And another American institution destroyed

[Melvin]

So yet again we get to witness a 100 year old institution being destroyed by the yellow back invertebrates in suits that run the BSA as they capitulate to nature's criminals. Hopefully the religious organizations will cut all ties with the BSLA and create a new organization that sticks to the principles that Baden Powell put in place.




http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2013/01/29/boy-scouts-america-may-drop-gay-ban/

__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____

"I hope they all die screaming of ass cancer" - Sean Penn

[Zundfolge]

I can't imagine this is going to work out well for the BSA.

I suspect that they are about to lose a ton of funding, members and places to meet.

[Ridge]

Wow, fucking really?

[Great-Kazoo]

Wow, fucking really?

No, Fucking Rand. This will give a Hole new meaning to the Boy Scout Salute[pileoshit]

[Colorado Osprey]

There was a bunch of back-lash when the scouts announced that gays were not welcome last year. Many parents pulled their support and kids from scouts.
This turn around is probably to try and get those kids and support back in scouting.

That being said, it makes things uncomfortable for non-gay kids knowing they are sharing private space like cabins and showers with gay kids.
This is the main reason that gays have not been welcome in the past... kind of like mixed male/female spaces.
Gay leaders I have never had a problem with as adults don't share personal space or facilities with the kids. Exception being if you are a leader you can tent with your child only.

[merl]

I don't see what the fuss is.

[MarkCO]

I don't see what the fuss is.

And thus the America we now live in.

[Ridge]

And thus the America we now live in.

Yeah, we should go back to executing the gays.

[StagLefty]

After being a Scout as a kid and an adult leader for 15 years-I hated to see this moral compromise due to PC pressure. What the organization may not anticipate is a huge loss of adult VOLUNTEERS. The BSA is nothing without these folks. Several fellow Scout leaders I've talked to today have said that's it for them.
Just another sign of the decline of this country and it's standards.

[MarkCO]

Yeah, we should go back to executing the gays.

You just proved my point.

[Dave_L]

It's an all boy/man organization. Letting in a person that is gay is the same as letting a female in, IMO. They might find themselves with a hefty lawsuit if there's an "incident" during a camp out. However, who's to say they don't already have gays/pedo's in there already? I am not familiar with how membership works though. Do they have a screening process or is it a "Fill this form out and you're in" kind of thing. How many people would come out and say "I'm gay!" that are trying to join BSA or would announce it if they are already in it?

[Ridge]

You just proved my point.

Wasn't your point that tolerance is the downfall of society?

[StagLefty]

It's an all boy/man organization. Letting in a person that is gay is the same as letting a female in, IMO. They might find themselves with a hefty lawsuit if there's an "incident" during a camp out. However, who's to say they don't already have gays/pedo's in there already? I am not familiar with how membership works though. Do they have a screening process or is it a "Fill this form out and you're in" kind of thing. How many people would come out and say "I'm gay!" that are trying to join BSA or would announce it if they are already in it?

You have to have a background check run if your going to be a leader and also take their Youth Protection Course.

[Fmedges]

There was a bunch of back-lash when the scouts announced that gays were not welcome last year. Many parents pulled their support and kids from scouts.
This turn around is probably to try and get those kids and support back in scouting.

That being said, it makes things uncomfortable for non-gay kids knowing they are sharing private space like cabins and showers with gay kids.
This is the main reason that gays have not been welcome in the past... kind of like mixed male/female spaces.
Gay leaders I have never had a problem with as adults don't share personal space or facilities with the kids. Exception being if you are a leader you can tent with your child only.

We shared spaces in the Corps with a gay man that was in my plt and we never had a problem at all. I am not a gay man, but I don't think that they are any less people than the rest of us. I have had a gay teacher at school that was very effeminate to the point where it was very distracting and every gesture or phrase was sexual in nature. I think that the individual dictates whether their sexuality is going cause issues or not. That being said if organizations don't want gay, straight, women or men for example then they should be allowed to do as they want. I'm sure that the BSA has had to eat a lot of shit over the years for this stance, but I don't have a problem with it.

[car-15]

It's an all boy/man organization. Letting in a person that is gay is the same as letting a female in, IMO. They might find themselves with a hefty lawsuit if there's an "incident" during a camp out. However, who's to say they don't already have gays/pedo's in there already? I am not familiar with how membership works though. Do they have a screening process or is it a "Fill this form out and you're in" kind of thing. How many people would come out and say "I'm gay!" that are trying to join BSA or would announce it if they are already in it?
there is a full background check, and over an 1 hr of training on youth protection. our troop is sponsored by a Methodist church, (they appear to be fruit friendly) so them letting the charter of the troops decide is going to be interesting for us to say the least.

