Alternate means of communications?

[Ashton]

So if something ever did happen in the US and there was an opposing force with boots on the ground whether it be a different country or a civil war the first rule of battle is to cut off communications and supplies.

[Byte Stryke]

If no one has told you, there might be a reason...

and yes, I did have to change channels when I moved.

[zteknik]

Probably do it the same way as in the past-by mesenger and crypto notes and such.
Electronic means of communication will be monitored.If you have the knowhow you can get around it somewhat.
Theres been a lot of hams that were used in disater situations,like the Waldo canyon fire and they have the abillity to still communicate.

[jerrymrc]

I put this here for now.

[streetglideok]

Ham radio would be the most effective way IMO. Now, if things went south, we wouldn't use our FCC callsigns obviously, but it would allow comms outside of the country as well as inside, data transmissions, etc. It would allow you to be mobile, and harder to find, and with the range of frequencies, fairly hard to jam them all. Only catch is, if you wait till SHTF to figure it all out, no one's going to stop to teach you. Lot easier to get the license, practice using it, and put a plan together for when it goes down, you're not all alone waiting on that Iphone to work.

[gnihcraes]

Being a ham, all the specified frequencies would be monitored or jammed. (assuming they could jam a lot of it?) Radios we have typically won't transmit out of "band" so the preset ranges are there for monitoring. Any data communications are simple and unencrypted.

Same goes for GMRS, FRS and CB. Not sure there is much of a way to not be monitored if they were. Take the risk I guess. If someone fails to respond all of the sudden, I guess you know. :)

Not enough of the gun owners are trained in the communication as stated by Streetglideok above^ and there is no time to teach. Some of the Ham stuff is pretty easy to understand, but some is not at all. I'm still the basic level ham, so I can't brag.

[two shoes]

http://www.drpaddock.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/469369Tin-Can-and-String-Telephone-Posters.jpg

[Omicron]

The problem is there are a LOT of frequencies to jam, which takes a lot of power and jamming equipment, so that's not practical. For this reason, once they take out the cell and internet capability, I suspect it'll just be radio direction finding equipment and targeted strikes against anyone who transmits, either via soldiers, or perhaps via a missile or air strike.

So I suspect the first thing to go will be the cell phone network and the internet. This'll take out 80% of the general public's communications ability, as a lot of people don't have land lines any more. Next up in priority would be the civilian law enforcement and emergency responders communications, although this will be harder to do. They'd be the closest thing to an armed and trained paramilitary force to be dealt with if you're trying to take over a country, hence the priority. Military frequencies would also be a jamming priority, but are going to be exponentially harder to do, as they are hardened and expect jamming so they frequency hop and use other technological schemes to make them hard to jam. Finally is ham, but there are so few of them relative to the population that they'll be low priority. Most likely they'll be targeted by direction finding equipment as mentioned above. I don't believe CB, FRS, and GMRS will be paid much attention to because they are so short range as compared to the others.

The POTS (plain old telephone systems) will also be hard to take out, as it's somewhat hardened, and very distributed. You'd have to know exactly which relay stations to take out, and where they are, and take out all of them for a specific area to take down telephone communications to that area.

[Dave]

The problem is there are a LOT of frequencies to jam, which takes a lot of power and jamming equipment, so that's not practical. For this reason, once they take out the cell and internet capability, I suspect it'll just be radio direction finding equipment and targeted strikes against anyone who transmits, either via soldiers, or perhaps via a missile or air strike.

So I suspect the first thing to go will be the cell phone network and the internet. This'll take out 80% of the general public's communications ability, as a lot of people don't have land lines any more. Next up in priority would be the civilian law enforcement and emergency responders communications, although this will be harder to do. They'd be the closest thing to an armed and trained paramilitary force to be dealt with if you're trying to take over a country, hence the priority. Military frequencies would also be a jamming priority, but are going to be exponentially harder to do, as they are hardened and expect jamming so they frequency hop and use other technological schemes to make them hard to jam. Finally is ham, but there are so few of them relative to the population that they'll be low priority. Most likely they'll be targeted by direction finding equipment as mentioned above. I don't believe CB, FRS, and GMRS will be paid much attention to because they are so short range as compared to the others.

The POTS (plain old telephone systems) will also be hard to take out, as it's somewhat hardened, and very distributed. You'd have to know exactly which relay stations to take out, and where they are, and take out all of them for a specific area to take down telephone communications to that area.

Easiest way for them I think, is they would use drone strikes against any signals they find that are not on their authorized list.

[Wulf202]

I've got a few pigeons on the roof

[USAFGopherMike]

If you haven't read "One Second After", do that before you do anything else. As a matter of fact, go to the damn book store right now and buy it. I hate to read and I read it in one night. Couldn't put it down as a matter of fact. I recommend it to everybody now. Probably the most important book I've read in the last 2.5 years. Spoiler Alert, Thread about it here: http://www.ar-15.co/threads/34413-Those-that-recommended-One-Second-After?highlight=WILLIAM+R.+FORSTCHEN

That said, I've run some comm-out scenarios and it's chaotic. People don't cope well, everything is disorganized and normal tasks/comm takes much longer. Now imagine if you no comms and no cars. Now imagine if you had no comms, no cars, and no electricity. Go get the book.

