Sure did.
Sure did.
Why not tile? I always did tile for kitchen & bathrooms (plus any laundry or mud rooms) and then hardwood on the rest of the surfaces. Seems that that's the recommended setup anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinelement
Why tile?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
Wood floors look way better.
I have tile in the mud room and bathrooms. Better for moisture.
You answered your own question in the same post. You don't get moisture on the floors in the kitchen? Seems just as prone to liquid as bathrooms.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinelement
You shower in your kitchen? Walk in from the snow with wet boots in the kitchen?
Our kitchen is a place that is clean. We prepare food there. If the kids want a glass of water they can sit at the table in the dinning room which is tile, or have it in a spill proof sippy cup. It's not an area that is exposed to 3 hot humid showers a day. Yes things get spilled, but I clean it up right away. They are work, but worth it in my opinion. Properly taken care of they last way longer than carpet.
You said it wasn't the norm. I just bought a house built in '92 with original hardwood floors. My in laws have had their house since '72, original hardwood floors.
I originally answered your thread by saying I have hard wood floors and love them. I will do them again.
My parents-in-law (not sure that is an actual term...) did bamboo floors about eight years ago, entire (large) home, cost a fortune. In hindsight, I don't think they would have chosen bamboo again for a host of reasons.
It looked great for the first month though...
My parents did bamboo floors several years ago (5+) and their floor still looks good from what I remember.
+1.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinelement
I am in 25-30 new home kitchens or newly renovated Kitchens per month. The large majority of them are wood floors. Tile comes in second and vinyl(all types) third.
Lobbed from my electronic ball and chain.
Moisture content, noise and warmth, IMO, are the 3 top concerns with wood flooring. Therfore, I would not put it in bedrooms, bathrooms, laundrys or basements (engineered in basements if you must). Surface moisture, if wiped up relatively quick, shouldn't be an issue. Air moisture from swamp coolers or unfinished basements will cause expansion and contraction opening up cracks constantly. Lots of pros to hardwood over carpet but there are a few cons which include 230lbs of excitable dogs. Tinnelment is probably correct though. Don't put it where dogs access the back yard.
I have a wood floor, but the boards are a composite with solid wood on top, and layers underneath that kind of look like OSB or fiberboard. The floor is not as tough as hardwood. My dog's nails (which we keep trimmed) have scratched and gouged the floor. If we were going to do it over, we would get real hardwood.
The only issue I have seen with wood in kitchens is if there is a leak and it is not fixed promptly. I know of people that have had leaks from ice maker lines and dishwashers that caused a lot of damage.
This is why I would be (and have done) doing tile in the kitchen. In most of the homes I've been in the wood stops at the kitchen, bathrooms, laundry room & mud rooms and I think it's a good idea to avoid potential liquid damage. I'm sure the odds are low but they're certainly quite a bit higher than living rooms and hallways. Plus I prefer the look of tile in the kitchen to match up with the counter tops & such. We'e got cherry cabinets so a lighter color wood in the kitchen might not look as good either.Quote:
Originally Posted by newracer
Thanks for all the info fellas. Keep it coming!
Light wood and dark cabinets look okay in my studio. The wood floors are reclaimed bowling lanes from "celebrity" when it was demoed.
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/26/ybate4yq.jpg
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That does look good but the key there is the contrast. Youi've got VERY dark cabinets and VERY light floors and the contrast looks fantastic. My floors and cabinets would likely be in the same color pallet family which I'm concerned wouldn't look as good. Whereas with a tile I've got the warm colored wood and then a cool colored/textured tile so it works better. I know I'm knit picking but I've done this a few times and IMO if you can be picky you might as well. Nice kitchen BTW. I'm sure whoever does the bulk of the cooking doesn't appreciate the spaciousness between the fridge & oven/counters though. Speaking of fridge is that a Viking or Subzero?Quote:
Originally Posted by Firehaus
To be brutally honest, whomever installed that floor is an idiot. Those who know what I'm talking about will see it right off. Looks like it was installed in sheets. Unless it is supposed to look like that, then I suppose I'm the idiot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Firehaus
I'm not a pro, but my Pa was and he showed me lots of things, including how to install hardwood flooring.
We once ripped up an old gymnasium and used the hardwood to redo the upstairs (pop-top) in our house. It was a long, arduous summer.