[Dave_L]

You have to have a background check run if your going to be a leader and also take their Youth Protection Course.

Good to know. Thanks for the info. I'm still willing to bet there's plenty of gays already in there that just don't publicize it and probably wouldn't even if they started accepting gays officially.

[StagLefty]

Wasn't your point that tolerance is the downfall of society?

Helluva difference between tolerance and acceptance IMHO

[XC700116]

We shared spaces in the Corps with a gay man that was in my plt and we never had a problem at all. I am not a gay man, but I don't think that they are any less people than the rest of us. I have had a gay teacher at school that was very effeminate to the point where it was very distracting and every gesture or phrase was sexual in nature. I think that the individual dictates whether their sexuality is going cause issues or not. That being said if organizations don't want gay, straight, women or men for example then they should be allowed to do as they want. I'm sure that the BSA has had to eat a lot of shit over the years for this stance, but I don't have a problem with it.

I'd have to agree with Fmedges on this pretty much to a T.

IMO, the attitude that gays are somehow less than human is on the same level as anti-gun people trying to persecute us for exercising our 2A rights. No matter the mix if everyone involved is a consenting adult and it happens behind closed doors, I don't care if they what they do sexually.

Also the fact that any organization should be allowed to pick and choose who they want as members and who they don't know matter the reasons.

Life, LIBERTY, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

[StagLefty]

^ Big issue is adults and kids not consenting adults,

[XC700116]

^ Big issue is adults and kids not consenting adults,

So you're saying that you believe the myth that all gays are pedophiles??

[Fmedges]

When I was in the scouts as a kid, the last thing that every came up was anything that was ever sexual. Everything was focused on being a good person and learning about wilderness and crafting.

[rockhound]

ya know i dont care about gays, they can be whatever they want, it does not bother me, they want to be gay great, get married i dont care

what i dont understand is why every group feels that they have to be out in the open and accepted by everyone and if they are not then they sue to be accepted and think that now it is going to be alright,

if they are discriminated against then they not only get to sue to be included, but then they get their own group and cause they were discriminated against they get get to make up for it by having their group that discriminate and they get to participate in the other group they forced their way into.


for example, if the gay kid just kept his mouth shut then the BSA would not know anything about it and he would have been a scout, the BSA has a lot of religious overtones and gays are not generally accepted by christians, so now we sue so that we can be in your face openly gay and screw your values, they dont meet my values and mine take precedent

the black college students were not getting grants and scholarships back in the day so they sued, and now they are participating equally in all the grants and scholarships and they have their own that discriminate against anyone who is not black, whites should sue to get into the United Negro College fund, When i was in college i was turned down for grants because the money was being held for colored students, no lie that is a quote.

the country did not want a muslim center near the towers and so the muslims sued. now they will be in your face and forcing you to accept them

illegal aliens are not getting instate tuition rates so now they are suing, they come here get all kinds of free shit a free high school education and now they want to benefits of voting tax paying citizens and a lower cost college education.

all of this crap is enough to make you a hater,

wtf, is wrong with dont ask dont tell, your policies make my gay kid feel left out and unaccepted, well life is a bitch, your gay kid is making my straight kids feel uncomfortable, i dont parade around in your night clubs and your houses making you accept me

we are here illegally we are not getting the same chances that citizens are, well tough shit, get in line and come here legally then when we determine that you are not a scumbag you can come here and be a productive member of society

get over yourself, live your life and leave people alone, stop trying to make everyone like you, accept you, there are plenty of people who dont like me so what, get up go to work make living stop looking for a handout, and you will be alright. stop trying to make people accept your sexuality, color, race, religion etc.

i am a christian, white male, i dont have to accept you for any reason, if you are not a complete dick then we will get along fine regardless of your color, race, religion, sexuality

you could be a muslim queer with a black father and a chinese mother for all i care, if you are here legally, paying taxes, voting and holding a job that you are good at, upholding the constitution, and raising kids that dont want to kill me because i am not then we will get along just fine,

for the rest of you, bite me

[MarkCO]

Wasn't your point that tolerance is the downfall of society?

Not even close.

[StagLefty]

So you're saying that you believe the myth that all gays are pedophiles??

Your assuming something I didn't say

[XC700116]

When I was in the scouts as a kid, the last thing that every came up was anything that was ever sexual. Everything was focused on being a good person and learning about wilderness and crafting.

Exactly, that's the way it was when I was in the scouts as well.

