AG Eric Holder's new campaign: to ban homeschooling

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Originally Posted by Teufelhund

...this idiot supports his case by saying there's nothing in the Constitution that guarantees a right to homeschooling...

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Actually there is text in the Constitution that guarantees the right to home schooling: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.


There is no power delegated to the Federal government to force children into indoctrination centers ... er ... schools. Period. Therefore you do have the absolute constitutional right to NOT send your children to government schools.

But like I said in another thread, the 10th Amendment has been dead for longer than most of us have been alive.

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Originally Posted by Clint45

Well, although MOST homeschoolers have the best intentions and actually teach their children the same subjects they'd learn in a public school, there are a lot of horror stories too. Believe it or not, some parents would just claim to "homeschool" their kids without teaching them anything: either to use for unpaid labor, or to prevent them from telling anyone about abuse at home, or to prevent any semblance of socialization with people outside of their weird cult. I agree 100% that NCLB was designed to fail our children, teachers, and schools . . . but if you claim to be "homeschooling" your kids, having their knowledge be tested once a year is quite reasonable and a safeguard against abuses. Believe me when I tell you that "homeschooling" has been used simply as an excuse to pull children out of public schools with no attempt made to educate them.

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Contrary to public opinion, it is not the job of the Federal Government (nor do they have the right to make it their job) to prevent child abuse. At best it is the job of the states to come up with laws and rules defining "abuse".

More people have been abused by and failed in government run schools then have been home schooled. If the simple fact that there are rare examples of home schooling parents abusing their children is enough to allow it to be banned then public schools should also be banned.



Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
-C. S. Lewis

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Originally Posted by UncleDave

Think Hitler Youth people. Read up on the history of that and you will see what this is about.

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I've heard some spooky allegations about AmeriCorps lately.

I move to Colorado, I get back to my roots with my love of firearms...Dems take it over and work toward ruining the state. My wife and I are about to have our first child, and now they are working on telling us we can't home school, damnit.

this is beginning to get on my nerves

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Originally Posted by Clint45

Well, although MOST homeschoolers have the best intentions and actually teach their children the same subjects they'd learn in a public school, there are a lot of horror stories too. Believe it or not, some parents would just claim to "homeschool" their kids without teaching them anything: either to use for unpaid labor, or to prevent them from telling anyone about abuse at home, or to prevent any semblance of socialization with people outside of their weird cult. I agree 100% that NCLB was designed to fail our children, teachers, and schools . . . but if you claim to be "homeschooling" your kids, having their knowledge be tested once a year is quite reasonable and a safeguard against abuses. Believe me when I tell you that "homeschooling" has been used simply as an excuse to pull children out of public schools with no attempt made to educate them.

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I certainly believe you, no question. However, does that mean that the gubment should get involved? What about all the other 'abuses' in our society/culture today? Do you expect the gubment to "fix" those as well? Does the Constitution give the gubment the 'job' of fixing all abuses? If not, then we're done with the discussion.

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Originally Posted by Clint45

but if you claim to be "homeschooling" your kids, having their knowledge be tested once a year is quite reasonable and a safeguard against abuses. Believe me when I tell you that "homeschooling" has been used simply as an excuse to pull children out of public schools with no attempt made to educate them.

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you must be talking from alot of experience. Because I have never seen this. Im sure if you are dealing with ghetto trash, maybe thats why. I have met and know hundreds of home school families and none of them would fit your biased stereotype.

How about some actual data to back up your claims?

If you are proficient with a gun, you must be ok with the government requiring annual testing. Otherwise you cant use your 2a rights. If you want to use your 1a rights you shouldnt mind taking an annual test for that either...right? Any other things you are ok with the government forcing us to do?

This is the problem with America. Everyone wants more laws and more government.

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Originally Posted by Zundfolge

Actually there is text in the Constitution that guarantees the right to home schooling: The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

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HA excellent point, sir.

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Originally Posted by HBARleatherneck

you must be talking from alot of experience. Because I have never seen this. Im sure if you are dealing with ghetto trash, maybe thats why. I have met and know hundreds of home school families and none of them would fit your biased stereotype.

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It isn't generally reported in the media. I have a few friends working as investigators for Child Protective Services in another state, and a few friends who are public schoolteachers who are familiar with cases involving abused kids being pulled out of school by abusive parents for "home schooling", and am familiar with a few isolated "religious communities" who don't want any contact with the rest of society and try to maintain total control over their community like a cult . . . and I'm not talking about the Amish or Hassidic communities either, but nutjobs who make the Scientologists and Branch Davidians almost look sane.

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Originally Posted by Clint45

Well, although MOST homeschoolers have the best intentions and actually teach their children the same subjects they'd learn in a public school, there are a lot of horror stories too. Believe it or not, some parents would just claim to "homeschool" their kids without teaching them anything: either to use for unpaid labor, or to prevent them from telling anyone about abuse at home, or to prevent any semblance of socialization with people outside of their weird cult. I agree 100% that NCLB was designed to fail our children, teachers, and schools . . . but if you claim to be "homeschooling" your kids, having their knowledge be tested once a year is quite reasonable and a safeguard against abuses. Believe me when I tell you that "homeschooling" has been used simply as an excuse to pull children out of public schools with no attempt made to educate them.

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"Although MOST gun owners have the best intentions and actually use their guns for normal functions, there are a lot of horror stories too. Believe it or not, some gun owners would just claim to own semi-automatic firearms with high capacity magazines for legal purposes, and then hide them in their homes for all sorts of nefarious reasons. But if you claim to be a law abiding gun owner, having your "arsenal" inspected once a year is quite reasonable and a safeguard against abuses. The Second Amendment has been used simply as an excuse to own all sorts of guns that have no place outside the military."

I actually do get what you're saying, but I'm done with the notion that the "Government is here to help". I've dealt with CPS down where I am now too, and they were not helpful, nor there to help. The idiot that we had to deal with had no grasp on reality, and after admitting that she had no idea what high-functioning autism involved, proceeded to tell us what we should do with our son. In fact, I discovered during the course of dealing with them, prior to their ultimately being unable to do anything to us after all sorts of threats, that the region the office we were dealing with was in were under investigation from the State for various misdeeds. Social Services is one of the more screwed up sections of Government, and as far as I'm concerned is past helping; it needs to be eliminated and replaced with an entirely different organization.

I spent 24 years in the military, and have dealt (and still deal) with various portions of the government all the time. Very little I see makes me think things are getting better. The Education System is not broken, it's been destroyed, and as far as I'm concerned they've squandered any respectability they may have had, and ANY right to tell me what to do. My kids will be educated; much better than the products the system is spewing out. And they'll be able to think for themselves.

I attended public school. In 10th grade my HS counselor told me to drop out so I did. Public schools are amazing.

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Originally Posted by Clint45

Well, although MOST homeschoolers have the best intentions and actually teach their children the same subjects they'd learn in a public school, there are a lot of horror stories too. Believe it or not, some parents would just claim to "homeschool" their kids without teaching them anything: either to use for unpaid labor, or to prevent them from telling anyone about abuse at home, or to prevent any semblance of socialization with people outside of their weird cult. I agree 100% that NCLB was designed to fail our children, teachers, and schools . . . but if you claim to be "homeschooling" your kids, having their knowledge be tested once a year is quite reasonable and a safeguard against abuses. Believe me when I tell you that "homeschooling" has been used simply as an excuse to pull children out of public schools with no attempt made to educate them.

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I would like to know more about this; some sources would be great!