Basics of an SBR build

[stoner01]

OK so Im trying to convince the wife unit to let me build another AR as a deployment gift to myself. I already have one complete gun and Im thinking to use that as the basis. How do I start the process? I dont get to be home on R&R until mid-April.

Next question I have would be since I dont have the necessary parts to have a Complete SBR, could I start building the upper and wait until I get the paperwork back to finish it or do I need a lower first.

Appreciate the help

[mtnrider]

My 2 cents would be to get a lower (good luck) and build your SBR from scratch. Do a pistol build so you can function check it then apply for your stamp. You'll be able to enjoy the gun while you wait the 6+ months for your stamp to come in.
You can assemble your upper first but DO NOT attach it to your existing rifle. You are going to need to have your upper or at least an idea of what you are going to build because you need to put the length on the Form 1.

[stoner01]

10.5. That much I am certain on.

[SAnd]

The ATF Form 1 that is used to make a short barreled rifle is an "Application to Make and Register a Firearm". You will need a gun to make into a SBR before you register it. In other words you will need at least a specific lower receiver to fill out and submit a Form 1. You will need the "name and location of the Original Manufacturer of Firearm" as well as "Model" and "Serial Number" for the form.

Have Fun.

[Darth Stang]

You should also know yo will have to get the receiver engraved with your name and city of manufacture (essentially however you register the part that will have to be on there) so think about whether to register as an individual (cannot transfer to anyone and when you die it becomes illegal) or as an NFA Trust. As an SBR, you can simplify by stating the overall length as 25", the law applies to any rifle with a total length under 26". You can change the upper at any time, even for a full length barrel. You only have to contact BATFE if you intend to make it a permamnet long barrel rifle or transfer it. I've got a couple and cool factor is high for a one time $200 payment :) Also, make sure you have a good safe or get one, you have an obligation to secure Class III items and ensure no one but you can handle them.

[Great-Kazoo]

You should also know yo will have to get the receiver engraved with your name and city of manufacture (essentially however you register the part that will have to be on there) so think about whether to register as an individual (cannot transfer to anyone and when you die it becomes illegal) or as an NFA Trust. As an SBR, you can simplify by stating the overall length as 25", the law applies to any rifle with a total length under 26". You can change the upper at any time, even for a full length barrel. You only have to contact BATFE if you intend to make it a permamnet long barrel rifle or transfer it. I've got a couple and cool factor is high for a one time $200 payment :) Also, make sure you have a good safe or get one, you have an obligation to secure Class III items and ensure no one but you can handle them.

Dude, so many inaccuracies
When you die and IF the NFA item is not in a Trust the estate / family can transfer item to them on a FORM 5
City of residence. John or Jane DOW. Liberal,Colorado

Incorrect. ANYONE can handle, shoot, etc your NFA items PROVIDING, you are on site with the,(Machine Gun shoots / Rentals) An obligation to secure any firearm yes, HOWEVER there is no mandated area or safe that they need to be "secured" in.

[O2HeN2]

...so think about whether to register as an individual (cannot transfer to anyone and when you die it becomes illegal)...
This is absolutely wrong. The engraving is the maker of the firearm (who does a Form 1 on it). It DOES NOT restrict its later sale in any way, shape or form (beyond the normal NFA requirements of a Form 4 or 5). Of course a firearm with your name on it probably won't fetch a high a price as one that came from the factory as an SBR (no engraving except for the standard manufacturing engraving that every firearm carries) or one with a cool trust name.

Assuming your "complete gun" is a rifle, don't convert it into a pistol. Nor should you buy a short barrel until you have your stamp in hand.

See this thread: http://www.ar-15.co/threads/75119-NFA-Form-1-questions-for-a-first-timer-in-El-Paso-County for a more thorough treatment of your question.

O2

[Darth Stang]

Gentlemen, not looking to start a flame war but please examine the substance of the statement. Yes you can transfer an NFA weapon after death, but that's if someone knows what the hell to do! If for some reason the "family" doesn't know WTF a form 5 is, the weapon is not legal for anyone else to own and can be confiscated. Please refrain from telling someone they are wrong when you have to throw a BIG IF to prove your point. Next, in many cases I don't know of people manufacturing their weapon in a city other than that in which they register the weapon, but I suppose you could be TECHNICALLY correct. Congrats. You still have to engrave your name, as registered on the Form 1, and city. As the intent was to be mindful of long names to be engraved on the receiver, I think the residence vs manufacture oversight is trivial, but OK you got me!