[Melvin]

I'd have to agree with Fmedges on this pretty much to a T.

IMO, the attitude that gays are somehow less than human is on the same level as anti-gun people trying to persecute us for exercising our 2A rights. No matter the mix if everyone involved is a consenting adult and it happens behind closed doors, I don't care if they what they do sexually.

Also the fact that any organization should be allowed to pick and choose who they want as members and who they don't know matter the reasons.

Life, LIBERTY, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

This about kids. That's why it isn't called the Man Scouts of America.

As to your second point, you may want to point that out to the stool pusher mafia.

[XC700116]

Your assuming something I didn't say

OK, then please explain in further detail what you mean.

It's already been mentioned that scout leaders aren't allowed to bunk with the kids unless it's their kid and only their kid. Are you talking about a gay kid somehow trying to get it on with a straight kid?

[Melvin]

Exactly, that's the way it was when I was in the scouts as well.

That's because you don't bring a cat to a dog show.

[MarkCO]

When I was in the scouts as a kid, the last thing that every came up was anything that was ever sexual. Everything was focused on being a good person and learning about wilderness and crafting.

And you hit the nail on the head.


get over yourself, live your life and leave people alone, stop trying to make everyone like you, accept you, there are plenty of people who dont like me so what, get up go to work make living stop looking for a handout, and you will be alright. stop trying to make people accept your sexuality, color, race, religion etc.
Agree!

[StagLefty]

OK, then please explain in further detail what you mean.

It's already been mentioned that scout leaders aren't allowed to bunk with the kids unless it's their kid and only their kid. Are you talking about a gay kid somehow trying to get it on with a straight kid?
All I'm addressing is a 100 year old organization dropping one of their traditional rules.

[hatidua]

BSA policy, either for/against homosexuality isn't going to increase/decrease the number of gay scouts any more than new gun legislation put forth by Feinstein/Obama is going to affect criminals getting guns. You can have all the rules/regulations/laws you want but they will never equate compliance.

[XC700116]

This about kids. That's why it isn't called the Man Scouts of America.

As to your second point, you may want to point that out to the stool pusher mafia.

The first point was directed at you and your assertion of "nature's criminals" and the fact that IMO you're no better than the gun grabbers.

The second point is pretty clear in that I don't buy the BS about forcing organizations to accept those they don't want. And the Courts have agreed on this as well with regards to the BSA multiple times in the past. The fact that they have decided on a national level to now allow gays, but are leaving it up to individual local troops to decide for themselves how they wish to go on with the issue and their own membership, tells me they just want the fight to be over with on a national level.

[Rucker61]

I can't imagine this is going to work out well for the BSA.

I suspect that they are about to lose a ton of funding, members and places to meet.

According to Wikipedia, the LDS church sponsors about 30,000 Scout units, about 13% of Scouts by population. I would assume they'd pull their sponsorship.

[XC700116]

All I'm addressing is a 100 year old organization dropping one of their traditional rules.

Ahh, got it.

[StagLefty]

According to Wikipedia, the LDS church sponsors about 30,000 Scout units, about 13% of Scouts by population. I would assume they'd pull their sponsorship.

I didn't even consider that !!! The Mormon church uses the Scout program as their youth program.

[XC700116]

According to Wikipedia, the LDS church sponsors about 30,000 Scout units, about 13% of Scouts by population. I would assume they'd pull their sponsorship.

Hopefully they'd just knock it down to local level and support those local troops that choose to keep their troop in line with what the church feels is right. But who knows.

[clublights]

Oh Jesus .....

They are letting it be decided at troop level ... if you and yours don't want to have gay scouts or leaders then change troops or start your own.

I'm an Eagle and see nothing wrong here.
You anti gay folks seem to be worried about the super flamer dancing in their underwear on the float at the gay pride parade.

Guess what THOSE gays WON'T JOIN SCOUTS. They don't go camping, they are not "outdoorsy" they would want nothing to do with Scouts or kids.

Gay pedophiles are not going to advertise the fact they are gay pedophiles if the scouts let gays in or not . cuz guess what .. BEING A PEDOPHIlLE IS ILLEGAL.

Gay pedophiles already manage to get in to scouting and have caused problems. Let's gays in or not will not change this problem. Hell might even help prevent it . The Gay pedophile Might let it slip he is a pedophile to the other Gay leaders and then they can kick him out. Just because your gay doesn't mean you wouldn't wanna protect your/others child from a predator .


But equating gay with pedophile is like saying gun owner = murderer.

[Rucker61]

Hopefully they'd just knock it down to local level and support those local troops that choose to keep their troop in line with what the church feels is right. But who knows.

