https://omny.fm/shows/the-george-sho...aylist=podcast
Caldara and Kopel on the pending legislation.
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https://omny.fm/shows/the-george-sho...aylist=podcast
Caldara and Kopel on the pending legislation.
So what I am understanding is the entry into the backroom might be through the backdoor?Quote:
Originally Posted by MED
Exactly. The candidate doesn't matter anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by MED
This vegetable won...
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...8a1bd61167.jpg
That’s the biggest turd emoji I have ever seen!
What happens to firearms covered in this bill when the owner dies?
What happens in regards to same if owner wants to sell them to someone outside Colorado?
What happens if you want to file a Form 1 to SBR a firearm covered by this bill after it passes?
What happens if you own an NFA firearm that also is regulated by this bill and you want to sell it to someone out of state?
First. The anti 2A crowd is interested about taking every gun you have. Even a single shot.Quote:
Originally Posted by rtr
Death by a thousand cuts.
They do not care if you cannot have an NFA item. That is a bonus and closer to their goal.
That said, a form 1 does not transfer ownership of many firearms but it is manufacture so it is a very interesting question..
1. Depends on what you set up. I'm setting up a semi auto trust separate from my NFA trust so that the owner will be the trust before the law goes into effect. After that, any trustee can take them because ownership hasn't changed and there is no transfer between trustees. I'm putting eligible family members as trustees in my trust that I'm still allowed to private transfer as gifts. After the law goes into effect, this will not be possible to set up. If you don't have a trust, they would have to be sold through an FFL out of state or transferred to a designee in your will who is out of state.Quote:
Originally Posted by rtr
2. You can sell outside of CO as long as you go through an FFL because you're selling across state lines.
3. This should work as long as there is no transfer. It will be too late to put it in a trust after the bill becomes law. However, this one could get kind of murky because I don't know how they are going to go about it until it happens. It should go through in theory, but we'll see because they could argue it is making a new firearm that is banned. I think this is the biggest question mark of the questions you asked.
4. You can sell outside of CO as long as you go through an FFL because you're selling across state lines. The FFL will have to follow all NFA laws for the transfer.
"I'm putting eligible family members as trustees in my trust that I'm still allowed to private transfer as gifts."
I've never heard that you can transfer personal firearms as gifts into your trust without a BGC. Please educate me.
A couple of exceptions listed under C.R.S. 18-12-112:
(b)
A transfer that is a bona fide gift or loan between immediate family members, which are limited to spouses, parents, children, siblings, grandparents, grandchildren, nieces, nephews, first cousins, aunts, and uncles;
(c)
A transfer that occurs by operation of law or because of the death of a person for whom the prospective transferor is an executor or administrator of an estate or a trustee of a trust created in a will;
Can you recommend an attorney to setup a trust?Quote:
Originally Posted by MED
It is my understanding that as long as I don't appoint someone as a trustee that doesn't fit in CRS 18-12-112 section (b) that you quoted, I can do that. I can also use the assignment to trust form for each item as long as I'm not violating state or federal law when doing so. NFA is a totally different animal, and I'm not addressing that here, which requires steps with the ATF. It would be in a person's best interest to consult an attorney before proceeding, which is what I'm in the process of doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
Edit: "I've never heard that you can transfer personal firearms as gifts into your trust without a BGC. Please educate me." You don't transfer to the trust; it's an assignment of property using an Assignment form you should get with your trust. Again....totally different process for NFA items.
I'm in the process of finding somebody new since the person who did my NFA Trust isn't doing it anymore.Quote:
Originally Posted by rtr
Would you have to worry about Colorado's private party transfer laws at all if your trust with bonafide family member beneficiaries is formed in another state? Say if the firearms are currently stored in Colorado but the trust is formed in another state where a beneficiary resides?
This is definitely an attorney question.Quote:
Originally Posted by hollohas
Do migrants to Colorado have to leave thier assault riffles behind when they move here?
As of right now, it looks as though all possession and proof of ownership language is removed except for certain triggers and rapid fire devices. However, that can change in the legislative process.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
Are triggers with 'standard' designs, like a Geissele SDwhatever singlestage, considered in the aforementioned groups?Quote:
Originally Posted by MED
Last draft I read "rapid fire activators" were banned outright with no grandfathering.
Has that changed?
Could anyone post a link to the latest version?
You'll have to look at part c of the Rapid Fire Trigger Activator definition to determine that; it is horribly vague, and open to interpretation. Does it mean that any trigger other than the trigger that comes with the firearms, which is what if it was a stripped receiver? Does it mean things like force reset or binary triggers? It is horribly written, and retailers might determine that they will not ship aftermarket triggers to CO even if they meet the definition of a semi-auto trigger in accordance with federal law. It uses words like parts or combination of parts that substantially increase the rate of fire....so what is substantially defined as? A semi-auto trigger is a semi auto trigger regardless of how efficient it is, but they are trying to put that on a scale using words like substantially increases. Binary and FRT are definitely out. Things like geissele SSA or Larue MBT should be fine, but they may not be shipped here if you order them.Quote:
Originally Posted by battlemidget
It's still just Introduced, your can view everything about the bill here including the latest amended as it goes through the process: https://leg.colorado.gov/bills/hb23-1230Quote:
Originally Posted by bellavite1
and yes they are banned as it stands now.
Are they gonna ban my thumb and belt loop?Quote:
Originally Posted by bellavite1
If you're unarmed, you are a victim.
