Interesting take on Roberts/Beehocare

[Singlestack]

I came across an interesting article on the Beehocare decision and why it might be very good for conservatives in the long run.

http://visiontoamerica.org/10680/did-justice-roberts-pull-one-over-on-the-liberals/

In thinking about this further, it seems to me this forces Democrats to use tax increases as the basis of proposing future statist legislation. While they could pass that in a democrat-controlled congress, we have seen how unpopular tax increases are to the american public at large. This will make it very hard to push forward future legislation based on tax increases, methinx. It will take time to see how this plays out, but I think IF the Republicans can take the Senate and White house in November and get rid of Beehocare, this decision could have some long-term benefits.

Singlestack

[Zundfolge]

I came across an interesting article on the Beehocare decision and why it might be very good for conservatives in the long run.
I understand the desire to look for silver linings, but the fact that the individual mandate was upheld (even as just a tax) is the single most massive reduction in individual liberty in American history ... bad enough that I'm not convinced we come back from this.


In thinking about this further, it seems to me this forces Democrats to use tax increases as the basis of proposing future statist legislation.
Then the answer is clear, we need a TABOR amendment to the US Constitution. [Beer]

[Singlestack]

Then the answer is clear, we need a TABOR amendment to the US Constitution. [Beer]

I'd LOVE to see that enacted! Requiring voter approval of tax increases is the way to go!!

Singlestack

[rocktot]

With the racist demographic shift being shoved down our throat, Libs could take the country in 10-20 years. Thats the end of the end. They will ignore, as they do in England, race crimes committed against Whites. They will suck the private sector dry. Etc. And more weird freakish supreme court nominees who believe in a 'living constitution'.

Its basicly over, just a matter of time.

[Zundfolge]

With the racist demographic shift being shoved down our throat, Libs could take the country in 10-20 years.
The flaw in that theory is that second generation immigrants tend to be more conservative than first generation (and third more than second, and so-on) until after a few generations, minority immigrants tend to be as conservative as whites born here. Blacks descended from slaves don't seem to follow this but even black immigrants from Africa and the Caribbean tend to follow this trend.

Non-white immigration isn't the problem (well at least not legal non-white immigration).


Libs are only 20% of the population, conservatives are 40-45% and the remaining 35-40% are the wishy-washy "independents".

[Wiggity]

Interedasting indeed......

[TS12000]

Libs are only 20% of the population, conservatives are 40-45% and the remaining 35-40% are the wishy-washy "independents".

I would love to see a source on this

[aahorn]

Libs are only 20% of the population, conservatives are 40-45% and the remaining 35-40% are the wishy-washy "independents".

i have read this too, but i think voters, especially lefties love to identify as 'independents' so they don't feel defined by a party.

[Zundfolge]

I would love to see a source on this

From Gallup (http://www.gallup.com/poll/141032/2010-conservatives-outnumber-moderates-liberals.aspx)

http://sas-origin.onstreammedia.com/origin/gallupinc/GallupSpaces/Production/Cms/POLL/iglnwvn0jeaslencabs5iq.gif

Fine ... they use the term "Moderates" instead of "Independents".

[Colorado Osprey]

i have read this too, but i think voters, especially lefties love to identify as 'independents' so they don't feel defined by a party.

I'm an Indy but it is because I think the Republican party is the same as the Socialist Dems!
In my view the 2 major parties are one in the same as proven by the SCOTUS ruling. The main difference is how fast the transition to a socialist state happens.
ObamaCare and RomneyCare are so close as to be perceived by me as identical.
Romney will not get my vote.

Until real conservatives start to vote their conscience instead of voting for a Republican the sooner a change can actually happen. The whole idea and spewing "throwing away a 3rd party vote" is just a way of complying and contributing to the mess we are in.

You shouldn't have to plug your nose to vote. Vote and act with your heart/mind/wallet and a change will happen.

BTW I have close friends who all feel this way and are independent. We are NOT wishy-washy at all.

[xring]

I came across an interesting article on the Beehocare decision and why it might be very good for conservatives in the long run.

http://visiontoamerica.org/10680/did-justice-roberts-pull-one-over-on-the-liberals/

In thinking about this further, it seems to me this forces Democrats to use tax increases as the basis of proposing future statist legislation. While they could pass that in a democrat-controlled congress, we have seen how unpopular tax increases are to the american public at large. This will make it very hard to push forward future legislation based on tax increases, methinx. It will take time to see how this plays out, but I think IF the Republicans can take the Senate and White house in November and get rid of Beehocare, this decision could have some long-term benefits.

