brain damage . he was 12 and where he was a normal kid before he has to cared for in every way still .
so yes i dont care what the circumstances are
strange dog off leash = threat
Yes... because Dog Owners rights to let their dogs run outweigh my rights to walk in the park without being molested by a "nice dog" that just wants to say hi.
I think you're a baby. The dog was the earliest domesticated animal in the world. Most of our "dog problem" is in our heads.
A dog being around you isn't encroaching on any of your rights. Even if it jumps on you.
SideShow Bob
10-31-2011, 19:02
I think you're a baby.
A dog being around you isn't encroaching on any of your rights. Even if it jumps on you.
Well then just call me Huey. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2c/Babyhuey.JPG. If an unknown dog jumps on me or mine at a public park, it will be the last time that dog jumps on anyone.
If an unknown dog jumps on me or mine at a public park, it will be the last time that dog jumps on anyone.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aptl4jXYIIs
[ROFL1]
Well then just call me Huey. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/2c/Babyhuey.JPG. If an unknown dog jumps on me or mine at a public park, it will be the last time that dog jumps on anyone.
Pussy. If a dog just jumps on you?
SideShow Bob
10-31-2011, 19:59
Pussy. If a dog just jumps on you?
You damn skippy I would !
And maybe you should move to Boulder and buy a Prius.
Because I'm not afraid of dogs and aren't just waiting to hurt one that jumps on me, I should move to Boulder?
What car do you drive? I'm going to write, "I <3 dogs" on your rear windshield during my lunch break.
hghclsswhitetrsh
10-31-2011, 20:09
You damn skippy I would !
And maybe you should move to Boulder and buy a Prius.
If my dog happened to get off of his leash some how and jump on someone, not cause serious bodily injury and that person did more than push him away. Things would not work out so well for that person. I am not from Boulder, I'm from the country - the attitude you have must really slow you down in life.
SideShow Bob
10-31-2011, 20:12
Because I'm not afraid of dogs and aren't just waiting to hurt one that jumps on me, I should move to Boulder?
No, because you have been"smoking something" and can only see the world through your rose colored glasses, if you believe every dog is a harmless little Fluffy that would never bite or hurt anyone.
No, because you have been"smoking something" and can only see the world through your rose colored glasses, if you believe every dog is a harmless little Fluffy that would never bite or hurt anyone.
I'm not like that at all, nor did any of my posts indicate that. You said that if a dog "jumped" on you, it'd be its last time.
Byte Stryke
11-01-2011, 00:14
If my dog happened to get off of his leash some how and jump on someone, not cause serious bodily injury and that person did more than push him away. Things would not work out so well for that person. I am not from Boulder, I'm from the country - the attitude you have must really slow you down in life.
Trust no one and nothing, Kill anything I percieve as an threat.
It's worked well for me for over 40 years.
Trust no one and nothing, Kill anything I percieve as an threat.
It's worked well for me for over 40 years.
How many things have you killed under that premise that were not insects or snakes?
You can leave out the people if you've done that in the service.
Byte Stryke
11-01-2011, 01:07
How many things have you killed under that premise that were not insects or snakes?
You can leave out the people if you've done that in the service.
more than once and less than a dozen...
and no...I wont compare pee-pees with you.
[ROFL1]
wow, I have to work a full day and now I see how I get wrapped up in conversations! this thread is pretty funny!
end result, the OP f'd up, broke the law, admitted to it, has to pay a fine, no children were harmed, and the collective amount of time spent by people on this board from this single incident could have produced probably $5000 worth of labor had everyone been working instead of posting about it[ROFL1]
Byte Stryke
11-01-2011, 01:43
the collective amount of time spent by people on this board from this single incident could have produced probably $5000 worth of labor had everyone been working instead of posting about it[ROFL1]
My Boss says if I am not working, its a wonderful thing
Drivers arent breaking anything
they havent hit anything
they have the tires pointed in the right direction (down)
and I am not spending his money
:D
You running a wrecker these days Byte?
Close thread...
Reminder: Never bring my dog anywhere with anyone on this forum...
hehehe.
jerrymrc
11-01-2011, 21:05
Pussy. If a dog just jumps on you?
I will say it. There is a split second between when a dog jumps on you and you get bit? I have been there/done that with a lawn mower between me and the Dog that was going to tear me to shreds but I should have let it jump on me first to find out?
Your so full of crap it is not even funny.
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