you mean re-writing the .gov's argument instead of simply ruling on it? Roberts should be tried for treason and hung til dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aloha_Shooter
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you mean re-writing the .gov's argument instead of simply ruling on it? Roberts should be tried for treason and hung til dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aloha_Shooter
Give me the job. I would be a great SCJ. I will have the Racist Sotomayer and gun grabber Kagen shooting three gun competition with in a year.
Some more reality for you , https://lm.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...o7d9qim9lI&s=1 , even the ASA says the HPA is a non starter untill at best after the mid terms in 2018 .
Because politicians are cowards and only care about protecting their jobs, not our hearing.
They don't care about saving us money either. We are just sheep that need watched until they need us slaughtered.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
I originally supported the HPA because I misunderstood what it actually would do -- probably because the proposed law is so utterly vague and doesn't address state consequences. As seen on page 3 or 4 of this thread, I provided quotes from the sponsor's General Counsel on the legal ramifications of its passing which dig into those consequential concerns. The end result is that it will effectively place NO Federal backstops against a state level ban, and only shifts the blame of unconstitutional banning and/or taxation, permitting, etc. into the state's control.
Some states already ban. CO doesn't, but I believe that's because it hasn't been a whack-a-mole issue due to the backstop of Federal regulation.
I foresee a ban in CO if the HPA passes, or at the very least a state-level version of the federal headache we now experience. As such, I wholeheartedly disavow all support for the HPA. and would encourage everyone here to do the same, until there is placed in it a provision which keeps states from taking adverse action against suppressors.
It's utterly retarded and legally ignorant (not to mention philosophically daft) to clamor for a Federal deregulation under the guise of Constitutionality, and then just shift that into State violation with a grin on one's face. If it passes as is, it would not only be a Pyrrhic victory, it would be a real life version of the devil you don't know.
And it will be just as big a headache as buying a muffler for your prius. I don't see how removing any regulation on any level of Government can have a negative effect let alone be the beginning the Apocalypse.
Gov never gets smaller.. just sayin
It's the devil you know. Given the political climate of Colorado, it would be a bit naive to think that the devil we don't know would be better.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
Reference post # 57 in this thread . Suppressors are ILLEGAL in Co with an affirmative defense of having a " permit " for them being used to make them legal , the NFA being that permit .Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
Pretty simple after that no NFA no suppressors .
Quote:
Originally Posted by CavSct1983
I've been saying the same thing, and asking relevant sponsors of the HPA, to include the ASA, to clarify, comment, and assuage our concerns. Crickets.Quote:
Originally Posted by C Ward
I get flamed as a naysayer or FUDD bringing the issue up on other venues - gun boards, bookface, etc.
Me too. But nobody wants to hear anything other than how the HPA is going to save the world.Quote:
Originally Posted by brutal
Shhh
Jk. The cold hard truth will do.Quote:
Originally Posted by sampson
Still. I will take it. The liberals can't be in power here in Colorado forever. R's come and go in power.
Ummm yes they can, states are much different than the country as a whole, when it comes to election cycles.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
There has been exactly 1 Republican governor in the last 42 years in the state . The political make up of the population centers that have the most impact on elections has steadily moved to the left for the last 10 plus years . I wouldn't hold my breath if I was you .
None of this changes the fact the the HPA has fundamental flaws in the bill and we may very well be worse off here in Co if it passes . Looking at it with rose colored glasses isn't going to make it any better .
Everybody looks at the ASA and the HPA like they are the savior's when it is just another lobbying organization that is doing what they think is best for their clients , this is business nothing more nothing less . The only thing the ASA cares about the general public for is as customers for their clients . The other thing everybody fails to remember is the ASA is directly responsible for 41P , they went to the ATF to talk about removing the LEO sign off and in the process opened their eyes to the trust process which put in to motion 41P .
^^^ THISQuote:
Originally Posted by C Ward
over 1/2 the population of Colorado lives in the Denver metro area... which is now 2nd to San Francisco in LGBTQ population, and consistently blue. The cold, hard truth of politics in CO are that if you don't agree with Denver, you don't matter.
Well that explains why I don't get lost in Denver anymore. There is aids on every corner.
This is one of the most ignorant things I've heard in awhile. Get out of the 80's, being gay in 2017 doesn't automatically equal aids...Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
What is the arrest record for having a dangerous weapon? Is it a law thats on the books but not enforced unless its an add-on charge like no seat belt with a speeding ticket? Tilting my rose colored glasses down for a second but I'm not taking them off just yet.