[Dave]

Does anyone keep a faraday cage handy to protect commo equipment from either an EMP detonation or a direct hit from a solar flare? Any designs recommended or how to keep them grounded?

[ChadAmberg]

Easiest way for them I think, is they would use drone strikes against any signals they find that are not on their authorized list.

Folks would need directed EMP charges pointed upwards to take out the drones.

[Teufelhund]

Folks would need directed EMP charges pointed upwards to take out the drones.

Having been a comm tech in the Corps, I've been thinking about this one a little bit (strictly out of curiosity). Unmanned aircraft are controlled by radio signals, which can be intercepted or jammed as easily as any radio. FYI, aircraft communications are typically in the UHF band. I guess the question would be how autonomous are they when the remote control is cut off? Do they crash? Do they still fire on targets? Do they just go home?

[patrick0685]

Having been a comm tech in the Corps, I've been thinking about this one a little bit (strictly out of curiosity). Unmanned aircraft are controlled by radio signals, which can be intercepted or jammed as easily as any radio. FYI, aircraft communications are typically in the UHF band. I guess the question would be how autonomous are they when the remote control is cut off? Do they crash? Do they still fire on targets? Do they just go home?

that all depends on the Drone and what its mission is

[Omicron]

Does anyone keep a faraday cage handy to protect commo equipment from either an EMP detonation or a direct hit from a solar flare? Any designs recommended or how to keep them grounded?Eventually I'll build a real one. But for now, I have my most critical electronic equipment in the basement in an insulated container, sitting on additional insulation, contained within a metal shelf that completely surrounds it, grounded to a water pipe. Should protect it from most EMPs.

[ChadAmberg]

Blocking drone comm is tough, they tend to be satellite controlled, so their antennas are microwave and pointed up. Real tough to jam. Easy to eavesdrop since most still aren't encrypted from what I hear.

[Singlestack]

I read a book several months ago by a guy who piloted Predators in Afghanistan. They had in-theatre pilots that were responsible for takeoff and landing, and handed control off to the mission pilots located in the US. Yes, sat comm was and is used, but they did on occasion lose contact with drones. The drones were programmed to either fly in circles or return to base if comms were lost.

[Beprepared]

In relation to OP's question,
These might be work well for short range.

http://www.trisquare.us/index.html

Based on wireless phone tech, billions of channels, and encrypted.

[USAFGopherMike]

Old school rotaries with copper wire or one of those military radios where you have to crank it to charge the line. Also doubles as an excellent interrogation device if you have some jumper cables.

Edit - http://nwga.craigslist.org/clt/3483345767.html

[zteknik]

Old school rotaries with copper wire or one of those military radios where you have to crank it to charge the line. Also doubles as an excellent interrogation device if you have some jumper cables.

Edit - http://nwga.craigslist.org/clt/3483345767.html

I just use my TA-312 [Coffee]
20103

[Teufelhund]

How about a handheld ham radio? Link on Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Dual-Band-Improved-Stronger-Enhanced-Features/dp/B0097252UK/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1360265601&sr=8-2&keywords=handheld+ham+radio)

Anyone have any experience with these? Seems like a good idea for backup, long-range communications.


On the UAV side-topic, there is now some very detailed info on the web about jamming these things (even found some schematics for an appropriate jammer). I won't link to it out of respect for site liability, but it's easy to find. As has been stated, they will probably RTB if comm is killed, but at least they can't loose a missile at you.

[streetglideok]

The cheap chinese radios work pretty decently from what I've heard, though how tough they are remains in question. The radios will work for local comms, however in the event of losing the internet, your range would be limited, as some repeaters use the internet to link to other repeaters. For those situations, using the HF, sub-50mhz frequencies would allow you to talk to others hundreds of miles away. Yeah, someone can jam you, but they would have a hard time jamming all the frequencies. Sure, they can pin your location, but if you are smart, you will not transmit long in one location, making it harder to find you.

Regardless, just like shooting, the time to learn how stuff works, and learn to be proficient at it, is not when SHTF, its before. Right now, we are still in the before stages, for now at least. Plenty of places to learn the material, and get a basic tech license and figure out how things work.

[USAFGopherMike]

With good atmospheric conditions, HF can get you thousands of miles. I like that TA-312! What did you pay for it?

[zteknik]

With good atmospheric conditions, HF can get you thousands of miles. I like that TA-312! What did you pay for it?
15 years [Coffee]
It was outdated and struck from inventory-supply sgt said on the way to the dumpster if it happens to fall anywhere,oh well....
Now to find me a gra39 setup so I can remote hook it to a radio :)
Every now and then I see 312's at surplus stores going for around $45

[Dave]

I just use my TA-312 [Coffee]
20103

Those bring back some painful memories of JRTC for me. Nothing like running the wire from the TOC and holding the ends, attempting to hook them up to your phone when they decide to test the line. [taze]

[zteknik]

Those bring back some painful memories of JRTC for me. Nothing like running the wire from the TOC and holding the ends, attempting to hook them up to your phone when they decide to test the line. [taze]

[ROFL3]Even worse when it's wet out!![microwave]