Seems. I wonder if that's how it came from the bowling alley though since it's reclaimed. Maybe have been glued together with some sort of backing laminate like that. Just guessing though.Quote:
Originally Posted by brutal
Despite some negative reviews about the glue version, I'm planning on installing the Ultra (click-lock) in my RV. Seems the key is to ensure a proper float to avoid gap during expansion/contraction. The only thing I'm not particularly liking is the 200 lbs it will add to my tow rig, and weight=$$$ in fuel. I'm already pushing it with the change from jet-ski's to boat.Quote:
Originally Posted by Irving
Sounds like cork flooring.Quote:
Originally Posted by HoneyBadger
It's installed in alley sections pieced together. It's around 3" thick maple. They just flipped them over, so the bowling side is on the bottom. Was here when I bought the place.Quote:
Originally Posted by brutal
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Fridge was a commercial True.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
This is another unit in my building with more of what your describing contrast wise.http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/27/ge8e9epa.jpg
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That doesn't look too bad either. The key to that IMO is the counter tops which are close enough to the floor that they kind of tie everything together. We were looking at a granite that would be similar in color to that so maybe it would work after all.
To everyone that had Bamboo that fell apart... was it engineered or just bamboo? I keep hearing others say that Bamboo is very durable but these photos posted here suggest otherwise. I have heard that engineered hardwood or bamboo has a tendency to fall apart though so that's why I ask. I only want to do this one so whichever I decide I want to make sure it's the best and I don't feel like creating more work for myself in a few years to save a few bucks.
The floors in the last pick are Douglas fir which is pretty soft. 105 years later, they took their last refinish. 105 years of use isn't bad. Are you getting engineered or true 3/4" tongue and groove? I don't think I'd do engineered if I was planning on living there forever. Just me.
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From the limited research I've done I don't want to use engineered. That's why I was asking about that since it seems it doesn't last as long.Quote:
Originally Posted by Firehaus
I've done 2, in my little humble home, went with low end pergo type. it has been down for about 14-15 years now. It shows, I will say however. the first 4 it was down, it look good. Then, I got the lab. In those 10, it has started to look worn. Other than just inside the backdoor, for the most part it has held up decently.
The other I did for a friend, about 5 years ago. A "higher end" snap and click. That one was a breeze, the hardest part was the wear and tear on my beat up knees. She has three dogs, and looking at the floor, you would never know. Kind of wish it had been around when I did mine.
Any more details on the snap & click one that's holding up so well?
William, a member here, sells really nice hardwood flooring.
http://www.westerncoswick.com/
You have to think of a hardwood floor as a living entity. It will react to changes in climate, especially humidity. This is especially true with a solid hardwood floor. In Colorado I strongly recommend having a whole house humidifier for any hardwood floor, but it is especailly important for solid.
A solid hardwood floor should be 3/4" thick. If so it can be resanded 3-4 times over a life time. A solid floor should only be installed above grade over a wood subfloor.
I do sell prefinished hardwood floors and if you want you can call me for advice at seven one nine 2 2 nine forty five thirty five.
Thanks for chiming in. This floor would be installed above grade and on a wood subfloor. The basement will be mostly carpet with a few areas going to be finished concrete or tile.Quote:
Originally Posted by William
Due to our house being green-built the builder won't honor warranties if a humidifier is added as they even have fans on humidistats to remove humidity before mold becomes an issue. From this aspect our home has better humidity control than most and, correct me if I'm wrong, but it's the changes in humidity that can cause issues with hardwood flooring, right?
Yes, that is the major concern. If the water content of the wood drops below 7% you can have major issues with the wood cracking and splitting. I have heard of this happening in Colorado, but have never seen it myself. Relative humidity would have to get extremely low for that to happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
Attachment 42747Attachment 42749Attachment 42751
Couple pictures of solid floors I have done in C/S.
Looks good. Thoughts on engineered versus solid? Sounds like the engineered may be cheaper but doesn't last well at all. What about some of the newer versions that are supposedly better? I think I'm still leaning towards solid real stuff but at this point open to new innovations that may be better if they exist.
It depends on quality. The cheapest engineered have a rotary cut top or wear layer. The reason that is used is it has the least amount of waste. The problem is wood will attempt to regain it's orginal shape and rotary cut lamella (layer) on floors are notorious for cracking and peeling. What you want to look for is a plain sawn lamella (top layer) that is at least 2-4 mm thick (the company I rep only makes 4mm top layers.). A 2mm thick top layer can be sanded once, a 4 mm top layer can be sanded 2-3 times which will give you a lifetime of use. To contrast a solid hardwood floor can be sanded 3-4 times.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
There are actually some advantages to a quality engineered floor. One they are less likely to be affected by changes in humidity (given floating or glued down with a 100% urethane glue) as the whole floor tends to move together. The other is they can be installed below grade over conrete. The last is they can be floated which makes installation 10x easier than stapling/glue down. The disadvantage of floating is if your subfloor is not near perfect, resanding it down the line will be difficult if not impossible, and it is possible to have places on the floor that flex when you step on it. A glued or stapled down engineered floor will not have those issues. Acoustically you can match the sound of a solid floor by putting cork as an underlayment. That will raise your job cost by 30-50 cents a square foot.