I would suspect that troops sponsored by the LDS are likely to be led and managed by church members, so locally there might not be much change. The annual national/regional gatherings might get interesting, though.

[MarkCO]

Guess what THOSE gays WON'T JOIN SCOUTS. They don't go camping, they are not "outdoorsy" they would want nothing to do with Scouts or kids.


So you use a stereotypical response to refute stereotypes...The friends I have had that were homosexual did not fit your stereotype, and one was in the Scouts as a youth and made Eagle Scout.

[Melvin]

The first point was directed at you and your assertion of "nature's criminals" and the fact that IMO you're no better than the gun grabbers.

The second point is pretty clear in that I don't buy the BS about forcing organizations to accept those they don't want. And the Courts have agreed on this as well with regards to the BSA multiple times in the past. The fact that they have decided on a national level to now allow gays, but are leaving it up to individual local troops to decide for themselves how they wish to go on with the issue and their own membership, tells me they just want the fight to be over with on a national level.

If you violate the law you are a criminal. Violating the nature hardly equates to a right. If some dude was schtupping goat, a cactus or corpse, an apple pie you still going to stand there and say he is normal? No you're not because you haven't been brainwashed to think that was normal.

Good thing their mindset(BSA management) didn't hold sway back in the 40s or we would all be speaking germanese. Just another example of spineless Americans more concerned with being liked than standing on principle.

[clublights]

So you use a stereotypical response to refute stereotypes...The friends I have had that were homosexual did not fit your stereotype, and one was in the Scouts as a youth and made Eagle Scout.


Were your Gay scouting friends the type to dance on the gay pride parade float in their underwear?

[Rucker61]

If you violate the law you are a criminal. Violating the nature hardly equates to a right. If some dude was schtupping goat, a cactus or corpse, an apple pie you still going to stand there and say he is normal? No you're not because you haven't been brainwashed to think that was normal.

Good thing their mindset(BSA management) didn't hold sway back in the 40s or we would all be speaking germanese. Just another example of spineless Americans more concerned with being liked than standing on principle.

Gosh, you're a hoot.

[XC700116]

If you violate the law you are a criminal. Violating the nature hardly equates to a right. If some dude was schtupping goat, a cactus or corpse, an apple pie you still going to stand there and say he is normal? No you're not because you haven't been brainwashed to think that was normal.

Good thing their mindset(BSA management) didn't hold sway back in the 40s or we would all be speaking germanese. Just another example of spineless Americans more concerned with being liked than standing on principle.

Newsflash, a goat can't give consent, and last I checked bestiality is illegal.

I'm not trying to change your mind, but I still think you're on the same level as the gun grabbers saying we are somehow bad people for owning firearms. Liberty is Liberty, god will judge them, it's not for me to do as they do NO HARM to me by living their lives the way they choose without infringing on my Liberty.

If you had it your way would you make being gay illegal????

[TS12000]

I have no problems with people fucking cacti. Darwin's award and all that jazz....

[tmjohnson]

My grandsons won't be joining the Boy Scouts

[Dave]

All the hatred spewing forth over this and people wonder why I say out loud that humans likely won't make it another century. All of you that cling to ideas like this and support people like Santorum and Walsh are why Obama got re-elected. Moderate voters won't vote for tea party whack jobs or Evangelical preachers. So those of us who are conservative outside of religious issues end up voting 3rd party or not at all.

[sniper7]

I don't see what the big deal is. I work with a ton of gays. they are good people, just trying to get their rights like everyone else. When they ask me about gay marriage...I tell em have at it. they can be with the same person for the rest of their life and if they decide not to, then lose half your shit.
I'm guessing a lot of the kids in scouts don't even really know they are gay yet. the ones that do are probably not as into it. the ridicule they will get from the other kids will push them out.
If you are worried about a gay troop leader that is understandable, but what about a priest who likes boys. that happens a heck of a lot more then you hear about a gay guy assaulting/molesting children.

The ones that annoy me are the flamboyant ones who have to go out of their way to let you know they are the gayest person you have ever met. But that happens with all types of people...women that have to push the issue that they think they are the hottest, or people who think they are the smartest, or guys who think they are the coolest, or gun shop employees who think they know ever damn rifle ever made and everything about them. Each group has its shitheads. that is life.

[centrarchidae]

I'm lost. What principle are we losing because of this?



Good thing their mindset(BSA management) didn't hold sway back in the 40s or we would all be speaking germanese. Just another example of spineless Americans more concerned with being liked than standing on principle.