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I can easily see that manning is a traitor, but am still glad I know some of the stuff that leaked. Such as the state dept memo acknowledging that the 90% of Mexico guns are not from US dealers but the us gov aid to SAmerica, not mom and pop civilian dealers that hillaryclinton lied about two weeks later.
Snowden, IMO, did the USA a great favor by leaking what he did. If the GOP wins in 2014/6, I think snowdens leaks might have contributed to it. Hatidua put it quite well I think.
Our government is trashing the constitution and the guy that pulled back the curtain is a traitor?
When this first was a story, we had a thread about this and I think Aloha had an explanation of how whether right or wrong, he is a traitor by definition.
Yes, technically he is a traitor.
So were Washington, Revere, and Jefferson.
Snowden social engineered passwords, broke into accounts, vacuumed up all kinds of information, planned out his departure from the country and did all of this in what, six months? There's no way he went in as a wide-eyed naive kid who became disillusioned and decided to break it out on the spur of the moment.
The calling records are equivalent to the outside of the envelope when you drop something in the mail. This story has been spun from the start by those who don't like the NSA at all -- like Harold Stimson shutting down the Cipher Bureau because "gentlemen don't read each other's mail." Contrast that to the IRS asking Tea Party groups for records of their meetings, letters, etc.
The fact of the matter is that Snowden has done incalculable damage to national security. People who really feel they're whistleblowers don't typically run off just before the news breaks -- look at the Pentagon Papers. While I'm happy he put the lie to Hillary's statements about firearm trafficking and Mexico, who here really needed his confirmation that she was lying through her teeth? In the meantime, I'm NOT happy about him revealing to the PRC, Russia, AQ, et al how we find and track their agents.
On this one note, every gun grabber in the US needed to know she was lying.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aloha_Shooter
Irving, the problem is that none of the gun grabbers will pay any attention to that. They're all living in their little fantasy worlds ignoring things like facts and logic already. One more piece of evidence that Hillary lies is ... redundant and almost pointless.
It's better to be able to prove that she lied, than to just be confident about it. That kind of thing is what shuts people up, even when you know they'll never agree with you. Back to Snowden.
Since the 1990s people have been warning us that EVERYTHING you do online, every phone call, ever credit card purchase, was "ingested" (to use Snowden's term) into a massive digital database. These people were usually laughed off as "kooks." What Snowden did was verify this. Not only that, but he alleged the existence of an international intelligence apparatus operating outside of any government oversight, of which the NSA supposedly was only a part. I found it interesting that he defended his actions by claiming it was not "treason" since he revealed it to American journalists for free rather than to another government for profit. I do not know anything about the nature of the leaked documents, nor do 99% of the American people. What the media is reporting, for the most part, is simply that "the NSA" (or whoever) is collecting ALL online and digital activity into a database, storing it forever, and occasionally misusing it. It is about time the average citizen was made aware of that, but Snowden is no hero for violating his oaths and breaking multiple laws. He could've gone about this another way, without releasing his "proof" to the general public and getting all our allies pissed off at the United States. I doubt anything will change, and in 6 months it will be forgotten, and a year later Snowden will be found dead of "natural causes."
Snowden is merely pealing back the curtain that Obama has in front of the peering at each of us, if you support Obama, it would make sense to oppose Snowden.