Great info. It sounds like engineered wood can actually be better than solid wood if you get the right product then, right? I was scared away from the horror stories but it sounds like those may have been due to an inferior product that's not exclusive to the entire segment.Quote:
Originally Posted by William
That is true. Beware products made in China or sold by companies with initials LL. There are plenty of great options from US and European manufacturers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
Let me ask you this then, if you were going to rip out carpet/pad in the house you live in and do something other than carpet/pad.... what would you go with & why?Quote:
Originally Posted by William
I did just rip out around 800 square feet of beer stained (not sure how that happened) and pet vomit stained carpet. Going to preface it with I don't have kids or large energetic dogs in the house. If I didnt have a business selling hardwood floors the other product I would look at besides hardwood is bamboo (with formaldehyde free glue). Personally I would keep/add tile in kitchens or bathrooms. Both hardwoods and bamboo are easy to keep clean and spilled beers and pet vomit will come up quickly even if you find it a couple days later. Both are natural products, are long lasting, and have a natural beauty where every board is unique. Personally I am not a big fan of laminate because of the limited number of patterns used to create it and the fact that the top layer is essentially plastic although it works great in some situations. At one point I would have considered cork until I was on a job site with new cork and the initial VOC emissions were nauseating. This may not be the case with all cork floors but it turned me off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
Two more pics of hardwood floors I was involved with. The first is an engineered American Walnut here in the Springs (very soft, so a no shoes kind of floor). The second is a solid floor in a model home in Minnesota.
Attachment 42819Attachment 42821
So talk to me about hardwood v bamboo then. The thought had crossed my mind but then I started hearing horror stories although now it seems as though most of those may have been an inferior engineered product and possibly a better product would hold up better and put it back in the running. I would have thought that by now bamboo would be less expensive than comparable hardwood since it grows so quickly and is so much easier to produce. It seems as though demand has kept the prices up to where hardwood is or more still. I like the idea of soft as we go barefoot but I'm concerned with long-term reliability & durability if we do that. I also had a buddy that did their kitchen floor in cork because his wife wanted a softer surface but after doing that they both swore they'd never do cork flooring again. Just one opinion I guess but it was enough to scare me away from attempting it and will likely just opt for tile in the kitchen & bathrooms. We've got vinyl flooring for now that will be fine until I feel like taking on tile work but as bad as this carpet is I think this project should come first.Quote:
Originally Posted by William
Quality Bamboo is not cheap, and the cheap bamboo has formaldehyde glues. If you take a green product like Bamboo and lace it down with chemicals it isn't all that green anymore. So it is a matter of preference based partially on what you like the look of.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
Here is a good article on the pros and cons of each.
My biased opinion is to buy hardwood and my prices on quality hardwood in Colorado are hard to beat :) But good luck which ever way you go.
I'm not as concerned about being green although if I can it's a nice bonus. I get what you're saying about cheap bamboo & probably wouldn't opt to go that way anyway. If the good stuff was that much more cost prohibitive it wouldn't be a consideration anyway. I have been leaning hardwood the entire time but wanted to make sure I was considering all of my options and I know that bamboo has gained in popularity so I wanted to see why and if it had advanced any further since I gave it a cursory look years ago. It seems as though not much has changed though really which makes hardwood a more viable solution. I get that you sell hardwood and appreciate your frankness on the topic. I would also give you a call about sourcing my materials from you if you were closer but getting that much hardwood all the way up here (about 2.5hrs one way) would be cost prohibitive I'm sure.Quote:
Originally Posted by William
I am a direct sales rep for a manufacturer. We ship all over the contiguous US directly from our manufacture's warehouse near Toronto. I won't be offended if you don't buy from me of course that is just business, but for quality flooring I can usually beat the to your door price of the brick and mortar stores. Are you installing yourself?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jer
How does it work if I order 10% more than my measurements to be safe? I know if I buy local I can simply return the unused portion for a refund but if I'm shipping how does this work? Also, you're able to beat local shop's prices even with freight shipping fees?Quote:
Originally Posted by William