View Full Version : Case Annealing Question
I am looking into buying a case annealing machine and will be happy if it "just" extends case life....but the question I have is: if done properly will it aid in accuracy? Has anyone tested the process to see if there is a measurable change or delta in the ES? I recognize there are a great deal of variables to be considered but wonder what others have found in this area. My initial thought is to number about 25 cases, anneal prior to each load, and record the velocities over a number of identical trial loads to see how much they very.
spittoon
03-25-2013, 19:37
Case annealing good question. I do not know the answer but I all ways thought it was for case life to keep the brass soft to relieve stress from "work harding" after resizing or forming.
XC700116
03-25-2013, 19:57
Interesting for sure, but I would think that if done in a consistent, automated process, it should (along with neck turning) produce more consistent neck tension, so possibly increased accuracy.
I am certain you are right about extending the case life but I have noticed that while seating bullets I will occasionally seat one that "feels" a little more resistant than the others while going in the case. Since they are all from the same lot I thought it might be attributed the way the bullet was sitting on the case, perhaps slightly misaligned, differences in case lube while the neck was formed or even the rate at which the ram is actuated in the various steps. It does feel like there are slight variances in the neck tension (felt or perceived while bullet seating) which could be attributed to work hardening. My thought is annealing might relieve the brass in the neck area to a nominal hardness and mitigate any (some) differences in neck tension by returning to a baseline. I just don't know. I did a google search but couldn't find any quantitative info from testing on the subject. Plenty of claims such as improved accuracy (undefined) and the case life being extended 10x. I am sure there members here that would have some experiential input, if not test data that would be beneficial for sharing. Thanks
Interesting for sure, but I would think that if done in a consistent, automated process, it should (along with neck turning) produce more consistent neck tension, so possibly increased accuracy.
Yes I would certainly want an automated process, considering how fast the brass heats, I don't think my response time would offer much consistency.
paddywagon
03-25-2013, 21:27
It's been my experience that you do not need a machine to do this. I have sttod mine up in a water bath that comes about half way up the case and heated the necks with a torch until kind of a cherry red color and then knock them over in the water. trick I learned years ago and works well.
A lot of guys use a cordless drill fitted with a deep-well socket that the brass will just drop into and a propane torch. Set the torch up so it doesn't move or burn anything. Run the drill and spin the case neck & shoulder in the flame, drop into bucket of water. Repeat.
If the case necks are getting cherry red that is way to hot . Go over to AccurateShooter.com , used to be 6mmbr.com , they have a very good article on annealing .
Short answer is yes it helps in my experience .
If the case necks are getting cherry red that is way to hot . Go over to AccurateShooter.com , used to be 6mmbr.com , they have a very good article on annealing .
Short answer is yes it helps in my experience .
How Would you characterize the change in accuracy as tighter groups or the mitigation of "fliers"?
What I have seen is the more uniform neck tension leads to better constancy , closer ES and SD numbers and fewer fliers .
If the load doesn't shoot all ready it isn't going to fix that .
I've got the Bench Source machine and there is no way I'd do this stuff by hand . I can get about 500 cases an hour done after setup is complete .
Also I only do this on my precision rifle ammo , no way I'd mess with it loading AR ammo .
Well I put in my order for the Girard and they say I can expect it in June, yikes. It was a toss up, I really liked the models with the turntable and being able to do multiple cartridge types but am concerned about some that don't turn the case as as they are heated. The model I really like ran about a grand and that just seamed a bit steep. Does yours pause or index while undergoing heating? Which model did you get? Do you notice any differences in bullet seating tension?
Well I put in my order for the Girard and they say I can expect it in June, yikes. It was a toss up, I really liked the models with the turntable and being able to do multiple cartridge types but am concerned about some that don't turn the case as as they are heated. The model I really like ran about a grand and that just seamed a bit steep. Does yours pause or index while undergoing heating? Which model did you get? Do you notice any differences in bullet seating tension?
I have the Giraud and am very happy. I ordered 223, 308, 338 and 50 BMG conversions for it as well.
Dont forget to order some templaq.
As far as I know Bench Source only has the one model . The shell plate indexes each case and there is a small turntable that spins the case in the torches .
The neck tension while seating is the biggest thing that is noticeable , they are all way more consistent than UN appealed brass where you get some stiff and some loose and everything in between .
I have to agree the Bench Source looks like the best platform, I have an email into them asking for the cost and time to ship. If I can find a timely alternative I might move in that direction.
I have the Giraud and am very happy. I ordered 223, 308, 338 and 50 BMG conversions for it as well.
Dont forget to order some templaq.
I have the Giraurd trimmer and have been very satisfied with the workmanship. My only concern with the Giraurd Annealer is the way the cartridge falls after being annealed ? I thought I would have them drop into some water for fear of the cartridge falling on the hot mouth or neck. Have you had any issues with the way the cases drop? Also do you have sufficient control over the duration of the heat cycle?
IIRC Mine was 550ish , they told me they assembled them in batches when the parts arrived . When i ordered mine they had it in stock . The 2 torches and spinning the case and the multiple calibers with the one shell plate is what sold me on it .
IIRC Mine was 550ish , they told me they assembled them in batches when the parts arrived . When i ordered mine they had it in stock . The 2 torches and spinning the case and the multiple calibers with the one shell plate is what sold me on it .
Well I finally got a reply from Bench Source and they stated they had them in stock and ready to ship so I went ahead and ordered. Debating whether I should cancel the Giruard or just have two. It really is a sickness.
Great-Kazoo
04-01-2013, 19:32
Well I finally got a reply from Bench Source and they stated they had them in stock and ready to ship so I went ahead and ordered. Debating whether I should cancel the Giruard or just have two. It really is a sickness.
Good Things come to Those who Wait.
I received the Bench Source Machine last night and must say it looks well built. I ordered the Tempilaq on the same day I ordered the Annealing machine so hopefully it gets here soon. I can't wait to test this thing out.
I am looking into the Bench Source annealer for high volume processing as well as uniformity for precision rifle. Since this is a 5.5 year old thread, I though a couple people using them could give me some insights (ease of use, durability, etc.) . Also, how it compares to the Giraud or making my own.
I am looking into the Bench Source annealer for high volume processing as well as uniformity for precision rifle. Since this is a 5.5 year old thread, I though a couple people using them could give me some insights (ease of use, durability, etc.) . Also, how it compares to the Giraud or making my own.
I have and use them both, for high volume of a single type of case then the Girard . I haven?t had any mechanical issues with either unit. Although annealing did make a slight difference in precision i doubt it worth the expense for most shooters.
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