Denver Police Department

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Originally Posted by foxtrot

I also think, that in a lot of cases, people will essentially open the door, basically invite them in, LEO's search, etc. etc. Then after the fact the homeowner is pissed off (of course) does some research/talks to people and realizes that they didn't HAVE to get searched. No sympathy for those that learn AFTER the fact. Learn your rights, exercise them, and you will have my support. If the father had stepped out, closed the door and politely stated he doesn't consent to searches, and the beat him down with nightsticks and kicked his door in shouting "this is the police" then you would have my full support. Instances like these are like thinking of a good comeback twelve hours after an argument is already over. You might want to act like it matters, but it doesn't count.

People act like its LEO's responsibility to teach them their rights. "Ma'am, can we come in? We would like to search your house to see if you have any meth making products, but did you know by the bill of rights you can tell us you don't consent to a search and we would actually have to get a warrant? Oh? we cant come in now?"

Of COURSE they work off peoples ignorance. That doesn't make them bad LEO. That just makes the people NAIVE - their own fault. No cookies for the uneducated.

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So its OK for me to screw someone on a car deal because they are not educated? So its OK for me to take money from old people because they are not educated. So its OK for me to take advantage of you, selling you a gun, because YOU are un-educated?

I fail to see how it is OK for Police to take advantage of people based on their ignorance. I've had my dealing with the police, in one, they took advantage of an un-educated guy and put him in jail, sadly on my behalf. When I questioned the officer about his methods he asked what my problem was and if I wanted anything done about the situation. He abused the system and took advantage of someones ignorance.

I'm all about people educating themselves, to protect themselves FROM being taken advantage of by Police that would.

-myers

I didn't read any of the middle but I gather he was innocent yet consented to the search?

No means no [ROFL1]

Hint from an insider if the police are there to talk to you ABOUT you, they are not really trying to help you out regardless of what they say 9/10 times unless you know them....


And DPD entered his home and he is alive he is a lucky guy [Neene1]


Just kidding DPD yous guys GTG for the most part

I also am going to let another secret out :
LE at the Fed/State/County/Local Level are humans [Help] I know and take your industry I bet at least 20% of your coworkers don't fully know how to do their job exactly right, occasionaly make mistakes, and some are just assholes.. There is no job that has perfect people if 20% of your population are assholes than about 20% of your Doctors,GarbageMed,Peace Officers are going to be assholes....

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Originally Posted by Fal Grunt

So its OK for me to take advantage of you, selling you a gun, because YOU are un-educated?

-myers

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I agree w/ your concern but what maybe un-ethical is still legal. I am all for buyer beware rather than having govt. passing more laws and rules attempting to micro manage our daily live.

4kilo12 I agree with what you're saying for the most part. This whole post went south of cheese. It was meant to just be a discussion on why this happened and what were the legal and illegal issues behind it.

And I agree that for the most part Denver PD is not that bad. There's always gonna be shitty people in every job. I had a warehouse gig once and we could've easily gotten rid of people.

In the end whether or not he gave them what they thought was consent it still just bothers me that it can happen. And it'll probably happen again.

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Originally Posted by AK545Man

4kilo12 I agree with what you're saying for the most part. This whole post went south of cheese. It was meant to just be a discussion on why this happened and what were the legal and illegal issues behind it.

And I agree that for the most part Denver PD is not that bad. There's always gonna be shitty people in every job. I had a warehouse gig once and we could've easily gotten rid of people.

In the end whether or not he gave them what they thought was consent it still just bothers me that it can happen. And it'll probably happen again.

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It boils down to this by nature LE comes in contact with a bunch of scum, some in the middle and some truly brilliant criminals. Most do have a very cynical outlook on life and are used to what I call playing the game of life.

The system most directly benefits the Justice system as in Judges,CA/DA,PD,Private Attny's. Now this is going to sound incredibly opinionated because it is......

The current state of the game is such that frequent customers are treated better because they are repeat business, and in some cases the oops I F@#$ed up once get a much rougher ride than those that are used to playing the game because they are scared, don't know the rules of the game.

In every deputy/officer there was a brilliant criminal who played the I am a decent guy can you help me out here trick and the deputy went for it. Many paid with their life for that the ones who didn't develop a natural distrust of people in general, is this fair NO is this good NO........

without rambling on too much,
Of course LE is going to ask permission to search/enter if their gut feel indicates something stinks, and trust me if they have in their opinion solid PC or (this is iffy with me) RS to enter/open/look they will phrase the question much differently and at that point they are not asking they are just gathering better evidence for the CA\DA to work with. Now if it is truly phrased as a question then they are hoping the criminal is dumb enough to say yes and most of the time they do say yes.

If you don't want to consent and that is your right. The best course of action is this, don't qualify it or justify. Simply: "I do not consent to a search,am I free to go?" Those are the only words you want to say if you don't consent anything else like it's not cause i have anything to hide, or brownshirt motherf@#$er just are words with no legal bearing that could help the officer but will not help you. Polite/Firm/Short and to the point....

Will the officer try and call your bluff, many times yes but in the end if you have not provided RS/PC the Watch Commander will tell the officer let em go, I have heard this a lot through my own radio back in the day a lot. And in this state at the State and County level more so than others you will find people working LE to have the highest integerty, and even though they KNOW said person is guilty as sin, they can't dishonor themselves and lie under oath that they had PC/RS to go ahead and continue the search when they didn't. Not excluding or badmouthing any city folk...



I don't subscribe to the nothing to hide nothing to worry about mindset nr do I suscribe to the Die Oinker you can't talk to me at all crowd...
As it is with most of life it's kind of a grey area. Each interaction is unique and barring UOF (and people make mistakes there to, but because the stakes are so high) people make mistakes, have bad days:
Doctors,Plumbers,Manual Labor, Astronauts, BUT nowhere are the stakes as high and the choice that could save your life or haunt your life happens so fast than LE and the .mil and the people making these choices are not very well compensated when compared to private sector salary packages.

It boils down to you get what you pay for
and due in large to the intergety of the people working for the local LE you get a WHOLE lot more than you pay for because of their dedication and honor.

I am not crying about pay, I have not been active in that role for quite q while, but if everyone involved would broaden their mindset they are people just like you and me LE and criminal alike all are humans, and with that come human traits good and bad...


ramble off

PS The best way to avoid a search is to have current reg/plates/ins, obey traffic laws and don't hang with known criminals. Your chances of the lottery and being searched are about the same if you don't invite LE into your life. In most areas of this state there are just too many priority calls holding for fishing trips

Can someone summarize the previous post? [Coffee]

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Originally Posted by MB888

Can someone summarize the previous post? [Coffee]

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1.don't write a reply while you are on the phone with tech support and IM'ing a co worker and expect it to even appear sane much less understandable.
2. Don't invite the man into your life, if you do here is how to nicely ask him to leave your life.
3. Da Po Po are people too,

In a way I'm with Foxtrot on this one. Got to know even if you would think the "bad" guy should tell you.

That goes back to whole comment I made a few pages back where I was talking about the people who are super stars and stripes but they don't know enough to protect their own ass because they believe things like that don't happen. It's a vicious cycle.