Singlestack

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2-fFJM6jtE

[MuzzleFlash]

I understand the desire to look for silver linings, but the fact that the individual mandate was upheld (even as just a tax) is the single most massive reduction in individual liberty in American history ... bad enough that I'm not convinced we come back from this...

Sadly I have to concur with this sentiment. I'm just not buying the happy banana spin. We make fun of the other side when they do it: Scott Walker kicked their asses in Wisconsin. Did they take it to heart? No, they bragged because they won back the state senate. It's a short lived victory. The senate is out of session until the November election and redistricting means they probably can't hold on to it.

I found the SCOTUS decision stunning. Roberts could have sided with the dissenters and still established every single one of the "good" precedents in the majority decision - the limits on the commerce clause, the elimination of "greenmail" to enforce federal mandates on the states, etc. Instead, Roberts told congress "This commerce clause door is shut for you, but you can get to the land of tyranny through this unlimited tax authority door I just unlocked."

In the short run, this motivates the masses - including the pissed off pro-life Democrat Catholics - to vote him and this health care monstrosity into history's dustbin. Who wins the next election is extremely important - even critical. A Romney victory will prevent Obama from using a second term to tip the the court further left. Down ticket Republicans may benefit when their base turns out in droves. But "victory" at what cost?

Thanks to stare decis, this crack in liberty's armor will remain for the balance of our country's lifetime. Long after we've passed, our grandchildren will labor under a government much bigger and more intrusive than it is today. That is a certainty. With this decision, congress can use unrestrained taxation authority to command or to eliminate what it otherwise cannot legislate. For example, the following liberal and conservative wet dreams/nightmares are now possible:

"stimulation" of the economy by commanding every business owner to hire workers they don't need
limitations on public discourse by requiring all participants to purchase expensive libel insurance
evisceration of the Heller and McDonald decisions by requiring gun owners to purchase expensive liability insurance
elimination of the firearms marketplace by requiring gun owners to pay prohibitive transfer taxes
requirements that a teen must announce an abortion performed without parental consent in the local paper
requirements that a women seeking an abortion must purchase expensive mental health coverage for "when they realize they destroyed a human life"


Every one of these actions uses coercive taxation to achieve what has been constitutionally foreclosed from congress by any other means. It's a fundamental mistake for either side to achieve their ideological goals by expanding the powers of the leviathan.

If Roberts is a genius, he's a truely evil one.

[Singlestack]

Muzzleflash - that is great analysis and I can't dispute what you brought up. The flip side to what I originally said is that sooner or later the Dems will again control the house and senate, and the presidency too at the same time. Voters were pissed off at the Republicans in the 2006 elections and gave the dems large majorities in both houses. Then Mr hope and change comes along in 2008 and voila - a POS piece of legislation like Beehocare becomes law! The same could happen again. When it does (not if), there will be all kinds of ridiculous freedom-robbing taxes passed regardless of the opposition or the will of the people - and perhaps the very kind of taxes you brought up. Just like now, the Dems will claim it is a penalty and not a tax, get political cover from the media, and win in Federal court due to the precedent set by Beehocare. I do think the "benefits" of this decision won't really last past November, but the downside is probably with us forever. It might take a new Supreme Court to weaken or undo the current decision, if that is even possible.

Singlestack

[Ranger]

Silver lining? Forget it. No matter what you find, we have given congress the power to pass nearly any law they want in the name of health care reform.

No more big macs for you, nope it costs too much to take care of you, we now pass a law.

No more guns for you, they are too dangerous and can cause too much burden on the health care system. After digging up every statistic and skewing them, just look how we can save billions in taxpayer dollars a year by disallowing people to own firearms.

The list goes on and on and on. Congress passing even MORE nanny laws (and you think Bloomberg is bad, just wait until Washington gets their hands on you). I'm hoping for a repeal of this law but I have to face that it probably will never happen because if it gets repealed it will then get re-enacted when libs take over again. This is with us to stay now.

Just another nail in the coffin as I see it. Just one more way to divide and bankrupt our country and another reason why I think eventually the people will rise against the government and I do NOT look forward to that day.