For you anti death penalty members…

My oppositions:
1: Courts get wrong guy
2: Appeal process for DP costs millions (cheaper to throw them away for life)
3: DP is getting off easy in my book. Life sentence means they sit there for a long long time and think about what they did to get there.
4: DP is not a deterrent for violent crime. Don't have the studies in front of me but I can dig them up if you want.
5: "We kill people that kill people to teach people that killing people is wrong"
6: A vast majority of victims families are not satisfied once "vengence" is done. They still feel empty and they most often don't feel like killing them was such a good idea. (Again, don't have the reports but I can dig them up).
7: People make mistakes in life, the DP is available for punishment even for non-murder/rape crimes. I think if you kidnap somebody and ask for money you don't deserve to die.
8: A lot of people convicted of the DP have a public defender for their counsel.

I'm also religious and I think that anybody can be "reformed" by God. You don't have to agree with me and you most certainly aren't going to change my mind on that one.

With regards to the religious part, God says that you are supposed to obey Caesar's law as well as God's. And there's a difference between being forgiven for your sins, and having to pay the penalty for them.

I agree if there's doubt, the death penalty becomes questionable. However, in those cases where there's no question I think it's appropriate. Prison doesn't appear to be a terribly viable deterrent for many; I also don't understand why we should pay to keep some of that scum alive after what they've done.

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Originally Posted by cebeu

I don't either but thats a different discussion. That said, this case, confession, hard evidence, vile crime, is death deserved or not?

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Do they deserve to die? Yes. Should they receive the death penalty? No.

I try (and usually fail) to not be a hypocrite. I'm against the death penalty for most of the reasons already mentioned by other people, so I don't get to pick and choose.

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Originally Posted by OgenRwot

My oppositions:
1: Courts get wrong guy

Agreed, but they didn't here IMO, and the opinion is admittedly media-based.

2: Appeal process for DP cost millions (cheaper to throw them away for life)

That, too, the end-to-end cost associated with such heavy state-accepted responsibility is a topic unto itself, pron and con. I'm with ya' here but there's more disucssion to be had than just stating; "the DP costs more." Yeah, it does, would never debate that fact and as a responsible citizen I would expect it to be when employed.


3: DP is getting off easy in my book. Life sentence means they sit there for a long long time and think about what they did to get there.

Agreed.


4: DP is not a deterrent for violent crime. Don't have the studies in front of me but I can dig them up if you want.

No, I'm good re: research but thank you.

5: "We kill people that kill people to teach people that killing people is wrong"

No comment.


6: A vast majority of victims families are not satisfied once "vengence" is done. They still feel empty and they most often don't feel like killing them was such a good idea. (Again, don't have the reports but I can dig them up).

I would be interested in more references on this topic, pass those along please and thanks.


7: People make mistakes in life, the DP is available for punishment even for non-murder/rape crimes. I think if you kidnap somebody and ask for money you don't deserve to die.


This case, yup...and these mistakes deserve termination in my book.


8: A lot of people convicted of the DP have a public defender for their counsel.

Agreed.


I'm also religious and I think that anybody can be "reformed" by God. You don't have to agree with me and you most certainly aren't going to change my mind on that one.

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Understood and not my privilege nor intent to do so.


Appreciate the comments OgenRwot, sincerely, thanks.

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Originally Posted by jake

Do they deserve to die? Yes. Should they receive the death penalty? No.

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You can reconcile that Jake, I can't, strange eh, such differing perspectives? Good position you have. Thanks.

I've grown to not view the death penalty as a punishment (despite the name). It's just what you do when a citizen has exhausted their right to exist in society in any way, shape, or form. It's kind of a detached opinion, but you have to be some what detached in order to deal with difficult things and not self destruct.

So what about the Darfur thing? Or Traffic problems in China.
We are so removed from the actual case in reference I don't think we can offer a Fair and Just opinion on the matter. Each and every circumstance and case, arguments for and against are different.

Sure, we can spout statistics and case studies and religious or philosophical rhetoric until we are all blue in the face, pat each other on the ass and go drink beer. That poor man lost his entire family, My Opinion? Ask HIM.

If it were me? Someone shoot me, my life would be over anyway.

Usually, I'm for the death penalty in military case's only.
Remember that Jesus Christ recieved the death penalty.

DP can be misused, if the crime warrants and the evidence supports the conviction i have no issue.

as for these two asshats, i would pulled the trigger myself and sleep well at night.

I believe the death penalty is 100% effective in preventing THAT PARTICULAR convict from ever doing harm again. so, in that respect, it is very effective. I agree that it's application is at best haphazard and capricious, but in cases where there is no doubt, such as when a suspect admits freely to his crimes in open court with full knowledge of the consequences, and this is backed up by iron clad physical evidence, then the death penalty is appropriate. As flawed as our justice system is, I believe they get it right far more often than they get it wrong.