Finally, my statement on securing was wholly accurate and I'm a little surprised you would even have an issue with it. Again, if your point requires a huge IF or PROVIDING statement, then aren't you just looking for an argument? You of course can supervise the use of your class III weapons, but if you aren't around, and it's not part of a trust, then no one but you can possess the weapon. End of story. Why would you feel the need to point out something simple, unless you want me to spell out, "no one can handle them when you are sleeping, in vacation, taking a shit, ect". no you don't have to have any specific safe, but god help you if your NFA weapon ends up out of your control.

always interested in reasonable conversation.

[Great-Kazoo]

Gentlemen, not looking to start a flame war but please examine the substance of the statement. Yes you can transfer an NFA weapon after death, but that's if someone knows what the hell to do! If for some reason the "family" doesn't know WTF a form 5 is, the weapon is not legal for anyone else to own and can be confiscated. Please refrain from telling someone they are wrong when you have to throw a BIG IF to prove your point. Next, in many cases I don't know of people manufacturing their weapon in a city other than that in which they register the weapon, but I suppose you could be TECHNICALLY correct. Congrats. You still have to engrave your name, as registered on the Form 1, and city. As the intent was to be mindful of long names to be engraved on the receiver, I think the residence vs manufacture oversight is trivial, but OK you got me!

Finally, my statement on securing was wholly accurate and I'm a little surprised you would even have an issue with it. Again, if your point requires a huge IF or PROVIDING statement, then aren't you just looking for an argument? You of course can supervise the use of your class III weapons, but if you aren't around, and it's not part of a trust, then no one but you can possess the weapon. End of story. Why would you feel the need to point out something simple,Because you did not clarify the simple statement. unless you want me to spell out, "no one can handle them when you are sleeping, in vacation, taking a shit, ect". no you don't have to have any specific safe, but god help you if your NFA weapon ends up out of your control.

always interested in reasonable conversation.

It remains part of the estate UNTIL a sale or transfer is made to another person or NFA lic business. The ATF understands this and unless a way to make the system move any faster than it is. The NFA item can remain part of the estate until buyers approval is in hand.


This is what you posted.
Also, make sure you have a good safe or get one, you have an obligation to secure Class III items and ensure no one but you can handle them.
Your statement appears to mean NEVER handle. Since you mentioned TRIVIAL. How you worded it is incorrect, BUT trivial at the same time. ANYONE CAN Handle any NFA item. PROVIDING NFA paperwork and owner is in attendance. Regarding SECURING in a SAFE. Absolutely, it's a no brainer. However to date not one ATF agent or LE entity has ever contacted me or anyone else I know to see where and how their NFA items were secured,Even prior to approval.

If my NFA items became Out of my control, they were stolen at which point i nor any other NFA owner can be responsible for what happens. However in today's litigious society, i know the lawyers would be lined up at a victims house like people at gun shows for a slice of the pie.

You being upset with me is due to you being incorrect and or not clarifying the trivial wording of your op.

[Darth Stang]

Jim, not upset with you. You have no bearing on my life. Just trying to offer the guy some advice from my own experience.

[O2HeN2]

Gentlemen, not looking to start a flame war but please examine the substance of the statement. Yes you can transfer an NFA weapon after death, but that's if someone knows what the hell to do! If for some reason the "family" doesn't know WTF a form 5 is, the weapon is not legal for anyone else to own and can be confiscated. Please refrain from telling someone they are wrong when you have to throw a BIG IF to prove your point.
So let me see if I got this right, you said, without qualification, that if you engrave your name to make an SBR "[you] cannot transfer to anyone and when you die it becomes illegal".

That's wrong any way you look at it. Then you harp on me that though right, you have to know the process and that somehow makes what I said wrong? Well, duh, yes, you do have to know the process. If you're planning on Form 5ing an SBR to a next of kin one would hope you've talked to them about it before you croak.

So let's make this simple: You: Wrong. Me: Right.

If you don't want a flame war, don't post incorrect information. It's hard enough to navigate the NFA world without misinformed people giving bad advice.

O2

[sako55]

This helped me with filling out the paperwork
http://www.guntrustlawyer.com/form1.html

and this
http://forums.officer.com/t107341/

This applies to the trust route.