I was never in the 80's. Maybe I just wanted to see if you were the hypersensitive easily triggered snowflake type. And that JOKE is still very popular in San Fransisco. A gay guy told it to me when I was there a few years back.Quote:
Originally Posted by hurley842002
ETA: We laughed at his expense to break the ice. Its nice to get a long. Its not so nice to be at each others throats over what someone says.
AKA Troll? I'm far from a snowflake.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
My friend said that about CA, 35 years ago. he still believes it.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
No idea on the arrest stats but I have no desire to be the crash test dummy for a felony conviction , you wanna be the test case and end your life for at least 5 years working through the legal system more power to you .
Anyone that filed as an individual or has since notified LEO post 41P is going to have to deal with the fact that someone knows* what you have.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
* It's my understanding that 41P paper goes through a shredder in DougCo, but I've no direct evidence.
I suppose it's also possible that should they go looking, the feds may be compelled by the state to report on any NFA items in one's possession? Frankly, I don't know the law in that regard.
While I am of the same mind as Chuck in regards to the legal issues owners in CO may face if the HPA passes, passage will take a long time, if ever.
The average for Federal legislation to become law is 23 months. Contentious issues, longer. After passage, the HPA would have some period of time before taking effect wherein rulemaking would occur as some Federal Agency (currently the ATF) which would take several months at a minimum. So, say three years maybe before it might become law. Then (akin to the AR15 market) you will get morons entering the fray and the good companies struggling to meet demand. Depending on what you want, might take a few months to a few years to come in stock. So, IMHO, I'd bet on a 4 year time period, at a minimum, to be able to buy 16.1" integrally suppressed barrels OTC, if Trump or Pence win the Presidential Election in 2020. If a D wins in 2020, NEVER.
Those with tax stamps would still have their permit to own a gun mufflers.
No one in Colorado would be able to obtain future mufflers unless our laws are changed.
Do other state require background checks when purchasing a muffler?
Meaning essentially, that we could not apply for refunds like other red blooded Americans in freedom loving states. Welcome to Komirado.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
The state firearms laws vary greatly especially with the NFA , https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...hZQT_wGGHKLhVQ .
This is why the HPA having no preemption language in it is a reason for concern and if they remove suppressors from the NFA the states will be free to regulate them with state law .
Like I said before it's a pipe dream to think suppressors will be deregulated and available over the counter like some European countries .
The thing is that NFA owners are a miniscule percentage of the gun owning public and like every tiny lobbying group it's easy to blow smoke up your ass when the politicians have no intention of changing anything .
Contentious banter aside- and polarizing debate notwithstanding, is there any update on the HPA? Congress' website on the bill states that on 2/6 it was referred to the subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism, Homeland Security, and Investigations, but nothing else.
Also had a chat with a coworker about the state law issue and if the HPA passed and became law, since there is no licensing ability they would be "defacto" illegal, but that would simply invite a request to the legislature to remove that language from the statute or institute some sort of licensing. Neither is likely to happen with our blue legislature, but enough noise made about turning honest gun owners into criminals might raise the issue.
If you kept your stamps, wouldn't those serve as your permission slip to own a muffler?
It would end all new purchases, transfers or manufacturing of mufflers in Colorado.
Why wouldn't you keep your stamps? They're proof of ownership, especially for those who built them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric P
Part of the HPA is an option to have the $200 tax stamp refunded.Quote:
Originally Posted by Great-Kazoo
Can't I just tell them "I'll take the money, but I'm keeping the paperwork"?Quote:
Originally Posted by brutal
I thought they would only be refunding the tax for applications received after some date in October of last year.
Interesting about how this impacts Colorado. I have 4 stamps pending and 4 on the books. Might need to add to that.
Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk
Yes, October 22, 2015, the date of introduction of the bill.Quote:
Originally Posted by cfortune
For all you folks saying you'll wait until HPA passes to buy a can, have you considered the effects it will have on supply and demand? Currently, the purchase of a suppressor is cost prohibitive and the application process wait time and expense puts most people off. If HPA passes, EVERYONE is going to try to buy a suppressor or two. There is no way the current supply is going to accommodate that increased demand, and not only will there be long out-of-stock issues, the price of in-stock items will instantly increase. I think it's going to take a long time for it to get to the point where you can just go to the gunshop and pick up a new can at a reasonable price.
Thinking out loud... if you were thinking of getting setup to manufacture suppressors for sale (legally of course), you'd probably be in a great position to make some money if HPA passes. Demand will be astronomical.
Go buy one now and get your money back later. Sounds like a great investment.
Kind of like what happened after Sandy Hook and Aurora when the dems were making talk about banning "assault weapons." The price gouging was incredible, but that's the law of capitalism, buy low, sell high.Quote:
Originally Posted by DOC
I think Teufelhund is onto something- figure out how to manufacture quality suppressors and you're in business.