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Agree. Still looks like the lead gun is giving the instruction. That said, as a drunk/drinking/stoned/stupid person, too many instructions to comprehend.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamnanc
Taze, trank, stun, kick or what ever... The man on the floor was not a threat. The room door was closed. If there was a threat, the front cop would take the shot.
Police called for a suspected rifle sticking out of a balcony window.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duman
Loss of life + lots and lots of loss in city treasury $$.
I am not going to sit on armchair and Monday morning quarterbacking. Very sad incident. I think this and MN ccw guy incident was pretty bad.
Irrelevant. They were in a hallway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ah Pook
You need to Monday morning quarterback. It's necessary for learning and correcting negligent behavior.Quote:
Originally Posted by MrPrena
Not questioning why they were there. Questioning what happened when they walked into the hallway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Duman
Yes. LE were not educated for the situation. Why not? Deescalate before killing an innocent. Is this a hard concept?
I'm going to go out on a limb here and disagree with most of you.
The officers were called to the scene due to multiple reports of a man with a long gun aiming it at pedestrians in the parking lot and the surrounding areas.
People typically are not forced out of their room at rifle point for anything less serious then this type of call.
There were two people in that hallway that were not police officers, one of them was shot and the other was not. Why was the female not harmed? Because she followed the instructions of the officer-in-charge who was a Sergeant with the Mesa PD. The the male suspect Mr. Shaver failed to follow officer instructions. Keeping in mind that this was not a simple normal everyday routine contact with a law enforcement officer responding to a noise complaint, smell of marijuana, underage drinking, doing donuts in the parking lot, or prank calling the front desk of the hotel repeatedly. The officers were within reason to be a bit amped up.
I'm not in any way saying that the Mesa PD, and particularly the Sergeant couldn't use better Verbal Judo skills and a better SOP to arrest / detain suspects. I'm also not saying that I I'm glad Mr. Shaver was shot and killed by law enforcement, but I feel like some of the posters on this forum might have felt a bit differently if they found themselves in the same situation, holding someone at gunpoint with the reasonable suspicion that the person was armed and dangerous.
I am suprised by the rush to crucify this guy when many of us have not walked a mile in his shoes.
What the guy had engraved on his dust cover is irrelevant. Let the PC Hippies worry about that garbage.
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I can't crucify the shooter, either. That was a hot mess of a situation. At the moment when Shaver moved that right arm back, there's two voices expressing sounds of concern which likely influenced the shooter to act (he's taking in what he sees and what he hears).
That kid sounded scared shitless. But to say he wasn't a threat... he's not a threat until he's detained/restrained. In my mind, if you decide someone is not a threat then you run the risk of letting down your guard.
It's unfortunate. I think of my own kid who gets so discombobulated when he gets nervous or stressed, that he would fail to be able to focus well enough to comply exactly with instructions in such a situation. It chokes me up a little just thinking about it.
The shooter didn't make it to 2nd base in the fuck-fuck games, ML. He was a shitbag and got fired for other reasons later on. Let's not blue line of silence this as some stand up guy like so many of the members here, and not here, who made a split decision or can be faced with that. The situation was copulated unceremoniously. There was no reason they couldn't advance and detain. Introduction of complexity necessarily complicates the situation. Loss of control occurs when one introduces action into a situation that is not controlled by the person in charge. What do I mean? I mean playing Simon Says with someone who is not the one in control.
As other more experienced posters have said, the only reason this wasn't in the bag is because the Prosecution went too long on the ball.
And yes, his ejection port does matter because it indicates a mentality which is not conducive to a service profession. The dude wasn't some veteran street stomper. He was a 1 year cherry chump. He was a trigger happy idiot. He got his wish. I hope he can live with it, because the other guy died for it.