Policeman gets owned by law student

Although a repost, still like it. He should have never been stopped in the first place. If you complain about the guy being an asshole, put yourself in his situation. The law says you can carry. The law says you can't be stopped without reasonable suspicion of committing a crime. The law is on his side yet the law enforcement doesn't know the law and uses common practice to disarm the man and begin to question him and check his legal status to own and carry a firearm.

While an isolated incident, I don't want to see this abuse get carried out further and progress into something more.

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Originally Posted by Ronin13

The cop asked for ID, he was denied. Then the cop asked for the guys name. DENIED. WTF? That's just a dick move.

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Why is it a dick move, when the kid doesn't have to do this? So the kid is dick for not volunteering more information than he is required to, by law? The cop shouldn't have even been talking to him if he didn't have a reason to suspect that a crime was being committed. And carrying a gun isn't a reason to suspect that a crime has been committed. A concerned citizen saying that there's someone carrying a gun isn't reason to suspect that a crime has been committed.

You guys go ahead and talk to cops and give them whatever they ask for, no matter what your rights are. I'm going to do the absolute bare minimum, every single time. And if that makes me a stupid idiot asshole who people predict will get kicked off this message board in short order, so be it.

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Originally Posted by sniper7

Although a repost, still like it. He should have never been stopped in the first place. If you complain about the guy being an asshole, put yourself in his situation. The law says you can carry. The law says you can't be stopped without reasonable suspicion of committing a crime. The law is on his side yet the law enforcement doesn't know the law and uses common practice to disarm the man and begin to question him and check his legal status to own and carry a firearm.

While an isolated incident, I don't want to see this abuse get carried out further and progress into something more.

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Ok, you say exactly what I've said, and I predict that nobody will call you a stupid idiot asshole and say you're going to get kicked off the message board. We'll see.

I still do not understand how people who claim to be 2A friendly are so anti-OC. It baffles me every single time.

OT though, can't watch the video at work...but there are some folks going out looking for a confrontation. Those people are not helpful to our cause. Now there are other people who go out armed with a gun on their hip for protection, and a camera on their person for protection.

Now I will say this, chances are the internet will never see the videos of good LEO encounters. So yes, there probably is a large proportion of OC videos on the internet of folks looking for a confrontation. But the actions of these few people who abuse their OC rights affect the perception of OCers in the 2A community. Does that sound familiar? It's exactly the same situation that is happening nationwide when it comes to our beloved ARs. Folks, don't let the actions of a couple nutter butters skew your perception of law abiding citizens.

Last thing, the whole "Just because you can, doesn't mean you should" argument from some 2A folks is at it's core extremely hypocritcal when it comes to OCing. I bet you would get your undies in a wad if someone came up to you and said "Just because you can own an AR, doesn't mean you should." Right?
[Beer]

Enough of this-

Ronin, I know you want desperately to be a cop, so you see nothing wrong on the cop side and the citizen in question is in the wrong, but in this case, your flat wrong. Back up a second and look at this in a different light. Watch the video again. I OPEN CARRY. Friends of mine OPEN CARRY, and I promise you that if a cop came up and TOOK MY GUN before he even asked my name etc. I would not be particularly cooperative and might need bail money afterwards.

JM, I like you, met you at the range, but back that shit up. Are you even a LEO? Seems like I remember you posting to that effect but cant remember, however, open carry is legal. Get over it.

However in your guys honor I am going to put aside my Kel-tec cc gun and strap up with the XDM on the hip. Maybe head over to wal-mart or the mall.

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED MEANS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. Its just not for mags yanno!

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Originally Posted by Ronin13

False. I don't think treating any gun as something more than what it is is right. I'm just saying MOST people don't know the law, they see a gun on someone's hip, they call 911, the cops show up, they have to check it out- if you make it hard for them to determine everything is okay, then you deserve to be held up for a long period of time and the false feeling of being "violated." I don't think these cops "Violated" the guy in any way, but he did go out looking for a confrontation with his local PD. That's what we're getting after... Further- did you even watch the video? The cop asked for ID, he was denied. Then the cop asked for the guys name. DENIED. WTF? That's just a dick move. "UH it'll go in the report." STFU guy. I think it's little dipshits like in that video that make us all look bad. So you can go ahead and try that out... I suggest drawing down on the cop first, just to make sure he knows not to violate your rights. [facepalm]

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Originally Posted by dwalker460

Enough of this-

Ronin, I know you want desperately to be a cop, so you see nothing wrong on the cop side and the citizen in question is in the wrong, but in this case, your flat wrong. Back up a second and look at this in a different light. Watch the video again. I OPEN CARRY. Friends of mine OPEN CARRY, and I promise you that if a cop came up and TOOK MY GUN before he even asked my name etc. I would not be particularly cooperative and might need bail money afterwards.

