Wind energy

i like the idea of solar and wind combined. I don't see how the wind energy is over 20 times more expensive. the highest costs are the initial build and leasing of the land. maintenance is a factor as well but it can't be that much more than a coal plant along with the trains that have to carry it and the diesel fuel burned.

solar is being used heavily out at DIA. hell, just look at a lot of mountain homes, they have solar panels as well as propane backup. some don't even have power running to their house from an outside means, they make it work.
I know that isn't realistic in a more urban setting (where the greenies mostly live...like in downtown) but it is a small step in the right direction.

the cost of solar technology is coming down, improving and seeing more widespread use. it will just take time to get things down to a reasonable level.

then we will find monstrous[ROFL1] coal and oil reserves and wonder what the fuck we were thinking!

I think wind turbines and solar are part of the solution to the problem of achieving energy independence. I also believe that domestic drilling and, in particular, nuclear energy, are also part of the solution.

I live out in the country and I would love to be "off the grid" as others here have mentioned. I'm looking at a smaller wind turbine for my own use. The biggest problem I see with them as they exist now is that it will take a very, very long time for the turbine to pay for it's self...

Solar I'm not entirely sold on. At least not at the current level of development of this technology. I do think it will be a significant contributor to our power grid in the future though.

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Originally Posted by TFOGGER

The problem lies not in generation efficiency, but in transmission losses. Some 50% of the electricity generated in power plants never makes it to the end user.

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No way 50% losses - it averages about 7%. My background's in EE, and it shits me that we can even get it that low. Working in power trading now, we'd be dead at 50%.

Mesh power generation is nice for something that needs combat reliability, but as it is, we're not even willing to invest in existing infrastructure. You need a *lot* of infrastructure to realize reliability improvements, and someone has to pay. As-is, the grid is capable of realizing the microgeneration contributions. You have solar and wind home "hobbyists" that get exuberant about seeing their power meter run backwards. Aside from the panels or turbines, there's significant cost involved - a phase synchronizer for whatever you generate costs thousands of dollars. I don't believe the American public is supportive of the taxes and cost increases needed to realize this situation, especially as it becomes widespread. For better or worse, organic growth and incremental improvement are the only way to alter the grid.

Y'know, it's kinda sad that when you start looking at proposals for energy infrastructure overhaul in this country at an operational level, a lot of them seem to be predicated on the establishment of socialist utopia.

Vestas from Denmark has built multiple manufacturing sites here along the front range in the last couple of years. The towers plant in Pueblo is almost complete and operational. One of the largest turbines they make is being built on site just off I-25 down there. It's cost for this one turbine is 6 Million.

Here is a very recent picture of the turbine going up... (49 meter blades)

http://www.dcandh.com/gallery2/main....serialNumber=1

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Originally Posted by gnihcraes

Vestas from Denmark has built multiple manufacturing sites here along the front range in the last couple of years. The towers plant in Pueblo is almost complete and operational. One of the largest turbines they make is being built on site just off I-25 down there. It's cost for this one turbine is 6 Million.

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I worked on thier manufacting plant.... BIG PLACE...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TFOGGER

The problem lies not in generation efficiency, but in transmission losses. Some 50% of the electricity generated in power plants never makes it to the end user.

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Nope, NEC states that we have to be within +/- 3-5% on our end. When I hook up gear, for the most part I can test it out to be 477 to 484 volts for a "480" volt system So for the most part I can attest that it isn't a 50% loss..

Besides High enough voltage over a big enough wire, voltage drop won't be that much..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by gnihcraes

Vestas from Denmark has built multiple manufacturing sites here along the front range in the last couple of years. The towers plant in Pueblo is almost complete and operational. One of the largest turbines they make is being built on site just off I-25 down there. It's cost for this one turbine is 6 Million.

Here is a very recent picture of the turbine going up... (49 meter blades)

http://www.dcandh.com/gallery2/main....serialNumber=1

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I am sure several people have seen them on the highway, but each blade is about as long as a semi truck!
I got close to one up near the CO/NE border. I bet they are about 180ft. tall or better!

[quote=sniper7;197877]i like the idea of solar and wind
hell, just look at a lot of mountain homes, they have solar panels as well as propane backup. some don't even have power running to their house from an outside means, they make it work.

I'm in one of those mountain homes, power our home with wind and solar. We are 2 1/2 miles from a utility line. We make no claims to be "greenies", we like the Independence. No utility bill, one less monopoly to fuck with us.
I have to admit I kind of enjoy it when you grid folks (not co-ar15 members of course) lose power from a storm, we always power, na na na na na!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CqEccgR0q-o

Here's a cool wind turbine crash video. Bottom line no one was hurt, no oil spilled, no haz mat stuff. Just pick up the pieces. Put up another one. No big deal.

since you wanted a picture for reference... there is a blade on the truck. :)

http://www.dcandh.com/gallery2/main....serialNumber=1

[quote=offgrid;198106]

Quote:

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Originally Posted by sniper7

i like the idea of solar and wind
hell, just look at a lot of mountain homes, they have solar panels as well as propane backup. some don't even have power running to their house from an outside means, they make it work.

I'm in one of those mountain homes, power our home with wind and solar. We are 2 1/2 miles from a utility line. We make no claims to be "greenies", we like the Independence. No utility bill, one less monopoly to fuck with us.
I have to admit I kind of enjoy it when you grid folks (not co-ar15 members of course) lose power from a storm, we always power, na na na na na!

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I hope to have something like that one day. plenty of land, a well, solar and wind power (maybe even water if it is near a stream/river) and propane as well!