I had a very nice conversation with a well regarded trust attorney in Golden (if you know, you know,) about a trust. He raised several concerns for me. Would a revocable trust survive my lifetime? Would an irrevocable one as well? The cost difference between the two is dramatic, and if neither protect firearms for future generations what's the point.Quote:
Originally Posted by MED
Look forward to seeing what others discover. And hope we do it soon! I'm going to call another attorney that was recommended to me and see what his thoughts are.
When I have purchased NFA items, the stamps have been issued in the trust name.
However when picking up the items and doing FFL transfer, the 4473 and CBI background were done on a person.
So it seems that the 4473 is separate from trust ownership.
The current pistol brace free registration, say that to register free through a trust, ownership by the trust must be shown to have ownership prior to the publishing date of rule.
What a convoluted pain in the ass...
If it will save one life? Yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by buffalobo
I was talking to a friend who knows a lot more about this than I do. My NFA firearms trust that I currently have is a revocable trust. Upon my death, all property I assigned to the trust must be dispersed to my beneficiaries, and they will need to follow whatever state and federal laws are on the books for each item. He mentioned ATF Form 5, which is a one time free estate transfer for the beneficiary of an NFA item named in the trust. This obviously won't protect future generations as you mentioned. However, something like it will allow my immediate family members access to my non-NFA firearms while I'm alive, which is what I am looking into right now. The reason I'm looking at a second one is that the stupid rule to include all co-trustees for NFA purchases makes using a trust a PITA so I don't have any on it right now until I'm done buying my suppressors, and then I'll put my son on it. I want to be able to appoint co-trustees for all my semi-autos so I'm going to create a different one for that.Quote:
Originally Posted by 3beansalad
The irrevocable trust divests your ownership of the asset with those named on the trust and does protect property, but you lose control over the asset. This will protect the assets, and the trust does not dissolve upon your death. I have no idea what the rules are for putting firearms as assets into this type of trust, which is possibly different than the forms I fill out to put them into the one I have.
That pretty much sums up all interaction with government; the only purpose government serves is to make people's lives difficult.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bailey Guns
My one and only pistol lower that used to have a brace (blade) was purchased on my NFA trust in 2015 and has been on the schedule A submitted to AFT multiple times since. I just need to drag the wife over to a kiosk for prints to submit my existing draft form1 on it for a free stamp. Already have many SBR, what's one more?Quote:
Originally Posted by DDT951
I am out of here again. Left. Came back and already looking to depart again.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Crime statistics related to failure to perform a BGC and large capacity magazines:
Unlawful manufacture, import, purchase, sale, and transfer of assault weapons. This bill creates the new offense of unlawful manufacture, import, purchase, sale, and transfer of assault weapons, a class 2 misdemeanor. To form an estimate on the prevalence of this new offense, the fiscal note analyzed the existing offense of failure to perform a background check during a private firearm transfer as a comparable crime. From FY 2019-20 to FY 2021-22, 19 offenders have been sentenced and convicted for this existing offense, or about 7 per year. Of the persons convicted, 16 were male and 3 were female. Demographically, 14 were White, 4 were Black/African American, and 1 was Hispanic.
Unlawful possession of rapid-trigger activators. This bill creates the new offense of unlawful possession of rapid-fire trigger activators, a class 2 misdemeanor. To form an estimate on the prevalence of this new offense, the fiscal note analyzed the existing offense of unlawful sale, transfer, or possession of a large-capacity magazine?not including charges for possession of a large-capacity magazine during commission of a crime?as a comparable crime. From FY 2019-20 to FY 2021-22, 80 offenders have been sentenced and convicted for this existing offense, or about 27 per year. Of the persons convicted, 76 were male, 3 were female, and 1 was unknown. Demographically, 45 were White, 31 were Black/African American, 1 was Hispanic, 2 were Asian, and 1 was unknown.
So the dindu nuffins mag possession in Denver is the basis for banning binary/FRT. FFS.Quote:
Originally Posted by kidicarus13
Back to AZ, or other options?Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeandSugar
News said this goes to committee tomorrow (Wednesday)
So gun ban coming soon…
To testify by Zoom or in person
https://www2.leg.state.co.us/clics/c...nsf/signIn.xsp
Judiciary committee
Wednesday 1:30pm Old State Library(2nd floor capital room 271)
Best to register ahead of time. If in person must be in meeting room when meeting starts.
If you're unarmed, you are a victim.
Not to be cynical, but what good will it do?Quote:
Originally Posted by buffalobo
DEMS already ended debate with rules to move red flag forward...
Do you think you will change on DEM's mind who is voting?
IF they pass this, when would it go into effect?
Buy now. Buy often.Attachment 93384Quote:
Originally Posted by One Shot
I know what i'll be doing all weekend then...
Well, I was going to buy a new truck, but couple Barretts might be more fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by One Shot
Saw this over on the other site.
"Originally Posted By Zak-Smith:
Just got this in text———
CO assault weapons ban hearing postponed.
Apparently 400 people were showing up testify in opposition.
Dem leadership pulled it for now. Expect to see them try and sneak it an again - like they did this time.
Good job everyone."
I checked the House and Senate schedule for tomorrow and did not see this bill listed. I don't know how else to confirm.
See post #79.Quote:
Originally Posted by DDT951
Maybe put a little effort into participation in the system instead of lamenting the foregone conclusion.
If you're unarmed, you are a victim.