JM, I like you, met you at the range, but back that shit up. Are you even a LEO? Seems like I remember you posting to that effect but cant remember, however, open carry is legal. Get over it.

However in your guys honor I am going to put aside my Kel-tec cc gun and strap up with the XDM on the hip. Maybe head over to wal-mart or the mall.

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED MEANS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. Its just not for mags yanno!

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That's a damn good 1,00th post my friend.

[Score]

If the officer in the video didn't know the law at the time that encounter took place, then how can he do something "on purpose?" I think some here are forgetting the requirement of malice-aforethought... Mens rea (guilty mind) is what the lawyers call it. I think I may have read that somewhere. ....

In before [shithitsfan]

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Originally Posted by generalmeow

Ok, you say exactly what I've said, and I predict that nobody will call you a stupid idiot asshole and say you're going to get kicked off the message board. We'll see.

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You just need to learn how to be a post whore!

I don't advocate for provoking cops, they have a job to do, this guy was tring to do his job, but he also needs to understand that common practice is not the law. The guy carrying, for whatever his reason was within the limits of the law and this incident should have never taken place if common practice was not so common.

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Originally Posted by generalmeow

Why is it a dick move, when the kid doesn't have to do this? So the kid is dick for not volunteering more information than he is required to, by law? The cop shouldn't have even been talking to him if he didn't have a reason to suspect that a crime was being committed. And carrying a gun isn't a reason to suspect that a crime has been committed. A concerned citizen saying that there's someone carrying a gun isn't reason to suspect that a crime has been committed.

You guys go ahead and talk to cops and give them whatever they ask for, no matter what your rights are. I'm going to do the absolute bare minimum, every single time. And if that makes me a stupid idiot asshole who people predict will get kicked off this message board in short order, so be it.

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The cop asked his name, he refused to give it. I know he's not required by law, but FFS that's just being an asshole. Stop standing on principal when IRL if a cop has contact with you and politely asks so they can converse with you, what is your first name, it's kind of being a big swollen asshole to say "I'm not gonna give you that... huff!"

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Originally Posted by dwalker460

Enough of this-

Ronin, I know you want desperately to be a cop, so you see nothing wrong on the cop side and the citizen in question is in the wrong, but in this case, your flat wrong. Back up a second and look at this in a different light. Watch the video again. I OPEN CARRY. Friends of mine OPEN CARRY, and I promise you that if a cop came up and TOOK MY GUN before he even asked my name etc. I would not be particularly cooperative and might need bail money afterwards.

JM, I like you, met you at the range, but back that shit up. Are you even a LEO? Seems like I remember you posting to that effect but cant remember, however, open carry is legal. Get over it.

However in your guys honor I am going to put aside my Kel-tec cc gun and strap up with the XDM on the hip. Maybe head over to wal-mart or the mall.

SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED MEANS SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. Its just not for mags yanno!

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You assume a lot... I'm not being some, what's the word some have used on here? "Badge licker." I'm not saying OC is wrong, or bad... I'm all for it, but due to the way the world is today (and if you fail to see this you are in for a real shocker) OCing draws unwanted attention in populated areas... Sheep will call the cops, not all cops are well versed on 110% of every single law, regulation, statute or rule... this is just the way it is. Expecting cops to know EVERY single of the 100,000's of laws out there is just ludicrous. I'm not defending the cop's actions, I'm not saying in this case they did right- but as we all learned as kids (I hope we all did) two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts make a right! [Coffee] <interjecting humor to ease the tension in here. The kid in the video was a prick, the cop overstepped, there! Okay? My main point was: When you go out looking for confrontation you are an asshole, plain and simple. If you're just going out and exercising your rights in OCing, good for you, but don't be surprised, nor come crying when you have an interaction with LE because someone called in "a man with a gun." That's the way it is these days, I wish it weren't, but hey, I wish a lot of things weren't this way, like Obama being president, gas costing nearly $4/gal, etc. Adapt and overcome, or do your part in changing it THE RIGHT WAY. Don't strap a gun on your hip, get your camera, and go out looking to be the next YouTube douche looking for cops to confront, that is not the right way, and it only makes you look like a punk. [Beer]